Be very afraid: The normally unflappable Ole's 'pleased' delusion

romufc

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We had a "challenge" two swasons ago :lol: You want Poch? I'd be tempted to go for him if I had a say.
Well Ideally it would be Pep or Klopp but the next best is Poch.

I also think NAgglesman is a very good manager but I dont think a United job this early in his career will do him any good because like Pep he has a unique system which would take a season to implement.
 

Sterling Archer

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Mourinho tried to set that. He slapped martial for not tracking back. Pogba for showboating when it isnt necessary.

What do we do? We side with the players. Jose is the only manager that demands a certain standard, the others are just too happy to get the job in the first place.

You think ole has the guts to give a hairdryer to pogba? At this stage?
Amen fam.

This forum is rife with this ridiculous attitude. It took one shoddy season from Moyes for the mob to start crying that their favorite prima dona players were being treated too unfairly. I understand that Jose isn't everyone's cup of tea, but from personal experience the only fans I know of his teams that have been as vocally against are the spoiled Madristas that couldn't bear to see their beloved Spaniards be rubbed the wrong way. Spoiled and soft and entitled.

Worse yet Ed has been playing favorites with players, unlike the fans, he makes decisions.
 

roonster09

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Solskjær “it’s not the 90s” comment was very strange. A dig at fans chanting the name of legends, but strange coming from a guy who came and prospered for 2 months by going on about 99
It's not dig at anyone. He was asked why the team is not respected like before, he said it's not 90s, it's a different era with different team and group of players.
 

momo83

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I reckon what he says to the press is different to what's said behind closed doors. Listen to what the likes of Neville and Keane have been saying about him, they know the guy, and have said in the past he isn't the sort of guy to take sh1t, he will say what needs saying. Just a couple of weeks ago Keane was saying after a game how he could see he was absoloutly seething with the performance. He's pretty much learnt his trade from SAF and will keep EVERYTHING in house. At end of the day Thursdays result (considering the team put out) was a good result and a good learning for the young lads. This team including the 1st xi are playing about the levels of thier abilities, can't blame Ole for this. He's said its gonna take time to fix this. So far with his transfers he's doing alright. Back him. Believe in him.
So did Steve Bruce.

Does anybody know how you ignore threads or if that function actually works? I've tried to ignore this and the other threads which are all pretty much the same shit-flinging over and over, but it still shows up on the threadlist?
Above comment pretty much sums up Solskjær’s management
 

red4ever 79

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He obviously wasn't pleased with the performance. Confidence is shot and he didn't think laying into them publically was the best option is more likely.

I wasn't best pleased with those comments though. He is only adding to the noise about his own ability to manage
But the performance is the same game after game. What is this guy doing to change the situation and turn things around. Nothing
 

romufc

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Tbf what else can he say?
You don't have to throw individual players under the bus but I am sure along the lines of.. today was difficult clearly not one of our better days, we need to be more of an attacking threat going forward.

It is up to me as the manager make sure we attack better.

That is owning up whilst still covering for the players.

He can then go into the dressing room and lose his sh*t, but I think Ole is too nice for that he probably goes in and says to them well done good effort better luck next time.
 

red thru&thru

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So the problem is we have no plan? So the first plan was give Moyes a go because he came highly recommended by Fergie and he was new in the position.

The next plan was get managers with pedigree, LVG and Jose but that didn'r work.

His next plan was to rebuild it with Ole.

So you think Ed Woodwards lack of plan is the biggest worry at this football club?
So from all the above, it is clear, his plan has changed with each manager. The philosophy of play and how to bring success has changed with each manager. Actually, I do apologise. When I said he has no plan, I mean has no long term plan, or sticking to anyone given plan! So that within itself shows, he doesn't actually know what he is doing?!
 

vangagal

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You don't have to throw individual players under the bus but I am sure along the lines of.. today was difficult clearly not one of our better days, we need to be more of an attacking threat going forward.

It is up to me as the manager make sure we attack better.

