Pogue Mahone
The caf's Camus.
Never mind this season. It’s 14 months since they last had a pen awarded against them!Is it true that Liverpool haven’t given away a league penalty this season ?
Never mind this season. It’s 14 months since they last had a pen awarded against them!Is it true that Liverpool haven’t given away a league penalty this season ?
Oh, yeah I get you. It's so stupid.No I agree. I wasn't sure if you were arguing it's irrelevant, because I know people that say you need more to give a penalty than a fk, which is nonsense.
When you look at the state of the decision making it’s even more unbelievable that they haven’t been on the wrong end of any pen decisionNever mind this season. It’s 14 months since they last had a pen awarded against them!
I understand the love the media has with us and to maybe some extent the league but it’s probably just a little incompetence, a little luck, and always being camped out in the opponent’s box that has us avoiding penalties.When you look at the state of the decision making it’s even more unbelievable that they haven’t been on the wrong end of any pen decision
That was very obvious yesterday.Starting to believe VAR is corrupt
they pick and choose what they want to see
Exactly this. If anything the introduction of VAR has made decisions less consistent and more open to influencing the outcome of a game.I’ve been going on about a challenge system since they introduced VAR and I really think it’s time to seriously consider it.
The fact that officials can pick and choose which decisions to look at and which not to look at has given us some really dodgy and biased refereeing this season. Remove the VAR official and replace him with a technician who just rolls the replays for the referee. A team can challenge any major decision (goal, penalty, red card offence) and keeps their challenge if the call is overturned in their favour, even if it’s not fully in their favour (player tackled, ref doesn’t give foul, team challenges for denying goalscoring opportunity and the ref changes the decision to foul and yellow, for example). A challenge would force the referee to the monitor and then he wouldn’t need the clear and obvious threshold to overturn himself, just basically balance of probabilities.
Not to mention even more frustrating, because now we have clear evidence of players poking each others in the eyes, studding each other in the thighs, blocking the goalkeeper's sight from an offside position, pushing each others in the back, yet we still don't get the right decisions made on the pitch due to technicalities with regards to the burden of proof and degree of wrongness on the original call. I was very much pro-VAR before it was introduced, but at this point it's just another tool with which games can be influenced beyond the control of the managers and players on the pitch.Exactly this. If anything the introduction of VAR has made decisions less consistent and more open to influencing the outcome of a game.
It’s definitely incompetence. You have to remember that the technology doesn’t change but the person operating it does. That’s a different referee every time with their own opinions, interpretation and feelings towards what is and isn’t a foul, handball, red card etc.I understand the love the media has with us and to maybe some extent the league but it’s probably just a little incompetence, a little luck, and always being camped out in the opponent’s box that has us avoiding penalties.
Yeah this is the biggest issue IMO in addition to the complete lack of transparency. I genuinely don't remember a single example of the ref not overturning it when going to the monitor. There should be many examples of the ref going to the monitor, seeing it again, and sticking with what he originally saw.The selectivity of when a ref does and doesn’t get asked to look at footage is maddening. Every time they look at the footage they always upgrade the punishment. Never the opposite. And the decision about what does/doesn’t get reviewed is entirely arbitrary. It’s a completely broken system.
I didn’t see much of today’s game. What happened?How did Everton not get a pen? That's mad.
Yeah, 100%. So these marginal calls are utterly dependent on the decision of whoever the feck in the truck. It’s not a tool that makes the on-field referee’s job any easier (which was how it was sold to us) It basically just takes decisions away from him and gives them to someone else.Yeah this is the biggest issue IMO in addition to the complete lack of transparency. I genuinely don't remember a single example of the ref not overturning it when going to the monitor. There should be many examples of the ref going to the monitor, seeing it again, and sticking with what he originally saw.
Plus another thing. If I'd been a referee with a standard sense of integrity and willingness to do a good job, I'd be pretty pissed off at my "buddy" in the VAR room denying me the chance to correct my mistakes. For example, if I thought I'd seen Cedric falling and catching the ball in the falling motion, I'd want my colleague in the bus to alert me to the fact that he was crawling for five or six yards before the actual handball occurred, because there's no way that any normal referee would say to his VAR colleague "I saw him crawling and then scooping the ball out of the penalty box so it's not a deliberate handball for me, but correct me if I saw it wrong" when discussing the incident in the next break of play.Yeah, 100%. So these marginal calls are utterly dependent on the decision of whoever the feck in the truck. It’s not a tool that makes the on-field referee’s job any easier (which was how it was sold to us) It basically just takes decisions away from him and gives them to someone else.
Yeah there was the idea put out that they aren't supposed to re-referee the game, but that is in effect exactly what they are doing by essentially letting the VAR decide one way or another and the center ref never differing from it.Plus another thing. If I'd been a referee with a standard sense of integrity and willingness to do a good job, I'd be pretty pissed off at my "buddy" in the VAR room denying me the chance to correct my mistakes. For example, if I thought I'd seen Cedric falling and catching the ball in the falling motion, I'd want my colleague in the bus to alert me to the fact that he was crawling for five or six yards before the actual handball occurred, because there's no way that any normal referee would say to his VAR colleague "I saw him crawling and then scooping the ball out of the penalty box so it's not a deliberate handball for me, but correct me if I saw it wrong" when discussing the incident in the next break of play.
