The idea that Liverpool are struggling with injuries has been massively overblown.

[Chairman Steve]

The real problems are clear when they’ve only scored one league goal at home since the start of the year.

If the loss of VVD, Gomez and Matip was the only problem, then they’d be probably still winning relatively consistently, doing just fine scoring wise and it would be just clean sheets would be a rareity. They’d be winning games 3-2 or 2-1 with some high scoring draws in there too

 

[Pogue Mahone]

The real problems are clear when they’ve only scored one league goal at home since the start of the year.

If the loss of VVD, Gomez and Matip was the only problem, then they’d be probably still winning relatively consistently, doing just fine scoring wise and it would be just clean sheets would be a rareity. They’d be winning games 3-2 or 2-1 with some high scoring draws in there too

Something’s been off for them up front since long before the injury crisis. Last season they won a lot of games by a single goal. It’s been two seasons since they were at their free-scoring best.

 

[Irrational.]

Something’s been off for them up front since long before the injury crisis. Last season they won a lot of games by a single goal. It’s been two seasons since they were at their free-scoring best.

This is such a massive and under-reported point. They squeaked through so many games by the skin of their teeth last season, through a refereeing decision, an opposition error or the keeper throwing the ball into his own net.

This season is merely their chickens coming home to roost.

 

[Crustanoid]

Must be the PED cycle mentioned in another thread and the theory might also apply to City getting better this year?

 

[Irwin99]

Not that I mind the idea of Liverpool FC suffering one bit I do think that their injury crisis at the back has hit really hard. Their front 3 don't click anywhere near as well now though either. It's such a cliche but maybe after winning the Champions League and Premiership maybe they've lost a bit of hunger?

Interestingly Cole and Yorke I think had one direct assist/interplay for a United goal after the 98/99 season and although they both did well the following year their numbers slid down considerably after that. Maybe the same is true for Liverpool's front 3? Teams have either figured them out a bit better or they're just not as motivated.

 

[Fox_Chrys]

Against us Sky couldnt stop talking about their injuries, yet almost our entire first choice back 4 was missing and Ricardo was out of position.

 

[Samid]

Every loss is still down to the injuries judging by their fans and media. VVD missing is apparently a legitimate reason for their goals drying up.

We’ve got DDG, Jones, Pogba, Donny, Mata, Rashford, Cavani missing for various reasons. Shaw and Martial are playing through knocks and niggles. Especially in midfield and attack we’re threadbare. We started the season without a pre season and have played every single available midweek since the start. Yet there’s no mention of the players we’re missing and basically relying on the same 11-12 players to play most games.

Some clubs get on with business despite injuries and hectic schedules. Others make silly excuses for their failures.

 

[Dancfc]

It's not overblown in itself, that defensive lineup yesterday was ridiculous, certainly puts us having to play Essien and Ferreira at CB into perspective.

It's not an excuse for results to be like they are though, not even close.

 

[horsechoker]

Every loss is still down to the injuries judging by their fans and media. VVD missing is apparently a legitimate reason for their goals drying up.

We’ve got DDG, Jones, Pogba, Donny, Mata, Rashford, Cavani missing for various reasons. Shaw and Martial are playing through knocks and niggles. Especially in midfield and attack we’re threadbare. We started the season without a pre season and have played every single available midweek since the start. Yet there’s no mention of the players we’re missing and basically relying on the same 11-12 players to play most games.

Some clubs get on with business despite injuries and hectic schedules. Others make silly excuses for their failures.

Liverpool fans don't want to face up to the possibility that the problems might be deeper than Vam Dijk's absense.

Something is rotten there and I hope it continues

 

[dove]

Every loss is still down to the injuries judging by their fans and media. VVD missing is apparently a legitimate reason for their goals drying up.

We’ve got DDG, Jones, Pogba, Donny, Mata, Rashford, Cavani missing for various reasons. Shaw and Martial are playing through knocks and niggles. Especially in midfield and attack we’re threadbare. We started the season without a pre season and have played every single available midweek since the start. Yet there’s no mention of the players we’re missing and basically relying on the same 11-12 players to play most games.

Some clubs get on with business despite injuries and hectic schedules. Others make silly excuses for their failures.