That is owning up whilst still covering for the players.

He can then go into the dressing room and lose his sh*t, but I think Ole is too nice for that he probably goes in and says to them well done good effort better luck next time.
If that the case no wonder Rashy always take every free kicks. Better luck next time.
 

romufc

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So from all the above, it is clear, his plan has changed with each manager. The philosophy of play and how to bring success has changed with each manager. Actually, I do apologise. When I said he has no plan, I mean has no long term plan, or sticking to anyone given plan! So that within itself shows, he doesn't actually know what he is doing?!
Yes the plans changed because after LVG it was success here and now, didn't work.

It is clear Ed's footballing knowledge is 0 to none. We are too nice of a football club, we need someone to come in and rough people up. Get rid of under performing staff, players and management. A DoF would be a start with whom identifies players and staff based on the philosophy that Manutd want to achieve.

Every player, staff and manager will have to take responsibility.
 

romufc

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If that the case no wonder Rashy always take every free kicks. Better luck next time.
And corners keep getting booted to far post for Maguire to head back for someone to score.

keep trying lads it might come off once.
 

romufc

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How times have changed. I was listening to the 1999 documentary on t'radio last night and Steve McClaren had an anecdote about standards.

He first said he found his first five months here very hard - if there was a cone out of place the players would be on at him, such were the standards.

Anyway, of relevance to the thread, after the 1-0 Inter game he went into the dressing room and was giving it all the "great game, lads, great win" etc. and Keano pulled him up - (something like) "knock it off Steve, we were crap, and when we're crap it's your job to tell us we were crap".

Only the shirt colour and stadium is recognisable from that team.
Agreed, we seem to have become so soft on players and managers. It seems to me that Ole can't manage these players and he is scared to tell Pogba, Rashford and the like off.
 

red thru&thru

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Yes the plans changed because after LVG it was success here and now, didn't work.

It is clear Ed's footballing knowledge is 0 to none. We are too nice of a football club, we need someone to come in and rough people up. Get rid of under performing staff, players and management. A DoF would be a start with whom identifies players and staff based on the philosophy that Manutd want to achieve.

Every player, staff and manager will have to take responsibility.
Exactly. It has to start from the top and filter it's way down. You can never start from the top and filter it upwards.

Hence why Ed and the board need to leave, as in the past 7 years, it's shown that there is no direction.
 

Forevergiggs1

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More than half the team missing or rested, a synthetic surface and a horrible missed penalty call not withstanding, came away with a point. I think he'll be happy with it all things considered.

The wider issue of there not being adequate quality to fill the gaps in key positions is an entirely different issue altogether.
The thing is if we had of had a full strength squad would anything be any different? AWB is a great defender but not as strong going forward. If he had played, Dalot wouldn't and last night Dalot produced a number of good crosses. Maquire obviously wouldn't of made a difference because we didn't concede. Williams played really well so Shaw and Young weren't missed. Does anyone think Pogba would of been up for the game? Peirera or Lingard starting wouldn't of made a difference. Perhaps McT starting would which is worrying and as for Martial, since I think he's one of the most gutless players I've ever seen I don't think he'd of made a difference.

As for the penalty decisions. We should of had one they should of had two. A synthetic pitch might have made a difference but it wasn't AZs pitch so I don't think that could be used as an excuse. So maybe Ole was positive taking away a point but he shouldn't of been on the bigger scale.
 

romufc

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Exactly. It has to start from the top and filter it's way down. You can never start from the top and filter it upwards.

Hence why Ed and the board need to leave, as in the past 7 years, it's shown that there is no direction.
Realistically, do you think this will happen?

The reason it is easy for a manager to get sacked is performance on the pitch. Fans voice concerns.

Ed is a bit more difficult. I would love to see the man gone.
 

red thru&thru

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Realistically, do you think this will happen?

The reason it is easy for a manager to get sacked is performance on the pitch. Fans voice concerns.

