Donny van de Beek image 34

Donny van de Beek Netherlands flag

2021-22 Performances


View full 2021-22 profile

5.7 Season Average Rating
Appearances
14
Goals
1
Assists
0
Yellow cards
1
Status
Not open for further replies.

Oranges038

Full Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2020
Messages
11,788
But how does this matter if he was Ole signing or club signing? Maybe he was not preferred by Ole, but surely our midfield is a mess and we need to find a solution at least for the next 2 months (possibly 7). I would expect any manager to make the best use of his resources, which I think we're not doing properly right now. Do you think this treatment of van de Beek is justified because "he's not Ole signing", especially in this dramatic situation we have?

To be honest at this point I think Ole won't play van de Beek because if he turns out to be better than either of Fred, Matic, McTominay and Pogba (and IMO chances for that are not slim), it will make him look foolish because he was wrong for the whole time.
I posted the other day that at this stage it just looks like pure stubbornness from Ole. He has made up his mind and he's just not going to give him a chance.

I think the reason it gets to a lot of people is that he's given more chances to underperforming players and ones that have disappointed time and time again than he's prepared to give DVB.
 

pocco

loco
Joined
Mar 17, 2010
Messages
22,097
Location
Keep a clean shit tomorrow, United is my final bus
If you still think it was Ole that bought him at this stage then my word......

Never been more confident of anything ever that he was a club signing. No manager treats a player they supposedly wanted this way otherwise.

The club is to blame yet again. We are still signing players the manager hasn't asked for. Happened under the previous two managers too.
Wrong. Ole convinced him to sign.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ma...-news/solskjaer-told-van-de-beek-18871580.amp
 

McGrathsipan

Dawn’s less famous husband
Joined
Jun 25, 2009
Messages
24,581
Location
Dublin
Perfect idea to send him to barca on loan. Get minutes on big stage next to de jong again. If he performs obviously take him back, if not, cut losses
Why the feck would he want to come back!

He has to leave for the good of his career and then put this period of time behind him. Footballers have limited time in their careers

I think its poor that he hasnt been given a chance however he isnt getting one when the master tactician remains in charge.

I wish him well at his new club - which will be announced early in January I would reckon
 

Bilbo

TeaBaggins
Joined
Sep 27, 2004
Messages
14,208
It's weird how people are determined to make more out of this than what it is. Donny hasn't done enough to get into the team. It really is that simple.
 

Big Ben Foster

Correctly predicted Portugal to win Euro 2016
Joined
Mar 19, 2008
Messages
12,455
Location
BR -> MI -> TX
Supports
Also support Vasco da Gama
It's weird how people are determined to make more out of this than what it is. Donny hasn't done enough to get into the team. It really is that simple.
He's played five minutes all season
 

Bilbo

TeaBaggins
Joined
Sep 27, 2004
Messages
14,208
He's played five minutes all season
Exactly. Do you think we would leave a player who is killing it on the training field on the bench the whole time? Of course not. We've used multiple combinations of players in our midfield this season. If he isn't figuring then its because he isn't making a compelling case.

I feel for the player that this move hasn't worked out how he would have liked it to, but I find it difficult to believe that there is some internal agenda against him. We have a number of players that can't get onto the field.
 

Terranova

Full Member
Joined
Nov 12, 2020
Messages
1,069
Supports
United/Ajax
It's weird how people are determined to make more out of this than what it is. Donny hasn't done enough to get into the team. It really is that simple.
It's weird that people are determined to believe that any thing Ole does is correct. Even if you're die hard Ole-in, you can't believe that everything he does is perfect.
You probably also believe that Sancho hasn't done enough to get into the team?

Or maaaaaaaaybe it's a stubborn manager without any tactical knowledge to get anything out of players that actually know how to play football instead of kick&rush.
 

moses

Can't We Just Be Nice?
Staff
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Messages
42,771
Location
I have no idea either, yet.
Exactly. Do you think we would leave a player who is killing it on the training field on the bench the whole time? Of course not. We've used multiple combinations of players in our midfield this season. If he isn't figuring then its because he isn't making a compelling case.

