Jadon Sancho| Staying at Dortmund for now

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Bondi77

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I wonder if Angel signs a three or four year deal with us will that be an indication that Sancho is coming and if he chooses to go to another club will that be a sign that he is not coming. I know they played together at youth level but I do not know if they were good mates or not but I suppose whatever he does it will be the career move that is best for him.
Just throwing something different out there guys.
 

Strelok

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Quality of league and Dortmund play style also plays a factor to his output. It still a question whether he can replicate those numbers in PL.
Agreed, big question indeed.

Lot of posters here seem to forget Kagawa and Mkhitaryan already.
 

Brightonian

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Agreed, big question indeed.

Lot of posters here seem to forget Kagawa and Mkhitaryan already.
His numbers will almost certainly drop. But it's not really a Kagawa/Mkhi situation. For those in the know, Sancho had already emerged before Dortmund signed him. He was comfortably the best player in the entire youth football system in England when he left. A couple of clubs, including ourselves, tried to sign him. So although his success at Dortmund has been exceptional, it hasn't been unexpected. And Unlike Kagawa or even more so Mkhi, his style is not visible one that relies on a radical strategic approach at the club. For one thing, we've already seen him look just as promising for England.

His numbers will drop, and people should be prepared for that. His xG stats already suggest he's getting the rub of the green at the moment and could already easily be getting fewer goals for his efforts. But that's fine - the important thing if we sign him is that he contributes to a more dangerous attacking unit, not that he scores all the goals. If there aren't enough goals and assists to be had from Rashford, Martial, Sancho, Fernandes and Pogba, with Greenwood and (hopefully) Ighalo as options to call on, we've got more serious problems.
 

Suvvernmanc

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His numbers will almost certainly drop. But it's not really a Kagawa/Mkhi situation. For those in the know, Sancho had already emerged before Dortmund signed him. He was comfortably the best player in the entire youth football system in England when he left. A couple of clubs, including ourselves, tried to sign him. So although his success at Dortmund has been exceptional, it hasn't been unexpected. And Unlike Kagawa or even more so Mkhi, his style is not visible one that relies on a radical strategic approach at the club. For one thing, we've already seen him look just as promising for England.

His numbers will drop, and people should be prepared for that. His xG stats already suggest he's getting the rub of the green at the moment and could already easily be getting fewer goals for his efforts. But that's fine - the important thing if we sign him is that he contributes to a more dangerous attacking unit, not that he scores all the goals. If there aren't enough goals and assists to be had from Rashford, Martial, Sancho, Fernandes and Pogba, with Greenwood and (hopefully) Ighalo as options to call on, we've got more serious problems.
Good post. Sancho is a brilliant creator of chances who is also good at getting himself in good positions in the box to score. He also loves to run at defenders and create his own goals.

I think he will slot nicely into our setup with our better functioning midfield.
 

Rozay

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I wonder if Angel signs a three or four year deal with us will that be an indication that Sancho is coming and if he chooses to go to another club will that be a sign that he is not coming. I know they played together at youth level but I do not know if they were good mates or not but I suppose whatever he does it will be the career move that is best for him.
Just throwing something different out there guys.
I would imagine the two are completely unrelated. They aren’t a couple!
 

Bondi77

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I would imagine the two are completely unrelated. They aren’t a couple!
Of course they are not but how often have we read the posts about coming to play with his mates like Rashford and Gomes on this site.
Good to see there are other people who realise that is a rubbish angle to use to join a club.
 

limerickcitykid

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Of course they are not but how often have we read the posts about coming to play with his mates like Rashford and Gomes on this site.
Good to see there are other people who realise that is a rubbish angle to use to join a club.
It isn’t a rubbish angle, playing for the same club as a good mate is very obviously a factor when choosing clubs. Players often say they’ve decided a club after speaking with their mates who play/played for said club.

Angel doesn’t get to play though, so he’s obviously got more pressing concerns than a mate.
 

Strelok

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His numbers will almost certainly drop. But it's not really a Kagawa/Mkhi situation. For those in the know, Sancho had already emerged before Dortmund signed him. He was comfortably the best player in the entire youth football system in England when he left. A couple of clubs, including ourselves, tried to sign him. So although his success at Dortmund has been exceptional, it hasn't been unexpected. And Unlike Kagawa or even more so Mkhi, his style is not visible one that relies on a radical strategic approach at the club. For one thing, we've already seen him look just as promising for England.

His numbers will drop, and people should be prepared for that. His xG stats already suggest he's getting the rub of the green at the moment and could already easily be getting fewer goals for his efforts. But that's fine - the important thing if we sign him is that he contributes to a more dangerous attacking unit, not that he scores all the goals. If there aren't enough goals and assists to be had from Rashford, Martial, Sancho, Fernandes and Pogba, with Greenwood and (hopefully) Ighalo as options to call on, we've got more serious problems.
Tbh I've never heard of him before Dortmund. And I've never watched the guy either. I said so because some posters above seemed so sure that he would replicate such numbers here and even using those statistics to compare him with Hazard.