Ed is a bit more difficult. I would love to see the man gone.
The question is, what are the fans after? To call out the root of the problem and get it fixed or keep hiring and sacking managers, until we get lucky with a manager?
 

romufc

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The question is, what are the fans after? To call out the root of the problem and get it fixed or keep hiring and sacking managers, until we get lucky with a manager?
I know my answer. We have changed managers. The last 4 managers have all had tenures ended with the same style of play.

90 mins.. 1 / 2 shots on target
But at least we kept possession.
 

red thru&thru

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I know my answer. We have changed managers. The last 4 managers have all had tenures ended with the same style of play.

90 mins.. 1 / 2 shots on target
But at least we kept possession.
What is your answer?
 

Sky1981

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The question is, what are the fans after? To call out the root of the problem and get it fixed or keep hiring and sacking managers, until we get lucky with a manager?
Why not?

Every team does that from barcelona madrid bayern etc. Every team apart from us and arsenal.

Are we so high we wont sack a manager?

Klopp was liverpool nth managerial, took them 26 years of hiring and firing.

Why is it beneath us to fire a lousy manager?
 

amolbhatia50k

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How times have changed. I was listening to the 1999 documentary on t'radio last night and Steve McClaren had an anecdote about standards.

He first said he found his first five months here very hard - if there was a cone out of place the players would be on at him, such were the standards.

Anyway, of relevance to the thread, after the 1-0 Inter game he went into the dressing room and was giving it all the "great game, lads, great win" etc. and Keano pulled him up - (something like) "knock it off Steve, we were crap, and when we're crap it's your job to tell us we were crap".

Only the shirt colour and stadium is recognisable from that team.
:lol: Keane is brilliant
 

red thru&thru

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Why not?

Every team does that from barcelona madrid bayern etc. Every team apart from us and arsenal.

Are we so high we wont sack a manager?

Klopp was liverpool nth managerial, took them 26 years of hiring and firing.

Why is it beneath us to fire a lousy manager?
So you don't think there is actually some structure or planning when hiring a manger? You seriously think it's just the case of getting lucky?
 

amolbhatia50k

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So you don't think there is actually some structure or planning when hiring a manger? You seriously think it's just the case of getting lucky?
Of course thought goes into it. But if you have hired the wrong/incapable person you have to replace him. Admitting a mistake is part of the solution. Delusion is not
 

red thru&thru

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Of course thought goes into it. But if you have hired the wrong/incapable person you have to replace him. Admitting a mistake is part of the solution. Delusion is not
When you have hired 4 managers and have failed miserably with each one, when do you begin to look at yourself, or processes to think you may not be doing a good job?
 

Wednesday at Stoke

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The thing is if we had of had a full strength squad would anything be any different? AWB is a great defender but not as strong going forward. If he had played, Dalot wouldn't and last night Dalot produced a number of good crosses. Maquire obviously wouldn't of made a difference because we didn't concede. Williams played really well so Shaw and Young weren't missed. Does anyone think Pogba would of been up for the game? Peirera or Lingard starting wouldn't of made a difference. Perhaps McT starting would which is worrying and as for Martial, since I think he's one of the most gutless players I've ever seen I don't think he'd of made a difference.

As for the penalty decisions. We should of had one they should of had two. A synthetic pitch might have made a difference but it wasn't AZs pitch so I don't think that could be used as an excuse. So maybe Ole was positive taking away a point but he shouldn't of been on the bigger scale.
Not even a glass half full kind of person aren’t we?
 

amolbhatia50k

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When you have hired 4 managers and have failed miserably with each one, when do you begin to look at yourself, or processes to think you may not be doing a good job?
Both? What's with this strange notion that only one thing must be wrong? Ideally you'd replace both the manager and CEO for being incompetent. But we know that Ed isn't going anywhere.
 

Forevergiggs1

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Not even a glass half full kind of person aren’t we?
I prefer to see myself as a more realistic person when supporting United. Optimism I reserve for the real life. After 7 years of false dawns it's certainly easier that way. From you're retort I can see you obviously don't agree with me. Do you see anything happening differently to what I've explained? Maybe help me fill that glass a little?
 