I feel for the player that this move hasn't worked out how he would have liked it to, but I find it difficult to believe that there is some internal agenda against him. We have a number of players that can't get onto the field.
I'd take issue with that bolded part a little bit.
 

Foxbatt

New Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2013
Messages
14,297
It's weird how people are determined to make more out of this than what it is. Donny hasn't done enough to get into the team. It really is that simple.
he must be worse than any player we have at United then. Maybe he is not really the player who was at Ajax? Maybe he is an imposter. Even Bebe had more chances than DVB at United.
 

Foxbatt

New Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2013
Messages
14,297
I'm trying to be diplomatic. The United forum is terrifying.
Yes I do understand that. I am not that big a fan of DVB but this is criminal in how he is being treated at United. He is a young man trying to make a career in football and he has been sold a lot of BS and comes to United and then never gets a chance to play or to move to another club. He has lost his International place in his national team. Yes he gets paid to sit on the bench but it is like living in an abusive relationship for him now.
 

Bilbo

TeaBaggins
Joined
Sep 27, 2004
Messages
14,208
I'd take issue with that bolded part a little bit.
McTominay & Fred is our most consistent partnership, but we've seen Pogba/Matic, Pogba/Fred, Matic/Fred & Pogba/McTominay all used this season in the PL & CL.
 

moses

Can't We Just Be Nice?
Staff
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Messages
42,771
Location
I have no idea either, yet.
Yes I do understand that. I am not that big a fan of DVB but this is criminal in how he is being treated at United. He is a young man trying to make a career in football and he has been sold a lot of BS and comes to United and then never gets a chance to play or to move to another club. He has lost his International place in his national team. Yes he gets paid to sit on the bench but it is like living in an abusive relationship for him now.
Yeah pretty much but from what I've seen (pre United, mostly in clips) and read I think I do like him, or could, but would definitely like to know.
 

moses

Can't We Just Be Nice?
Staff
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Messages
42,771
Location
I have no idea either, yet.
McTominay & Fred is our most consistent partnership, but we've seen Pogba/Matic, Pogba/Fred, Matic/Fred & Pogba/McTominay all used this season in the PL & CL.
I still that's pretty conservative shuffling if you have a new €40m midfielder sitting on your bench.
 

Chief123

Full Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2013
Messages
12,789
He's played 5 mins of PL football and people still think he was an Ole signing just because they want to blame him for everything. Incredible.

Definitely not a player he wanted. I have never seen a manager treat their 'big money transfer' of the summer like this before.

All the rumours were Sancho and Grealish last summer and out of nowhere, and without the press even knowing about it, Donny was signed.

All points to what I'm saying but if you hate Ole you can never agree clearly.

It's actually perfectly plausible that Ole is not good enough AND Donny was a club signing.
If the fact Donny hasn't played much is a sign he wasn't an Ole signing. Well I guess we could say the same about Sancho. Barely been used yet he was most certainly an Ole signing as he wanted him ever since he got the Utd job. The truth is no one has a clue whether Ole wanted him or not.
 

Bilbo

TeaBaggins
Joined
Sep 27, 2004
Messages
14,208
I still that's pretty conservative shuffling if you have a new €40m sitting on your bench.
It's almost every possible combination of midfield using those four players, and still Donny is not getting onto the pitch. I thought he was pretty decent in his last performance against West Ham, and that perhaps he might kick on from there, but he is playing for a club that are searching pretty hard for a winning formula in the middle and he is not getting anywhere near it. It can only be because he isn't showing enough in training.
 

