Shola Shoretire

Berbasbullet

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He is a talent but he is a bit underwhelming in the U23 so far. Gets too much playing time. Reminds me of Lingard, good technique, a good link-up player, and can hold the ball but not much of a goal threat. Time on his side though but feels like he should play a few U18 games.
So why exactly are you upset he isn’t playing for the seniors? This was less than a month ago.

We have one of the youngest squads in the league so the idea we don’t play youth is ridiculous , but I know you have already had that discussion and it’s getting circular.
 

Smores

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He isn't wrong despite the defensive attacks. Ole hasn't integrated an academy player this year yet, i expect he will but if he doesn't that's poor of any united manager. I'm surprised that's even a touchy point for anyone.

I wouldn't expect it to be Shoretire though for me he isn't ready and I'd be surprised if he got many games next season either. Hannibal and Amad if they avoid injuries should be the two this season. Next season Laird will no doubt join them so we wouldn't be doing bad at all.
 

KM

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It's such a moronic expectation for an United fan to expect manager their to integrate an academy graduate every season. That almost never happens.
 

jb8521

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It's such a moronic expectation for an United fan to expect manager their to integrate an academy graduate every season. That almost never happens.
He actually has given an academy player a debut this season in Henderson. It's also not possible to just throw in academy players unless they've been training with the senior team long enough to meet the required Covid testing history. Add in the lack of a preseason meaning almost every player in the squad who isn't a regular starter needs game time, the injury issues meaning the u18s & u23s squads are already stretched, most of the underage players who are ready for senior football are out on loan & the fact that we already have a number of young players like Williams & Tuanzebe who need game time & it hasn't exactly been the easiest season for just handing out debuts.
 

andersj

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Cant we just ask his dad about his height? :)

What I like about him, and think seperate him from Gomes, is his off ball movement. Makes him look more mature as a player than quite a few of the kids that has come through. It is easy to forget, players spend 90 % of the game without the ball. Their movement without the ball is crucial.
 

lenny_1248

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It seems there's a dispute about Shoretire's height. Here's a recent photo of Amad and Shola. Amad Diallo is 173cm (5ft 8in); according to TransferMarkt. Judging by the photo, Shola is no shorter than Amad (taller if you ask me)
It was obvious from the games that he's a little taller and bigger than Amad.
Must be 1.75-ish?
 

Bebestation

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Is he a winger or is he a central player like a short false 9? I've never seen him but he seems to have a good passing abilities.
 

dal

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He isn't wrong despite the defensive attacks. Ole hasn't integrated an academy player this year yet, i expect he will but if he doesn't that's poor of any united manager. I'm surprised that's even a touchy point for anyone.

I wouldn't expect it to be Shoretire though for me he isn't ready and I'd be surprised if he got many games next season either. Hannibal and Amad if they avoid injuries should be the two this season. Next season Laird will no doubt join them so we wouldn't be doing bad at all.
Mctominay, Rashford, Greenwood, Diallo, Tuanzebe, Mengi.

We aren’t doing too badly at all.

You can’t integrate academy players for the sake of it.
 

Bebestation

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2nd striker for me. Playing wide diminishes some of his strengths, but likely he will be bedded into 1st team football out wide
Thanks. I thought he looked like be sorted central from youtube aswell because has can trick people in the half spaces before playing a pass in to open space.
 

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:lol: I swear the Caf is obsessed with height. I think he's taller than Diallo by a fraction but both haven't finished growing yet.
Whether he is 5'8" or 5'10" isn't going to make or break his career in the positions he plays. His movement and agility are very good.
For now we have to be patient with him because physically he's still developing into a man's body so that is his real limiting factor for game time in senior football.

Amad has a wiry strength to him that along with his balance allows him to compete, so I think he's almost ready.

Mejbri looks like he's on the verge of becoming physically strong to me. Be interesting to see how he fills out in the next couple of years because his frame had grown a lot since last season.
 

Smores

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Mctominay, Rashford, Greenwood, Diallo, Tuanzebe, Mengi.

We aren’t doing too badly at all.

You can’t integrate academy players for the sake of it.
This is just nonsense but i think this thread has already been diverted enough.
 

Grande

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He isn't wrong despite the defensive attacks. Ole hasn't integrated an academy player this year yet, i expect he will but if he doesn't that's poor of any united manager. I'm surprised that's even a touchy point for anyone.

I wouldn't expect it to be Shoretire though for me he isn't ready and I'd be surprised if he got many games next season either. Hannibal and Amad if they avoid injuries should be the two this season. Next season Laird will no doubt join them so we wouldn't be doing bad at all.
It’s not as much of a touchy point as it’s a ludicrous point. If you claim that most eighties’ strikers scored more goals than Messi and Ronaldo, you’d be countered quite a bit not because you hurt anyone’s feelings, but because you made a ludicrous claim that most people know the answer to, and that’s easy to check if you want to find.

It’s not normal fare for a top club to integrate minimum a youth player in the first team every year. Neither has it been at United.
 

Drainy

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This is just nonsense but i think this thread has already been diverted enough.
In case you missed this sensible analysis of your critique of Ole

He actually has given an academy player a debut this season in Henderson. It's also not possible to just throw in academy players unless they've been training with the senior team long enough to meet the required Covid testing history. Add in the lack of a preseason meaning almost every player in the squad who isn't a regular starter needs game time, the injury issues meaning the u18s & u23s squads are already stretched, most of the underage players who are ready for senior football are out on loan & the fact that we already have a number of young players like Williams & Tuanzebe who need game time & it hasn't exactly been the easiest season for just handing out debuts.
 

