Frenkie de Jong | The last muppeting lap

[KirkDuyt]

It wasn't really a question for everyone- it was question more for @KirkDuyt due to how I have seen him talk down some Netherlands players like Van De Beek and a bit in this thread talking down about De Jong.

It's not that I disagree or agree - I just wanted to see who he rated as a Dutch player highly/higher right now.

What can I say, I have high standards (except when it comes to Berghuis).

Honestly though, I do rate Frenkie and think guys like Donny and De Ligt are good players, just not as good as that 2018 CL season suggested. Out of all those guys I think only Frenkie and to a lesser extent Ziyech can truly become world class.

@troylocker Memphis and De Ligt play at a higher level than Danjuma and are probably also better, I just rate them at less than they are advertized. Now Memphis gets plenty of flack, especially on here and he's not a crap player, he's just a Lyon level player, which is respectable. As for De Ligt, I truly don't see the world class player there. He is very big and very strong, but so are many other defenders. He is too clumsy and capital error prone to be world class for me. Doesn't mean he's bad, just, I dunno, meh.

I'm a contrarian and critical cnut, I can't help myself. I also hate Max Verstappen, simply because the rest of our country loved him. It's the only way to survive supporting Feyenoord.

 

[Stacks]

According to the cloggies because he did well at Lyon, and against average teams for Holland.

you got me!

 

[BrilliantOrange]

Anyway mate,
Who do you rate the best 5 currently anyway? And maybe the next best 3 for the future?

Difficult to say..

VVD, De Vrij, Depay are dead set there for me. VVD and De Vrij are world class in their field and you jus cant get around Depays performances for the National Team. Frenkie should be dead set as well, but he is out of form for quite some time now. I feel he is being massively misused at Barca for a longer time now as they play him as a midfielder who should get in the box (they actually mention this as well quite often) in stead of using him how he excelled at Ajax and the National Team, i.e. being the main man in build up from behind, especially when an opponent puts us under pressure. Should mention that Frenkie isnt at his best in general, also when he is playing further back for the National Team now. De Ligt should be in the list and I think he still is. He is just a bit out of scope at the moment as puts in very decent performances for Juve but he's now behind De Vrij in the National Team and the whole of Juve is struggling. Wijnaldum is an obvious mention but he's been extremely poor for a while now at the National Team and plays a role in the margins at PSG. Personally (but im aware Im biased) I think Daley Blind is a world class player in a role where he is used what he's good at. Other fixed starters lately are Dumfries, Berghuis/Malen, Klaassen. A level in the hierarchy lower we have the likes of Bergwijn, Ake, Til, De Roon, Weghorst, maybe Im forgetting someone..

Talent on the way? Timber (who is immense actually) and Gravenberch are the main mentions from Ajax perspective, where also Rensch made his national debut. Bijlow is a very promising goalkeeper. Gakpo started off the season extremely well for PSV and looks one to watch. He isnt popular in NL, but Noa Lang puts in class performances for Brugge in the Champions League in a mediocre team and did well in the minutes he played for NL. Danjuma is a bit older, but he has plenty years to come and always looks a threat. Energy, pace, power, eager towards the goal. Koopmeiners looks to be developing well and maturing at Atalanta. At left back you have Wijndal and Malacia competing for the role of back up behind Blind (as long as we play 443 at least, Van Gaal is hinting at a different system towards the World Cup.

 

[Stacks]

What can I say, I have high standards (except when it comes to Berghuis).

Honestly though, I do rate Frenkie and think guys like Donny and De Ligt are good players, just not as good as that 2018 CL season suggested. Out of all those guys I think only Frenkie and to a lesser extent Ziyech can truly become world class.

@troylocker Memphis and De Ligt play at a higher level than Danjuma and are probably also better, I just rate them at less than they are advertized. Now Memphis gets plenty of flack, especially on here and he's not a crap player, he's just a Lyon level player, which is respectable. As for De Ligt, I truly don't see the world class player there. He is very big and very strong, but so are many other defenders. He is too clumsy and capital error prone to be world class for me. Doesn't mean he's bad, just, I dunno, meh.

I'm a contrarian and critical cnut, I can't help myself. I also hate Max Verstappen, simply because the rest of our country loved him. It's the only way to survive supporting Feyenoord.

I mean you have historically produced some of the GREATEST talents of all time with nearly 10% of the all time top 50 bein Dutch so your standards should be through the roof

 

[BrilliantOrange]

I mean you have historically produced some of the GREATEST talents of all time with nearly 10% of the all time top 50 bein Dutch so your standards should be through the roof

And yet we're all praying to god momentarily nothing serious happens to Memphis.

Guess we're all just happy the Ryan Babel days are finally over..

 

[MadDogg]

If he doesnt fancy England, only Bayern or PSG remain as options. Both were interested the summer he moved.

With what his Dad has said with the weather and lifestyle being important, PSG does sound like the most likely next destination. They could be looking at FDJ to lessen their reliance on Veratti considering the latter's injury issues.

