Does being a newbie hinder your reading ability? We've done this in other threads, your continual grinding at this bone seems to have affected your brain.
Guardian: Manchester United lose £200m training kit deal over fans’ anti-Glazers campaign
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
Yeah because that’s definitely what’s going to happen if fans pressure owners into selling the club because of the debt. Someone’s going to come along and just borrow more, so logical and plausible.
On the other hand a scenario where you just accept the owners can use the clubs money to pay off leveraged debt that’s a huge deterrent.No one in their right mind would even consider it then, you’ve really nailed it, a truly brilliant business mind. And banks will definitely lend billions that can never be repaid, and someone will think it’s a great idea to own an asset that will have huge interest payments they could not service by seeing their investment plummet.
Like I said stock exchange, look it up. It’s not all about billionaires or leveraged buyouts.
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Delusional.
Bless you been shown up and that’s all you’ve got. Here’s a tip when you come with one of these brilliant ideas check it actually supports what your arguing. Keep trying you’ll get there sooner or later.Delusional.
And like I said look up what the stock exchange is.
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It seems there is quite a strong intent to have the Liverpool match cancelled once again on Thursday. If that happens once again, then shit is going to get even more real for our lovely owners.
I have to say, I'm quite enjoying Project Mayhem so far. I think that in time, some of the opponents to the movement on here will gradually jump onboard too.
"His name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion"
I have to say, I'm quite enjoying Project Mayhem so far. I think that in time, some of the opponents to the movement on here will gradually jump onboard too.
"His name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion"
It seems there is quite a strong intent to have the Liverpool match cancelled once again on Thursday. If that happens once again, then shit is going to get even more real for our lovely owners.
I have to say, I'm quite enjoying Project Mayhem so far. I think that in time, some of the opponents to the movement on here will gradually jump onboard too.
"His name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion"
What have we been through? For you to be able to say who is or isn’t a real fan is quite funny when you said that United fans deserved to be be beat up.
You’re also calling other people extremists with the views you hold
And you say that we havent payed that becourse of them? Why have the club payed all this money?No they haven't.
That's how much has been paid by the club.
It would be great to get it cancelled again. I hope it can be done peacefully as it would eliminate a lot of the negative press whilst sustaining the message that we aren't just going to go away.It seems there is quite a strong intent to have the Liverpool match cancelled once again on Thursday. If that happens once again, then shit is going to get even more real for our lovely owners.
I have to say, I'm quite enjoying Project Mayhem so far. I think that in time, some of the opponents to the movement on here will gradually jump onboard too.
"His name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion"
We. Us lot. OUR gang. We are not a blouse. Not a hat. Not a cravat. But we...
...Are tragic. Boo-hoo sad and tearjerker tragic. The logic is remedial. Indeed it is. Especially when deployed of a Tuesday. Very remedial indeed.
Businesses go under. What an unpleasant prospect. I wonder how Legacy Fans of our club will like our NEW super duper plans, dreamt up on the back of a postage stamp. We don’t want to appear ungrateful. This time we will TELL the Legacy Fans. We can COMMUNICATE with them. After all, we have SO much in common...
It’s going really well, all this letter-writing. I’m gobsmacked we didn’t think of the Legacy Fans before. How do we start? Dear Drasdo/MUST person, would you mind if we did that dividend thing again at the weekend?
DEAR CAFE, we are remedial.. Double or single pivot?
They're asset still nets them a cool £20m in dividends. When you've got no intention of selling something it doesn't matter what it's worth.
Odds are that barring a few extremist purists, virtually no one wants that. More importantly, no one thinks that. They're thinking quite the opposite, in fact. TL;DR at the end.
The vast majority of the 'people thinking this is good' are approaching this akin to chemotherapy.
They're 'calculating' - to varying degrees of ability, of course - that the Glazers are among the two or three very worst possible owners in existence, hence the odds are pretty good we'll be able to attract better owners, and with a lot of effort and dialogue and external help such as government intervention, maybe even good or great owners who really know what they're doing, will implement a plan to substantially decrease the debt over two or even one-ish sponsorship cycle and get to where every financial-minded poster is pointing out: this club can compete with the petro-clubs without substantial owner investment.
Almost more importantly than that, they're also calculating that the show of force will discourage, or pre-emptively 'filter out' any Glazer-type prospective owners via various means that most fans won't even know about let alone consider. People in the 0.01% world aren't all chums and pals generally united in the common pursuit of exploiting those below. They have allies and enemies and agendas far away from football but that can be 'thrown into the package' so to speak during any machinations. Fan movements like this can aid like-minded prospective owners and hinder Glazer-types via political - and in this case potentially quite literally political - maneuverings. Fan protests and action like this can help a 'good/great' buyer manipulate themselves into the picture.
