Its not a debate, never was. Ronaldo's fans think it is, but it's not. Atalanta, 5th in the Calcio ffs
Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance
- Thread starter Rado_N
- Start date
- Status
Hendrix is miles ahead as a guitarist (Keith Richards doesn’t always play lead and always had another guitarist in the band that played lead as well) and is also ahead as a songwriter because he did it on his own, not as part of a songwriting team with Mick Jagger.
This is probably better used as an analogy when comparing someone like Maradona to Ronaldo by the way. Messi and Ronaldo’s longevity is basically the same at this stage.
Don’t be ridiculous.Messi was extremely mediocre in that final too.
Yeah, if Messi wins the Ballon d'Or this year he will be the oldest winner since Lev Yashin in 1963? And first placed in the top 3 when he was 20. That's about the longest stretch in history of Ballon d'Or placings.
This is where you’re getting confused though, it matters not that Atalanta are 5th in Serie A, it matters that Ronaldo’s team are playing like a side 15th in Serie A and that Ronaldo is currently the only thing keeping them in the biggest competition in World football.
Then it’s simply a bonus that he’s also doing similar in hands down the strongest league in the World.
Just look what happens to a world-class player but mere mortal Harry Kane when his team play like shit. Somehow Ronaldo seems to be able to rise above that shit and still bang out insane stats, and at 36 years old no less.
Last edited:
There's be many horrific posts on here over the years, but this might just be the worst one yet.
Tempted to change my vote, I can’t see Messi doing for us what Ronaldo is doing right now.
Dude…wrong end of the stick. I’m not saying Serie A is amazing, I’m saying La Liga is just as average and has been for a while. If that poster is discrediting Serie A title, it’s a bit rich.
Ronaldo certainly has the longevity over Messi. Still think it is down to personal preference.
Well Messi isnt 36 almost 37 yet, but I definitely think Messi will start dropping off soon.
Exactly, hard to see Messi still doing what Ronaldo is doing at his age but you never know I suppose. Ronaldo is an incredible athlete, probably the best that football has ever seen.
Ronaldo all day long... but I’m a bias Man Utd fan.
he is incredible though. What a player, what a career. He has also proven himself everywhere he has gone.
he is incredible though. What a player, what a career. He has also proven himself everywhere he has gone.
Ronaldo has an incredible body and incredible mentality. Even if Messi has/had the same mentality he doesnt have Ronaldo's body. I still think Messi will pick up his form but i think he will have a massive drop by 35/36.
I refrain from saying anything about Messi or Ronaldo for the time being. They seem to bounce back whenever people think they are done.
Have noticed it seems to be a lot of people changing their vote based on Ronaldo scoring for us instead of Juventus. If he went to City, it would probably be 60% Messi. To be expected I suppose in fandom, but it's letting bias getting in the way of thinking. Although it was great to see, Ronaldo scoring a few group stage CL goals does little to change what is a 10-15 year body of work, just recency bias. You shouldn't change your vote because Ronaldo scored against Atalanta, if that's your reason.
Nah. I don't think so. It's the combo of Ronaldo doing it for a very inconsistent team like ours with a amateur coaching setup and Messi struggling to get himself going in France and for a better team.
I think it's wise. You could read exactly the same thing about Messi last year, he ended up with 38 goals and 14 assists in club games (compared to Ronaldo's 36 goals and 4 assists).
Definitely take la liga over Serie a where serie a had the same winner 8 years in a row, no question
Plus since Copa semi final, Messi seems to be off mentally and physically, the horrible tackles he have had with the Argentina NT must have effected him physically, but he seems not to be ignoring, like acting childish against Poch when he was subbed, kinda like KdB with Belgium.
Will effect him in long term, if he does not realize that he is now a old guy in terms of football.
Isn't he out of squad for tonight's match?
And Barca wasn’t inconsistent poorly setup in recent years? Messi had a ballon d’or level season under Koeman of all people. United finished runner up in the PL last season and this was without Ronaldo.
yes but as a whole la liga >>>> bundesliga
Are you judging an entire career off a few months though? The problem with that approach is that it constantly changes. Messi was clearly better in the first 6 months of this year and led a poor Barcelona team to the Copa del Rey, playing unbelievable some unbelievable football. Now Ronaldo is playing better in the past few months. But it's volatile, and it's like basing how much you like a band on their latest song, rather than their previous 10 albums.
If you vote based on the latest match or the latest month, it can change quickly. Who know, Ronaldo could leave United at the end of the season having failed to get Champions League football and join PSG, then Messi could go back to Barcelona. At the end of last season, nobody would have expected Ronaldo to be United or Messi at PSG, so it could change quickly again. It's a parody at this point people saying "this ends the debate" after some random game in October or November of a season.
The only goal or game that should majorly change their legacy at this point is a World Cup final or similar, which would offer a new point to the debate. There's not much left to say about their club careers that hasn't been said.
But you in your original post said CR has won nothing significant, but he has won Serie A, which even if Juve won for 8 years, is still a big title.
CL he may not have won, but let us be honest, apart from few matches, he performed consistently for Juve in CL.
