Rank the PL coaches

Skills · Oct 6, 2020

Leroy The Red said:
I’ve left out Parker, Lampard and Arteta because they’re simply far too new to management to be able to compare and contrast with the others.
Pretty much all things considered, style of play, signings, ability to motivate, results, game management, etc.

1. Klopp
2. Pep
3. Mourinho
4. Ancelotti
5. Bielsa
6. Rodgers
7. Santo
8. Hasenhutl
9. Hodgson
10. Dyche
11. Wilder
12. Potter
13. Ole
14. Bruce
15. Bilic
16. Moyes
17. Smith

This is quite good but I'd move both Bruce & Moyes up.

I think Bruce is quite underrated but he's been a very solid manager in the Championship/PL for a long, long time. He does a job any club in the bottom 10 in terms of keeping them safe.

Moyes is the same - he's a good coach in the bottom 10 level. I'd trust him to keep them safe from relegation. The likes of Bruce and Moyes have a place in the PL but just not at the top end clubs. Their level is bottom 10 and they do very well there.

I think Wilder and Potter still have a lot to prove before you can put them ahead of them, though Potter's had a promising start. Dyche as well has done well with Burnley, but could easily end up with his reputation heading down if he went elsewhere - see Tony Pulis.

RooneyLegend · Oct 7, 2020

1 Klopp
2 Pep
3 Ancelotti
4 Bielsa
5 Potter
6 Arteta
The rest I think are trash

Winzaghi · Oct 7, 2020

Skills said:
This is quite good but I'd move both Bruce & Moyes up.

I think Bruce is quite underrated but he's been a very solid manager in the Championship/PL for a long, long time. He does a job any club in the bottom 10 in terms of keeping them safe.

Moyes is the same - he's a good coach in the bottom 10 level. I'd trust him to keep them safe from relegation. The likes of Bruce and Moyes have a place in the PL but just not at the top end clubs. Their level is bottom 10 and they do very well there.

I think Wilder and Potter still have a lot to prove before you can put them ahead of them, though Potter's had a promising start. Dyche as well has done well with Burnley, but could easily end up with his reputation heading down if he went elsewhere - see Tony Pulis.

Doesn't Bruce have the most relegations on his CV of any manager? Cost of doing business perhaps given how many relegation teams he's managed, but he's not as much of a sure shot as Sam Allardyce or even Tony Pulis.

As for Moyes, there's not much of a sample size really. He almost got relegated with West Ham the first time around, and got sacked. Kept them safe this time but that team should have been nowhere near relegation really. When it comes to guaranteeing safety, I think Allardyce is king. His record is spotless.

Ludens the Red · Oct 7, 2020

Winzaghi said:
Doesn't Bruce have the most relegations on his CV of any manager? Cost of doing business perhaps given how many relegation teams he's managed, but he's not as much of a sure shot as Sam Allardyce or even Tony Pulis.
As for Moyes, there's not much of a sample size really. He almost got relegated with West Ham the first time around, and got sacked. Kept them safe this time but that team should have been nowhere near relegation really. When it comes to guaranteeing safety, I think Allardyce is king. His record is spotless.

A grand total of two :lol:

Worth mentioning he won promotion back both times the following season.

Has the joint record for most promotions to the Premier League too and has never suffered immediate relegation.

I don’t get why Villa fans are like this with Bruce. I mean youve had Remi Garde, Di Matteo, McLeish, Sherwood, Lambert. Some absolutely stinking managers and yet for some weird reason all the hatred seems to be saved for Bruce. I get he was Birmingham but Jesus he was probably the only decent manager you got in post O’Neill.

Hound Dog · Oct 7, 2020

The standard of managers in the Prem is insane, very tough to decide. Here it goes:

1. Klopp
2. Mourinho
3. Ancelotti
4. Bielsa
5. Espirito Santo
6. Rodgers
7. Wilder
8. Dyche
9. Guardiola
10. Lampard
11. Bilic
12. Arteta
13. Bruce
14. Hassenhutl
15. Potter
16. Solskjaer
17. Hodgson
18. Smith
19. Moyes
20. Parker

Edit: I was probably too kind on Bilic and Ole and harsh on Arteta and Hodgson but oh well.

Bastian · Oct 7, 2020

soapythecat said:
I think Ole is firmly in the group of managers that would not get another job in this league if sacked.

Ole, Parker, Moyes and Billic.

Our manager, Ole.

