The United way

tomaldinho1

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The United Way


..and no other club does this with the amount of success we have done it.

We have only ever had two periods of success in our 140-years as a football club.

It just happens that those two period lasted nigh on 40 years between them.

Sir Matt's success was from 1950 - 1968

Sir Alex's success was from 1993-2013

Both dominant periods were built the same way; from the ground up.

Both managers put in place a long-term strategy that would see us not only competing in teh transfer market for top players, but moreso breathing our own...

Matt brought 6 players into the first team from the academy after the Munich Air disaster and totally rebuilt the club from the ground up... those six players would go on to win league and European titles.

Alex brought 6 players into the first team from the academy through the early 90s (most fans couldn't wait for this to come to fruition and wanted him sacked) and totally rebuilt the club from the ground up after we turned into a joke in the 70s & 80s... those six players would go on to win league and European titles.

Now Ole is trying to do the exact same after we lost our way post 2013.

But lots of 'fans' on here don't wanna know about it.

They want Allegri in and they want Manchester United to be the red version of Chelsea. Which is a joke. They are clearly supporting the wrong football club.

The Manchester United way is all about breathing from within... creating League and European Cup contenders with a bulk of the team built from our underage academy.... There are clubs such as Ajax who like to build their team from within, which is great - I LOVE AJAX and their 'way' has to be applauded, in fact IS applauded - but United are on their own in terms of producing for themselves, in that Ajax sell once the player becomes of age... United don't have to sell.. We produce and the players stay with us for the best of their career.

We all know this. Or we should all know this, what with us being United fans.

Which is why it is baffling that while Ole is trying to do the exact same thing, building from within, some United 'fans' would rather have Allegri or somesuch hotshot European manager.

They want our club to adopt the Chelsea way. Not the Manchester United way.
Can I beg you not to turn this into another Ole thread.

United way is a v interesting discussion on its own.
 

Bobcat

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Where are you getting that transfers were a rare occurrence? We signed Tommy Taylor for £30k (£1 short) a near British record, hardly £5 and a packet of crisps and were offered £65k for him from inter Milan a near world record. Perhaps you’re thinking about the early 1900’s?

But if you want to believe there was nothing special about the Busby babes and that it didn’t inspire Sir Alex to recognise the need to recreate our youth set up....then in my opinion you’re very disrespectful to Sir Matt and Manchester United.
I was half way wumming.

Still, though. Clubs were a lot more reliant on their academy back than, and all though the Busby Babes were special even for their time, i still think the class of 92 was a bigger suprise, since football had been a lot more comercialized then
 

Schmeichel's Cartwheel

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The United Way has more of a meaning, if indeed it has any meaning at all, off the pitch rather than on it.

On the surface it sounds sentimental, but I've worked for a lot of different companies and every single one of them had a unique culture, or set of core values, which tend to stick even through changes in leadership. In my experiences leaders who understood and embraced that culture were more successful. No reason why a football club should be any different.

From a fans perspective we should all be proud of our record with youth. We've had a home grown player in every single matchday squad since 1937. Thats incredible. If anything represents a United Way, it would be that, and that comes from a long standing culture within the club that believes in that and encourages it.

Every club wants to blood youth, and every club will field one if they are special, but our record suggests we have provided a better platform for that, consistently, over a long period of time.
Is that true? Even under van Gaal post Blackett/McNair & pre Rashford/Lingard?
 

Bastian

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Its developing your own players, but its a bit of a cliche really and (largely) based on the class of 92, which was a once in a century occurence.

Of course we should focus on bringing through the very best in our academy, but unfortantly it wont be enough in this age of oil clubs
Twice.
 

The holy trinity 68

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God knows...I could imagine a non united fan perhaps...but any united fan who thinks Man Uniteds history began with Sir Alex and the Co92 shouldn’t be writing posts about what the club stands for.

