Yeah it's hard to see who could beat you at home. England's spinners are nowhere near good enough and the Aussies have no-one to support Lyon. Plus neither side can score 400 consistently.
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- Thread starter EdWeatherall
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I think by the time you guys tour us , you would have been better prepared and maybe our present team would have past his peak especially our spinning duo of ash-jadeja. It's sad they are not that appeciated by the board and even some fans but they are one of the main reason for us being this good in home conditions. If they bring their A or even B game I just cannot see opposition surviving.
This tour to Pakistan could turn out to be a blessing for SL. Great T20 series for win without their senior pros. They have got some really good back up players who might be ready to take SL cricket forward. As for Pakistan well.maybe time has come for them to drop sarfaraz Ahmed completely. The guy offers nothing to the team. Find a new leader asap.
Shocking that Rohit got dismissed early and generally looked horrendously uncomfortable in a match where ball was doing something.
Seems like I'm the only one following this series. Anyways Rabada is class(no shit etc). Looked thrice the bowler in comparison to any other bowler.
I tried to watch a bit this morning but don't have the right channel unfortunately.
SA have been unlucky losing the toss both times but looks like they've dropped a massive clanger letting Harmer go.
Quotas, money in English cricket and Piedt's form in domestic cricket caused that. Things is though, SA struggle in India because India figured out we couldn't play spin and adjusted accoringly. Sri Lanka have also discovered this now. When the middle order was Amla, Kallis, AB and Prince you stood a chance on those wickets but with De bruyn, Bavuma, Faf and allrounders these days we're going to struggle. We lost to Sri Lanka at home ffs. Need to kill the quota policy and hope that Brexit takes care of the Koplak issue.
The problem is lack of options in opening position means Rohit is getting shoehorned. Prithvi Shaw should and could have made this position his own had not for his injuries and drug issue. I don't want Gill's career to be wasted by asking him to Open when clearly he is much better as a middle order. Rohit could a decent job for short term basis till we get Shaw back.
Yeah. If you had all the Kolpaks back it wouldn't do much for your batting but your bowling would be outstanding.
Imagine if you had this team:
Elgar
Markram
De Bruyn
Bavuma
Du Plessis
De Kock
Vilas
Harmer
Rabada
Morkel
Abbott
Would be a lot stronger than the one you've got now.
Gill opened in WI for the A matches and looked like a fine player. Rohit is class and all but he's also 33, without being any disrespectful to Saffers I wanted Gill to debut in this series so that he can acclimatize here and then go abroad.
Rather than waiting for rohit to fail abroad and him getting a chance which will happen.
I don't trust this management to be patient with Gill. I still think it would be better for him to start as a 2 down or 3 down batsmen than just forcing him to open. He is a special talent and as I said with this management, couple of failures the pressure will be put on him.
Its actually on TV here - some fake Star channel.
We've done well. Agarwal looks a real find.
Have to say Saffers have been quite unlucky. Kohli has edged quite a few but all have gone safe.
They're standing far too away from the wickets considering the bounce in Indian pitches.
They're standing far too away from the wickets considering the bounce in Indian pitches.
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He's not wrong. I watch all the matches but some help for the seamers would be good. Day 2 is the worst.Bitterbaby is back.Tweet
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Sub continental matches come alive only near the end of day 3.
Or maybe India are just too good in home conditions because I have seen numerous times in the past 2 years or so where our spinners have bundled out the opponents even when they bat first. And then we hear the same Michael Vaughan like people saying pitch assists the spinners too much. To be fair Rohit and Mayank did struggle for the first 10 odd overs but bar Rabada none of the other strike bowlers bowled that good. One cannot blame the pitch for that. Maybe one should wait for 5 days and then comment. If SA also.score past 500 then maybe yes we can say they should have something for the bowlers. From what little I have seen there is something for the bowlers if you bowl well.
Edit: Just saw Umesh already taking 2.wickets and SA are.18-2. Maybe Vaughan would have been smart in giving some credit to this Indian side, which is why I called him bitter.
I am talking about how it's been for over a decade. The game comes alive mostly when spinners come into it on day 3.
Obviously you're a very good side, but I don't think you can really deny that the pitches produce boring run fests for the first few days.
Uh yes he is. Why on earth should seamers get assistance in India? Spinners dont get favours in Aus, SA or Eng.
Nonsense.
Except they don't. Just go through our recent test matches - we haven't had typical flat wickets in ages. And SA are 33-3...
Mate England scored over 400 against you three times in India and we can't bat.
You forgetting our tours in 2011 and 2014 where you were constantly smashing us for 400, 500 and 600? Cook and Bell scoring 250s for fun.
Its home advantage. These arent your typical flat wickets which is why SA will get smashed.
The problem with cricket is that too much is dependent on luck. The toss, the pitch, the weather everything plays a big part, especially the toss. You can say it adds to the unpredictable nature but it's not a fair competition where teams win purely on the basis of talent or performance. Yes luck plays a part in every sport but it plays to big a part in cricket IMO. This is true especially in the subcontinent where winning the toss and bat first and then wait for the pitch to deteriorate by day 4,5.
ICC should find a way to make sure conditions don't have a massive influence on the game. They can maybe make sure the pitch has something for both bowlers and batters. Such changes will make the game more interesting.
