[bosnian_red]

My worry with a Kane - Sancho - Antony line up would be pace. I’d veer toward Osimhen if possible with the wing options we have.

Rashford is obviously our main LW. Antony has enough pace too, with him it's more about knowing how to be explosive or just finding better off the ball runs (like vs Everton). Speed isn't his issue, but doesn't need to be Dan James level anyway.

Sancho can be depth/competition on either side but Rashford is the only one in our squad who offers a true off the ball in behind threat. Antony can learn it, not to the same extent but can get to a good level IMO.

 

[Adnan]

The striker is absolutely vital - more so than any other position. Sure a midfielder and goalkeeper helps the playing out from the back but there are many ways to play and that specifically wouldn't impact Antony. With Antony it's confidence, adapting to the league, the club, the pressures here and the price tag pressure IMO, but also developing his own game more. Genuinely think we'll get Kane and we'll see a different level from our whole attack. Sancho and Antony especially. Having someone who scares opponents in the middle makes a big difference, someone to be a focal point.

The striker is a obvious signing and doesn't need mentioning.

But the goalkeeper is absolutely crucial in the first phase of the build up for a head coach who adheres to the positional play principles and looks to dominate all phases of play.

And yes that does impact on the attacking players because not being able to fluidly build up from the back will isolate the final third players against quality opposition who are adept at closing off the space high up the pitch. And having a fluid first phase build up will connect defense and attack and will open up triangles (rondos) which will suit the technically gifted players and open up the space for the free man.

 

[RedRonaldo]

I don’t know why we overpaid him that much for. He looks like a 40m signing to me, who is still struggling to adapt to the league.

 

[BarryWinks]

The club had all but signed Toni Kroos, until Louis Van Gaal came along and decided he wasn't for him. The club had spent years scouting Fabinho, then Mourinho came in made them get Matic instead. Who was his boy from Chelsea - and was redundant after 6 months. The club vetoed Maguire under Mourinho, and then got forced into signing him when Solskjaer came in and asked for him because the 'back the manager' dimwits made the club a toxic cesspit after it was revealed that the club refused to sanction that signing a year before.

Don't forget Tiago whom we scouted and had all but signed only for fecking Moyes to overrule, then proceeded to sign Fellaini and almost Baines.

I don't know how people never see how giving managers the "backing" has adversely affected us. Starting fro. Moyes (and with the exception of Solksjaer because of where he was coming from), all of our managers have signed their former boys. That tells you they have huge say in deciding who to go for. That is not to say we haven't made mistakes with scouting e.g. VDB and Sanchez, but our past managers are not blameless, and they were enabled by the idiotic portion of our fanbase who believed - and still do - that give any manager enough time and authority and they'd become Fergie.

 

[Borys]

My main worry is how low is lows can be. Given his talent and reputation, I have no doubt he will have some world class games for us but I'm just tired of extremely inconsistent players.

I feel quite the opposite, my worry is Antony's HIGH level. What is it exactly?
Also, how is he inconsistent? This was probably one of his better games (and still he didn't do anything). So far he's been pretty consistent in being unimpressive, solid on the ball at best. Since he's been found out and not allowed to cut in, he brings zero threat, keeps the ball, passes 5yard and works off the ball. Every performance is on the same level, I don't see how Antony can be called "inconsistent".

 

[Malone_Post]

19 games, 0 assists. Can’t dribble, can’t pass, can’t cross. Doesn’t create, occasionally scores a worldie. Works hard defensively. It’s just not good enough.

Dan James was a far more effective player. And he was nowhere near good enough himself. He could at least pin defenders back with his raw pace. Antony must be the easiest attacker in the league to defend against.

We can all see it (despite some people trying really hard to convince themselves otherwise) but the guys been a total flop so far. You can’t call it anything else.

 

[kingEric68]

He only has one foot and average pace. He’s lost. He needs some help and guidance now to bring him up to the right level. His price looks very toppy considering all this lack of expertise and maturity

 

[zenith]

We need a fit again Sancho and Amad back to cover for this very important position. Can't rely on Antony to put in 7/10 consistently

 

[LARulz]

What I find most fascinating about him is he looks absolutely rapid for someone who is far from being absolutely rapid.

