Get rid of VAR NOW! We want our game back! (...or not, some are happy)

VAR - Love or Hate?

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bleedred

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sullydnl said:
The bigger problem for me is that if the defender handled the ball in the exact same way nothing would happen.

It would be fairer if an accidental handball on the defender's part resulted in a penalty but then you'd have to put up with more penalties and attackers deliberately playing the ball off defenders' hands.
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Its all like opening a can of worms. The attacker is penalized only when it results in the goal and its not really a foul if nothing happens after that. Like instead of Jesus scoring, if lloris palms it for a corner. Its still a corner rather than FK for spurs because of the handball and if city score from it, its still a goal.

Or say for example, if ball touched laporte's arm, fell to a spurs player who miscues it and then Jesus scores. I don't think the goal can then be disallowed. or will it?. Its too confusing and very ambiguous.
 

montpelier

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bleedred said:
Its all like opening a can of worms. The attacker is penalized only when it results in the goal and its not really a foul if nothing happens after that. Like instead of Jesus scoring, if lloris palms it for a corner. Its still a corner rather than FK for spurs because of the handball and if city score from it, its still a goal.

Or say for example, if ball touched laporte's arm, fell to a spurs player who miscues it and then Jesus scores. I don't think the goal can then be disallowed. or will it?. Its too confusing and very ambiguous.
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See, that's a FK for me. Keep your arms out of the way. Especially if you're hammering defenders with a penalty for something similar. The hand affects the defence's ability to defend?

And you're giving referees leeway to be lashing it up.
 

awop

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sullydnl said:

This is a really good thread on the City penalty incident, explaining how/why they likely decided not to review it. As I said above, it's a direct result of the PL opting for a much higher threshold. However, it's interesting that this may change based on referee feedback, as it apparently did in Germany.
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Interesting but ultimately they're just guessing. Why aren't they officially announcing the reasoning for using or not VAR for every big incident ? Especially if they are discouraging the use of pitch-side reviews. Didn't they do it for the KO stages of the Champions League last year ? That would clear up a lot of questions that everyone (pro or anti-VAR) have for any given game.
Mrs Smoker said:
Was there some pushing/showing/pulling, or Lamela just put his hands on Rodri? Of course, saw them called a lot, but I personally liked that refs let them play on in this game. Unless I did miss pushing/showing/pulling...
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It should have been a pen imo, he had his hands all over him.
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
stop the ridiculous fantasy scenarios. Live in reality. Comment on that. You’re all going nuts.
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I agree, it's boring, you just have to skip posts from these 2 users.
 

sullydnl

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awop said:
Interesting but ultimately they're just guessing. Why aren't they officially announcing the reasoning for using or not VAR for every big incident ? Especially if they are discouraging the use of pitch-side reviews. Didn't they do it for the KO stages of the Champions League last year ? That would clear up a lot of questions that everyone (pro or anti-VAR) have for any given game.

It should have been a pen imo, he had his hands all over him.

I agree, it's boring, you just have to skip posts from these 2 users.
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This is the single thing they've got most wrong about VAR so far imo, they've been terrible at communicating to the fans what's happening and why. Which is annoying as that's something they should have absolutely been able to forsee as an issue before ever introducing VAR. If you're going to make a change that big you have to explain to people how it works on an ongoing basis.

I mean just by being on a football forum where we can discuss VAR we're probably all more tuned in to what's going on than most fans, yet there is still confusion after various decisions as we try to piece together why X was given and Y wasn't.
 

kouroux

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bleedred said:
The main problem for me is that I feel its being rushed too soon. I don't think any of the higher ups even possibly discussed the various scenarios discussed among the fans and they just said, lets wing it and see. And that has become a pro-VAR narrative as well, "with time it will get better". Maybe,maybe not.

Cricket has had VAR and TV replays for nearly a decade and yesterday they weren't sure if a ball was caught or not. There is going to be and there still is imperfections with VAR as well and people have to acknowledge that to fix it, rather than burying their head in sand and claiming "its not VARs fault", "it will be better","its an neandrathal agenda".
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I do agree with you that with experimentation, as the system is meant to stay for a while, they refine and improve on it. In some instances though, VAR has nothing to do with the frustration generated by some decisions. I think it's important to acknowledge that VAR should be improved upon but also that VAR and the new rules are two separate things.
 

Rafaeldagold

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UnrelatedPsuedo said:
Anyone that says this should be banned.

Not for anything even vaguely topic related.

It’s the most ridiculous pish that anyone could write. Only equaled by “Would you rather every decision was wrong”

I hate VAR. but everyone, stop the ridiculous fantasy scenarios. Live in reality. Comment on that. You’re all going nuts.
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Oh should I? It’s a possibility- there’s a poster or two on here saying we should review throw ins & everything to make sure we get the ‘correct’ result.

Reality is that VAR is clearly obviously shite yet posters defend it & even want to increase how often it’s used.

That’s insanity
 

UnrelatedPsuedo

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Rafaeldagold said:
Oh should I? It’s a possibility- there’s a poster or two on here saying we should review throw ins & everything to make sure we get the ‘correct’ result.

Reality is that VAR is clearly obviously shite yet posters defend it & even want to increase how often it’s used.

That’s insanity
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Pick a position. Everyone will.

But any suggestion that the natural forward motion is a week long lag between announcing results... it’s pathetic. Just stop.
 

