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    Jonno

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    Yes Mourinho started well but couldn't sustain it, it was utterly toxic and he had to leave. He was never the right manager for United. Your statement is a very rose tinted view of his tenure.
    Van Gaal is one of the true greats of the game - he was perhaps slowly making some progress BUT it was utterly turgid to watch, painful shit. He spent a shit load of money and failed transfers and made bad misjudgments on which players should leave the club and which should stay.
    Both have their shave of blame in our current mess.

    So two of the best coachs of the last 30 years failed here. Who is it you think will come in and fix things quicker than Ole?

    Spurs are finishing above us because they have a better squad of players. If Mou was still managing United and Ole was managing Spurs - spurs would still be finishing above United.

    Your 20-30% statement is nonsense - people said Fergie was delusional in 89. None of us know if Ole is going to work out, but since he's been chosen to do this rebuild we should give him the required time before judging him
    Van Gaal and Mourinho were bad appointments for United, I agree. But they still have something Ole will never had, and thats a winning pedigree in management, thats why they won stuff before ultimately they failed. LVG didn't come to United as a true great in his prime, he came way past his best. Thats like signing Rooney now and expecting him to have a 30 goal season. It aint gonna happen due to the fact he's past his best, as was LVG.

    Ole is a calm person and will never upset the applecart, it will never turn toxic, but that alone isn't enough. We shouldn't be saying, right we have a manager such as LVG/Jose, OR we have a manager like Ole. We need to appoint a top level manager, who is the right fit. I don't care if it takes 10 managers to find him, just ask Liverpool, they endured Hodgson but got Klopp. I am flabbergasted as to why people think we give Ole time just because previous managers didn't get time! It's ridiculous.

    You can't compare this stint Ole is producing to the one that Fergie was in in 1989.... Fergie was a proven top level manager. He had sone unpresedented things as a manager, he had proven he was good enough. Ole has not proven that in the slightest.

    My extra 20% statement is not nonsense. If he had an extra 20% Cardiff would have avoided relagation or at least put up a fight. We wouldn't lose 4-0 at Everton, we wouldn't lose 0-2 to Burnley at home, lose to Newcastle, the list goes on. Do you know we're winning on average 1 game per month? It's unacceptable! He's happy with this.
     
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    Van Gaal and Mourinho were bad appointments for United, I agree. But they still have something Ole will never had, and thats a winning pedigree in management, thats why they won stuff before ultimately they failed. LVG didn't come to United as a true great in his prime, he came way past his best. Thats like signing Rooney now and expecting him to have a 30 goal season. It aint gonna happen due to the fact he's past his best, as was LVG.

    Ole is a calm person and will never upset the applecart, it will never turn toxic, but that alone isn't enough. We shouldn't be saying, right we have a manager such as LVG/Jose, OR we have a manager like Ole. We need to appoint a top level manager, who is the right fit. I don't care if it takes 10 managers to find him, just ask Liverpool, they endured Hodgson but got Klopp. I am flabbergasted as to why people think we give Ole time just because previous managers didn't get time! It's ridiculous.

    You can't compare this stint Ole is producing to the one that Fergie was in in 1989.... Fergie was a proven top level manager. He had sone unpresedented things as a manager, he had proven he was good enough. Ole has not proven that in the slightest.

    My extra 20% statement is not nonsense. If he had an extra 20% Cardiff would have avoided relagation or at least put up a fight. We wouldn't lose 4-0 at Everton, we wouldn't lose 0-2 to Burnley at home, lose to Newcastle, the list goes on. Do you know we're winning on average 1 game per month? It's unacceptable! He's happy with this.
    Van Gaal and Mourinho were given time and money. I think Ole deserves the same.

    I know Fergie had a great success with Aberdeen. But plenty thought he was out of his depth at United and thought it was aimless.
    Ole is essentially an unknown quantity, he might fail but you can't say that he definitely won't turn things around.

    As for shit results - we've been battered at Everton, lost to Newcastle etc. Under the last three managers. It's not a new thing that's just started.

    It's fine that you would prefer a 'top level manager, who is the right fit' - everyone would
    it sounds great, who is this person you have in mind???
     

    sunama

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    I agree that we're not good enough. And it's terrible watching United getting bullied at home to Burnley and languishing in 6/7. My view is we just have to suck it up at this point and let Ole have the time to either suceed or fail.