The people 'thinking this is good' are thinking (in broad strokes):
A. if you buy the club and do things right, you'll have this kind of fan support at your back (AKA once the dust settles, you'll be picking up the club 'on a song' but you-and-I-and-banks-and-sponsors all know that that any 'depreciated' numbers aren't the real numbers, they're the numbers generated while the fanbase drove out the Glazers using 'chemotherapy'
B. if you're someone like the Glazers, kindly on't even bother applying for the job.
C. if you're someone of means, you know how to calculate and utilize these things; we'll try and keep doing our part until someone like you can finally take action
Among the fanbase, there are certain more knowledgeable people thinking very very strategic and tactical things in the midst of all this. But the above A through C is the core of it.
TL;DR Everyone very much realizes there can be short-term pain. These people are banking on able buyers recognizing and utilizing that leverage. On average, it's actually the 'don't you realize you're hurting the club derp derp' people who don't realize they aren't seeing nearly as far as the vast majority of protesters.
Like the below:
Yeah, you're right, billionaires are famous for giving away their billions...
Some good publicity for the campaign which is great to see.
Long term though the club will pick up another sponsor for the training kit but that's not the point. Keeping the issue very much in the forefront of the media is. That said I hope no more issues of the same nature tomorrow or Thursday.
Long term though the club will pick up another sponsor for the training kit but that's not the point. Keeping the issue very much in the forefront of the media is. That said I hope no more issues of the same nature tomorrow or Thursday.
All this is great but people are presuming they will actually sell. What if they never do? What then?
You obviously don’t realise but the stock exchange isn’t a place where you give shares away, you sell them.
I know it’s crazy but in the real world it’s actually possible for there to be outcomes in between the club being given away (dumbest yet that no one has every mentioned until now) or loaded with billions of debt, burnt to the ground etc.
Here’s something that will really blow your mind, the Glazers have already sold off some of the club on the stock exchange and made hundreds of millions.
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I know exactly what the stock exchange is my friend, I trade it for a living.
These people only care about making money, billionaires are looking for their next billion, and if it’s a billion you can make passively your better than the next billionaire that has to graft for it.
They have sold of shares to raise capital, it’s called taking profits along the way so you can create liquidity for further investments. It’s common practice.
Course you do, what about it being given away?. Where did you pluck that gem from?. Pleased you did some Googling after I told you about the shares already being sold.
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What are you talking about? I was referring to another billionaire coming in to buy the club, with a section of fans that expect them just to front $4b (potentially more) and then not expect a single penny return on that investment. You don’t have to be a billionaire to see how little sense that makes.
As I previously stated, insider share sell offs are a common way to raise capital. Manchester United share price has barely moved in the last 16 years, it isn’t going to move anytime soon because there’s no momentum in sports team stocks, they’re largely unprofitable or rarely make enough to make them worth investing in. Just to give you a comparison, Tesco make more per quarter than United make in yearly revenue.
This is really what fans are expecting, a big giveaway by greedy owners.
I said they’ll list it which didn’t seem to mean anything to you (despite being a trader) as you think I was referring to a white knight that’s going to spend more than clubs worth and expect nothing back.
What’s the expectation? Sell something that nets a cool £20m a year, and maybe more in the future as revenue increases, or sit on it for another 30 years or more, pass it down the family and eclipse any money from a potential sale and secure family wealth forever?
It’s almost like there are different outcomes and expectations, and some more viable than the club being given away or other extremes.
If so it’s going to hurt us a lot more than help us.
The Glazers listened to the fans and have extended an Olive branch this past week, hopefully they put words into actions.
If it happens again I’m going to see points reductions being a real possibility and it may move us out of UCL places.
Winning the EL is not guaranteed either!
The Glazers listened to the fans and have extended an Olive branch this past week, hopefully they put words into actions.
If it happens again I’m going to see points reductions being a real possibility and it may move us out of UCL places.
Winning the EL is not guaranteed either!
It seems there is quite a strong intent to have the Liverpool match cancelled once again on Thursday. If that happens once again, then shit is going to get even more real for our lovely owners.
I have to say, I'm quite enjoying Project Mayhem so far. I think that in time, some of the opponents to the movement on here will gradually jump onboard too.
"His name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion, his name is alexthelion"
It’s daft really. Like the FA just won’t move the game to an unnamed stadium and not announce where the game will take place. It doesn’t have to be played at Old Trafford
wow
The battle is over, the yanks are defeated, they've fecked off.
or not..
don't count your chickens before they hatch
"sources claim" that they've pulled out of contract talks.
Talks have been taking place about finding a replacement. But it is understood one of the front-runners, The Hut Group (THG), has pulled out of a potential deal.