Adam-Utd

Part of first caf team to complete Destiny raid
Joined
Sep 10, 2010
Messages
39,954
It's weird how people are determined to make more out of this than what it is. Donny hasn't done enough to get into the team. It really is that simple.
Do you really think a professional at this level wouldn't be doing well enough in training? He played for a top club in Holland, he's made the national team many times.

You simply don't get that far by being rubbish in training.

We heard reports at the start of the season that he was training very well and his team mates were impressed. So why is it he now has LESS minutes than he did in his first year?

His performances on the pitch have been a decent level, certainly not rubbish or well below his team mates. Nowhere near enough to say he doesn't deserve to ever play again.

It's quite simply Ole doesn't like him. Whether it's his style, his personality, his agent mouthing off? something is clearly making him not give him a chance.

NOBODY can say he's had a fair crack at his time here.
 

Litch

Full Member
Joined
Dec 23, 2013
Messages
10,183
Whether good enough or not, not playing him at all is complete madness. Something has happened I'm in no doubt and will come out in the wash.
 

moses

Can't We Just Be Nice?
Staff
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Messages
42,771
Location
I have no idea either, yet.
It's almost every possible combination of midfield using those four players, and still Donny is not getting onto the pitch. I thought he was pretty decent in his last performance against West Ham, and that perhaps he might kick on from there, but he is playing for a club that are searching pretty hard for a winning formula in the middle and he is not getting anywhere near it. It can only be because he isn't showing enough in training.
Maybe, but he's here a long time, and was supposedly not allowed leave and wasn't sold to make way for someone better. From whatever perspective it's not good.
 

Borys

Statistics Wizard
Joined
May 10, 2013
Messages
9,023
Location
Bielsko Biala, Poland
Exactly. Do you think we would leave a player who is killing it on the training field on the bench the whole time? Of course not. We've used multiple combinations of players in our midfield this season. If he isn't figuring then its because he isn't making a compelling case.

I feel for the player that this move hasn't worked out how he would have liked it to, but I find it difficult to believe that there is some internal agenda against him. We have a number of players that can't get onto the field.
Has Fred been making a compelling case to be our regular starter this season? Are you satisfied enough with his performances so that you're not interested what can other options bring to the team?

Van de Beek played a good game vs West Ham in the EFL, was one of the best players on the pitch. Hasn't played a minute since. I find it difficult to believe he's worse than Fred on current form. And I didn't get that impression watching Donny in those few (few and far between) performances this season.
 

Bilbo

TeaBaggins
Joined
Sep 27, 2004
Messages
14,208
Has Fred been making a compelling case to be our regular starter this season? Are you satisfied enough with his performances so that you're not interested what can other options bring to the team?

Van de Beek played a good game vs West Ham in the EFL, was one of the best players on the pitch. Hasn't played a minute since. I find it difficult to believe he's worse than Fred on current form. And I didn't get that impression watching Donny in those few (few and far between) performances this season.
I think we know for the most part what we are going to get from Fred. He's rarely brilliant and he's rarely terrible, but he is reliable and he is one half of the combination that seems to be our best one available.

There is so much that we don't see. How Donny trains. What he is like as a personality. How he gets on with the other players. How he is actually delivering on his specific instructions. I have no agenda against him, and I actually think he has the potential to add another dimension to our midfield, but I have to object to any notion that he is not being played out of spite because that just doesn't sound logical to me.
 

Foxbatt

New Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2013
Messages
14,297
I think we know for the most part what we are going to get from Fred. He's rarely brilliant and he's rarely terrible, but he is reliable and he is one half of the combination that seems to be our best one available.

There is so much that we don't see. How Donny trains. What he is like as a personality. How he gets on with the other players. How he is actually delivering on his specific instructions. I have no agenda against him, and I actually think he has the potential to add another dimension to our midfield, but I have to object to any notion that he is not being played out of spite because that just doesn't sound logical to me.
It's exactly what it is. Either Ole has no clue. He has played in the Semis of the CL. A lot more than we have played with Ole as a manager. He has played for Holland. If Ole don't rate him I have no issues with that. It's his call but for ffs sake he bought him too. Then he refused to let him go on loan either. He refuses to give him any chance either. He is destroying his career.
 