 

[Red the Bear]

I just read up barca having to not play demiral so they won't meet the 10 aps clause on his contract even though they are short on players

Thats just desperate I actually think we might have a chance to get him even in jan

Should we though ? his attitude in their defeats has been concerning almost as if he doesn't care

 

[Robertd0803]

I just read up barca having to not play demiral so they won't meet the 10 aps clause on his contract even though they are short on players

Thats just desperate I actually think we might have a chance to get him even in jan

Should we though ? his attitude in their defeats has been concerning almost as if he doesn't care

Regarding his attitude while its a concern I can totally understand his frustration seeing Barca fall apart around him while having to play with whatever 12 year olds Barca have had to draft in to the first team squad this week. (After taking a pay cut as well?) Especially considering its not going to improve anytime soon.

A change of club could be just whats needed. (Especially if its ours).

Also his fathers comments about not liking the weather in Manchester/Munich are just silly.

 

[bosskeano]

1000% we should test Barcelona's resolve this january for De Jong. Given their financial situation they might need to sell and also how long will it take to rebuild that club to be competitive?

 

[Guapa]

No brainer get him if available.

 

[Niemans]

1000% we should test Barcelona's resolve this january for De Jong. Given their financial situation they might need to sell and also how long will it take to rebuild that club to be competitive?

Only a huge offer will convince Barcelona to sell De Jong, in January that offer should be even bigger

 

[Red the Bear]

Regarding his attitude while its a concern I can totally understand his frustration seeing Barca fall apart around him while having to play with whatever 12 year olds Barca have had to draft in to the first team squad this week. (After taking a pay cut as well?) Especially considering its not going to improve anytime soon.

A change of club could be just whats needed. (Especially if its ours).

Also his fathers comments about not liking the weather in Manchester/Munich are just silly.

Remember they are still Barcelona i can imagine some of our fans get proper riled up if the same happened over here a big club will always remain one after all

And yes I think his father is just trying to pull some shenanigans for a better deal because if it ain't England or bayern (and obviously no real )that just leaves him with juve and psg(and juve are broke) so just psg

 

[AussieDevil]

Imagine signing De Jong and then in a years time signing Bellingham. That midfield would dominate for years to come.

 

[croadyman]

Imagine signing De Jong and then in a years time signing Bellingham. That midfield would dominate for years to come.

Would be the ultimate McFred upgrade but sadly won't happen in a million years

 

[crossy1686]

With what his Dad has said with the weather and lifestyle being important, PSG does sound like the most likely next destination. They could be looking at FDJ to lessen their reliance on Veratti considering the latter's injury issues.

Paris? Not all that great to be honest.

 

[crossy1686]

Imagine signing De Jong and then in a years time signing Bellingham. That midfield would dominate for years to come.

People said this about Pogba, Bruno, VDB. Still waiting for it to happen.

 

[kingwaynerooney]

People said this about Pogba, Bruno, VDB. Still waiting for it to happen.

Nobody said a midfield of Pogba Bruno and vdb would dominate midfield for years to come.

Maybe people had expectations from Pogba, that's about it

 

[BrilliantOrange]

People said this about Pogba, Bruno, VDB. Still waiting for it to happen.

I dont think anyone expected a midfield with only these three to set the world on fire,..?

BTW, people are taking waaaay to much into what his dad said about the weather..

 

[Biggins]

Are there any credible sources showing that we may go after him? Him and some defensive minded mid would be crucial for us if we want to start challenging again.

 

[justsomebloke]

That would be such a great signing. Don't think it's realistic though.

 

[Bondi77]

Are there any credible sources showing that we may go after him? Him and some defensive minded mid would be crucial for us if we want to start challenging again.

None! ......but don’t let that spoil it for you.

 

[Bebestation]

That would be such a great signing. Don't think it's realistic though.

For me it doesn't seem that hard if we go after his ex manager which isn't exactly unlikely.

Ten Hag would have the ability to get better performances from Van de Beek and many other players - Frenkie De Jong might be seeing himself on the bench whilst Xavi's management isn't winning matches for Barcelona.

Barcelona aren't exactly the most money balling club either- so you never know if De Jong starts looking across the border to the league that has his ex manager and 4+ other great managers and clubs competing in the best league in the world; which he has made noises about before.

 

[arthurka]

Isn't the weather in Southern Germany pretty good? It's better than over here, that's for sure.

What kind of self respectung Dutchman complains about weather anyway. Though Frenkie is a whingy cnut on the field too I guess.

Yes it is I have a feeling has father has never been to Munich. Liverpool, Manchester and Torino all have shitty weather to be fair but a player choosing his club really doesn't give a feck about football he should call up Becks and ask if he could play in Miami.

 

[justsomebloke]

For me it doesn't seem that hard if we go after his ex manager which isn't exactly unlikely.

Ten Hag would have the ability to get better performances from Van de Beek and many other players - Frenkie De Jong might be seeing himself on the bench whilst Xavi's management isn't winning matches for Barcelona.