Jones, Mata and VdB never play anyway, we hardly miss them, especially Jones

Have you seen Liverpool's back 4 yesterday? It reminds me the injuries we had with LVG when we used to put similar players in defence as we simply had nobody else. Our fans couldn't stop crying about it and it was a legitimate reason we struggled. Let's not be hypocrites. They should still be doing better than they are but you can't hide the fact they have some injury issues.

 

[Berbasbullet]

Liverpool think they have problems! We have had the next Duncan Edwards injured for years! And they think they got problems? Pfft.

 

[AltiUn]

Liverpool fans don't want to face up to the possibility that the problems might be deeper than Vam Dijk's absense.

Something is rotten there and I hope it continues

They always seem to convinently forget they got pasted 7-2 with van Dijk in the team.

 

[RUCK4444]

Every loss is still down to the injuries judging by their fans and media. VVD missing is apparently a legitimate reason for their goals drying up.

We’ve got DDG, Jones, Pogba, Donny, Mata, Rashford, Cavani missing for various reasons. Shaw and Martial are playing through knocks and niggles. Especially in midfield and attack we’re threadbare. We started the season without a pre season and have played every single available midweek since the start. Yet there’s no mention of the players we’re missing and basically relying on the same 11-12 players to play most games.

Some clubs get on with business despite injuries and hectic schedules. Others make silly excuses for their failures.

It’s laughable at this point.

What does VVD got to do with there goals drying your entirely, or the seemingly massive drop in their work rate all over the pitch! They are just lying to themselves.

Would like to see Mane and Salah move on this summer just to cement this decline.

 

[AshRK]

Jones, Mata and VdB never play anyway, we hardly miss them, especially Jones

Have you seen Liverpool's back 4 yesterday? It reminds me the injuries we had with LVG when we used to put similar players in defence as we simply had nobody else. Our fans couldn't stop crying about it and it was a legitimate reason we struggled. Let's not be hypocrites. They should still be doing better than they are but you can't hide the fact they have some injury issues.

But then according to your logic the only key player they are missing is VVD as matip is always injury prone and so is Gomez.

 

[horsechoker]

They always seem to convinently forget they got pasted 7-2 with van Dijk in the team.

This too which highlights the fact that problems were there from the start.

The pause last year probably delayed these problems because there were signs the wheels were coming off when they were knocked out by AM and lost to Watford.

 

[Samid]

Jones, Mata and VdB never play anyway, we hardly miss them, especially Jones

Have you seen Liverpool's back 4 yesterday? It reminds me the injuries we had with LVG when we used to put similar players in defence as we simply had nobody else. Our fans couldn't stop crying about it and it was a legitimate reason we struggled. Let's not be hypocrites. They should still be doing better than they are but you can't hide the fact they have some injury issues.

Jones, Mata, VdB. Those exact players exist in the Liverpool squad in Matip, Shaqiri and Oxlade. And Liverpool fans have been using those three to hype up their injury 'crisis' at various points throughout the season.

Klopp had Fabinho (their best defender this season) and Arnold on the bench yesterday. That's like saying 'did you see United's back 4 vs Sheffield'? We started Tuanzebe and Telles despite having Lindelof and Shaw on the bench. Benching two main defenders is tactical, it has little to do with injuries.

There's nothing hypocritical about it. LVG was an idiot for trimming the squad as much as he did, and he was rightly so criticised for it at the time. If you leave yourself in a position where 2-3 injuries at the same time equates to relying on unknown youngsters you're basically architecting your own downfall.

 

[Oldyella]

It’s laughable at this point.

What does VVD got to do with there goals drying your entirely, or the seemingly massive drop in their work rate all over the pitch! They are just lying to themselves.

Would like to see Mane and Salah move on this summer just to cement this decline.

I think the decline is more likely to happen if Mane and Salah stay tbh.

 

[RUCK4444]

I think the decline is more likely to happen if Mane and Salah stay tbh.

Yeah perhaps.

Hard to imagine they play as poorly next season but here's hoping.

 

[Judas]

I think the decline is more likely to happen if Mane and Salah stay tbh.

Exactly. Last thing we want is them replaced with younger hungrier players.

 

[Ish]

It’s laughable at this point.

What does VVD got to do with there goals drying your entirely, or the seemingly massive drop in their work rate all over the pitch! They are just lying to themselves.

Would like to see Mane and Salah move on this summer just to cement this decline.

I can't decide if selling Mane and Salah will be a good, or bad thing, at this point for Pool. Especially if they get a fair whack for them to reinvest.