Borys

Statistics Wizard
Joined
May 10, 2013
Messages
9,023
Location
Bielsko Biala, Poland
I think we know for the most part what we are going to get from Fred. He's rarely brilliant and he's rarely terrible, but he is reliable and he is one half of the combination that seems to be our best one available.

There is so much that we don't see. How Donny trains. What he is like as a personality. How he gets on with the other players. How he is actually delivering on his specific instructions. I have no agenda against him, and I actually think he has the potential to add another dimension to our midfield, but I have to object to any notion that he is not being played out of spite because that just doesn't sound logical to me.
As a big fan of Fred I disagree about him rarely being terrible. He had some really good spells for us but right now he's consistenly poor.
The bolded part is the problem - we don't know how combinations with van de Beek would look like because he's not even considered as an option for the manager. Which is very very strange.
 

Bilbo

TeaBaggins
Joined
Sep 27, 2004
Messages
14,208
As a big fan of Fred I disagree about him rarely being terrible. He had some really good spells for us but right now he's consistenly poor.
The bolded part is the problem - we don't know how combinations with van de Beek would look like because he's not even considered as an option for the manager. Which is very very strange.
I think it would be stranger if Donny's good performances in our shirt had outweighed the bad, but I don't believe that to be the case. Its an unanswerable question really. Is he not in the team because he isn't getting a chance, or is he not getting a chance because he isn't showing enough to get one? Who knows for sure, but it's most likely to be the latter.
 

Ronaldo's ego

Incorrectly predicted the 2020 US Election
Joined
Nov 22, 2012
Messages
7,669
Location
I'm better than Messi (even though I'm not)
If you still think it was Ole that bought him at this stage then my word......

Never been more confident of anything ever that he was a club signing. No manager treats a player they supposedly wanted this way otherwise.

The club is to blame yet again. We are still signing players the manager hasn't asked for. Happened under the previous two managers too.
It’s bizarre a board that seemingly knows little about football and only cares about making money would go over the mangers head and spend big on DVB. I can understand them bringing Ronaldo - former player, one of the greats, household name, cash cow. He ticks all the boxes, VDB ticks none of those.

Ole’s found his new formation and he’s going to stick with it so Sancho and Greenwood are the next victims. Ole spent 2 years chasing Sancho and the board backed him and paid a lot of money for him, kid won’t get much of a look in now. The board aren’t getting a pass, they never do but everyone at the club needs to be held accountable, including Ole. The truth is he fecked up because he hasn’t a fecking clue himself.
 

clarkydaz

Full Member
Joined
Oct 25, 2013
Messages
13,354
Location
manchester
Exactly. Do you think we would leave a player who is killing it on the training field on the bench the whole time? Of course not. We've used multiple combinations of players in our midfield this season. If he isn't figuring then its because he isn't making a compelling case.

I feel for the player that this move hasn't worked out how he would have liked it to, but I find it difficult to believe that there is some internal agenda against him. We have a number of players that can't get onto the field.
You cant apply that logic with this manager. Explain Bailley signing a new contract being ignored for a lardarse Maguire with one days training with him being the root cause of a hammering. common sense doesnt apply with Ole.
 

skc_18

Full Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2021
Messages
374
This. It is beyond footballing reasons. I assumed he is not getting time because Pogba is not sold last season as planned but he is not getting time even when Pogba is not playing.

Out of McT/Fred/Pogba he is the most press resistant because he is not static like others. Pogba however has higher quality so it makes sense to play him but can't find any reason why he cant replace McT/Fred few games especially even if one of them is injured. Bizzare considering we are pretty bad in the midfield-defense linkage.

