Had he lost that much pace though? Or is it more that he reads the game even better and does not get into as many foot races? Rio was ridiculously fast before he hurt his back, but even then he seldom found himself in foot races one on one.
Thiago Silva | Chelsea Player
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He never was a very fast CB, i wouldn't say he lost a lot of pace. Some for sure but not much and he's stil in spectacular shape for a 36 yo. I'd say his last season with PSG was one of his best with us (since he joined in 2012).
But he does read the game probably better than any CB in the world. Same for headers, he doesn't jump that high but his timing is perfect.
But yeah, if he plays high on the pitch, he can have rough nights against fast and physical players.
Whilst never rapid, I definitely describe him as a CB with pace, in his prime.
In his prime he was such a well-rounded CB. He basically had no weakness. Was he the fastest CB? No. But was he fast enough? Yes. Was the best ball playing CB? No. But was he a good ball-playing CB? Yes. Etc etc.
For me he was pretty much an 8/10 in every facet of the game. Positioning and reading of the game has always been top draw though. Wonderfully elegant too. Of course, he makes the odd mistake, but what player doesn’t.
It all depends about which time we're talking about, but my impression of him at his physical peak (mostly at Milan) is very different: Lots of pace, aggressive sweeping movements, remarkable jumping ability, expansive passing ability, and even deep attacking runs. I agree on exceptional anticipation and timing, and that combined with his athleticism made him so good back then.
But he's of course not the same physically since many years, and he plays more conservative, that is clear.
JT, Desailly, Carvalho or 'Jamaica' are probably the best I have seen at the club
Forgot Desailly, definitely gets my vote. But I'd have him above both Terry and Carvalho who were about even and both great. I just really rate Thiago. Glad to see him even in a PL cameo.
not sure if you remember him or not but Jamaica, was Paul Elliott, he was an absolute rock at CB too
Well of course he's not as fast but he changed the way he plays for years now. I've rarely seen him deep attacking runs with PSG (a couple at the very beginning but that's pretty much it) and he never took any risks with his passing with us. That's one of the reasons why we were happy to play with Marquinhos instead since he brings more on offense (even if he' plays as DM atm).
Poor Terry
I don't think there's much disagreement. As I said, it probably depends a lot on the point of time we're talking about. I'm mostly talking Milan. Entirely possible that early times at PSG were already the beginning of a loss of athleticism and a transition in style.
Although two games I recently watched were the 2013 CL match against Barca in Paris, and the 2013 Confed Cup final against Spain. Imo, in both games "Milan" Thiago Silva was still visible in terms of mobility and some nice progressive passing. (Attacking runs not so much, only a minor one against Barca. But he only did it every now and then at Milan either.) Anyway, I of course let you judge his PSG stint in general, everything else would be silly.
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True. In my mind it started to disappear at PSG after 2 seasons or so. Maybe it's because of the way PSG played back then, letting Motta (and Verratti) organize everything. He stopped taking responsability on offense and that's a shame because he clearly had the ability. He was never the kind of defender who'd stay high on the pitch though, even for Milan when he was more athletic.
Still one of the best CB in the world.
Spectacular defender. Best I've ever seen.
His reading of play is something special. Staying high on the pitch when the opposition is in space is the sort of foolishness that modern defenders get up to that provably gives the likes of Cannavaro heart palpatations while watching. Nothing great about it at all.
Most of the old school center back legends played the way TS does. He sure lacked a bit of agressiveness and had a tendancy to drop far too low when under a lot of pressure, but his ability to defend while standing is absolutely great. He didn't have much to improve to be the best CB of the decade but he never reached this ultimate level because his leadership ability was rather poor. Imo, Ramos isn't as good a defender but he can pick up his entire team when things go wrong and push all his teamates forward, TS could never do that.
Rubbish, he's easily the best of the past decade. Ramos is a bombscare of a defender. I've seen Kane do things to Ramos he couldn't dream of doing to Silva even at his current age let alone 5-10 years ago. Don't know what your on about. His decision making, positioning and reading of play are amazing even to this day.
There's 2 different aspects to a CB and a player in general : his defensive skills and what he brings to the team, especially if he's captain. Thiago Silva is more skilled as a defender but Ramos brings far more to his team as a overall player and a captain, that's undeniable. I've watched the 315 games played by TS with PSG, when things get really rough he starts defending lower and lower on the pitch while Ramos has the ability to take the ball and push his entire team forward. Being a center back isn't only about defending, especially in modern football.
Terry was world class in the right setup no doubt, but he was susceptible on the turn and didn't like to defend with too much of the pitch behind him. Carvalho was the one bailing him out in that regard when they weren't sitting deep.