    If there's no clear sign of improvement this time next year then it's going to be very hard to defend Ole. But I think it's important to let him have the summer window and see what next season brings. For all we know we could win Europa and be in the CL next year.

    I get what you say about having a top level manager coming in, but if I put my doubt aside about that I do have to question who that would be?
    Ole has been with us for over a year and there has been no improvement. In fact, we have regressed.
    Given the above, what makes you think we should give him another year?
    Has any manager, in recent history, at any club, managed to go from regression (in the first year), to progression (after the first year)?

    We know that the board are failing (as is the rest of the club, in every position), however, that does not mean we should give a failing manager a free pass.
    If I had my way, I'd first change the board, bring in DoF, new manager, new coaches, new players, new scouts, new medical staff. From top to bottom, mediocrity and apathy, has become acceptable. Even the fans are now accepting mediocrity.
     

    sunama

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    Van Gaal and Mourinho were given time and money. I think Ole deserves the same.
    They were both given money and time, because they were big time managers.
    The only pedigree Ole has is of getting relegated when managing Cardiff. And I believe he was heading for relegation in the Championship, but before he could achieve this, he got fired.

    I know Fergie had a great success with Aberdeen. But plenty thought he was out of his depth at United and thought it was aimless.
    Ole is essentially an unknown quantity, he might fail but you can't say that he definitely won't turn things around.
    Fergie got Aberdeen a European trophy. Who the hell are Aberdeen? Well that's exactly what MUFC were thinking.
    His pedigree is what bought him time.
    And let's not forget that he came in, in the mid 80's. Football has changed due to the money involved. The more money is involved in a project, the faster the results are expected.

    It's fine that you would prefer a 'top level manager, who is the right fit' - everyone would
    it sounds great, who is this person you have in mind???
    I do agree that there is no outstanding managerial candidate, however, that should not be the reason we hang onto a manager who is not good enough to manage any club in the EPL (and that includes a team at the bottom of the table).
     

    Jonno

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    Van Gaal and Mourinho were given time and money. I think Ole deserves the same.

    I know Fergie had a great success with Aberdeen. But plenty thought he was out of his depth at United and thought it was aimless.
    Ole is essentially an unknown quantity, he might fail but you can't say that he definitely won't turn things around.

    As for shit results - we've been battered at Everton, lost to Newcastle etc. Under the last three managers. It's not a new thing that's just started.

    It's fine that you would prefer a 'top level manager, who is the right fit' - everyone would
    it sounds great, who is this person you have in mind???
    Van Gaal and Mourinho were given time and money because they've won Champions Leagues, La Ligas, Premier Leagues! Ole hasn't done that!

    Ole is not an unknown quantity though is he, he's demonstrated an incredibly poor record in the league. We're performing the worst we've ever performed in the Premier League.

    Yeah, we might have lost to Everton in the past under a different manager, but check the win percentages, the average points. Ole is bottom. He's the worst, factually. And if Jose or LVG lost, they still got top 4, or a trophy.

    So its on me to pick Uniteds' next manager is it? Of course it's not. I'm a mere fan who works full time who doesn't have the time or energy to swot up on all the top managers in world football, i'm not a scout. But we need to be in the market for the very next Pep, the next Klopp. Nagelsmann is the closest I can think of off the top of my head. He has assembled a quality team that plays ruthless attacking football despite being a selling club. He's a world class, young manager. If I spent more than 5 minutes to think I'm sure I could come up with others. Fecking hell, I could think of 50 managers that possess better managerial/coaching skills than Ole.
     
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    Ole has been with us for over a year and there has been no improvement. In fact, we have regressed.
    Given the above, what makes you think we should give him another year?
    Has any manager, in recent history, at any club, managed to go from regression (in the first year), to progression (after the first year)?

    We know that the board are failing (as is the rest of the club, in every position), however, that does not mean we should give a failing manager a free pass.
    If I had my way, I'd first change the board, bring in DoF, new manager, new coaches, new players, new scouts, new medical staff. From top to bottom, mediocrity and apathy, has become acceptable. Even the fans are now accepting mediocrity.
    I think he should be given more time due to the pile of shit he inherited. Fans have been crying out for the dross the be shipped out en masse - finally we have someone doing just that.
    But a squad as bad as United's couldn't be fixed in one of two windows.
    The players Ole has brought in have been good additions, so I have faith that if he's back with money in the summer we'll be in a good position next season.

