There is big difference between being 1st, 2nd, 3rd in form table to 6th, 7th. Form table is smaller scope than the overall 23 game league table. People can just look at the PL table. Being in good form but not the very best has less value in media advertising and betting industry. There is money to be made changing the narrative.Not really. On all three form tables us and Fulham are around the top of the form table with us slightly ahead of them. The differences between those three tables with how it relates to us going into a head to head with them are negligible, and trying to make out like there’s some substantive difference seems to be an exercise in clutching at straws.
There is big difference between being 1st, 2nd, 3rd in form table to 6th, 7th. Form table is smaller scope than the overall 23 game league table. People can just look at the PL table. Being in good form but not the very best has less value in media advertising and betting industry. There is money to be made changing the narrative.
“This is a game between the most in form and the third best in form” read very different to “… against 6th best in form team”.
I don’t follow.Not when making a comparison between two teams who are about to meet up head to head. In all three form tables we’re a bit ahead of them. There isn’t some big swing which would change the narrative in any meaningful way.
I don’t follow.
In 7 game form table, Fulham would be 2nd and we’re at 6th. As I explained, that swing in position in form is enough to make one opposition sounds meh when selling a game to neutral, or even less serious fans of the clubs. Form table is not the actual table.
If all people are carefully examining context, they shouldn’t care about the form table or our form pre Carrick, knowing the context of our change of manager. The change is drastic enough to disregard the form under Amorim and Fletcher. Fulham form is good for them, but in overall, they’re not pulling trees. The manipulative way to cut the form table create narrative is for media profit, not some kind of highly useful data.
I will give you another example. Using 5 game form table, Newcastle is the most in form team in PL. In reality they just drew to Wolves and lost to Villa at home. They only have one win in their last six games in all competition (won in penalty shoot out in their FA cup game). Showing 5 game form table would make even the most careless people to notice and question the narrative to promote some games for this week.
Just bad sample of form to create excitement for this game.
Normally they use 5 game form or 10 game form. Here cutting at 6 game to include Newcastle for us to make us look good. At 5 game sample, or 7+ game sample, it doesn’t look pretty for us.
So you thought that I was being negative about us against Fulham? Then you misread my intention. I am talking about the general point of narrative creation to make us look good to make this game more sellable than it is. It’s only us against a mid table team in good form for their standard. Fulham recently got 2 positive under Amorim and another under ETH, but overall they don’t have good record against over a decade. It’s not the topic I discussed.You originally said:
I was simply pointing out that is false. In both the 5 or 10 game form tables, we were still above Fulham. There’s no meaningful difference in the narrative painted between the 5, 10, or 6 game form tables.
So I’m really not sure what you’re not understanding here.
Ok, things might look different by cherry picking a 7 game form table, but as you yourself pointed out, the 5 and 10 game tables are more usual, and they are what you chose to reference to try and make your point. And yet they both paint a picture which is much more similar to the 6 game one than you suggested.
So you thought that I was being negative about us against Fulham? Then you misread my intention. I am talking about the general point of narrative creation to make us look good to make this game more sellable than it is. It’s only us against a mid table team in good form for their standard. Fulham recently got 2 positive under Amorim and another under ETH, but overall they don’t have good record against over a decade. It’s not the topic I discussed.
In 5 or 10 game form sample, the team position show a different picture than this 6 game sample. For Fulham to be 3rd best form is very different to being in 7th. For us to be the most in form with 6 game sample is different than being 4th in 10 game sample. This is form. Not that table. Leeds have been doing well recently doesn’t get them back onto the top half.
I had already explained multiple times: Either Fulham or us or both would move outside of the spotlight by changing the sample size. 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th place in form table doesn’t have the gravity as the same the actual league table. One bad or couple result and teams widely changes position.
I am on Man United forum, what I wrote means toward us fan of this club. It’s a reminder for us to look past cherry picking sample. We should all be able to remember all of our last 10 game, no? The 8 before Carrick during the easier fixture does not look good, even adding 2 recent victories.