The list you could write of youth players that have come through at the club would be near endless, our run of having an academy graduate in our squad for over 4000 consecutive games spanning over 80 years certainly cements itself as a foundation on which the club is built.

when you list the ten greatest players to have played for the club, potentially half of the list could be made up of academy graduates

Duncan Edwards, Johnny Carey, Sir Bobby Charlton, George Best, Ryan Giggs, David Beckham, Paul Scholes,

in the tier below perhaps youd place:-

Bill Foulkes, Nobby Stiles, Norman Whiteside, Mark Hughes, Gary Neville

Without mentioning the likes of Roger Byrne, Eddie Coleman, Liam Whelan, Tommy Taylor and where they might fit in to a conversation.

Beyond this there would be countless examples of really good players and servants of the club such as John Aston, David Sadler, David Pegg, Will Mcguiness, Arthur Albiston, Clayton Blackmore, Fergies fledglings who helped us move from the drink culture to the 90s and the Co92, then Butt, Phil, Wes, O’Shea, Evans etc etc.

For a club to have Best, Charlton, Edwards, Giggs, Scholes and Beckham come through its academy.....sets it apart. It’s history and tradition that we mustn’t throw away.

Yeah there are some ridiculously good players over the years from the academy.

As for them names, incredible. Dennis Violett is another from the academy, he was a Busby Babe, survived the Munich Air Disaster, and scored 159 goals for the club in only 293 appearances. I also find it cool that he was from Fallowfield in Manchester, I lived there for a while when I was at Uni. :wenger:
 

Cast5

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Attacking football, promoting youth, winning mentality etc.

It’s a term that seems to really get under the skin of a lot of YouTube/Twitter fans for whatever reason, don’t know why.
 

Chairman Steve

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I find “The *insert any team here” Way” to be some buzzword jargon most of the time, as it always ends up being exciting attacking football and what mentalist wants boring defensive football week in week out.

I suppose our uniqueness is a pro-youth ethos despite being a giant club. You’ve got Real Madrid who historically pride themselves on having the cream of the crop around the world at all times, and their youth ethos is basically out on loan somewhere or sold to be bought later if they turn out well.
 

siw2007

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For me, Sir Matt Busby is responsible for creating Manchester United as we know it, it was his vision which propelled the club to the pinnacle of world football and it is the responsibility of every United manager to enact his vision on the football pitch, and it is through this that we believe we will achieve success. On the football pitch, it can simply mean to play attacking football to entertain working class people of Manchester, it can mean to develop our own young players through our academy, and it can also mean that we stand up and fight in the face of adversity as this club ultimately succeeded after the Munich disaster. Others will point to the standards of professionalism and the family culture at the club and how this relates to our ethos.

However, as football has changed significantly over the last 10 years, we must also look to update our football to make sure that we remain successful. Ferguson was successful at changing his tactics and systems over the years but always tried to follow Busby's vision for the club.
 

Roane

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Yes but the likes of United do it far more than others, especially when the club has always been one of the richest and could have just bought every player and never used the academy. Klopp (at Liverpool) has only done it because he has mainly had to due to injuries. Barcelona have always brought through youth players extensively, that is the Barca way nothing to do with Pep. How many youth players has he brought through at City?
Think that's an interesting topic in itself and for me it has more dynamics than meets the eye.
 

Jeppers7

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I was half way wumming.

Still, though. Clubs were a lot more reliant on their academy back than, and all though the Busby Babes were special even for their time, i still think the class of 92 was a bigger suprise, since football had been a lot more comercialized then
Ok fair enough
 

Bilbo

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Is that true? Even under van Gaal post Blackett/McNair & pre Rashford/Lingard?
Yes its never been broken as far as I am aware, and its something we should be enormously proud of, and protect.

If anything could encompass a 'United way', then it has to be that. I get no greater pleasure from football than seeing a young player blossom here.
 

Jeppers7

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Yeah there are some ridiculously good players over the years from the academy.