    Your wish list of replacing virtually every role at the club made me laugh. But it just shows that some fans fall into the trap of thinking they know what is happening inside the club. When really non of us know what's happening in the medical facility, with the scouts, with day to day coaching....

    Fans that don't want Ole sacked aren't accepting mediocrity, but believe that some continuity is best at this stage of the rebuild.

    I do agree that there is no outstanding managerial candidate, however, that should not be the reason we hang onto a manager who is not good enough to manage any club in the EPL (and that includes a team at the bottom of the table).
    .
    So you agree there's no recognisable candidate to replace Ole and solve United's problems - but you want to sack Ole anyway... that type of disjointed logic is impossible to reason with.
     

    sunama

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    I think he should be given more time due to the pile of shit he inherited. Fans have been crying out for the dross the be shipped out en masse - finally we have someone doing just that.
    But a squad as bad as United's couldn't be fixed in one of two windows.
    The players Ole has brought in have been good additions, so I have faith that if he's back with money in the summer we'll be in a good position next season.

    Your wish list of replacing virtually every role at the club made me laugh. But it just shows that some fans fall into the trap of thinking they know what is happening inside the club. When really non of us know what's happening in the medical facility, with the scouts, with day to day coaching....

    Fans that don't want Ole sacked aren't accepting mediocrity, but believe that some continuity is best at this stage of the rebuild.


    .
    So you agree there's no recognisable candidate to replace Ole and solve United's problems - but you want to sack Ole anyway... that type of disjointed logic is impossible to reason with.
    This thread is getting derailed and I can answer each of your points, without "laughing" or sounding condescending.

    I'll do the most obvious one, as it's a quick and easy:
    scouts - when was the last time we unearthed a gem, we bought for cheap and turned him into a regular first teamer? Without scouts, we could've bought the likes of Di Maria, Pogba, Maguire, Wan Bissaka, etc.
    medical facility - they are responsible for monitoring varous parameters of our players. Injuries for one. Pogba was brought back too soon and got injured after 1-2 games. Rashford had a minor injury which was getting progressively worse, but our medical team didn't spot this until it go so bad that he had to completely stop playing. Or how about the excess weight which some players have gained, which effected their game-play, which led to them getting sold? Shaw is next.
    coaching - anybody who knows anything about our football can watch our games and know that our coaching is poor. Most fans comment on this during the matches. You don't have to be ITK to see this with your own eyes.
    manager - our worst start to an EPL season EVER!
    DoF (Woodward) - under his reign we have gone from EPL champs to 7th place (currently). And the decline has been consistent.

    I could write paragraphs about every position in our club, but you get the point I am making.

    And as for replacing the manager - in business (we are run like a business, so I will give you a business example), if a person is underperforming in his role, a replacement is sought. NEVER in a successful business would you have a person obviously failing (worst in our EPL history) and he be allowed to continue. If he is failing as badly ad Ole, he will be removed quickly, even if a replacement has not been found. If poor performance continues, the damage done to the organisation could take longer to fix. Moyes was a great example of this.
     
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    This thread is getting derailed and I can answer each of your points, without "laughing" or sounding condescending.

    I'll do the most obvious one, as it's a quick and easy:
    scouts - when was the last time we unearthed a gem, we bought for cheap and turned him into a regular first teamer? Without scouts, we could've bought the likes of Di Maria, Pogba, Maguire, Wan Bissaka, etc.
    medical facility - they are responsible for monitoring varous parameters of our players. Injuries for one. Pogba was brought back too soon and got injured after 1-2 games. Rashford had a minor injury which was getting progressively worse, but our medical team didn't spot this until it go so bad that he had to completely stop playing. Or how about the excess weight which some players have gained, which effected their game-play, which led to them getting sold? Shaw is next.
    coaching - anybody who knows anything about our football can watch our games and know that our coaching is poor. Most fans comment on this during the matches. You don't have to be ITK to see this with your own eyes.
    manager - our worst start to an EPL season EVER!
    DoF (Woodward) - under his reign we have gone from EPL champs to 7th place (currently). And the decline has been consistent.