Sancho seems like a very good player indeed and he's rated very highly. However I'd rather stay skeptical regarding this, he's still young and the PL is very different from the Bundes.
 

macheda14

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Tbh I've never heard of him before Dortmund. And I've never watched the guy either. I said so because some posters above seemed so sure that he would replicate such numbers here and even using those statistics to compare him with Hazard.

Sancho seems like a very good player indeed and he's rated very highly. However I'd rather stay skeptical regarding this, he's still young and the PL is very different from the Bundes.
Well I mean he’s been consistently putting numbers comparable to Hazard’s output at Lille, in a better league and a younger age.
 

Brightonian

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Tbh I've never heard of him before Dortmund. And I've never watched the guy either. I said so because some posters above seemed so sure that he would replicate such numbers here and even using those statistics to compare him with Hazard.

Sancho seems like a very good player indeed and he's rated very highly. However I'd rather stay skeptical regarding this, he's still young and the PL is very different from the Bundes.
Yeah understood, and it's not an unreasonable concern. Personally having watched him from the start, I'm very confident that the level of football he produces for us will be just as good as he has for Dortmund. And Hazard comparisons aren't unwarranted although obviously it's always aspirational, you can never predict something like that for sure. But I do agree with you that the numbers might not hold up to what he's produced at Dortmund, at least at first. As I say, I don't think that's too important, although the fans and the media do like stats so we have to hope people are willing to use their eyes too.
 

Handré1990

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I’m pretty sure Hazard got like 18/19 goals in his last season at Lille, no?
I was thinking total, not in a single season. Hazard scored 20 league goals in his last season at Lille I think, which is very impressive. I just saw a comparison the other day, where Sancho has 27 goals in 69 league games for Dortmund, while Hazard had 36 goals in 147 league games for Lille.

I looked at it now and to be fair, Hazard started playing first team football at an even younger age than Sancho. While Sancho did just have a very productive season (30 g+a with almost a third of the season left to go).

So yeah, not much better, quite similar in fact. Not much in it at all.
 

Gasolin

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Can we get Sancho even without CL? That's really the question. We have to hope the iconic number 7 should be enough of an appeal, but we don't know that.
 

Rozay

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Can we get Sancho even without CL? That's really the question. We have to hope the iconic number 7 should be enough of an appeal, but we don't know that.
We don’t even know if there will be one next season at this stage tbh. But I’m confident we’ll make it one way or another anyway.
 

P-Nut

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Tbh I've never heard of him before Dortmund. And I've never watched the guy either. I said so because some posters above seemed so sure that he would replicate such numbers here and even using those statistics to compare him with Hazard.

Sancho seems like a very good player indeed and he's rated very highly. However I'd rather stay skeptical regarding this, he's still young and the PL is very different from the Bundes.
It was me that compared him to Hazard and it was more a point that people were saying he could turn into a player on Hazards level. I'd actually hope and expect him to reach a higher level than Hazard has, as he should be a top 3 player in the world in his age group, something Hazard hasn't ever really achieved. (obviously being part of the Messi and Ronaldo years impacts that, but take those 2 out and I wouldn't even put him top 5)
 

TsuWave

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Agreed, big question indeed.

Lot of posters here seem to forget Kagawa and Mkhitaryan already.
Dortmund would clap up United and most teams in the Prem.

Kagawa and Mkhitaryan have nothing to do with Sancho, unless, by the same logic, we are to start assuming that every import from the French league will be successful since they have provided the PL with so many stars over the years, which then poses a new set of questions since the perceived level of Ligue Un is generally accepted as lower than Bundesliga.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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Dortmund would clap up United and most teams in the Prem.

Kagawa and Mkhitaryan have nothing to do with Sancho, unless, by the same logic, we are to start assuming that every import from the French league will be successful since they have provided the PL with so many stars over the years, which then poses a new set of questions since the perceived level of Ligue Un is generally accepted as lower than Bundesliga.
Not going to argue about Sancho. I disagree with the poster anyway about his opinion on Sancho. However, I disagree with yours about Dortmund. Spurs smashed Dortmund last season in both legs. And we beat Spurs last season & this season under Ole.
 

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However, I disagree with yours about Dortmund. Spurs smashed Dortmund last season in both legs. And we beat Spurs last season & this season under Ole.
So, since we won over FC Bayern in 1999, we are better than any team in Bundesliga now?

Since we beat City this season and Astana won 1-0 against us in the Europa League, Astana is better than City?
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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So, since we won over FC Bayern in 1999, we are better than any team in Bundesliga now?

Since we beat City this season and Astana won 1-0 against us in the Europa League, Astana is better than City?
That's not what I'm trying to say that we are better.

I only disagree with him saying that Dortmund "would clap" us and most teams in PL.
 

Fosu-Mens

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That's not what I'm trying to say that we are better.

I only disagree with him saying that Dortmund "would clap" us and most teams in PL.
Your logic indicates otherwise. And using a game from last season between Spurs and BVB is not the same is not representative at all. Teams and leagues effectiveness against other teams or leagues changes from season to season, and from month to month.