As for them names, incredible. Dennis Violett is another from the academy, he was a Busby Babe, survived the Munich Air Disaster, and scored 159 goals for the club in only 293 appearances. I also find it cool that he was from Fallowfield in Manchester, I lived there for a while when I was at Uni. :wenger:
Nice....it’s hard to imagine how those that survived Munich carried on and achieved great things.
 

patty123

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The United Way

Both managers put in place a long-term strategy that would see us not only competing in teh transfer market for top players,
While I wasn't around for Matt's era sadly, I was for AF and sorry but it wasn't just down to him that saw us compete in transfer market, its was more to do with the fact we went from family owned to been a PLC.


Alex brought 6 players into the first team from the academy through the early 90s (most fans couldn't wait for this to come to fruition and wanted him sacked)
Again you are wrong, as most fans started to want him gone from Dec 89 and the kids were not even heard of then, oh wait sorry, the first verison was and that had failed, then he started his heavy spending and when that was failing as well is when fans turned on him and had nothing to do with the nevilles, becks etc.
 

Bilbo

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I find “The *insert any team here” Way” to be some buzzword jargon most of the time, as it always ends up being exciting attacking football and what mentalist wants boring defensive football week in week out.

I suppose our uniqueness is a pro-youth ethos despite being a giant club. You’ve got Real Madrid who historically pride themselves on having the cream of the crop around the world at all times, and their youth ethos is basically out on loan somewhere or sold to be bought later if they turn out well.
You're right, every team has a 'way' according to their fans, and some actually do but most don't.

For the bold part it shouldn't be underestimated how much this is actually in the bones of the club. Its not just that we've gotten lucky and had great youth talent all the time. We've taken chances on players where most other clubs (especially the giant clubs who could usually buy solutions) just simply wouldn't, and I think we do a lot of work that other don't to actually prepare players mentally for that jump. 84 years since we didn't have a homegrown player in a matchday squad. Its incredible.
 

King7Eric

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You're right, every team has a 'way' according to their fans, and some actually do but most don't.

For the bold part it shouldn't be underestimated how much this is actually in the bones of the club. Its not just that we've gotten lucky and had great youth talent all the time. We've taken chances on players where most other clubs (especially the giant clubs who could usually buy solutions) just simply wouldn't, and I think we do a lot of work that other don't to actually prepare players mentally for that jump. 84 years since we didn't have a homegrown player in a matchday squad. Its incredible.
What I don't understand is, people who claim the United Way is just a buzzword and everything should be done with "logic" and no sentimentality, why the hell do these people bother to support a football team anyway? There's no logic in watching 11 guys in shorts running around. Sport is all about emotion and if you can't embrace or understand it, you shouldn't really be following any team.

There most definitely is a United Way and focus on youth (both promoting from the academy and in our transfer dealings) is a big part of it and should be preserved at all costs.
 

Green_Red

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Fast, attacking football, try to play positively and on the front foot. Youth and local ie. British and Irish. Determination and grit. Courage to play. Think back to the Busby babes and the average age and where those players were from. That's the United way. What's that, 70 years of tradition at least?

Pep plays a version of Michels and Cryuffs total football, which he has learned, which could be classed the Barca way. Klopp kind of plays that too.

Manchester United have a footballing identity. People that don't understand that just want to see the team play the latest continental tactical fad and bring in players that make them look like football hipsters. It doesn't work at our club because the people in the stands don't want to see it. They want to see the type of football that has become our identity over those 70 odd years. I completely understand people watching around the world not getting that because they've maybe only watched United for a short time but if you want to see Pep style football you'd be better off watching Barca or City.

I also think Busby and Shankly both got it right when they said that the players job was to entertain the men and women from the factories, to get people whose lives were about working hard up out of their seats. To get the gasping for air at the exciting runs. That the players should feel privileged to be the people that got to do that. That goes someway towards our identity. I think it's something Man Utd and Liverpool both share.
 
