Manchester is undesirable but Liverpool isn’t?

Look at who's managing them.

Eh? Who are these "incredible internationals" City and Liverpool have, the likes of which have never been signed by Manchester United?

Achilles McCool said:

Wasn’t expecting the “Ole Out” brigade that soon, but alright. Why can Klopp and Pep recruit but Ole can’t? How do they convince the move where Ole fails?

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It doesn't take you to be part of a "brigade" to acknowledge the difference in lure or playing for Klopp or Pep over Ole. There's stratosphere between them in terms of managerial standing.

Leaving that aside, I'm not sure what point you're actually making. Couldn't you give some examples of what you're on about, that isn't Di Maria?

Pretty simple. The allure of playing for those managers, and more importantly trophies. If you were a world class 29 year old, with no affiliations to either clubs, which would you choose ?

Achilles McCool said:

Again, I don’t think Klopp/Pep are that far from Ole, and United, as a club, offer more, in my opinion, to those clubs, not to mention that we can offer wages even/above the other clubs.
United are made to sound like a step-child to City/Pool and that cant be Solely due to our manager.

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Its not a matter of opinion. Look at what they've won

Achilles McCool said:

I would choose to start for United rather than rotate in a Pool/City squad. Simple.

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Pretty sure he’s going to be a starter for Pool.

Achilles McCool said:

Again, I don’t think Klopp/Pep are that far from Ole, and United, as a club, offer more, in my opinion, to those clubs, not to mention that we can offer wages even/above the other clubs.
United are made to sound like a step-child to City/Pool and that cant be Solely due to our manager.

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Are you sure you're not looking at things through a heavily United-tinted pair of sunglasses. Because as much as i love Ole, Pep is practically two leagues above him in coaching pedigree. Klopp, after the last 2 years, is a league above as well

Achilles McCool said:

Thiago for starters. Aguero is one that has always bothered me.
Ive read that players have turned down a move to Manchester solely due to it’s location but I’ve never heard of a player turning down a move to City or Liverpool for such a personal reason. Lately it seems that United struggle with such recruitment and our location is used as an excuse, but others seem to have no difficulty with selling their club to potential players.
I will admit that I might be focused on potential United signings and getting angry that certain players turn down the transfer to move to a larger city (Paris, Madrid, London, Grimsby) but I’m curious how the recruitment differs between United and other elite “northern “ clubs.
If I’m ranting, please explain that I’m insane and the optics aren’t as I see them.

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You live in the United bubble, that's why. I did a quick google search and Mbappé, Messi, Bonucci, Phil Jones, Eriksen and Timo Werner all reportedly turned down City. Some recently, some years ago.

This summer Oshimen moved to Napoli and Christian Koffi moved to Fiorentina. Two young wingers that played in Ligue 1 last season that both have said they turned down Liverpool this summer.

Achilles McCool said:

Again, I don’t think Klopp/Pep are that far from Ole, and United, as a club, offer more, in my opinion, to those clubs, not to mention that we can offer wages even/above the other clubs.
United are made to sound like a step-child to City/Pool and that cant be Solely due to our manager.

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What is the point of this thread.

Achilles McCool said:

Thiago for starters. Aguero is one that has always bothered me.
Ive read that players have turned down a move to Manchester solely due to it’s location but I’ve never heard of a player turning down a move to City or Liverpool for such a personal reason. Lately it seems that United struggle with such recruitment and our location is used as an excuse, but others seem to have no difficulty with selling their club to potential players.
I will admit that I might be focused on potential United signings and getting angry that certain players turn down the transfer to move to a larger city (Paris, Madrid, London, Grimsby) but I’m curious how the recruitment differs between United and other elite “northern “ clubs.
If I’m ranting, please explain that I’m insane and the optics aren’t as I see them.

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Fergie turned down Aguero for £52m in the ‘no value in the market era’ and by all accounts Thiago was going to move to United in 2013 but Moyes cancelled the deal.

Its only a small minority of players that won’t move to the NW these days or who cant live here.

Eleven-Eighteen said:

Are you sure you're not looking at things through a heavily United-tinted pair of sunglasses. Because as much as i love Ole, Pep is practically two leagues above him in coaching pedigree. Klopp, after the last 2 years, is a league above as well

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They’re both currently leagues ahead of him . One has won the league and CL in back to back seasons, the other has imposed a style of football many thought wouldn’t succeed in the PL and has broken points records doing it .