Smores

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In case you missed this sensible analysis of your critique of Ole
It's a massive stretch to include a player who has a full season of Premier league football under his belt as bringing through an academy product.

So we're not at crossed purposes I'm talking about giving someone currently in the academy this season the step up games into the seniors. That might only be 5 games and they then might go out on loan next season but personally i think it gives all the academy a boost to see it. The taste of senior football is always good for the lads too.

I find it disappointing anyway if others don't then they don't. Oddly being told Rashford is playing doesn't make it less disappointing to me :lol:

This place is far too touchy on any subject right now. Everything is seen as an attack on the manager that must be defended. It makes it impossible to discuss in good faith.
 

Drainy

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It's a massive stretch to include a player who has a full season of Premier league football under his belt as bringing through an academy product.

So we're not at crossed purposes I'm talking about giving someone currently in the academy this season the step up games into the seniors. That might only be 5 games and they then might go out on loan next season but personally i think it gives all the academy a boost to see it. The taste of senior football is always good for the lads too.

I find it disappointing anyway if others don't then they don't. Oddly being told Rashford is playing doesn't make it less disappointing to me :lol:

This place is far too touchy on any subject right now. Everything is seen as an attack on the manager that must be defended. It makes it impossible to discuss in good faith.
Henderson is an academy product and its his first season with our first team squad. We also have a number of squad players who are in their first couple of years being implemented into the squad, some direct from the academy, some back from loan.

Yes, its always nice and exciting when we see young players step up in the way you are describing, the next in line (that aren't on loan) are Mejbri and Shoretire (Noone else is close really.) who are now promoted to the first team squad bubble and will need to be introduced carefully especially when every result matters.

Its not helped by the fact our cup draws have all been fairly challenging and our squad players aren't being rotated into the side enough.
 

Mr. MUJAC

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Walter Crickmer started it all...
Some very interesting comments.

I'll add a few of my own.

When we talk about youth development there are three basic factors you have to manage...if you make an assumption that the player is already technically capable.

1. Emotional capability (managing pressure, dealing with senior feedback, motivation, confidence, self-regulation)
2. Physical capability (obvious stuff like pace, stamina, strength on/off ball)
3. Intellectual capability (responding to tactics...inc opponents, decision making, speed of thought and application etc)

Doing all of these things at U/18 and reserve level is one thing...doing it at senior level is another. Doing it CONSISTENTLY as senior level is even harder for most. It takes time.

Some players need these tested. So let's include him in the squad to develop some of the above points but he's not ready to play just yet. For others, lets give him 20 mins, half a game or a full game and see how he goes. He may get multiple chances over a period of time (Chong is a good example)...but he isn't quite ready.

Other players make the jump really quickly (like Rashford) and it's a bit of a surprise. At least to supporters. But the coaching staff usually have a good idea as they see him in training and that's why he is suddenly included in the squad.

You can only integrate players properly when the above three things are all aligned. At the moment, maybe the coaching staff (for many different reasons like COVID, chasing the league, injuries etc) don't feel that any of the current crop of juniors are ready. So they are doing things slowly with the likes of Tuanzebe, Williams and even Greenwood. In addition others are out on loan because they need the experience and the pressure is too high at United. You only have to look at the dickheads on Twitter and on here to see how some youngsters get absolute shocking comments. So let's send Mengi, Garner et al out on loans.

Then there are other players who are under contract but sent out on loan because they won't make it...but the club is creating space for others like Shoretire to come through.

In addition, most young players lost half a season in 2020 and aren't getting that much game time this season. That will put them back.

In fact, this is actually a really good indicator of youth development. Whilst the ideal is to get a youth player into the first team every season, it doesn't work that way. There aren't enough spaces for one....they have to better than the current incumbent for two...and they have to be ready.

I would have loved to see Mengi get a chance at Luton. But maybe the club already knew what was needed in terms of his development and playing in a first team game wasn't part of that plan. Maybe Bailly needed game time next to Maguire as Solskjaer was trying to see what his best central pairing would be. Who knows.

I would like to have seen Shoretire get 10 mins at Real Sociedad over Mata. Maybe Solskjaer thought that was a step too far given his development to date. Who knows.

Finally, I would argue that Solskjaer has 'integrated' a number of players into the first team in Greenwood, McTominay, Tuanzebe, Williams and Henderson all in different ways. Some are doing better than others. But to say he isn't integrating youth just isn't true in my mind.

I'm hoping that in the next couple of seasons Elanga, Mejbri, Shoretire and one or two others get a chance. But to make that happen, Elanga has to better than Rashford...Mejbri/Shoretire have to be better than Fernandes and Pogba...they need time to do that. In training, with cameo appearances and out on loan.

Our history shows being patient and trusting the coaches works out in 99% of cases. There aren't many players to come through our system...not be 'integrated' properly and then perform brilliantly somewhere else. Five players max in 50 years in my opinion.

Let's leave it to the coaches, watch the youngsters grow, enjoy it when they get a chance and cross our fingers that we've found another gem!
 
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Redlyn

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I don't watch the u23 but I thought he didnt do much of note before the Blackburn match. How did he get promoted so fast.
 

Hernandez - BFA

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Very, very brief cameo.
Certainly looks as if he's not 100% ready to deal with the physicality yet - he is 16 after all.