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Tom Van Persie

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The United way isn't a meaningless phrase made up by pundits. Sir Alex used it himself many times and said some of these principles were passed along by Sir Matt. When Fergie took over we had no real academy so Fergie made sure we would always have an academy that would produce players for the first team. The never give up mentality that we had for decades, there was a reason why we had so many comebacks and last minute goals. I don't think there's another manager who put as much stock into the mental aspect of football as Fergie did. He viewed it as more important than tactics. Of course Fergie was very adaptable it's how he stayed successful for so long but he also had a principle that we would try to play fast flowing football that would excite fans as much as possible. He also gave our best players freedom to play.

So it's not really a live and die style of play philosophy like Barca or Ajax have but it's real and not some made up phrase.
 

dinostar77

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I think the United way has a few different facets to it:
  • Playing entertaining, attacking football
  • Promoting young players into the first team
  • Winning trophies
  • Doing all of the above whilst the club, its players, staff and fans contribute to the community and beyond
Above is the Utd mission statement. That is the Utd way. Well said.
 

Jeppers7

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What I don't understand is, people who claim the United Way is just a buzzword and everything should be done with "logic" and no sentimentality, why the hell do these people bother to support a football team anyway? There's no logic in watching 11 guys in shorts running around. Sport is all about emotion and if you can't embrace or understand it, you shouldn't really be following any team.

There most definitely is a United Way and focus on youth (both promoting from the academy and in our transfer dealings) is a big part of it and should be preserved at all costs.
Yeah me neither. Just skip around clubs in that case watching any team that fits your requirements.
 

united_99

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It’s kind of funny how some of our fans get annoyed by the mere term of “British / homegrown players”.
They support an English club based in England but somehow get annoyed by it.
Of course most of United’s homegrown players will be English/British the same way most of Barca’s will be Spanish and Bayern’s will be German.
All our big titles have been won with at least half the team being homegrown/British or even both. And it’s not like we are signing players or promoting them just because they are British. We are hardly signing Andy Carrolls of this world. We have also never closed the eyes on foreign talent as our history and current squad shows.
Plus British players will always have a connection to England/their home. There is a reason for example that we have more realistic chances getting Sancho than Mbappe.
British and homegrown players are part of the United Way and long may it continue.
 

GoldTrafford99

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No other club has won three European Cups with more than five players in the squad in each final brought through the academy at that club.

No other club has won the English championship more than Manchester United, but EVERY Manchester United league winning team from 1950s had at least five academy players in it.

That's the Manchester United way...
 

devilish

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Manchester United is a working class club. Players are expected to work hard, be down to earth and give their all to the club. OT is certainly not a place for an arrogant person or a slacker irrespective of how talented that person is. The youth academy is an important factor in it as it allow players who often come from a working class background to reach the top. What's special with Manchester United is that we're like family.
 

UnofficialDevil

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I'm not anti Scottish, I just wanted Moyes out.
I think the United way has a few different facets to it:
  • Playing entertaining, attacking football
  • Promoting young players into the first team
  • Winning trophies
  • Doing all of the above whilst the club, its players, staff and fans contribute to the community and beyond
Yep! Specially the first one.
 

Bilbo

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What I don't understand is, people who claim the United Way is just a buzzword and everything should be done with "logic" and no sentimentality, why the hell do these people bother to support a football team anyway? There's no logic in watching 11 guys in shorts running around. Sport is all about emotion and if you can't embrace or understand it, you shouldn't really be following any team.

There most definitely is a United Way and focus on youth (both promoting from the academy and in our transfer dealings) is a big part of it and should be preserved at all costs.
Exactly right. We all spend so much of our free time either watching United, talking about United, or being happy or miserable about United. How many fans could give an accurate answer as to why they care so much, though? It has to be more than just because we were the best side around when it was time to decide, otherwise you do just reduce yourself to being someone who can only feel frustration towards the club during periods when we aren't the best. That reads a bit 'top red' I know, but it doesn't mean its wrong.