Liverpool and City aren’t ordinarily any more attractive than United. But these things come and go in cycles, at present both have two of the most recognisable and highly regarded managers in world football. Players want to play under such managers, that’s really not such a difficult concept to grasp. United have been mismanaged for the last decade almost and the issues (Judging by this forums opinion of the board) show no sign of abating. The perception of you in the market, which is where you’d have the most direct contact with the members of opposing teams boards etc probably isn’t the most favourable judging by the way it’s reported in the media. I’m not talking shit sources I mean reputable ones which can stock can actually be taken from.

Also as far as Liverpool are concerned it’s not like we’ve been attracting world stars either. Thiago has been the only exception to that rule. The players that have wanted to play for Klopp and the club VVD etc only gained world wide standing after joining us.

In the last decade alone you’ve signed Di Maria Sanchez Falcao Schweinsteiger. All of whom were already proven but there was no football plan style etc in place. They were just big names because you could afford to get them. Uniteds appeal and standing is enormous, it’s just also now diminishing year after year as would happen to any club that’s made the errors they have. Your appeal is still unique, the issue has nothing to do with Manchester United being any less desirable as a whole, it’s a reflection of the current positions and trajectories of the clubs. What should be far more concerning is how it was borne about.

I can totally buy that Klopp and Guardiola have a strong pull, that Ole doesn't - because they've both won league and European titles, are both charismatic (in their own ways) and both have clear playing philosophies.

But I think all of that is secondary to the fact that if you move to Liverpool or City you're pretty much guaranteed to be in strong contention for domestic and European titles, and playing with other world class players.

Whether we like it or not, Ole's managerial achievement aren't anywhere close to Pep and Klopp, we're very unlikely to be in contention for the league, and very unlikely to be in contention for the Champions' League. I don't think an outside chance of an FA Cup medal or 4th place finish is likely to have the same pull as playing at the peak of European football

Achilles McCool said:

Again, I don’t think Klopp/Pep are that far from Ole, and United, as a club, offer more, in my opinion, to those clubs, not to mention that we can offer wages even/above the other clubs.
United are made to sound like a step-child to City/Pool and that cant be Solely due to our manager.

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Given the footballing world and their achievements say otherwise, your thoughts are incorrect.

Achilles McCool said:

Thiago for starters. Aguero is one that has always bothered me.
Ive read that players have turned down a move to Manchester solely due to it’s location but I’ve never heard of a player turning down a move to City or Liverpool for such a personal reason. Lately it seems that United struggle with such recruitment and our location is used as an excuse, but others seem to have no difficulty with selling their club to potential players.
I will admit that I might be focused on potential United signings and getting angry that certain players turn down the transfer to move to a larger city (Paris, Madrid, London, Grimsby) but I’m curious how the recruitment differs between United and other elite “northern “ clubs.
If I’m ranting, please explain that I’m insane and the optics aren’t as I see them.

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What about RVN? Veron? Evra? De Gea?

This is a pretty knee jerk thread really.

Life sucks less when you are fecking winning. I lives in fecking Aviano, but I w doing great at work so it didn't matter

People should stop assuming we're after every single player out there. The fact Liverpool just bought one of the best midfielders in the world frustrates me as much as it does every other United fan on this forum, but we can't just buy players recklessly.

Would've Thiago been a great asset to have? Yes. Do we have a world-class player in his position already? Yes, we do.

Over the past few weeks I've seen so many people around here say the media probably threw United's name in the news just to put pressure on other clubs or only to boost the price of the players, yet most people are infuriated transfers, which were never about to happen in the first place, fall through and the player goes to another club. Then, threads like this one appear.

I hope I'm getting my point across. We're not an undesirable destination. Feck, one of the best talent's in football in the face of Sancho wants to join us and I'm sure many more do as well. Ole has a clear path he wants to take the club through and I'm sure he knows as well as us around here what the team needs and what players are required in order to walk said path.

?

City: Money and trophies.
Pool: Trophies
United: Money... Brand and uhh history I guess.

London clubs: Location mainly (some also money and trophies)

Achilles McCool said:

Again, I don’t think Klopp/Pep are that far from Ole,

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This is a very strange statement that I find baffling.

Upon Klopp’s arrival at Liverpool, news was emerging that Gerrard had been phoning transfer targets as Rodgers wasn’t seen as enough of a ‘sell’ to potential high profile players.

This type of operation is a distant memory. Klopp has transformed the reputation of the football club. Both his charisma and success means Liverpool are a top-tier draw.

As it stands, Solskjaer isn’t in that arena.