Fulham is 7th in 5 game sample. They have same points and GD as Everton & Bournemouth, but scored less goal than Bournemouth. They scored same amount as Everton. As they lost to Everton during head to head earlier in the season, the form table has them in 7th place below Everton.But again, the 5, 6 and 10 game from tables all painted a very similar picture of our form versus Fulham’s. In all three we were slightly above them. And Fulham weren’t 7th in any of those three.
How does that even make sense?As usually, this is the more challenging game than the one against the top teams. Hopefully we pull off the win.
Dorgu has been outstanding in our last two games under Carrick but let’s not take it that far. He is not Bruno. We have options going forward with Cunha, Mount, Sesko.Time to see if this is yet another false dawn. Fulham are no joke, though, and without Dorgu it's going to be difficult. A good performance will do, even if it's a draw.
Maybe also start Sesko?
Why not Amad Sesko Mbeumo then? Probably work the bestIs it going to be Amad Mbuemo Cunha front 3 or Mbuemo Sesko Cunha? I see both options as valid. Having a bigger presence in the box with Sesko against a side like Fulham who will probably be tough to break makes sense to me, but at the same time Amad is the kind of player that can create something out of nothing so he would also be very valuable. I'd personally go with Amad, but if we struggle to create I'd make an early sub to bring Sesko in the second half
Mbuemo has to start, you don't bench your top scorer who scored against City and Arsenal back to back
We seem to do well against the bigger teams where we are actually the underdog, and I think it's partially because the players perform better on these occasions, but also because we're sitting back more, staying compact, and hitting them on the counter when they commit more players to the attack to break us down.How does that even make sense?
Mbuemo on the left is nowhere near as potent. Also Cunha deserves to start after the massive impact he had as a super sub recentlyWhy not Amad Sesko Mbeumo then? Probably work the best
Both Liverpool and Chelsea won so winning this is a must
I say if we win this comfortably, Carrick should sign a permacontract
No.Both Liverpool and Chelsea won so winning this is a must
I say if we win this comfortably, Carrick should sign a permacontract
The key is intensity. In the first 10 min we‘ll already know if we win or not. Can’t play passive or on the counter alone like in the last game
So who would you rather play every week, Fulham and West Ham or Arsenal and City?We seem to do well against the bigger teams where we are actually the underdog, and I think it's partially because the players perform better on these occasions, but also because we're sitting back more, staying compact, and hitting them on the counter when they commit more players to the attack to break us down.
In games like vs Fulham, it's them sitting back, staying compact, and hitting us on the counter, which means we have to approach the game a little differently and we've struggled with that over the last few years or so. Also, I do feel the players aren't as "up for it" as when we play the bigger teams.
Not saying we can't solve this under Carrick, we might. Just that it's a different kind of challenge and one that we have generally struggled with.
I don't know if that's criticising the poster but it was a valid point. We've failed to beat 16/17th/18th/19th. We beat 20th but failed at home.So who would you rather play every week, Fulham and West Ham or Arsenal and City?
I don’t know what point you’re making but Arsenal and City. I like bigger games generally though, so that maybe just me.So who would you rather play every week, Fulham and West Ham or Arsenal and City?
and Leno pulling off blinders for funCalvin Bassey to start and turn into the greatest centre back in the world for 90 minutes.
We had a system where we plod along passing between centre backs. It’s not like we ever had possession in the opposite third where teams like City were able to suffocate the opposition, we just played in areas that had no impact on the opposition.I don't know if that's criticising the poster but it was a valid point. We've failed to beat 16/17th/18th/19th. We beat 20th but failed at home.
We've managed to beat 1st/2nd/4th and 5th. So there has been a motivational issue/unable to best teams sitting back.
Bruno Fernandes
Senne Lammens
Amad Diallo
Lisandro Martinez
Benjamin Sesko
Kobbie Mainoo
Matheus Cunha
Harry Maguire
Casemiro
Manuel Ugarte
replaced by Noussair Mazraoui
replaced by Manuel Ugarte
replaced by Benjamin Sesko
replaced by Leny Yoro