I've seen people on here chastise others for getting giddy about Amad. Why? I'm giddy as feck about him, and there's no logic behind it at all apart from the hope that we might have another superstar youngster come into the team. When I think back to my all-time favourite United memories, there are many obvious ones, but definitely high on the list would be Rashford & Rooney's debut. Macheda's goal against Villa. Januzaj against Sunderland. Ronaldo's debut. Etc etc. I remember all of those a lot clearer than I recall how I felt when we lifted some of our PL titles.
 

Jeppers7

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Manchester United is a working class club. Players are expected to work hard, be down to earth and give their all to the club. OT is certainly not a place for an arrogant person or a slacker irrespective of how talented that person is. The youth academy is an important factor in it as it allow players who often come from a working class background to reach the top. What's special with Manchester United is that we're like family.
Eric says Hi
 

AgentSmith

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No other club has won three European Cups with more than five players in the squad in each final brought through the academy at that club.

No other club has won the English championship more than Manchester United, but EVERY Manchester United league winning team from 1950s had at least five academy players in it.

That's the Manchester United way...
Barcelona quite clearly have.

We also didn't have more than 5 in the 2008 final. So we haven't.
 

Polar

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Morning all.

Just wanted to have a discussion on the phrase " the United way". Its something I hear a lot and even when discussing players who have come up in our youth set up/academy and/or indeed Ole, I hear they've been bought up the United way.

Well what is the United way? In your opinion.

Also do people think that maybe this is hindering us? Do we not maybe need to look beyond that? So Pep or Klopp are now implementing their own philosophy rather than what maybe the City or Liverpool way. To be fair it probably applies more to Klopp and Liverpool.

But it's a new era and the Liverpool method of ex players and internal promotions didn't take them to the promised land. It was "outsiders" implementing their own philosophy that got them to where they are now. So likes of Rafa and Klopp and possibly Houllier and Rodgers.

Without trying to be controversial it wasn't likes of Carra and Gerrard that have taken Liverpool to the next level but, taking the current crop, VVD and Mane and Salah. Potentially Suarez and and even Torres?

Do we need to maybe need to look beyond the United way and look to establishing a new "way" with managers and players?

We always point to likes of Neville, Becks, Giggs and Scholes as United through and through yet arguably the most influential player for us was Cantona. A short sharp tenure that had more of an impact on the team and the players mentioned than previously.

I could go on to metion Evra and Vidic and Rio as players bought in who had that passion and winning mentality but were not youth/academy products. That was about SAF imo so the SAF way if you will. Players who were bought in and bought in to the managers philosophy. You can see this with Pep and Klopp too.

Football changes as do systems. So do we need to too? Do we need to find the next system or "way" rather than trying to stick to or revert to "the United way", whatever folk think that was/is?

Thoughts?
You have some good points, maybe it doesn’t have to be certain rules.

At the same time I see some benefits of “the United way”, because it brings continuity and focus on incremental improvements. Why should Great clubs with great traditions leave their success receipt, strengths or cutting edge factor.

It’all about moving forward while at the same time bring with you what works or worked really good.

Ajax, Real Madrid, BM and Barca er very good examples of clubs who emphasis what I’m talking about. It usually works!
 

devilish

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Eric says Hi
You might not know but Eric was the first person to come to training and the last to leave. Once everyone left he would take a kid or two from the youth academy and train with them. He also made sure to sign every single autograph by the fans. Once he mistakenly failed to sign a disabled person shirt and he drove back to the training ground to do the job.

Don't believe the facade mate.
 

Foxbatt

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Because Matt Busby never existed? :rolleyes:
Yes because to over 99% of the people here Manchester United was formed when SAF took over.
Sir Matt played and coached Liverpool. He found talented young players and when he couldn't he paid outrageous amounts and bought players. SAF even before he came to United was known to be a hard task master and wanted to play good attacking football.
I remember he berated Aberdeen after winning the cup for the way they played.
Players were scared of him as much as they respected him. Respect has to be earned.