When he’s running he seems to be smoking the ground beneath him, yet you’ll see someone like Dan Burn catch him up with ease.

so true

His lack of pace is infuriating because he doesn't seem skillfull enough to take his player on. You can be either slow and have the ability/skill to beat a man or be quick to beat a man or both. From him I have seen neither

He is too predictable when he runs with the ball. He always dribbles with his left foot and will almost never use his right to do any sort of pass. Him running along the touchline is so obvious what he'd do that I am convinced even I could defend against him

 

[Real Name]

Don't forget Tiago whom we scouted and had all but signed only for fecking Moyes to overrule, then proceeded to sign Fellaini and almost Baines.

I don't know how people never see how giving managers the "backing" has adversely affected us. Starting fro. Moyes (and with the exception of Solksjaer because of where he was coming from), all of our managers have signed their former boys. That tells you they have huge say in deciding who to go for. That is not to say we haven't made mistakes with scouting e.g. VDB and Sanchez, but our past managers are not blameless, and they were enabled by the idiotic portion of our fanbase who believed - and still do - that give any manager enough time and authority and they'd become Fergie.

They dont have to become Fergie, they have to get us playing good stuff and make a solid if not very good team. I think ETH is doing just that, do you agree?

 

[Real Name]

Games like today make me very optimistic for him going forward. Thought he was excellent in the first, had excellent work rate throughout, showed his exquisite technique and control... It'll take time, but i do think he has huge potential and has the right attitude mixed with the right skills.

At least some sense in here.

 

[SirMonteyne]

Brighton bought Mitoma for 2m, and he looks miles and galaxy better than our 80m guy.

 

[flappyjay]

Currently, Antony is worse than Dan James was in his first season, both in terms of goals + assists per 90 PL mins and expected goals + assists per 90 PL mins.

282 mins per goal or assist in PL. 0.25 xG90 + 0.04 xA90

Dan James (first season) 255 mins per goal or assist in PL 0.14 xG90 + 0.17 xA90

Indeed, he is alarmingly close to Elanga's productivity; main difference being Elanga has wasted decent chances inside the area, so underperforms his expected goals.

Elanga 294 PL mins per goal or assist, xG90 0.24 xA90 0.16

(stats from Understat)

Good god man. James had 4 goals and 7 assists that season in a worse team. James was around the same age and was coming from the championship. Antony has to do better.

 

[flappyjay]

Brighton bought Mitoma for 2m, and he looks miles and galaxy better than our 80m guy.

To be fair left wingers are a dime a dozen. It's hard finding left footed right wingers. We have spent 70m on Sancho and 80 on Antony trying to lock down the right. He who shall not be named screwed us big time.

 

[Borys]

so true

His lack of pace is infuriating because he doesn't seem skillfull enough to take his player on. You can be either slow and have the ability/skill to beat a man or be quick to beat a man or both. From him I have seen neither

He is too predictable when he runs with the ball. He always dribbles with his left foot and will almost never use his right to do any sort of pass. Him running along the touchline is so obvious what he'd do that I am convinced even I could defend against him

It's obvious because the defenders push him wide intentionally. No wonder he's not been threatening after the good start (3 goals in first 3 games!). He can be effective when cutting inside, he's just not allowed to do so.

The problem obviously is he doesn't have any other tools to be effective. I really feel for the guy, not his fault the club is in panic mode when decided to splash 100m for him.

 

[dinostar77]

Chocolate hamstrings would have been a better signing and he'd be injured half the time. But probably rack up more asists and crosses plus he can use both feet.

@Raaes did you pull your analysis video of antony for your Pythagoras in Boots channel on youtube as it no longer appears ?

 

[Jeffthered]

I feel quite the opposite, my worry is Antony's HIGH level. What is it exactly?
Also, how is he inconsistent? This was probably one of his better games (and still he didn't do anything). So far he's been pretty consistent in being unimpressive, solid on the ball at best. Since he's been found out and not allowed to cut in, he brings zero threat, keeps the ball, passes 5yard and works off the ball. Every performance is on the same level, I don't see how Antony can be called "inconsistent".

This.