Barcelona aren't exactly the most money balling club either- so you never know if De Jong starts looking across the border to the league that has his ex manager and 4+ other great managers and clubs competing in the best league in the world; which he has made noises about before.

Well, I hope you're right.

 

[crossy1686]

I dont think anyone expected a midfield with only these three to set the world on fire,..?

BTW, people are taking waaaay to much into what his dad said about the weather..

People on here were getting excited, and when we ultimately sign Rice, it’s going to obviously be back to back CL titles.

I know right!? The lads from Holland! I’m not sure people realise how much it rains there…

Makes Manchester look like Tenerife

 

[Lemon Moon]

Only a huge offer will convince Barcelona to sell De Jong, in January that offer should be even bigger

What's his market value? & how much over that do you think they would accept?

 

[Terranova]

I really hope we can pick him up, but not if that means VDB has to go. They work really well together

 

[Green Arrow]

My only concern is that will he want to come given the treatment of DVB? He might speak to him and get the told his experience to date and it's not been good.

 

[kingwaynerooney]

If he is available he has to be signed no matter the cost. He is a tier or two above Pogba, Fred, mctominay. Sign him. Immediately.

 

[Kaos]

Ahh this old talk of the famous Manchester weather being a deterrent.

Look at City - over the years they've signed players accustomed to warmer climates like Aguero, Silva x2, Dias, Ederson and they all seemed happy enough. Likewise even our Ronny after spending a decade in Spain and Italy saw no qualms about coming back to the North of England.

We forget that these players live in a luxury bubble and like us aren't cowering for cover from the elements at a bus stop outside a Greggs, they can just commandeer a private jet to a tropical retreat at a moment's notice. Not to mention Wilmslow and the like are hardly derelict wastelands.

I'm sure they'll be happy enough, just like many of their sun-loving predecessors who've played in Manchester.

 

[gregor]

De Jong would be an amazing signing for us.
How about a swap deal including Cavani and Pogba in January?

If we could then also add Haidara in summer our midfield would look really good.

 

[pcaming]

I really hope we can pick him up, but not if that means VDB has to go. They work really well together

The money we'll have t pay for him and to him, will mean he has no worry about playing time.

 

[Niemans]

What's his market value? & how much over that do you think they would accept?

In January it is almost impossible. Barcelona don't remember selling such an important player in that transfer window.
The only hypothetical case would be to sell him to sign several important players. F. Torres, Olmo, Adeyemi...

In summer it depends: If he makes a good season it is very difficult for him to leave (130+), if he has a bad season (90+), it will also influence how young people like Gavi, Pedri and Nico perform.

 

[bosskeano]

De Jong or Bellingham....probably can't get both but definitely need to get one of those two for our midfield

 

[Mainoldo]

If he is available he has to be signed no matter the cost. He is a tier or two above Pogba, Fred, mctominay. Sign him. Immediately.

Wait what? So why they selling him?

 

[Bondi77]

De Jong or Bellingham....probably can't get both but definitely need to get one of those two for our midfield

Buy another player from Dortmund?????
Jesus wept!!

 

[Scholsey2004]

With what his Dad has said with the weather and lifestyle being important, PSG does sound like the most likely next destination. They could be looking at FDJ to lessen their reliance on Veratti considering the latter's injury issues.

I wouldnt rule out Bayern on that basis. Bavaria has great weather and its vineyard country, youre within striking distance of the alps. Munich is very scenic as well i believe.

 

[croadyman]

My only concern is that will he want to come given the treatment of DVB? He might speak to him and get the told his experience to date and it's not been good.

Well let's hope Ralf can change that view in the next couple of months

 

[Red the Bear]

Got booed when substituted and xavi doesn't seem to particularly like him either fans are turning against him fast

He was pretty dire too his positioning was terrible (weird coming and trained in ajax) and played pretty high up the pitch with little to no success

There is this barca forum that I skimmed and their Fandom attitude towards him seems eerily similar to ours to pogba (large fee underwhelming etc etc)

I also question whether a player who went through so many drubbings can return to a winning mentality or is he damaged goods(Tottenham bayern real ...)

Seeing the situation i think clubs can push real hard for him in jan

I'm not sure he would suit us at all but I guess if we're going for ten hag next summer he's worth a try

 

[Niemans]

Got booed when substituted and xavi doesn't seem to particularly like him either fans are turning against him fast

He was pretty dire too his positioning was terrible (weird coming and trained in ajax) and played pretty high up the pitch with little to no success

There is this barca forum that I skimmed and their Fandom attitude towards him seems eerily similar to ours to pogba (large fee underwhelming etc etc)

I also question whether a player who went through so many drubbings can return to a winning mentality or is he damaged goods(Tottenham bayern real ...)

Seeing the situation i think clubs can push real hard for him in jan

I'm not sure he would suit us at all but I guess if we're going for ten hag next summer he's worth a try

In winter Barcelona will not sell him unless they can sign several players of high quality