I think Parker and Moyes would get another job in the league, at some stage. Parker because he's young and English. Moyes because some teams will think he can keep them up. Not sure about Bilic. Not sure about Ole either. Definitely not at a club at the top end.

Hound Dog · Oct 7, 2020

Winzaghi said:
Took over Villa 15th in the Championship.

Broke the club record for most wins in a row en route to getting the club promoted where a certain Steve Bruce failed, playing the best football in most people's living memory along the way.

Signed a whole new squad upon promotion due to the all the expired contracts and retirings/loanee returns (another Bruce legacy) and managed to get to a cup final as well as masterminding one of the greatest relegation escapes in recent history, being 7 points off safety with 4 games to go.

Presides over Villa's biggest ever PL win in his second season as well as inflicting the first ever 7 goal concession by a champion in PL history.

All this in almost exactly 2 years. Hardly what I'd call not achieving anything. If by achievements you meant trophies, then hardly anyone on the list even qualifies.

He was also absolutely brilliant at Walsall and Brentford before. Coached them to play a style not often seen at that level. A shame he left Walsall midseason could have guided them to the Championship. They are not even in L1 anymore now.

Bepi · Oct 7, 2020

1. Klopp
2. Ancelotti
3. Bielsa
4. Guardiola
5. Mourinho
6. Dyche
7. Wilder
8. Rodgers
9. Espirito Santo
10. Bruce

These 10 managers still add real value to their teams, their clubs or the game at large imho.

FootballHQ · Oct 8, 2020

Pretty hard this.

Think the only really out of his depth manager this season is Scott Parker but then it's not like Fulham going through the play-offs had the normal luxury of 8-10 weeks to get everything together. Plus given what happened to them previously they didn't really want to just replace half of their starting 11 again so caught in a difficult place.

Still look pretty easy to score against and would be amazed if they don't finish rock bottom.

OGS probably in th weaker set but he would argue he's given Man. United top 4 in his first full season just like Mourinho and LVG did but looks like the second season will go south.

Dean Smith is improving with a better set of players now. I was pretty critical of him last season due to our game management which meant we threw away so many leads in games but been much better so far.

Hodgson and Moyes are steady managers for just getting a club to finish 11-14th if they have an o.k set of players but we've seen these methods don't translate at all well for top 6 team.

Dyche and Wilder miracle workers imo but football gravity looks like it will pull both down this season.

If this 20 list was based on actual football quality then Steve Bruce would be rank bottom by a long way, look at how Newcastle attempted to play at Spurs last week. Were also completely outplayed at home to Brighton.

But again he did better than expected last season and this season has won 2/4 and progressed in cup.

Winzaghi · Oct 8, 2020

Leroy The Red said:
A grand total of two Worth mentioning he won promotion back both times the following season.

Has the joint record for most promotions to the Premier League too and has never suffered immediate relegation.

I don’t get why Villa fans are like this with Bruce. I mean youve had Remi Garde, Di Matteo, McLeish, Sherwood, Lambert. Some absolutely stinking managers and yet for some weird reason all the hatred seems to be saved for Bruce. I get he was Birmingham but Jesus he was probably the only decent manager you got in post O’Neill.

My bad I was thinking about his promotions. Again, not hating on Bruce specifically there. If you noticed I also mentioned Moyes in that post who is of a similar mould. Basically, they're not what I'd call survival specialists is the point I was making.

They're more suited to lower midtable sides with serviceable if not exciting squads, and they're not horrible enough to get them relegated. But when the chips are down and we're in a Watford/Villa type situation from last season or a Fulham from the season before, I'd call Allardyce or Pulis first as unappealing as that sounds and if it were 15 years ago, Redknapp.

Paul_Scholes18 · Oct 8, 2020

It is hard to judge, but what I can base it on is the clubs that would least benefit from changing manager. Although not fully judging the transfers they have made. Some are hard to judge though like Bilic.
I think Newcastle should aim higher than having Bruce too.

1 Klopp
2 Anchelotti
3 Pep
4 Espirito Santo
5 Rodgers
6 Wilder
7 Hassenhutl
8 Dyche
9 Bielsa ¨
10 Potter
11 Arteta
12 Dean Smith
13 Mourinho
14 Hodgeson
15 Moyes
16 Bruce
17 Bilic
18 Ole
19 Lampard
20 Parker

el3mel · Oct 8, 2020

Klopp
Pep
Carlo
Jose
Bielsa
Arteta
Nuno Santo
Rodgers

The rest are average.