Antony is going nowhere (in terms of his ability..) if he continues like this. He simply has v little to his game. Teams, fans hardly bother with him anymore.

And he cannot hit a decent cross? What is that about? That's shocking. And he's clearly getting into animated nonsense with teammates..hands waving, mouthing off... and the diving/play acting is embarrassing. Remember what SAF told CR7? To cut out that nonsense?

Our worries and observations are being highlighted, our limitations are being exposed. Listen to Keane and Neville post match yesterday... we're still playing some of the players who have proven to have limited skillset.

These players need to step up.

 

[Sylar]

It's a weird one with him. Right now he's the only one that brings balance to the right (maybe partly cos we're not giving pellestri a chance)

That side has gone to shit twice when he's come off this week. But also it says something that Eth brings him off before eriksen yesterday.

Maybe having Dalot would have helped him but the worry is taking on people or putting in crosses. He doesn't do either enough but he is good at advancing us up the pitch with the ball and Keeping it for the most part (although it ends up being a backward pass)

First half he tried stuff and was actually decent. His workrate is great but we defo need more than that.

Right now it's not good enough and you would hope it does get better. Maybe the cup games coming up will help (whether it's him improving or seeing more cameos from pellestri)

 

[padzilla]

He's been rubbish recently but at least he's getting on the ball a fair bit. Hopefully he'll play his way into form.

 

[lsd]

Zero assists is a shocking stat for a winger especially one who cost what Antony did

 

[MrFishers]

Anthony works hard but seems to have one trick in his bag (Cut in and fire with his left). I hope he proves me wrong

 

[Stacks]

Currently, Antony is worse than Dan James was in his first season, both in terms of goals + assists per 90 PL mins and expected goals + assists per 90 PL mins.

282 mins per goal or assist in PL. 0.25 xG90 + 0.04 xA90

Dan James (first season) 255 mins per goal or assist in PL 0.14 xG90 + 0.17 xA90

Indeed, he is alarmingly close to Elanga's productivity; main difference being Elanga has wasted decent chances inside the area, so underperforms his expected goals.

Elanga 294 PL mins per goal or assist, xG90 0.24 xA90 0.16

(stats from Understat)

he's not here for goals and assists primarily though if you look at his Ajax history. He is there to stretch play, bring balance on the right, track back and pass to an overlapping FB

 

[Malone_Post]

he's not here for goals and assists primarily though if you look at his Ajax history. He is there to stretch play, bring balance on the right, track back and pass to an overlapping FB

He’s an attacker playing for Manchester United.
If he can’t provide goals and assists, then he’s not good enough. Simple as that.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

This could be the one decision ETH may have got wrong in his short time here so far. But that's what happens when the club offers nothing and the manager has to do everything.

I think many of us were a tad concerned at the fee quoted as in the clips he lacked explosiveness which we needed given we had Sancho for playmaking wide play.

At the same time, I'm not as negative on Antony as many here are. It's early days and he did start his United career well. His close control and body feignts look good and he may be severely lacking in confidence due to the enormous step up between the leagues. You have to put in a lot more physically to get good numbers and impact games in the PL. A nice burst of pace makes life easier but if he works on his upper body strength and link up play he can cut it here still. In fact from the clips his creative passing was very impressive but here it's been anything but.

 

[Erics_Collar]

My biggest concern is that the problem with most high potential young players is usually end product. They show lots of promise and flashes, and it's usually just the end product that suffers. Or they try too much, and don't realise that the easy pass is often the best pass.

With Antony, I don't see flashes. I don't see him trying the impossible and falling short of it. I don't see a player who's only missing the end product and a bit of maturity.

I see a player who's incredibly one footed and unable to beat his man. He's become very predictable and easy to defend against. He is no good on the counter attack because defenders don't have to catch up with him to prevent him getting to the by-line - they only have to guard against the cut back onto his left. That significantly reduces the amount of ground the defender has to cover. Rather than getting ahead of Antony, they only have to get alongside him, or even slightly behind him because they know he's not going to swing in a cross with his right.