UnitedChampionsAgain

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Remember that clip of Solskjaer training his players at Molde where he says " you can't score if you don't f#cking shoot". This is what he should be stood shouting from the sidelines now. Something needs to get some urgency into these players.
 

Wednesday at Stoke

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I prefer to see myself as a more realistic person when supporting United. Optimism I reserve for the real life. After 7 years of false dawns it's certainly easier that way. From you're retort I can see you obviously don't agree with me. Do you see anything happening differently to what I've explained? Maybe help me fill that glass a little?
The squad is not good enough to sustain injuries to three or four top players and still produce well. That's the gist of it and when you subtract more quality to rest the ones returning and combine that with a synthetic pitch, this is what you get. This is not the game to lose one's mind over.

I mean we all knew that the team is fecked attacking wise if pogba is injured. Now why are we actually acting surprised when it eventually transpires?
 

Revaulx

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Amen fam.

This forum is rife with this ridiculous attitude. It took one shoddy season from Moyes for the mob to start crying that their favorite prima dona players were being treated too unfairly. I understand that Jose isn't everyone's cup of tea, but from personal experience the only fans I know of his teams that have been as vocally against are the spoiled Madristas that couldn't bear to see their beloved Spaniards be rubbed the wrong way. Spoiled and soft and entitled.
Well I’m not sure about Moyes. Some players (RvP certainly; Rio probably) hated Moyes because he abolished the bespoke training regimes and playing schedules SAF had carefully put in place to prevent them getting injured.

There’s no evidence that pre-meltdown Jose was disliked by the players though. By the time he got to United, he seemed to have forgotten how to assemble and coach a team. Which wasn’t good. However, if his man management was so bad and all the players hated him, how come they made so many decent comebacks?
Worse yet Ed has been playing favorites with players, unlike the fans, he makes decisions.
Not saying you’re wrong, but can you give examples? He seems to hand out pay rises willy-nilly; the only player I can recall who hasn’t been indulged is Herrera, and that looked like incompetence rather than (un)favouritism.
 

Striker10

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When your manager you manage situations. We didn't concede. Which is a plus. People knew it would be difficult. I imagine the glazers LOVE oles ideas. So I don't think his future is on the line anytime soon. We need our quality back and playing well.
 

Sky1981

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So you don't think there is actually some structure or planning when hiring a manger? You seriously think it's just the case of getting lucky?
Big part of it yes. Bayern et al doesnt always pick the right manager.

Off course it's not a matter of picking blindly, choosing the top manager increases your chance to get it right. Barceloa took a gamble with pep, it might or might not work.

We took ours on ole, it doesn't work.

Managerial is a talent, you either have it or you dont. Ole doesnt seems to have it, giving him 3 years doesnt mean he'll leave it in good condition for the next manager. If our bad form continues you can forget getting sancho.

Plus. One can argue if we gave atkinson more time we miss fergie. It can go both ways.
 
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OohAahMartial

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He's just trying to put a positive spin on the result to the media to try to reduce the pressure on the team and keep up their morale--that's what a coach does. He has said repeatedly that the team's had a 'robustness' issue, particularly towards the end of last season when Rashford said they couldn't forget their last games and the spirit went down. So he's trying his best to keep their spirits up.

But no, that's not good enough for the Caf, he should be sticking the knife into them when they're down, despite many being youth team players, and hoping that will prick their egos into trying harder. Different players respond in different ways, and the modern player tends to respond less well to old-fashioned hairdryers and more to the softer, positive approach. I don't really see Klopp or Pep saying anything much different.

If you can see the problems, you can be damn sure he can see them too. No need to feed the seagulls sardines though.


Some of you need to take heed of Berbatov's comments about how player's actually feel, and about social media (like the Caf).
 