Cloud7 · Oct 8, 2020

1) Klopp
2) Pep
3) Ancelloti
4) Bielsa (Probably warrants being higher but I haven't seen that much of him personally to rank him higher on my own list)
5) Rodgers
6) Nuno
7) Mourinho
8) Hassenhutl
9) Dyche (Even though his football isn't my cup of tea)
10) Arteta

Don't really care to rank the others but Ole is in the bottom three, Moyes not far from him. Steve Bruce, Parker and Bilic not far away either. Lampard is probably around 16 or so.

Fortitude · Oct 19, 2020

Does Villa's start to the season change the perception of their coach at all?

A few decent players, and he's gotten a totally different tune out of the side, which is an incredible contrast from last season.

Granted it's a few games, but surely food for thought?

HowYouDoin · Oct 19, 2020

Leroy The Red said:
I’ve left out Parker, Lampard and Arteta because they’re simply far too new to management to be able to compare and contrast with the others.
Pretty much all things considered, style of play, signings, ability to motivate, results, game management, etc.

1. Klopp
2. Pep
3. Mourinho
4. Ancelotti
5. Bielsa
6. Rodgers
7. Santo
8. Hasenhutl
9. Hodgson
10. Dyche
11. Wilder
12. Potter
13. Ole
14. Bruce
15. Bilic
16. Moyes
17. Smith

Ancelotti over Mourinho, Bilic and Moyes clearly over Ole too.

HowYouDoin · Oct 19, 2020

duffer said:
Have you blocked out the 2013/14 season from memory? That's why some people on here look down on him.

That was then this is now. West Ham are a formidable team. Manchester United were simply never his level but for a mid table team he is a decent coach. Moyes is better than Ole, much better.

FootballHQ · Oct 19, 2020

Fortitude said:
Does Villa's start to the season change the perception of their coach at all?

A few decent players, and he's gotten a totally different tune out of the side, which is an incredible contrast from last season.

Granted it's a few games, but surely food for thought?

What's been missed a little is we appointed Craig Shakespeare to the coaching staff in the summer, number 2 to Ranieri during Leicester title win and also came in with Nigel Pearson mid season to Watford and improved them.

Been far more of a gameplan to us this season compared to 12 months when it was just getting forward as much as possible so don't think that's a co-incidence.

BTW...anyone still not rank Steve Bruce 20th after watching Newcastle at weekend. :lol:

Web of Bissaka · Oct 19, 2020

Pexbo said:
This is a stealthy

...
20. Solskjaer

thread if ever I saw one.

Naah, no way Ole is the worst.

He's somewhere in the range of 8th to 15th.

Champ · Oct 19, 2020

Some truly shocking lists here :lol:

Fortitude · Oct 19, 2020

FootballHQ said:
What's been missed a little is we appointed Craig Shakespeare to the coaching staff in the summer, number 2 to Ranieri during Leicester title win and also came in with Nigel Pearson mid season to Watford and improved them.

Been far more of a gameplan to us this season compared to 12 months when it was just getting forward as much as possible so don't think that's a co-incidence.

BTW...anyone still not rank Steve Bruce 20th after watching Newcastle at weekend.

Thanks for that information. Guess it bodes well your main man isn't too proud to bring in helping hands of such quality.

It's certainly a worthwhile attribute to factor into the overall picture of what these guys bring to the table.

Fosu-Mens · Oct 19, 2020

A more tier ranked approach to this would be beneficial:

Tier 1: Can coach a team to play cohesive attacking(counter, possession and create chances against low block) and defensive (pressing and/or pragmatic) football.
Pep, Klopp, Potter,
Tier 2: Can coach a team to play cohesive attacking(counter, possession and create chances against low block) football.
Rodgers
Tier 3:Can coach a team to play cohesive defensive (pressing and/or pragmatic) football.
Mourinho,Hodgson, Dyche, Hassenhuttel, Moyes.
Tier 4: Go on lads, express yourselves on the pitch.
Lampard, OGS, Parker.

I think the rest are hard to evaluate. Like Ancelotti. He is known for being good with the players on a personal level, but it is hard to evaluate the tactical approach for Everton. Is he just good at putting 11 players together with the abilties and knowledge on how to play(I.e Allan and James brought in because they knew how to do certain things? And should not this ability be valued as well?) or is the seemingly cohesive defensive and attacking performances down to active coaching and input from manager/coaching team? And how to we factor in factors that are extremely difficult to quantify like improvement of the players through training and man management?