I can't see saf or sir Matt accepting the half arsed way we play on the pitch. They would be out of the dugout effing publicly at the players as they have always done.
The winning way is the United way.
 

Cast5

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It’s kind of funny how some of our fans get annoyed by the mere term of “British / homegrown players”.
They support an English club based in England but somehow get annoyed by it.
Of course most of United’s homegrown players will be English/British the same way most of Barca’s will be Spanish and Bayern’s will be German.
All our big titles have been won with at least half the team being homegrown/British or even both. And it’s not like we are signing players or promoting them just because they are British. We are hardly signing Andy Carrolls of this world. We have also never closed the eyes on foreign talent as our history and current squad shows.
Plus British players will always have a connection to England/their home. There is a reason for example that we have more realistic chances getting Sancho than Mbappe.
British and homegrown players are part of the United Way and long may it continue.
This is so true, worrying the reaction on here when we’re linked to English players, especially when Solskjaer had the audacity to sign 2 English players out of the 7 he’s signed.

From Sir Alex leaving to Solskjaer coming in to the club we signed a grand total of 1 outfield English/British player in 6 years (Shaw)

People forget we’re a British club, Imagine Madrid fans losing it when linked with a Spanish player, we have an odd fan base.
 

Green_Red

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It’s kind of funny how some of our fans get annoyed by the mere term of “British / homegrown players”.
They support an English club based in England but somehow get annoyed by it.
Of course most of United’s homegrown players will be English/British the same way most of Barca’s will be Spanish and Bayern’s will be German.
All our big titles have been won with at least half the team being homegrown/British or even both. And it’s not like we are signing players or promoting them just because they are British. We are hardly signing Andy Carrolls of this world. We have also never closed the eyes on foreign talent as our history and current squad shows.
Plus British players will always have a connection to England/their home. There is a reason for example that we have more realistic chances getting Sancho than Mbappe.
British and homegrown players are part of the United Way and long may it continue.
Yea, agree with this statement. Most people forget Eric Cantona was the first non English captain in an FA Cup final. That says a lot. Prior to the Premier League English top flight football was dominated by players from Ireland, England, Scotland and Wales.
 
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King7Eric

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Manchester United is a working class club. Players are expected to work hard, be down to earth and give their all to the club. OT is certainly not a place for an arrogant person or a slacker irrespective of how talented that person is. The youth academy is an important factor in it as it allow players who often come from a working class background to reach the top. What's special with Manchester United is that we're like family.
For once, I totally agree with you. Well said!!
 

MU655

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The United way doesn't really exist. I mean Manchester United have more often than not been unsuccessful than successful since their founding. So, you could say that recently we have returned to the United Way.

In terms of bringing youth through, I bet there are quite a lot of clubs that have brought through more players than we have. So, I'm not sure that is really the United Way rather than the way of most football clubs in England below the Premier League. Even in the PL, I bet there are quite a few clubs that do more in this aspect.

In terms of signings, we were actually one of the perpetrators for starting transfer price rises. Rooney - £25m; Ferdinand - £34m; Veron - £28.1m. These prices were huge in those days.

In the end, you could say the Premier League Era 'United Way' is to spend loads of money and bring through a few youth players. And hopefully have a manager who is really good.
 

Lentwood

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Apologies for just snipping this bit off the end but patience for patience sake is meaningless. It annoys me when people cite the first few years of Ferguson's reign as a reason why everyone should be gifted a three or four year grace period. I'm not saying this is what you're arguing but those who cite patience often do. Ferguson came into a club riled with problems, a drinking culture and worked to transform the club from the bottom up. He was also already a proven, exceptional football manager. This doesn't mean everyone deserves, or should get, the same level of patience and support.

That's a far cry from giving a manager three years based simply on the fact he played for us once. I see that as fairly insulting to what Ferguson did at the club in the early years; he earned the patience it wasn't just granted to him because it was assumed you could give any ex-player three or four years and he'd stand a decent chance of getting it right. I think this mindset is symptomatic of how low we value managers in this country.
I agree in the sense that there has to be some evidence of progression but I personally believe we have seen more than enough from Ole to suggest the club is making huge progress on and off the field.