Achilles McCool said:

Thiago for starters. Aguero is one that has always bothered me.
Ive read that players have turned down a move to Manchester solely due to it’s location but I’ve never heard of a player turning down a move to City or Liverpool for such a personal reason. Lately it seems that United struggle with such recruitment and our location is used as an excuse, but others seem to have no difficulty with selling their club to potential players.
I will admit that I might be focused on potential United signings and getting angry that certain players turn down the transfer to move to a larger city (Paris, Madrid, London, Grimsby) but I’m curious how the recruitment differs between United and other elite “northern “ clubs.
If I’m ranting, please explain that I’m insane and the optics aren’t as I see them.

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So your first example is literally a player who agreeded to join us?

Achilles McCool said:

I’m willing to accept this reply and admit that created this thread in a bar after drinking too many rounds...but, I still feel like I’ve read over and over, year after year, from Caftards and others online, that no sane international wants to move to Manchester instead of London. I do have a huge pair of rose (red) tinted tinted glasses but damn, I’m frustrated that we can’t be more attractive to potential players. I refuse to admit that our manager is the only reason players choose London or Pool/City over United.
Didn’t I read somewhere that even Pulusic chose Chelsea over United (his childhood club) due to London>Manchester?

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We buy sane intertnationals every year. Bizarre thread

Achilles McCool said:

I’ll admit that this thread is highly knee-jerk, but damn, shouldn’t we be the top destination for most top players? I realize I’m opening up myself for abuse, and maybe I’m living in the past, but deck me, we should be able to lure players to our club over Pool/City without our manager being in the discussion

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Despite being a contender for top 4 over the last 7 seasons? We are a very desirable football club but your current level as a team, track record, quality of manager etc all make a difference.

Last week Messi was set on manchester aswell

spontaneus1 said:

So your first example is literally a player who agreeded to join us?

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This is true. By all accounts he was set to join us

Achilles McCool said:

Wasn’t expecting the “Ole Out” brigade that soon, but alright. Why can Klopp and Pep recruit but Ole can’t? How do they convince the move where Ole fails?

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Come on, are you really serious? Klopp and Guardiola are the best managers in the world, both have won the Champions League and titles in more countries, both have charisma in their own way. Solskjær is a nobody as manager on all these counts.

Achilles McCool said:

Simple question but long rant:

I’ve heard for a long time that “International” players find that NW England is undesirable for a potential move/transfer because of its geographical location and if a foreign player were to consider a move to England, then London would offer so much more to high profile players because its more cosmopolitan than the rest of England. I’ve read many times that a transfer failed because the player didn’t want to “move to Manchester”. DiMaria’s wife is the first quote I can think of disparaging NW England but over the years, I recall many players turning down a move to United because of its location.

Plenty of examples of players choosing a London club over another English club solely due to geography and it’s urban appeal. And many Caf posters stating that if Manchester were on the Mediterranean than the recruiting would be much easier.
My question is:
How is Liverpool and Man City selling itself to all of these incredible Internationals but United can’t convince the players to play for United because Manchester isn’t a great destination for foreign players?
Citizens of Manchester: why can’t we “sell” our club to the high class foreign Internationals like Liverpool and City?

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It hardly matters, they will 99% of the time living football or their homes. All facilities are available anyway.

I think with the kind of wages players are being paid the location itself isn’t really that important. What attracts players apart from money is the project and honestly speaking as a neutral if you were a worldclass 29 year old given the choice between Pool, City and Utd at the moment I doubt many would choose Utd.

It wasn’t too long ago that Alexis Sanchez chose Arsenal over Liverpool. Who would bet on a player with a status similar to Sanchez choosing Arsenal over Liverpool today? The only players who seem to choose us over other English clubs these days are ex Chelsea players who don’t want to leave London and fair enough it reflects our current status which is up to us to change. History only matters to the fans ambitious players want to win trophies and will choose a club that can do that after all isnt that how RVP ended up at Utd?

This thread, shaking my head. Ceteris paribus you pick London over Manchester or Liverpoo. There's nothing controversial about this statement whatsoever.

The key here is for you to understand that attractiveness of the city isn't the only variable involved when choosing a club. Once you come to this riveting realisation, you'll have a great time.

Achilles McCool said:

The proposition of playing for Klopp/Pep is so incredible? I don’t buy it.

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Of course it is (at least for some people). By far my most important reason I choose a job is based on who is gonna be my boss. That makes a job fun or boring. In players’ case, it also significantly decides their chances to win trophies.

In the end it depends on the player, but I think that money, manager, chances to win trophies and city are all equally important. History is important only to fans, but I don’t think players give a shot about it when they make their decision on what team to join.