 

[Buchan]

Their poor run of form is in its fourteenth (if not fifteenth) month now - going all the way back to the last January when they spawned a few undeserved wins post-Christmas and were eventually caught out by Atletico, Watford and Chelsea all within a week in February/March - but Liverpool fans would have you believe the fairy dust was only lost five months back when van Dijk and Gomez got injured. Do not let them away with that shite. We haven’t forgotten the absolute dogshit performances last year that were covered up by late goals, opposition howlers and skin-of-their-teeth single-goal wins.

This was coming down the tracks and anyone who said so on this forum last season was ridiculed. It’s absolutely brilliant to see and long may it continue.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Keep Mane and Salah at Pool!

 

[horsechoker]

Keep Mane and Salah at Pool!

At least until their contracts run out so that leave on a free

 

[RUCK4444]

Exactly. Last thing we want is them replaced with younger hungrier players.

Yeah agree with that to an extent but at the same time can you see another entire season with them both playing so poorly?

I'd prefer them to sign a few more Jota's (who's decent in fairness) rather than have Mane and Salah back in top form. Until this poor run the latter two have been ridiculously consistent for them, annoyingly so.

Ideally they stay and play as crap as they have been.

 

[Judas]

Yeah agree with that to an extent but at the same time can you see another entire season with them both playing so poorly?

I'd prefer them to sign a few more Jota's (who's decent in fairness) rather than have Mane and Salah back in top form. Until this poor run the latter two have been ridiculously consistent for them, annoyingly so.

Ideally they stay and play as crap as they have been.

I don’t see either ever reaching the heights they already hit under Klopp again. Especially at their age. I think they’re burnt out and especially Salah has his mind on a move, and even then his numbers are still pretty impressive somehow.

I just think somethings got to change at that club but I hope it doesn’t and the rot continues to set in.

 

[Lentwood]

They are struggling because age is catching up with their best players - it's as simple as that in my opinion.

I had a conversation with a Liverpool-supporter at work at the start of the season and my exact words were 'I think you will probably squeeze one more top year out of Henderson, Mane, Salah, Wijnaldum and Firminho but after that, you will struggle as those players will need to be replaced and that will be tough with FSG in-charge'.

Of course, I was wrong because they haven't squeezed another year out of those players. The whole front three have been off it and the midfield has been exposed as the hard-working but limited players they are without a world-class front three.

To be fair, they did set out to build a team whereby the key players peaked at the same time and they executed that strategy very well and it was hugely successful for them.

 

[izec]

It is a mix of injuries, key players getting older and Klopp's style taking its toll (see injuries). It worked for a while, but they either need a new manager or new key players and rebuild to freshen things up.

 

[The holy trinity 68]

It's not overblown in itself, that defensive lineup yesterday was ridiculous, certainly puts us having to play Essien and Ferreira at CB into perspective.

It's not an excuse for results to be like they are though, not even close.

Jones, Mata and VdB never play anyway, we hardly miss them, especially Jones

Have you seen Liverpool's back 4 yesterday? It reminds me the injuries we had with LVG when we used to put similar players in defence as we simply had nobody else. Our fans couldn't stop crying about it and it was a legitimate reason we struggled. Let's not be hypocrites. They should still be doing better than they are but you can't hide the fact they have some injury issues.

They didn't even lose yesterday due to that back 4 though. They lost because Salah made a mistake that was capitalised on and then Liverpool's attackers failed to score yet again. They also had TAA and Fabinho on the bench but Klopp chose to play the youngsters instead.

Players Liverpool have had fit for most of the season include; Allison, Mane, Salah, Firmino, Henderson, Fabinho, Shaqiri, Robertson, TAA, Origi, Thiago, Chamberlain. That is nearly all their best players and even then, injuries are not an excuse to have lost 6 home games in a row, especially with most of the above available.

 

[RUCK4444]

I don’t see either ever reaching the heights they already hit under Klopp again. Especially at their age. I think they’re burnt out and especially Salah has his mind on a move, and even then his numbers are still pretty impressive somehow.

I just think somethings got to change at that club but I hope it doesn’t and the rot continues to set in.

Yeah I suppose the risk as well is that Klopp tends to polish turds with the best of them.

I think they will cash in on Salah this summer, whilst he is young enough to command a high fee.

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

It’s laughable at this point.

What does VVD got to do with there goals drying your entirely, or the seemingly massive drop in their work rate all over the pitch! They are just lying to themselves.