He's slow with the ball, and it seems to me it's because he is a poor dribbler. He doesn't have complete close control of the ball, his touches are poor so he has to slow down to compensate. He'll roll his foot over the ball multiple times which looks impressive, but only serves to slow him down more. It's an acknowledgment that he can't outrun the full back so he's trying to trick him instead.

As others have noted, I do think a rampaging RB with energy to burn who can provide overlapping runs would do him the world of good and take off some of the pressure. But its frustrating that an 80 million signing needs a complimentary player to unlock his best performances. And what happens if we sign that RB, and he gets injured or suspended? Antony is then nullified again. Dalot has been one of the better performers for ETH, so do we displace him simply because he doesn't get the best out of Antony?

It's looking like a torrid bit of business so far. To be honest, maybe I'm a dinosaur and not adjusting to today's money, but it doesn't sit right with me that an 80 million player isn't a plug & play component in your team.

I've said it a few times, but this isn't a kid getting his first exposure to first team football. He has 150 senior games under his belt and he turns 23 in the next fortnight. I don't see the problems he's having as being attributable to playing in a higher standard of league. Moving to England doesn't make you slower and doesn't take away your ability to use your weaker foot.

My hope is that somehow, a better striker and a better midfield - and maybe a better RB though harsh on Dalot - somehow unlocks something in him.

 

[Stacks]

My biggest concern is that the problem with most high potential young players is usually end product. They show lots of promise and flashes, and it's usually just the end product that suffers. Or they try too much, and don't realise that the easy pass is often the best pass.

With Antony, I don't see flashes. I don't see him trying the impossible and falling short of it. I don't see a player who's only missing the end product and a bit of maturity.

I see a player who's incredibly one footed and unable to beat his man. He's become very predictable and easy to defend against. He is no good on the counter attack because defenders don't have to catch up with him to prevent him getting to the by-line - they only have to guard against the cut back onto his left. That significantly reduces the amount of ground the defender has to cover. Rather than getting ahead of Antony, they only have to get alongside him, or even slightly behind him because they know he's not going to swing in a cross with his right.

He's slow with the ball, and it seems to me it's because he is a poor dribbler. He doesn't have complete close control of the ball, his touches are poor so he has to slow down to compensate. He'll roll his foot over the ball multiple times which looks impressive, but only serves to slow him down more. It's an acknowledgment that he can't outrun the full back so he's trying to trick him instead.

As others have noted, I do think a rampaging RB with energy to burn who can provide overlapping runs would do him the world of good and take off some of the pressure. But its frustrating that an 80 million signing needs a complimentary player to unlock his best performances. And what happens if we sign that RB, and he gets injured or suspended? Antony is then nullified again. Dalot has been one of the better performers for ETH, so do we displace him simply because he doesn't get the best out of Antony?

It's looking like a torrid bit of business so far. To be honest, maybe I'm a dinosaur and not adjusting to today's money, but it doesn't sit right with me that an 80 million player isn't a plug & play component in your team.

I've said it a few times, but this isn't a kid getting his first exposure to first team football. He has 150 senior games under his belt and he turns 23 in the next fortnight. I don't see the problems he's having as being attributable to playing in a higher standard of league. Moving to England doesn't make you slower and doesn't take away your ability to use your weaker foot.

My hope is that somehow, a better striker and a better midfield - and maybe a better RB though harsh on Dalot - somehow unlocks something in him.

This is how UNited do business nowadays. Saw it with Pogba. Will probably be the same with Sancho. We overspend on players with serious flaws who need 1 or 2 expensive players to unlock them. So for every 1 player we actually need to buy 3 in total

 

[Edwards6]

Seems like he's missing Dalot at RB, when he's cutting inside on his left we need that overlapping RB. He definitely needs to go on the outside a bit more though just to be more unpredictable

 

[sullydnl]

He’s an attacker playing for Manchester United.
If he can’t provide goals and assists, then he’s not good enough. Simple as that.

That's an extremely simplistic POV.

All that matters is that the team perform well and score lots of goals. If he ultimately helps us do that in the same way ETH saw him help Ajax do that then it doesn't matter in the slightest whether he's the one claiming significant productivity or not. It's team-first, not player-first.

 

[Lentwood]

I think he has all the tools, he just needs to learn how to use them effectively.