The battle is over, the yanks are defeated, they've fecked off.
or not..
don't count your chickens before they hatch
"sources claim" that they've pulled out of contract talks.
Talks have been taking place about finding a replacement. But it is understood one of the front-runners, The Hut Group (THG), has pulled out of a potential deal.
This is the key point, the Glazers basically bought the club for nothing and have been getting a dividend out of it every year since. If we lose 20 mil a season from a training ground sponsor and are unable to replace it, its likely to come out of the wages or transfer kitty, it just seems like there is going to be very little motivation for them to sell because its their golden cash cow that they gamed to acquire.
So its been amazing to see all this unfolding, great to have the negative press and the visuals of the fans storming Old Trafford but we could slash the clubs worth to 50% and it would still be 2 billion pure profit for the Glazers.
But almost every purchase of a football club is not with the intent for profit - hardly any make any profits, everyone knows this. There are a few exceptions like United, but it that doesn’t exactly help your point.
Rich people buy football clubs because they want a shiny toy, for the most part. Wouldn’t you agree?
The delusion in this thread is incredible
Why do some people find it so hard to just hold their hands up and admit they got it wrong?
I would be inclined to disagree. Most owners look to buy a club they feel they can improve, whether that be get promoted to the PL or get into the champions league, with the intention of then selling on at a later date. This is the reason clubs like Sunderland keep finding new buyers. No one loves the club and wants to spend millions on it, they’re looking to flip it and walk away with tens of millions in profit for a few years work.
Has there ever been a case, in the history of football where an owner has bought at club at the peak of its powers? A simple “yes, I love this club, I will buy whatever the price and shovel money into it until I have no more”.
United on the other hand are one of the few clubs that are actually profitable, and therefore offer a unique opportunity to any owner. No one would willingly buy United and not expect a return when the opportunity is clearly there.
It’s become school kid fantasy at this point.The delusion in this thread is incredible
“We can take down the school and the teachers”.
You can disagree all you like but it’s not the reality, especially with major clubs
I just love this blind faith people have in the charitable nature of billionaires, and/or that some lifelong United fan billionaire is going to come along and save the day. It’s a fantasy narrative that the Glazers are evil people, made up by people with a fundamental lack of understanding as to how the world actually works.
Actually, I do believe Joel Glazer gave money to the Republicans in 2012. But then he's supported the Democrats too, as you say.
And Ed Glazer - who gave quite a bit to Trump - apparently contributed to Hillary's campaign in 2016.
Not much you can read into that sort of thing anyway - it's mostly business, as they say.
But answer the question. When was the last time a club that was successful was purchased for a massive amount of money at the owners expense and the owner wasn't oil rich or state funded?
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To those who were saying it's BS
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Let's break your utter shambles of convo into parts and answer to them, okay, mate?
1. Who knows if it really is or isn't but the timing of it clearly suggests it is. Plus the sponsor sent info that it is clearly about fan protests.
2. Well duh, mate, this is the point. We want to make them sell our club. If they can't buy players then Man Utd will be left behind, we won't make it into CL, Glazers will lose even more money (whether directly or non-directly) Regarding this sponsor, the deal had been signed/or very close to replace AON on 1st of July 2021. If u want to write a half-baked long story then go to Man City forums. Very good if it has impact on transfer window, more fans would be upset about it and more protests.
3. What are u talking mate? 94% of our outgoings are club related? During the Glazer years United has generated 5,9B pounds revenue out of which 1,1 Billion has went to interest payments, SwillsRamble made great thread about it where they write that 1,8 Billion has went to Glazers out of the club, have you read it? maybe you should before u start writing nonsense here, 94%
where did u even come up with that number???4. Everything that you write is good, that is what we want to happen, to get Glazers to get lost. Again Less transfers - More people angry - more and angry protests
5. i would just say, short term pain for long term gain
Your whole post is so badly written, you have done 0 research and are just talking about things you dont know. I know that OT is leaking, Academy and training ground has seen less investment than Liverpool, Arsenal, Tottenham, Man City. out of 5,9 Billion revenue 30% has gone to Glazers. Do you understand?
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Go and read, then maybe you can write educated posts
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Why are some people taking the ludicrous stance that this will make United a toxic brand for sponsors (or prospective buyers)?
The whole point is that it's the Glazers who are toxic. Companies looking at sponsoring us are not run by morons, they realise perfectly well that it's association with the Glazer family that could damage their brand, not association with Manchester United.
The whole point is that it's the Glazers who are toxic. Companies looking at sponsoring us are not run by morons, they realise perfectly well that it's association with the Glazer family that could damage their brand, not association with Manchester United.