    I could write paragraphs about every position in our club, but you get the point I am making.

    And as for replacing the manager - in business (we are run like a business, so I will give you a business example), if a person is underperforming in his role, a replacement is sought. NEVER in a successful business would you have a person obviously failing (worst in our EPL history) and he be allowed to continue. If he is failing as badly ad Ole, he will be removed quickly, even if a replacement has not been found. If poor performance continues, the damage done to the organisation could take longer to fix. Moyes was a great example of this.
    The thread is getting derailed - but i would quickly say that stories about players being rushed back from injury or playing with injuries is normally a decision made by the player in discussion with the manager.
    I would expect that United are scouting the same top talent as always - but United are being snubbed for other clubs as we're a mess. Even in Manchester alone it's hard to sign local youngsters because City offer to pay for all their youth kids from about 8 to go to the best private school in the city.

    Nobody has yet told me their plan once they sack Ole. You mention business, well a competent business has succession plans in place. Until someone gives a name of the manager that will come in and improve things I will still back Ole to stay for a while yet.
     

    Dve

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    A game for James, and Martial has to be the one replacing Rashford. Maybe we can create something on the counter again.

    ......................De Gea

    Bissaka - Lindeløf - Maguire - Shaw

    ................ Fred - Matic

    .....James - Ighalo - Martial
     

    jimmyb2000

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    A game for James, and Martial has to be the one replacing Rashford. Maybe we can create something on the counter again.

    ......................De Gea

    Bissaka - Lindeløf - Maguire - Shaw

    ................ Fred - Matic

    .....James - Ighalo - Martial
    Aaaagh the old 10 players trick......that will catch Chelsea out. Or does your team contain Lingard as that's the equivalent of playing with 10 men anyway.
     

    Red00012

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    A game for James, and Martial has to be the one replacing Rashford. Maybe we can create something on the counter again.

    ......................De Gea

    Bissaka - Lindeløf - Maguire - Shaw

    ................ Fred - Matic

    .....James - Ighalo - Martial
    Lingard white text ?
     

    Dve

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    Aaaagh the old 10 players trick......that will catch Chelsea out. Or does your team contain Lingard as that's the equivalent of playing with 10 men anyway.
    Ferdinand is smelling the flowers outside the stadium. He´ll be back soon.
     

    Reddevil1978

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    Subs if chasing the win.
    Ighalo off for Martial
    Bruno off for James
    Mata off for Greenwood

    I've gone for Ighalo upfront simply because he's different , should give his all and to remind Martial he has competition. But Ole will probably go with Martial and bring in Ighalo later.
     
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    Wing Attack Plan R

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    Subs if chasing the win.
    Ighalo off for Martial
    Bruno off for James
    Mata off for Greenwood

    I've gone for Ighalo upfront simply because he's different , should give his all and to remind Martial he has competition. But Ole will probably go with Martial and bring in Ighalo later.
    You've got Bruno acting as an inverted winger or a forward? In this setup he's got only one person to pass to ahead of him, so I'd say that's not using his talents in the best way possible. He needs two players alongside him, a midfield 3, with at least 2 options ahead of him. This also leaves an actual hole in the center of midfield.
     

    Reddevil1978

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    You've got Bruno acting as an inverted winger or a forward? In this setup he's got only one person to pass to ahead of him, so I'd say that's not using his talents in the best way possible. He needs two players alongside him, a midfield 3, with at least 2 options ahead of him. This also leaves an actual hole in the center of midfield.
    You've got Bruno acting as an inverted winger or a forward? In this setup he's got only one person to pass to ahead of him, so I'd say that's not using his talents in the best way possible. He needs two players alongside him, a midfield 3, with at least 2 options ahead of him. This also leaves an actual hole in the center of midfield.
    I see what your saying might be better if Bruno drops back into the middle and mata swapped for Greenwood to play with Ighalo. Was just trying to but our most creative players on.
     

    Forevergiggs1

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    The only doubt is will Williams or Shaw start. Ole isn't exactly famous from getting away from his 4-2-3-1 formation.