You can talk of set ups all you want but you for sure need to be a world class cb pairing to finish a season only conceding 15 goals
clearly. It was also a perfect setup for his skillset.
Tbf, there's only a handful of defenders in the history of football that rival Ramos' match-winning qualities on the front end. Most of them probably liberos. World class defenders were usually world class without such an impact.
And again, I won't challenge anything when it comes to Silva at PSG, but I don't think it's true for his peak self. For Milan and Brazil he often acted as the wavebreaker who left the backline to break up attacks in front. Signature move, I'd say. He also defended as last man, and it was exactly the seamless switch between both modes, and his decisionmaking when to do what, that I find impressive.
Would be interesting to know the reasons for that apparently quite drastic change in style, at least if it goes beyond declining athleticism.
Yeah if you look at the 2014 World Cup, he defended very high and frequently in risky 1v1 and 2v2 situations in the centre of defence. He was the best I've seen do it in many years.
TS just stated that he felt relieved to have less pressure at Chelsea than at PSG. That's really the only thing he struggled with.
Th
Carragher once said Terry was the best he ever played with and England at that point had some strong defenders.
Thing is, sure he didn’t like getting turned or having to defend one on one but how many CBS are good at that? His reading of the game sets him apart from most of defenders. Most of the time he was already in the right place to clear before there was any danger.Im sure you wouldn’t find many videos of Terry destroyed by anyone in a game (Torres on Vidic, Messi ending Boatengs career etc).
Carragher once said Terry was the best he ever played with and England at that point had some strong defenders.
Old man still has it.
It has been such a seamless transition to English football.
Whilst I understand that as a person Terry divides opinion, I am unsure why people have him so low. Without question, he and Rio are the best two CB's of the PL era. Terry, may have been slow but I fail to remember any occasions, outside of his last 18 months, that he got targetted or out thought, which consequently meant he was able to avoid getting into foot races.
As for players outside of the PL both Silva and Ramos have been elite CB's that is true and people can argue were they rank alongside Terry and Rio. However, when talking about elite CB's Terry was in that category and for sure he and Rio are 1 and 2 in the best ever PL CB list.
As for players outside of the PL both Silva and Ramos have been elite CB's that is true and people can argue were they rank alongside Terry and Rio. However, when talking about elite CB's Terry was in that category and for sure he and Rio are 1 and 2 in the best ever PL CB list.
Agree with all of this. For what it's worth, I'd have Vidic and Carvalho in the next tier down as all time PL CBs. Both just lacked a bit of longevity at the top level for me.
Comparing players across leagues will always be challenging to some extent, but I think the likes of Ramos, Silva, Chiellini, and Godin have proven enough to be in the conversation as contemporaries (or near enough).
Looks good so far, but still lots of games to be played against the PL top 10 and in the CL. Will be interesting to see if the defense around Mendy & Silva can keep a similar level over a full season, and against the best offenses.
Yeah, he seems pretty underrated. Just one example, I remember his technique & passing game (with both feet) being really neat, but it's rarely mentioned.
Well they definitely won't keep up their current run, we're on a trajectory (since the WBA game) that would see us breaking all of Mou 1.0's defensive records if maintained
It's not the crazy transition some people make it out to be to go from Ligue 1 to the Premier league. Silva is just class regardless of where he goes, but I am pretty impressed how good he's looked at his age for Chelsea. Him and Zouma are forming a great partnership and with Mendy in GK, they are looking solid, all players from that farmer's league.
Ah no, didn't mean goal statsWell they definitely won't keep up their current run, we're on a trajectory (since the WBA game) that would see us breaking all of Mou 1.0's defensive records if maintained
Just the impression of a solid defense, which is still to be confirmed over a longer period & against tougher opposition.
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Totally schooled Kane, how did he fall into our lap like this?
They barely went into your half!
Kane went nowhere near him all game
I wouldn't go that far! Kane barely got in your half!
Its a fantastic punt by Lampard, it really is. I was always a massive Thiago Silva fan, but I really doubted this transfer, at his age, having played in a lesser league for so long, but he is boosting his legacy and profile and I am delighted for him (as an adopted Brazilian)
I was convinced they were scrimping with Silva and Mendy but they both look fantastic. I got it totally wrong in the Chelsea thread and Lampard deserves a lot of praise. He has gotten the summer spot on when he absolutely needed to.
I thought he didn’t have much to do today but he just oozes class and confidence. Great player. I’m happy to see him in the Prem.
So many people were writing him and Cavani off 1-2 games in. There's still a way a long way in the season to go but both players are showing what they're capable of.