The major plus is that he usually attracts multiple defenders. His problem at the moment is that he's inclined to want to try to dribble past them on the outside.

I think he'd be far better off drawing the defenders in and then just passing the ball and moving inside. It might not look as flashy but it's simpler and more effective.

A big part of a good coaches job (and ETH is clearly a good coach) is to make talented players effective players, so I'm not at all worried yet.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Good god man. James had 4 goals and 7 assists that season in a worse team. James was around the same age and was coming from the championship. Antony has to do better.

You say that as though 4 goals and 7 assists is a bad return though. 7 assists would match Saka's total from last season.

 

[Zen86]

Seems like he's missing Dalot at RB, when he's cutting inside on his left we need that overlapping RB. He definitely needs to go on the outside a bit more though just to be more unpredictable

This.

Not sure why everyone is dismissing him already. He's shown what he can do, he's looked painfully isolated in recent games though. AwB has shown a bit more in an attacking sense lately, but he just doesn't instinctively make those overlapping runs and often takes the overly safe sideways or backwards pass when there's opportunity to progress forward. There's not much free space out there and Antony's often looked restricted as a result.

He's hard working and got the right attitude. I'm confident he'll come good.

 

[Skills]

Seems like he's missing Dalot at RB, when he's cutting inside on his left we need that overlapping RB. He definitely needs to go on the outside a bit more though just to be more unpredictable

Dalot doesn't overlap? (Especially when partnered with Antony).

 

[saivet]

he's not here for goals and assists primarily though if you look at his Ajax history. He is there to stretch play, bring balance on the right, track back and pass to an overlapping FB

If this is what we're getting for 80m then we are in trouble

 

[Devil81]

The only blotch on ETH so far for me. He should have known full well this lad wasn't worth anywhere near the region of 90 million.

I'd expect and absolute superstar for 90 million, this lad is bang average and showing little sign of improving. My biggest bug bear is his insistence on using the outside of his foot to pass the ball. He never puts enough pace on the pass and it always seems to be cut out be a defender.

I'd value him closer to 30 million. We've had our pants down by about 60 million.

 

[Edwards6]

Dalot doesn't overlap? (Especially when partnered with Antony).

Dalot does overlap that's why Antony is missing him because Wan Bissaka is playing and is crap going forward

 

[red_de_pologne]

he looks out of form, out of confidence to me, he's shown already he can play so much better

 

[FrankDrebin]

My biggest concern is that the problem with most high potential young players is usually end product. They show lots of promise and flashes, and it's usually just the end product that suffers. Or they try too much, and don't realise that the easy pass is often the best pass.

With Antony, I don't see flashes. I don't see him trying the impossible and falling short of it. I don't see a player who's only missing the end product and a bit of maturity.

I see a player who's incredibly one footed and unable to beat his man. He's become very predictable and easy to defend against. He is no good on the counter attack because defenders don't have to catch up with him to prevent him getting to the by-line - they only have to guard against the cut back onto his left. That significantly reduces the amount of ground the defender has to cover. Rather than getting ahead of Antony, they only have to get alongside him, or even slightly behind him because they know he's not going to swing in a cross with his right.

He's slow with the ball, and it seems to me it's because he is a poor dribbler. He doesn't have complete close control of the ball, his touches are poor so he has to slow down to compensate. He'll roll his foot over the ball multiple times which looks impressive, but only serves to slow him down more. It's an acknowledgment that he can't outrun the full back so he's trying to trick him instead.

As others have noted, I do think a rampaging RB with energy to burn who can provide overlapping runs would do him the world of good and take off some of the pressure. But its frustrating that an 80 million signing needs a complimentary player to unlock his best performances. And what happens if we sign that RB, and he gets injured or suspended? Antony is then nullified again. Dalot has been one of the better performers for ETH, so do we displace him simply because he doesn't get the best out of Antony?

It's looking like a torrid bit of business so far. To be honest, maybe I'm a dinosaur and not adjusting to today's money, but it doesn't sit right with me that an 80 million player isn't a plug & play component in your team.