I don't really get the criticism of Indian pitches on here though. No home country makes pitches that will help the opposition. You don't see spin friendly tracks in England or Australia, similarly you don't finger pacer friendly tracks in the subcontinent. Also, if the pitch isn't hard like concrete on day 1, the whole thing will start to come apart by day 3. The way to prevent that would be to put some grass on the pitch, but that would mean providing the non subcontinent teams with home like pitch conditions.
ICC should find a way to make sure conditions don't have a massive influence on the game. They can maybe make sure the pitch has something for both bowlers and batters. Such changes will make the game more interesting.
I don't really get the criticism of Indian pitches on here though. No home country makes pitches that will help the opposition. You don't see spin friendly tracks in England or Australia, similarly you don't finger pacer friendly tracks in the subcontinent. Also, if the pitch isn't hard like concrete on day 1, the whole thing will start to come apart by day 3. The way to prevent that would be to put some grass on the pitch, but that would mean providing the non subcontinent teams with home like pitch conditions.
The quality is poor. We've toured well recently, Aus won in England, SA are normally better. The rest need to improve a lot.
Yeah, and nobodies saying that you shouldn't curate wickets to suit your teams talents. Just that the particular wickets that you've played on don't tend to produce a balance between bat and ball for the first few days.
As long as there's a result and match goes to five days then it's okay as far as I'm concerned.
Vaughan is a moron tbh. Typical English ex player who likes to moan about the pitches in India whilst saying nothing about some of the green carpets in England. It works both ways
Vaughan is a moron tbh. Typical English ex player who likes to moan about the pitches in India whilst saying nothing about some of the green carpets in England. It works both ways
I don't think this is a 600 esque easy pitch considering this is the same venue which was very much criticized of how it played out 2 years back when AUssie toured us. The score of the match was Aus 260 and 285, whilst India bowled out for less than 110 in both the innings and then in next test was again a low scoring match. It's funny when opponents are bundled out by Ashwin and co, it is said India produces too much spinning tracks and nothing for batsmen and when Kolhi and co get you 500 plus runs it is said it is boring. You cannot have both way. Maybe the opponents need to play better and bowl better. Of course if Micheal Vaughan is looking for ball swinging for the whole day then no it won't. You also see some crazy high runs being scored in Australia but there is no uproar then, why now.
Also, Vaughan should be the last one crying about pitches considering he defended the pitches produced by ECB in that Eng/Pak series when 350 plus were chased easily. He is a proper hypocrite and nothing else
Aus did not win in England!
Matches, my man.
You're clutching at strawmen throughout this thread. The point being made is that the first 3 days are dire cricket viewing. Can you refute that?
I think it'd be improved by providing some seam assistance - which India can also capitalize on without taking away home advantage.
Do you sit through sessions of cricket on days 1, 2 and 3? Do you enjoy it?
It's often tedious to watch. Just like Sri Lanka and UAE.
Do you think SA would have score 500 plus runs had they batter first , I don't. Like I said there have been instances in Indain pitches when teams have been bundled out for less than 300, even less than 150 and then we hear how there is too much assistance for bowlers. One cannot have both ways. Whether it is boring or not, it is matter of perspective. I don't think Micheal Vaughan would have called it boring had SA scored 600 plus runs, instead he would have tweeted how great SA batsmen are and would have mocked Indian bowlers. Which is why I said he is bitter. ALso, let us not forget how in 2014 when England were scoring 400 plus runs and we lost the series no one found it boring.
I think it has become a tedious argument how Indian pitches are unfair/boring/etc./etc.
I'll repeat it. Do you enjoy watching test cricket on the first three days in India, Sri Lanka, UAE?
I watch matches in Australia, NZ(when it was shown), south Africa, England easily. In the sub continent, it's tumescent.
To be fair in the past 5 odd years I have not been able to watch test matches in India or even Australia because of the time zone issues, just try to catch the highlights and follow the scores. If your question is whether I prefer watching India's tour of Australia more than the other way around then yes and that has nothing to do with pitch or too many runs being scored. Same when touring England or SA or NZ. The main reason is winning away from home especially outside subcontinent brings extra satisfaction. But I enjoy test matches played in India too. There have been some great test matches and test series in India. Just because opponents are not able to beat us does not make it boring.
I was just responding to the Michael Vaughan's tweet where he said the first 3/4 days of the matches favour batsmen too much, to which I gave examples where teams have been bundled out for less than 300 in Indian pitches in past 3 years and then the same Vaughan's and co. criticize the pitch and complain how it assists the spinners too much. You cannot have both the ways is what I am saying. Do you think Vaughan would have come out with a same bs tweet had SA or Eng scored 600 plus runs, I don't think so. Like I said the pitch argument has become tedious.
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That lineup would still get destroyed anywhere on the subcontinent. Plus you still need an extra spinner for a tour to India. Our spin bowling and batting vs spin hasntbeen good enough for some time now. Clearly its a transitional phase but alot of the batsmen we expected to push on and replace the best Test side in our history just haven't developed as hoped. Shame really because it's a bit of a waste of Rabada's career.
Clutching at straws? Theres a reason why in this era, only three batsmen average 45+ for us compared to the era gone by where our entire top order averaged 50+.
Tbh, time zone differences mean I don't watch many home matches. Ill catch some tomorrow but I've always preferred to watch us bowl.
@zing still think its a flat wicket?
Forget the toss and allow the away team to choose what they wanted to do. That would be a start.
Where were you when we lost 4-1 in England last year? Pretty sure we lost every toss yet easily could have won the series.