    ________________DeGea______________

    _AWB_____Lindelof___Maquire_____? _

    ____________Fred__Matic_____________

    __James_____Bruno________Martial __

    _______________Ighalo________________
     

    buckooo1978

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    I think I'd like to see

    --------------------------DeGea--------------------------

    ---------Lindelof__Maguire_Shaw---------------
    AWB-----------Matic------Fred---------Williams
    ---------------------------Bruno---------------------------
    -------------------Ighalo--------Martial--------------

    nice to have one or 2 options up front and be good to take one of James/Martial out of the firing line for a game

    think Ole has done quite well recently with this set up in games away at City and Anfield though I look forward to seeing Tuanzebe, McTominay and Pogba involved again soon
     

    Nou_Camp99

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    Best we can hope for is a draw. Without Rashford we look goal shy. 3 PL games on trot without a goal since he got injured. Could easily be a 4th on the horizon.

    Our season will come down to Europa League. Can't see how we will be able to sustain a top 4 challenge and compete on 2 cup fronts. Squad is awful.
     

    Random Task

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    Safe to say this is a must win. We're 8th in the table, a loss here with a Wolves draw or win will see us drop to 9th and 9 points off top 4.
    We can't even contemplate anything other than three points here, as losing it will end any hopes of top four and possibly Ole's reign to boot.

    Our record at the Bridge is rather poor which doesn't help matters.
     

    Zlatattack

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    I'd like to see;

    DDG
    AWB Maguire Lindelof Williams
    McT Matic Fred
    Bruno
    Ighalo Martial​
     

    Roboc7

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    We can sit back and hit on break so have a chance as that’s our preferred way of playing. Chelsea have been poor whenever I’ve seen them lately only problem is we’ve been every bit as bad if not worse.

    Win this, turn the corner then get one point out of Watford and Everton games.
     

    ArjenIsM3

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    We can sit back and hit on break so have a chance as that’s our preferred way of playing. Chelsea have been poor whenever I’ve seen them lately only problem is we’ve been every bit as bad if not worse.

    Win this, turn the corner then get one point out of Watford and Everton games.
    We need to lose against Watford to improve our chances of getting Grealish. This is the way.
     

    bosnian_red

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    Not a chance Ighalo starts... the guy isn't brought in to be a starter, especially not in a big game with no training with the actual team, right from China. He's an impact sub for the next half season, nothing more.
    De Gea
    AWB Lindelof Maguire Shaw Williams
    Matic Fred
    Bruno Fernandes
    James Martial
    Probably this. One of the left backs off for Greenwood when we need a goal, McTominay for Matic, Ighalo for James.
     

    Nicoseth

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    DDG
    AWB Lindelof Maguire Shaw

    fred Matic

    James Bruno Martial

    Ighalo

    Think this is what Ole might go for.
     

    momo83

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    Van Gaal and Mourinho were given time and money. I think Ole deserves the same.

    I know Fergie had a great success with Aberdeen. But plenty thought he was out of his depth at United and thought it was aimless.
    Ole is essentially an unknown quantity, he might fail but you can't say that he definitely won't turn things around.

    As for shit results - we've been battered at Everton, lost to Newcastle etc. Under the last three managers. It's not a new thing that's just started.

    It's fine that you would prefer a 'top level manager, who is the right fit' - everyone would
    it sounds great, who is this person you have in mind???
    How were they given time? LVG was sacked as soon as he failed to qualify for the CL on GD. Mourinho was sacked before the season ended after finishing second.
     

    Okey

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    Form over this season would probably have us as favourites for this game, and weirdly rightly so. I'm quite confident we'll sneak a win. I'm much more worried about the next game against Watford to be honest...
     

    Annihilate Now!

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    Hate Monday night games... dunno why but I never fancy us on a Monday.

    Anyone got any stats to back up/quash this?
     

    Alabaster Codify7

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    Chelsea struggles against our pace up top so Daniel plays.

    But probably ends up doing nothing at all, apart from run into dead ends. James is a busted flush, at the very least the boy needs a long rest to recharge his batteries - at worst, he's been found out.
     

    Annihilate Now!

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    Hate Monday night games... dunno why but I never fancy us on a Monday.

    Anyone got any stats to back up/quash this?
    Turns out i'm talking bollocks.