I think we should stop measuring Messi and Cristiano with their standards, like if they do not win CL, they have failed.
I'm talking about what is currently making people change their minds. It's got feck all to do with him playing for Utd. What he is doing right now is more impressive than Messi but obviously these opinions aren't set in stone and evolve for a lot of people.
Performing for this sorry Man Utd team is more impressive
Disagree with the songwriter bit. Hendrix did plenty of covers as well and nagger did the lyrics but Richards doing as much as he did with the music and variety has him ahead of Hendrix for me as a songwriter.
I mean even Richards solo album is much better than jagger’s solo stuff.
Serie a with Juventus is like winning bundesliga with Bayern. When a team wins it 7-8 straight times without you the trophy absolutely gets diminished.
it’s the same thing with Messi at his current setup being CL or bust. Even though psg failed to win the league last year, when they joined these one horse leagues this is the downside.
I wouldn’t call Ronaldo at Juventus a failure at all, but Juve getting knocked out earlier than ever in CL since he joined had to sting considering expectations the same way it will sting when psg may not even make the final with the players they got
But Juventus really showed Ronaldo a reality check of what poor management and coaching can do as leaving Madrid was a massive mistake.
if we are being honest, as much as it pains me to say it, Messi also should have left Barca sooner, some woefully mismanaged years from our club as I think both him and Ronaldo can get you a CL in the right circumstances and competence which neither have had for many years now
on a united forum it obviously does play a role. I agree with the other poster I’d be was doing this for City there Would be a lot more bickering from united fans. Hell, once he signed with united before playing a single match in his return there was a spike in votes for him
He is, muscle and knee injury (nothing too bad it seems but bad enough to sub him at half time during the previous game).
Cmon man, Hendrix wrote a bunch of timeless classics that’ve aged very well and were inventive and featured genius guitar playing as well as fine songwriting.
Richards’ writing was done as a duo (at least) and is, compared to Hendrix, essentially pastiche and a bit hammy.
The album ‘Are You Experienced’ alone is a level of songwriting that is dizzyingly good and tops Richards’ entire career as a songwriter.
The spike in votes is obvious why but when you take a step back and look at what he's done so far for Utd, the key goals he scored and the points he's won the team, people changing their opinion on this debate isn't based on emotions purely.
I've seen many football fans who hate United changing their tune on this. Why would they do that ?
In fairness, this is the first time anyone has been able to judge him outside of the Barca bubble. He's no longer at a club that's been built around him for the last decade and he's not performing - seems natural to question whether he's been so good all these years in part because he's been at the same club which has been built around getting the best out of him, brought up playing 'the Barca way' surrounded by groups of players he's grown up with accompanied by additional sprinklings of brilliance. People have been arguing for years over whether he'd look the same player outside of Barcelona so it's no surprise that, when he's not performing to his best, people comment on it.
but the average Messi final in the international stage was definitely better than the average Ronaldo final with the NT. Ronaldo was mediocre in nations league final as well, not that Messi was great himself in his finals mind you
disagree completely. Exile on Main Street, sticky fingers and let it bleed all surpass Hendrix. It’s silly to say Hendrix has written “timeless classics” which isn’t wrong but the stones peak surpasses his no question.
2 of the 3 most popular Hendrix songs in hey joe and all along the watchtower are covers. Amazing musician, but not in the same league as the stones and it’s like saying McCartney and Lennon should be docked as songwriters because they had each other. One doesn’t work as well in the band without the other, same with jagger/Richards.
That makes no sense to me whatsoever. The Copa America is a much inferior tournament to the Euros where almost all the best players in the world compete. There's a reason the Copa nearly always has one of those two countries in the final, and frequently both: there's only two really big footballing nations in South America. Brazil currently have one of their weakest national teams in living memory whereas Argentina have, on paper, one of their best since Maradona. Furthermore, France went on to win the fecking World Cup with basically the same team that Portugal beat in the final. In what possible world was it more impressive for Argentina to beat Brazil in the Copa than for Portugal to beat France at the Euros? Argentina beating Brazil was just an ordinary 50/50 affair whereas Portugal winning the Euros final against France was a monumental, historical accomplishment. Your take is beyond bizarre.
It's like saying that Liverpool winning the league for the first time in 30 years is a bigger deal than Leicester winning it.
Last edited:
Agree with this - at least two Stones albums are better than anything Hendrix has put out.
There is no debate that he’s had a good start with United but with united more pl fans watch him as most people tend to focus on the leagues their face team plays in. So now they’re seeing Ronaldo property again which plays a big role. If he was doing the same thing with Benfica none of those people would say much because they aren’t watching him.
I also think in the league he went a whole month without scoring, you still have plenty of articles and pundits saying united have taken a step back with Ronaldo.
He's only played 8 games for PSG yet, again that's the problem with judging things off a few months. 8 games out of 1,000 in a career. Still scored the winner against Man City, which was the best team he's played this season.
Spot on. I think I Messi has been good in CL for psg, and it’s early days but his league play needs to step up. PSG aren’t as good in the league as their record suggests right now
- Status