Kemizee

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I don’t understand you lot on here. First it’s complaining about how Mourinho would throw his players under the bus and now even though last nights game was ridiculously poor he came out and said he was pleased. Ole is not pleased with last nights performance but he won’t throw our players under the bus. He’s doing what Sir Alex was doing. Keeping everything in house. What would you prefer? Ole coming out and telling the world were shite of him coming out and saying he’s pleased? We can all see we need improvement but ole played a young team last night and will not abuse them so they go into their shell. Ole is doing right by his team and by Manchester United. We need to give him time. I don’t want him sacked. I’m happy to finish in the bottom half this season. We are building something and although you can’t see it right now you will see it soon. Have some bloody patience.
He could have easily said.. 'Not good enough by our standards as a club but we will do better' without throwing anyone under the bus. Everything I bolded indicates how far we have fallen as a club has beocme. No more standards or expectations. The board and ex-players have brainwashed certain fans to dance to their tune. We could literally finish in 15th position this season and some will say 'no problem, we will still be patient' despite it being abundantly clear we are regressing.
 

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Can you imagine Ole laying into any of the players? He's as meek as a mouse. I can't see them taking him seriously. Even at the full time whistle he was greeting the AZ players and having a laugh and a joke with their Norwegian midfielder. Any other manager would be straight down the tunnel following a result like that.

He's just here for the ride and I don't blame him: we were stupid enough to buy into that initial run of results, buy him out of his Molde contract and throw money at him.
 

sunama

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If you watch that performance and then say you are pleased, that is delusion. The worry is that is the first time I have heard that from him.
There are plenty of fans who believe that we are doing just fine. 10th place. Unable to register a shot on target against a minnow. They'll make excuses for this and say that Ole will turn it around.

The problem we have is who should replace him?
We hired LVG - who brought us possession football, which did not work.
We then got Jose - the serial winner who always wins titles. Woodward could not match Jose's ambition. Woodward wanted top 4, Jose wanted the league title and there was only way that was going.

I am at a complete loss of where we go next. There is no obvious candidate who can take us to top 4, while not boring us to death (talking about Allegri and Simeone, here).
Poch can't win trophies, so he'll probably be off the shortlist.
 

red thru&thru

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Big part of it yes. Bayern et al doesnt always pick the right manager.

Off course it's not a matter of picking blindly, choosing the top manager increases your chance to get it right. Barceloa took a gamble with pep, it might or might not work.

We took ours on ole, it doesn't work.

Managerial is a talent, you either have it or you dont. Ole doesnt seems to have it, giving him 3 years doesnt mean he'll leave it in good condition for the next manager. If our bad form continues you can forget getting sancho.

Plus. One can argue if we gave atkinson more time we miss fergie. It can go both ways.
Is it a coincidence that the aforementioned clubs have won titles, irrespective of their managers? I'm talking about the recent past. No it's not. Because whoever's the managers, the profile of the manager and players remain the same. That is the issue at our club. The profile of manager changes, which invariably means the profile of the players change. Then what you have is a mish mash of players that don't suit each other, this is our problem.
 

sunama

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I don’t understand you lot on here. First it’s complaining about how Mourinho would throw his players under the bus and now even though last nights game was ridiculously poor he came out and said he was pleased. Ole is not pleased with last nights performance but he won’t throw our players under the bus. He’s doing what Sir Alex was doing. Keeping everything in house. What would you prefer? Ole coming out and telling the world were shite of him coming out and saying he’s pleased? We can all see we need improvement but ole played a young team last night and will not abuse them so they go into their shell. Ole is doing right by his team and by Manchester United. We need to give him time. I don’t want him sacked. I’m happy to finish in the bottom half this season. We are building something and although you can’t see it right now you will see it soon. Have some bloody patience.
Have a read of what you wrote.
That's pretty sad that standards have dropped so low.
Only 18 months ago, people were moaning about 2nd place and now some people are perfectly fine with 10th place or below.

Hang on a minute....is this guy a Real Madrid fan mocking how bad we are playing?