    Our Monday night record is 43 wins from 65 games. We've drawn 16 and lost 6.

    This season we've drawn twice vs. Wolves and Arsenal... both 1-1, and we should have won that Wolves game.
     

    Samid

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    Turns out i'm talking bollocks.

    Our Monday night record is 43 wins from 65 games. We've drawn 16 and lost 6.

    This season we've drawn twice vs. Wolves and Arsenal... both 1-1, and we should have won that Wolves game.
    And the Arsenal one. Stonewall pen denied on 1-0 (handball) and McT (I think) missed a free header from five yards.
     

    Annihilate Now!

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    And the Arsenal one. Stonewall pen denied on 1-0 (handball) and McT (I think) missed a free header from five yards.
    Oh yeah and we gave away that stupid goal

    For some reason I was getting this Arsenal game confused with last years Arsenal game at home which we drew 2-2 and kept scoring right after they did.
     

    OleTheGreat

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    Don't think the result would mean anything. Even if we win, would we go on any sort of run?
    Never count out anything. Be positive. I know we have been poor consistently throughout the season but i do think we have a chance if we get ahead of Chelsea on the day. We will get players back from injury and we can definitely salvage something from the rest of this season.
     
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    How were they given time? LVG was sacked as soon as he failed to qualify for the CL on GD. Mourinho was sacked before the season ended after finishing second.
    Van Gaal had 2 seasons. A huge amount of money on transfers and served up some of the worst football ever seen at Old Trafford. It was toxic at Old Trafford in his last season. Lost the dressing room.

    Mourinho had 2.5 seasons - again backed well in the transfer market. Didn't buy well and served up some turgid football. 2nd was an achievement. But again toxic atmosphere and lost the dressing room. Sacked in 8th place.

    Ole is clearing out the shit players and those with bad attitudes. Ole is picking up the mess other managers created. He needs time.
    He's trying to improve performances and we see flashes of good football.
     

    momo83

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    Dec 5, 2013
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    1,387
    Van Gaal had 2 seasons. A huge amount of money on transfers and served up some of the worst football ever seen at Old Trafford. It was toxic at Old Trafford in his last season. Lost the dressing room.

    Mourinho had 2.5 seasons - again backed well in the transfer market. Didn't buy well and served up some turgid football. 2nd was an achievement. But again toxic atmosphere and lost the dressing room. Sacked in 8th place.

    Ole is clearing out the shit players and those with bad attitudes. Ole is picking up the mess other managers created. He needs time.
    He's trying to improve performances and we see flashes of good football.
    lvg was sacked as soon as he didn’t qualify for the CL. Mourinho was sacked 4 months into a season that isn’t even as bad as what Ole is having.
     
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Post-match discussion

Man of the Match

 Fred image Fred 53% of 406 votes

Runners-up

Player Ratings

6.7 Total Average Rating

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Compiled from 384.07692307692 ratings.

Score Predictions

124,99,70
  • Man Utd win
  • Chelsea win
  • Draw

Detailed Results

  • 20% Chelsea 1:2 Man Utd
  • 18% Chelsea 1:1 Man Utd
  • 12% Chelsea 2:1 Man Utd
  • 10% Chelsea 2:0 Man Utd
  • 6% Chelsea 0:1 Man Utd
  • 6% Chelsea 0:2 Man Utd
  • 5% Chelsea 1:0 Man Utd
  • 4% Chelsea 1:3 Man Utd
  • 4% Chelsea 2:2 Man Utd
  • 3% Chelsea 3:0 Man Utd
  • 2% Chelsea 3:1 Man Utd
  • 2% Chelsea 0:0 Man Utd
  • 1% Chelsea 5:0 Man Utd
  • 1% Chelsea 2:3 Man Utd
  • 1% Chelsea 0:5 Man Utd
  • 1% Chelsea 0:3 Man Utd
  • 1% Chelsea 2:4 Man Utd
  • 1% Chelsea 0:4 Man Utd
  • 1% Chelsea 1:5 Man Utd
  • 0% Chelsea 4:0 Man Utd
  • 0% Chelsea 4:1 Man Utd
  • 0% Chelsea 4:2 Man Utd
  • 0% Chelsea 1:4 Man Utd
Compiled from 293 predictions.
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