Would like to see Mane and Salah move on this summer just to cement this decline.

It’s ok, because they have that world class, non scoring forward called Firminho

the most overrated striker of the past decade (at least).

long may he continue to play.

apparently, he makes other players better

 

[The holy trinity 68]

It’s ok, because they have that world class, non scoring forward called Fabinho.

the most overrated striker of the past decade (at least).

long may he continue to play.

apparently, he makes other players better

You mean Firmino

 

[cjj]

Rather than injuries specifically making them 'hard done by', I think the previous two seasons they had a LOT of luck with injuries.

Klopp did this season what ended Pochettino a couple ago by barely rotating and pushing players carrying small injuries until they were burnt out. I don't think this 'turbo football' style ("high intensity") is maintainable, but I think lots of managers have the old "no manager lasts more than 3 seasons, anyway" mentality where they think that they can just rinse a squad dry, reap the rewards, then leave the mess for someone else. Fergie's last season was a little like that, but with old players rather than simply tired ones.

Crazy how their main success was based on getting Allison in to replace a calamity keeper in Karius, and they seem to have coached him into regressing into Karius this season. Nothing unsettles a defence like not having confidence in the keeper.

 

[Robbie Boy]

At least until their contracts run out so that leave on a free

Dream scenario.

 

[padr81]

This is so much like how Klopps Dortmund started his final season its uncanny (just happened 4 months later in the season). Injuries haven't helped but at this stage its not just injuries... They've been outworked in every game since Christmas. They are running on empty. It looks like other teams want it more but I think its more a case of Liverpool just don't have it to give at the minute.

An article on the issues his Dortmund side had at the beginning of the end... not scoring despite dominating, defensive calamities, injuries. Performances slowly dropping to match poor results... all the hall marks of current Liverpool, but you feel he can still turn it around at Liverpool when a minor refresh but they def need an injection somewhere, thinking a Firmino replacement, Thiago to hit form and a 4th CB.

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

You mean Firmino

I do. Predictive text was causing me issues, I must have then got distracted...

 

[jackal&hyde]

It's not overblown in itself, that defensive lineup yesterday was ridiculous, certainly puts us having to play Essien and Ferreira at CB into perspective.

It's not an excuse for results to be like they are though, not even close.

I remember we played Carrick and Fletcher as center back at times and Rafael CM. Injuries are very important but IMO the players lost a lot of motivation. Something SAF was always very careful not to happen, even letting good players go when he felt that was the case.

They have been rather lucky with injuries for the last 2 season anyway.

 

[crossy1686]

This is so much like how Klopps Dortmund started his final season its uncanny (just happened 4 months later in the season). Injuries haven't helped but at this stage its not just injuries... They've been outworked in every game since Christmas. They are running on empty. It looks like other teams want it more but I think its more a case of Liverpool just don't have it to give at the minute.

It does have a touch of that, however I think the depth outside of their first 11 is pretty weak.

We’re at a strange point in squad building across Europe where none of the big teams really have a bench that’s on par with the starting 11 anymore. City are probably the team closest to having that but there’s still a drop off.

The days of big teams keeping good players on the bench are over so these types of capitulations are going to be more frequent

 

[padr81]

It does have a touch of that, however I think the depth outside of their first 11 is pretty weak.

We’re at a strange point in squad building across Europe where none of the big teams really have a bench that’s on par with the starting 11 anymore. City are probably the team closest to having that but there’s still a drop off.

The days of big teams keeping good players on the bench are over so these types of capitulations are going to be more frequent

Good point too, especially this season. They were never gonna get away with running the team into the ground. I mean Pickford being Pickford fecked up VVD but a ton of their other injuries are muscular etc... I think they'll be more normal next season if they ride this one out but it seems to have a familiar feeling (not that I'm complaining). They have the potential to be great still. I wonder if Salah will stick around if they miss the CL, he seems the most likely to want out. I think the rest will stick.

 

[Jericho]

They're missing Van Djik, Gomez, Matip and Henderson yesterday. That left them with only Salah, Mane, Firminio, Keita, Thiago, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Jota, Shaqiri, Fabinho, Alexander-Arnold, Robertson, Wijnaldum. Ofcourse injuries are the reason they can't win a game or score a goal.

 

[Norman Brownbutter]

I don’t remember us falling apart when we lost Rio for a 8 months.