Rafaeldagold

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UnrelatedPsuedo said:
Pick a position. Everyone will.

But any suggestion that the natural forward motion is a week long lag between announcing results... it’s pathetic. Just stop.
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You have no idea where it’ll end. In order to get the ‘correct ‘ result.

There was a game a season ago where the game was ‘finished’ for the half yet the ref brought them back on the pitch for a penalty var had spotted.
 

awop

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sullydnl said:
This is the single thing they've got most wrong about VAR so far imo, they've been terrible at communicating to the fans what's happening and why. Which is annoying as that's something they should have absolutely been able to forsee as an issue before ever introducing VAR. If you're going to make a change that big you have to explain to people how it works on an ongoing basis.

I mean just by being on a football forum where we can discuss VAR we're probably all more tuned in to what's going on than most fans, yet there is still confusion after various decisions as we try to piece together why X was given and Y wasn't.
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It's so stupid, the referees already have to write a post-game report. It should be made public, they will be boring lingo 9 times out of 10 bu when something goes wrong we'd have something instead of trying to read minds.

Rafaeldagold said:
You have no idea where it’ll end. In order to get the ‘correct ‘ result.

There was a game a season ago where the game was ‘finished’ for the half yet the ref brought them back on the pitch for a penalty var had spotted.
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I'm sure something ridiculous will happen this year in the PL. Maybe worse than that. But it will all be for the greater good. Have faith.
 

Jacob

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Why was it allowed? Jota's pass to Mourinho was made while being offside.
 

El Zoido

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It depends when they take the still. There are a number of frames where the ball is still touching the foot of the player making the pass, if they’d picked a different frame for the analysis it would have been ruled offside. This is one thing they really need to figure out.
 

Lennon7

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This’ll only work if it’s much quicker. They need to get people trained up so they can do all that shit in 10-15 seconds and make a more informed choice, rather than make a spectacle of it or take ages to get it correct down to the millimetre.

Just a quick glance at a slow mo there would’ve been enough to see it was inside. Was it necessary to draw the line up to his shoulder? feckin hell even if his shoulder was 3 inches offside it’d be very hard to give
 

bleedred

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I know its not within the scope of VAR but previous to the goal we should had a corner and ref missed it. But VAR can do nothing about it and it changed the game completely.
 

sullydnl

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El Zoido said:
It depends when they take the still. There are a number of frames where the ball is still touching the foot of the player making the pass, if they’d picked a different frame for the analysis it would have been ruled offside. This is one thing they really need to figure out.
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They use the first frame where it's touching the foot.
 

Big Ben Foster

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Wasn't it a backward pass, and therefore not offside? Or am I missing something?
 

rooney1905

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Why was VAR not used to confirm that the pass into Lingard in the box earlier in the second half was actually touched by the defender and should have been a corner? Corners are considered goal scoring opportunities.
 

Jev

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The fact that VAR was used for their goal shows the problem. When you have to slow it down, replay it that many times and still have people arguing afterwards, it's not a clear and obvious error (if it had been one).
 

sullydnl

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Jev said:
The fact that VAR was used for their goal shows the problem. When you have to slow it down, replay it that many times and still have people arguing afterwards, it's not a clear and obvious error (if it had been one).
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It was an offside. "Clear and obvious error" has never applied to offsides.
 

Jev

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sullydnl said:
It was an offside. "Clear and obvious error" has never applied to offsides.
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It should though. If VAR is going to work (and by work I mean not ruining the flow of the game), it should only be used in situation where everyone (barring the most biased, delusional people) will look at the footage and agree.
 

sullydnl

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Jev said:
It should though. If VAR is going to work (and by work I mean not ruining the flow of the game), it should only be used in situation where everyone (barring the most biased, delusional people) will look at the footage and agree.
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You'd have to change the offside law then, I think. The new handball rule too.
 

Globule

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I hate the current use of VAR, but when you see so many human errors during a game it shows the need for us to keep working on technology.

Sack off all referees and replace them by cyborgs I say.
 

awop

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Is the Wolves player's head offside ? On the first replay i thought he was on, but the weird angle show maybe a part of his head being off. I also thought Pogba was a dive but there is contact on his left foot, he does sell it a bit but a pen is the right decision.
 

Flying high

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Farcical today when a freekick is awarded and a yellow card, yet the VAR guys are sitting on their hands for all that time when the ball is dead, and won't tell the ref about a mistake he can easily rectify.

VAR is the future. But it's too far from ready for top flight use.
 

Boneli

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I don’t see how you can have any confidence in the decisions when you see the check basically consists of drawing a line with Microsoft Paint.

And there’s no consistency either. One minute they are saying they will let play go and not stop attacks. Next minute they are sticking the flag up incorrectly and you’re just supposed to live with it.

And what’s the point of having it if it’s not going to correct things like incorrectly not giving corners? You haven’t made the right decision. It’s meant to be a corner and you’ve given a goal kick. That seems pretty clear and obvious to me. Certainly more than ruling out a goal because the player is possibly half a millimetre offside like some of these early season decisions. It’s infuriating!
 

Sp00ks11

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VAR is shit, it's just adding more unneeded in depth analysis. It should be used only for ridiculous decisions like the Arsenal mistaken identity sending off a few years ago.

Still funny when it goes against City and Liverpool.
 
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