There are too many 'players not happy with manager and manager getting sacked' vibes right now at Man Utd
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sultan

Nou_Camp99

what would Souness do?
Joined
Apr 1, 2013
Messages
10,274
Yeah, okay then :houllier:

Basically, good signing = Ole signing
Bad signing = Woodward signing
Not what I said at all. Wan Bissaka was clearly Oles player as he plays nearly every game and I'm not his biggest fan.

Maguire plays. AWB plays. Bruno plays. Even Dan James played a lot before leaving. Donny doesn't. Stop the difference.

He was quite obviously not Oles man.
 

NZT-One

Full Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2021
Messages
2,342
Location
Berlin
Yes I do understand that. I am not that big a fan of DVB but this is criminal in how he is being treated at United. He is a young man trying to make a career in football and he has been sold a lot of BS and comes to United and then never gets a chance to play or to move to another club. He has lost his International place in his national team. Yes he gets paid to sit on the bench but it is like living in an abusive relationship for him now.
Come on... Getting overdramatic will not make this any better. I am sure, DVB has the ability to terminate his contract, might be connected to a fine, might be impossible to get registered somewhere else before summer but if he wanted, he could just end it.

McTominay & Fred is our most consistent partnership, but we've seen Pogba/Matic, Pogba/Fred, Matic/Fred & Pogba/McTominay all used this season in the PL & CL.
Exactly that. The manager tried stuff in midfield, and in the match against Young Boys, Fred and Donny were the starting midfield. So acting as if the manager is only going the same people is just wrong. He has his go-to-guys, but which manager hasn't? This debate is spinning so relentlessly not because there a people thinking Donny shouldn't get a chance or more chances, it is spinning because there are so many people borderline claiming he only needs a few chances so he can finally take the place in the starting lineup. I wouldn't be too shocked, if all that only sets it up for failure because he will never be as good as some people imagine him to be. Would he be a better player in Ajax instead of Fred? 100% - no question about it. But he isn't at Ajax anymore. He is at United, a team with many flaws.

You cant apply that logic with this manager. Explain Bailley signing a new contract being ignored for a lardarse Maguire with one days training with him being the root cause of a hammering. common sense doesnt apply with Ole.
I am not sure where it was, might be Stretford paddock where they interviewed a data analyst who had a deeper look into Uniteds data. They talked about two mainstays in the team: Maguire and Shaw. They are the go-to-guys for most of the other players. They make others more comfortable because they show up for the ball and most of the time, they will deal with it. Thats why both of them play, even through injury. Without them, others would have to step up, but who would that be? AWB? Lindelof? McTominay? De Gea.

I don't want to deny your point, I agree with it. But there might be a logic in there. Not saying that logic = the right thing to do.

This. It is beyond footballing reasons. I assumed he is not getting time because Pogba is not sold last season as planned but he is not getting time even when Pogba is not playing.

Out of McT/Fred/Pogba he is the most press resistant because he is not static like others. Pogba however has higher quality so it makes sense to play him but can't find any reason why he cant replace McT/Fred few games especially even if one of them is injured. Bizzare considering we are pretty bad in the midfield-defense linkage.

There are too many 'players not happy with manager and manager getting sacked' vibes right now at Man Utd
Midfield isn't just about being press-resistant. Infact, apart from Southhampton, I didn't see many instances where we have been pressed all that much. But I guess you mean that DVBs technical level is way higher than the one of McFred so more unlikely to make mistakes and thats probably true.

I am with you, he should get a chance. At this point I am starting to lean towards just giving him a start in a difficult PL game which ends all these talks about him being great at this, this and that. I hope we aren't growing the next Pogba here. A player where after 5 years we are still unsure what to use him for.
 

Tomuś

Nani is crap, I tell you!
Joined
Oct 17, 2011
Messages
6,177
Location
Świdnik
So we assume that Woodward scouted and bought him then, alright.

Not that he wouldn't even know him before being handed the papers obviously.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.