I've said it a few times, but this isn't a kid getting his first exposure to first team football. He has 150 senior games under his belt and he turns 23 in the next fortnight. I don't see the problems he's having as being attributable to playing in a higher standard of league. Moving to England doesn't make you slower and doesn't take away your ability to use your weaker foot.

My hope is that somehow, a better striker and a better midfield - and maybe a better RB though harsh on Dalot - somehow unlocks something in him.

Sounds familiar. Who's that chap who left in the summer ?
But if its not a right-back who needs to help 'unlock Antony's potential' it'll be a forward or another creative midfielder or a fecking goalkeeper later down the line.
Like Pogba, and I like the guy, but fans are already making excuses for him.

Simply, he's just not doing it. Its ok to say he's not looking great because he's not.

But I agree with the gist of your post.

Regarding the fee, I also agree.
Fans will say 'its not your money' and they're right, its the clubs, not the Glazers. Fans should be questioning the club when its throwing insane money away like this on projects, especially on individuals who look severely limited such as Antony, Maguire and the likes. Horribly reckless with money this club at times.

Anyway, longterm I have more hope for Amad and Sancho. I think they have that something special in their games that I cant see in Antony at the present time.

 

[Ludens the Red]

My biggest concern is that the problem with most high potential young players is usually end product. They show lots of promise and flashes, and it's usually just the end product that suffers. Or they try too much, and don't realise that the easy pass is often the best pass.

With Antony, I don't see flashes. I don't see him trying the impossible and falling short of it. I don't see a player who's only missing the end product and a bit of maturity.

I see a player who's incredibly one footed and unable to beat his man. He's become very predictable and easy to defend against. He is no good on the counter attack because defenders don't have to catch up with him to prevent him getting to the by-line - they only have to guard against the cut back onto his left. That significantly reduces the amount of ground the defender has to cover. Rather than getting ahead of Antony, they only have to get alongside him, or even slightly behind him because they know he's not going to swing in a cross with his right.

He's slow with the ball, and it seems to me it's because he is a poor dribbler. He doesn't have complete close control of the ball, his touches are poor so he has to slow down to compensate. He'll roll his foot over the ball multiple times which looks impressive, but only serves to slow him down more. It's an acknowledgment that he can't outrun the full back so he's trying to trick him instead.

As others have noted, I do think a rampaging RB with energy to burn who can provide overlapping runs would do him the world of good and take off some of the pressure. But its frustrating that an 80 million signing needs a complimentary player to unlock his best performances. And what happens if we sign that RB, and he gets injured or suspended? Antony is then nullified again. Dalot has been one of the better performers for ETH, so do we displace him simply because he doesn't get the best out of Antony?

It's looking like a torrid bit of business so far. To be honest, maybe I'm a dinosaur and not adjusting to today's money, but it doesn't sit right with me that an 80 million player isn't a plug & play component in your team.

I've said it a few times, but this isn't a kid getting his first exposure to first team football. He has 150 senior games under his belt and he turns 23 in the next fortnight. I don't see the problems he's having as being attributable to playing in a higher standard of league. Moving to England doesn't make you slower and doesn't take away your ability to use your weaker foot.

My hope is that somehow, a better striker and a better midfield - and maybe a better RB though harsh on Dalot - somehow unlocks something in him.

Agree with this fully, sounds harsh on a relatively new signing but as United fans we should know by now that the simple matter of “time” doesn’t mean a player will make humongous strides of improvement. You have to expect an 80 million pound player to at least produce something to sink your teeth into. We’re not getting that at all.

 

[Mike Smalling]

My main concern currently is, that when he is isolated with a fullback he tends to just cut back and pass to the fullback or midfield. He never keeps the pace to try and beat his opponent, and he never goes to the byline. He's way to predictable.

 

[UpWithRivers]

I went back to watch the Ajax games to see if he had something that we just haven't seen at United. But he was just the same player in a weaker league. This is just Antony. Get ball, easy pass, fancy tricks, try cut in on left, every now and again a top left foot goal and even more rarely a cross with his left foot. I think he is doing exactly what Ten Haag thought he would do. And thats what confusing as fk. Sure with another season and experience he will improve but Icant see the fundamentals of his game changing. Someone called him a street footballer and that seems apt at this point. I think he would be good in a futsal team.