How did Everton not get a pen? That's mad.
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Mane put his hand in 2 guys faces and got away with one booking. Matip bundled over Gordon in the box, no penalty. The referee literally started moving his whistle to his mouth and proper hesitated before thinking better of it at Anfield. We need a title race afterall.I didn’t see the Liverpool game what was the controversy with that?
Oh wow. It's really that obvious now?Mane put his hand in 2 guys faces and got away with one booking. Matip bundled over Gordon in the box, no penalty. The referee literally started moving his whistle to his mouth and proper hesitated before thinking better of it at Anfield. We need a title race afterall.
You would’ve loved it.I didn’t see much of today’s game. What happened?
You would’ve loved it.
The rules a joke, needs to be changedDERMOT SAYS: "When you see the whole package, he is very lucky to still be on the pitch. Stuart and VAR are very unlucky because of the protocol. There's so much going on and Stuart sees the first one [on Allan] and he [Mane] is yellow carded, he may even have been alerted by his assistant.
So they have the first incident. The second incident you see later on with Holgate doesn't get witnessed. VAR can only look at it if it's a red card. VAR feels it's a yellow card offence and he can't recommend a yellow card offence to the referee.
"So even though he would have got a second yellow card, he can't do that. Therefore, Mane escapes."
Spot on. As always.Baffling decisions at the weekend. Some level of shirt tugging can be allowed, but the arm over and round the shoulder pulling Elanga back looked like a classic example of an over-the-threshold shirt pull. Standard shite where the attacker is punished for not collapsing to the floor. Similar for the Cedric handball, it looked like a very clear example of a 'direct action' towards the ball - i.e. where the defender makes a deliberate move towards the ball and their arms are in a blocking position. Once Cedric takes that extra crawl step, it again crosses the threshold from accidental to deliberate. And that's certainly the distinction referees are now supposed to be using.
It would have 110% been a red card if the ref had been asked to look at the screen beside the pitch. But that’s the way VAR works now. It’s completely arbitrary as to whether incidents get an on pitch review. And when they do, the referee will always upgrade their initial punishment.Seeing a replay of that Bruno tackle again, it's actually a shocking challenge. As easy a red card as youll see. Can't believe they missed it
The issue is a Klopper said its still subjective. The ref wasn't asked to look at it same as the Mane one because the VAR deemed it a yellow card offence and they can't get involved in yellow card offences. The whole thing is a mess, the technology is there but the common sense in the rules of football is not.It would have 110% been a red card if the ref had been asked to look at the screen beside the pitch. But that’s the way VAR works now. It’s completely arbitrary as to whether incidents get an on pitch review. And when they do, the referee will always upgrade their initial punishment.
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Have you got a link….I’ve been looking but can only find quotes on Liverpool game.Reading Dermot's take on things, i can only come to the conclusion that referees are thick as feck.
Especially since it's not necessarily true.Regarding the Mane possible red card
The rules a joke, needs to be changed
That was said about UTD as well, under SAF, and roundly sounded out as bollocks mainly by the dippers , its just favourable to the sides going for the title . And it's happened way to often for it to become coincidence. VAR has ruined the game .I understand the love the media has with us and to maybe some extent the league but it’s probably just a little incompetence, a little luck, and always being camped out in the opponent’s box that has us avoiding penalties.
Possibly us, depends on "conceding".That takes us all the way back to 2020, doesn't it? Yikes.
I wonder what the longest any team has gone without conceding a penalty.
Oh sorry, I meant having a penalty given against, not the opponent scoring a penalty against.Possibly us, depends on "conceding".
Sure we went years and years without conceding one.. a couple were given but missed/saved.
I'm tending to agree, we will look at the descions over weekend, UTD had 4 VAR incidents and 1 was looked at close Ronnys offside Goal, the others were just batted away, player offside in Keeper Eye line , not looked at, Hand ball in1st half not or either did but not long enough to see movement of hand to ball, Elenga brought down twice only 1 looked at??Starting to believe VAR is corrupt
they pick and choose what they want to see
Probably Liverpool. I'd do the research but that might show it's another club and I'm happier thinking it's Liverpool.Oh sorry, I meant having a penalty given against, not the opponent scoring a penalty against.
Agree with it allThat was very obvious yesterday.
- No serious VAR check for Elanga
- No serious VAR check for Cedric handball
- Serious VAR check for penalty once offside was given
- Lengthy VAR check for super obvious penalty given to us
- No serious VAR check for Elanga again
- No serious VAR check for offside with de Gea obviously having to look around Nketiah which delayed his reaction to the shot
That's six incidents in one game where the VAR has chosen the "pro-Arsenal" option whenever possible. I'm just surprised Bruno didn't get sent off as well to make it a smashing eight from the VAR.
That's why I want a challenge system so that teams can actually force the main ref to the monitor rather than having the guy in the bus act as a potentially biased filter before an incident gets sent to the ref.