The post-winter break BVB would be favourites against 17/18 of the 20 teams currently playing in the PL this season. Not sure about Wolves really. Their balanced approach could do wonders against BVB.
 

cyberman

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Your logic indicates otherwise. And using a game from last season between Spurs and BVB is not the same is not representative at all. Teams and leagues effectiveness against other teams or leagues changes from season to season, and from month to month.

The post-winter break BVB would be favourites against 17/18 of the 20 teams currently playing in the PL this season. Not sure about Wolves really. Their balanced approach could do wonders against BVB.
Dortmund play too open. Their style plays right into the counter attacking style of English clubs plus they are really shakey defensively on top of that.
They would be right in the middle of the top 4 war imo.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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Your logic indicates otherwise. And using a game from last season between Spurs and BVB is not the same is not representative at all. Teams and leagues effectiveness against other teams or leagues changes from season to season, and from month to month.

The post-winter break BVB would be favourites against 17/18 of the 20 teams currently playing in the PL this season. Not sure about Wolves really. Their balanced approach could do wonders against BVB.
I had explained it to you. Not my problem if you refuse to listen to it just to suit your argument.
 

Ramshock

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Dortmund play too open. Their style plays right into the counter attacking style of English clubs plus they are really shakey defensively on top of that.
They would be right in the middle of the top 4 war imo.
I love these hypothetical arguments. Like Favre wouldnt adjust tactics to adapt to the new league better. No he would use the same tactics week in and week out like a casual FM player. :rolleyes:
 

TsuWave

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Not going to argue about Sancho. I disagree with the poster anyway about his opinion on Sancho. However, I disagree with yours about Dortmund. Spurs smashed Dortmund last season in both legs. And we beat Spurs last season & this season under Ole.
And? Just cause A>B and B>C it doesn’t translate to A>C in football.

I don’t know how anyone would argue that currently Dortmund isn’t a better team than United. And over the course of a season Dortmund would clap up most prem teams.

But hey, if people wanna believe that Bundesliga standard is that far behind prem then cool I guess
 

VorZakone

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And? Just cause A>B and B>C it doesn’t translate to A>C in football.

I don’t know how anyone would argue that currently Dortmund isn’t a better team than United. And over the course of a season Dortmund would clap up most prem teams.
Dortmund aren't as good as people think. Notoriously poor in away games. A fit Man Utd with Pogba, Martial, Rashford, Fernandes, Fred, McTominay and Maguire would cause Dortmund tremendous trouble IMO.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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And? Just cause A>B and B>C it doesn’t translate to A>C in football.

I don’t know how anyone would argue that currently Dortmund isn’t a better team than United. And over the course of a season Dortmund would clap up most prem teams.

But hey, if people wanna believe that Bundesliga standard is that far behind prem then cool I guess
Dortmund lost to Spurs. We beat Spurs & other top PL teams. There is no indication that Dortmund would clap us & the others. We could beat Dortmund & we could also lose to Dortmund. I'm making a point that we are not a mid table team as what people in here suggested, we have the squad that capable to beat strong team in CL.
 

RUCK4444

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Dortmund lost to Spurs. We beat Spurs & other top PL teams. There is no indication that Dortmund would clap us & the others. We could beat Dortmund & we could also lose to Dortmund. I'm making a point that we are not a mid table team as what people in here suggested, we have the squad that capable to beat strong team in CL.
Of course we do, we beat City three times and were the only team to take points of the Scousers for much of the season.

Dortmund are decent but so are we.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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Of course we do, we beat City three times and were the only team to take points of the Scousers for much of the season.

Dortmund are decent but so are we.
Your point pretty much the same as mine. I'm confused.
 

thegregster

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Dortmund are the most overrated team in football post 2013.

They have won only 1 trophy since then.

They haven't done much in Europe either. They have made the CL Q/FS twice since 2013 but so have we. That shows how ordinary they have been.
 

cyberman

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I love these hypothetical arguments. Like Favre wouldnt adjust tactics to adapt to the new league better. No he would use the same tactics week in and week out like a casual FM player. :rolleyes:
But you need different players for different styles. Hummels on the half turn v a direct counter attack would not go down well.
Hell it doesnt go down well as it is.
 

GledTheRed

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Dortmund would clap up United and most teams in the Prem.

Kagawa and Mkhitaryan have nothing to do with Sancho, unless, by the same logic, we are to start assuming that every import from the French league will be successful since they have provided the PL with so many stars over the years, which then poses a new set of questions since the perceived level of Ligue Un is generally accepted as lower than Bundesliga.
They aren't better than us.
 

GledTheRed

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Dortmund are the most overrated team in football post 2013.

They have won only 1 trophy since then.

They haven't done much in Europe either. They have made the CL Q/FS twice since 2013 but so have we. That shows how ordinary they have been.
Yep, the BL is a pretty shit standard too.
 

Rozay

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With a full team, I’d back us to beat Dortmund any day tbh. I’d back us to take Bayern too if I’m honest.
 

unplayable

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With a full team, I’d back us to beat Dortmund any day tbh. I’d back us to take Bayern too if I’m honest.
I like your confidence but we would need a small miracle against Bayern.
 
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