Let's not forget how bad things had gotten. We barely scraped 7th under Moyes and that was with the likes of Rooney, RvP, Carrick, Ferdinand, Vidic, Evra, Fletcher, Evans, Nani etc...still in the squad. Granted, many of them past their best, but still experienced PL footballers.

LvG had a very difficult job in my opinion and was never the right appointment given he was only going to be around for 3yrs maximum. He didn't really take us forward at all, so that was just two years wasted, however, at least he didn't spend huge amount of irrecoverable money - most of his signings we managed to get at least a good number of games out of or most of our money back in the transfer market.

Jose was the one who was really taking the club in the wrong direction, and in fact, I would argue he was going completely against 'the United way', which of course is the topic of this thread. Now, many people incorrectly believe that's just about tactics and on this front, I completely agree there is no 'United Way', as such. I sat and watched SAF park the bus on many occasion when he knew we were outclassed. I also saw him fielding the likes of O'Shea, Phil Neville and Park in CM purely to do defensive, man-marking or 'hatchet' jobs on players...so let's not pretend it's was all gung-ho attacking and 7-0 wins.

What Jose was doing for me that went totally against the United ethos was managing for himself, rather than in the best interests of the club, and trying to buy success as quickly as possible. Sure, we have always spent money on players but we would generally have a mix of home-grown or home-developed players and each summer one or two key additions might be made. Jose was like some crazed-child in a sweet shop, kicking and screaming because he couldn't get what he wanted. Not only that, the players he targeted were completely the wrong profile. I would have taken Perisic but the likes of Eric Dier, Jerome Boateng, Willian etc...100% no from me! Likewise, some of the players Jose bought in are just not 'United' players. Some people might consider this old-fashioned but I would rather watch Mason Greenwood grow and develop with all the good and bad that goes along with that than just bring in some mercenary like Alexis Sanchez or a player like Lukaku, who I never really worked out to be honest.

In summary, I would say the best and fairest approach to take with each manager is set them a 'minimum' target. It can't all just be nice philosophical musings and pleasantries, granted. Last season, I gave Ole a completely free pass because the squad at the start of the year had major surgery and it was always going to be a rocky ride. Ole massively exceeded my expectations by finishing 3rd, so credit to him for that. This season, my minimum expectation was top four, however, I said at the time I would like us to do it comfortably i.e. not be scraping in with a win on the last day of the season, but maybe be in the top 2/3 positions for most of the season. Again, so far we have managed that. Therefore, I think it's unfair to say it's 'patience for patience sake'...targets are being set, there is a level of expectation on progress but that works both ways....we can't expect to go from 7th to winning titles in 18-months, particularly with the constantly changing makeup of the squad.
 
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wolvored

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Ole is WAAAAAY ahead of where Sir Alex was in his rebuild after 2.5 years. Let's not forget that Sir Alex finished 11th in his third season, then 13th.

Sir Alex didn't progress year on year like Ole has. Nor did Sir Matt whose first seasons were 11th, 2nd, 11th again...

Saying "Ole is stuck in a rose tinted view that he needs to be a Fergie clone without having the skillset" is like saying in 1989 that "Fergie is isstuck in a rose tinted view that he needs to be a Busby clone without having the skillset."

It makes no sense, and is narrow-minded in the extreme...
Fergie started with a team with a high drinking culture and decades of dross sprinkled with an odd FA cup win. Ole took over a team who had finished 2nd the season before, so started from a much higher platform to operate from. Fergie had also won the Championship at Scotland and beat Real Madrid to win the European Cup Winners Cup.
 

wolvored

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Why wouldn't you try to replicate the GOAT's methods?
Because time moves on and Ole should try and define his own brand, whatever that is. Even Fergie kept chopping and changing and was nothing like how he started at the end of his career.