Jim Beam · Oct 19, 2020

Ole is better for this club then Jose.

Klopp is first.

90 + 5min · Oct 19, 2020

Oh my... Is this some joke I am missing to understand?

Here we have a manager taking a team to third place, semi in every other competition (FA cup, League Cup and Europa League) and people are putting him in bottom three.

Fosu-Mens · Oct 19, 2020

90 + 5min said:
Oh my... Is this some joke I am missing to understand?

Here we have a manager taking a team to third place, semi in every other competition (FA cup, League Cup and Europa League) and people are putting him in bottom three.

From a tactical point/gameplan etc yes.

As a man manager, albeit difficult to quantify, he seems to be able to motivate the players to always give their best and they seems motivated and happy, at least most of them. So, in this area, he seems more than good enough. But the question is if he can develope the tactical side or at least get the help with this, like SAF did. If OGS had a team of coaches working under him that understood how to coach a team to play relevant football, then it could work.

KcB32 · Oct 19, 2020

90 + 5min said:
Oh my... Is this some joke I am missing to understand?

Here we have a manager taking a team to third place, semi in every other competition (FA cup, League Cup and Europa League) and people are putting him in bottom three.

That' because you have to consider the squad and resources at each manager's disposal. Do you think 3rd place and a couple semi-finals is good for one of the richest clubs and most expensive squads in the world?

90 + 5min · Oct 19, 2020

Fosu-Mens said:
From a tactical point/gameplan etc yes.

As a man manager, albeit difficult to quantify, he seems to be able to motivate the players to always give their best and they seems motivated and happy, at least most of them. So, in this area, he seems more than good enough. But the question is if he can develope the tactical side or at least get the help with this, like SAF did. If OGS had a team of coaches working under him that understood how to coach a team to play relevant football, then it could work.

Every manager have faults. So my question would be how you can put the likes of Hodgson, Dysche, Potter and more of those managers infront of him?

KcB32 said:
That' because you have to consider the squad and resources at each manager's disposal. Do you think 3rd place and a couple semi-finals is good for one of the richest clubs and most expensive squads in the world?

What he did last year is more than anyone could have hoped for. We are where we are, not because Solskjaer, but because of problems begining at the end of Sir Alex Ferguson era. Expensive squad doesn't mean we have best squad. In our case it means giving contracts to people who didn't deserve and overpaying players. The quality of players didn't warrant the money involved.

bosnian_red · Oct 19, 2020

Ranking based on if they were all available but had no previous attachments to any club, what I would deem as pecking order for a standard club (so not necessarily big club going for big player name cause potential (for whatever reason). Purely managerial, weighing up both experience in survival and attributes to be suited to a bigger club (even if they aren't the same).

Jurgen Klopp
Pep Guardiola
Carlo Ancelotti
Jose Mourinho
Marcelo Bielsa
Nuno Espirito Santo
Brendan Rodgers
Ralph Hassenhuttl
Sean Dyche
Chris Wilder
Graham Potter
Roy Hodgson
David Moyes
Dean Smith
Ole Gunnar Solskjaer
Frank Lampard
Mike Arteta
Steve Bruce
Slavan Bilic
Scott Parker

Top 5 easy, for current level, past achievements, immediate/long term success (some like Mourinho way more towards immediate), but general years of backing. Bielsa maybe controversial to have there, but the guy is a purist and as a coach, has successfully implemented his style successfully wherever he's been, for years. Doesn't care about the level he's at, just wants to be trusted. Gotta admire that.

6-8 as kind of Mourinho/Pep/Klopp wannabes.

9-14 firmly the mid table group who have done alright in the recent past or shown they can keep sides up, but that being their limit.

15-17 wildcards... And I'm probably one of the people who defend Ole the most! If we're being honest all 3 of him, Lampard and Arteta are incredibly lucky to be in big managerial jobs, with nothing showing they should be there apart from being good players, which has no relevance to being a good manager. But sometimes they pop up to be good managers in time, so who knows. This isn't ruling them out, but they just aren't proven for anything past taking decent squads to perform roughly at their level. You need more than that to be a successful lower table manager, or a true title challenger.

18-20 - relegation tier. Bilic, Bruce and Parker are nothing managers really and easy bottom 3 IMO.

Grande · Oct 19, 2020

Leroy The Red said:
3. Mourinho

Red Shorts said:
I would say this is very accurate, would possibly put ancelotti above Mourinho though

RedDevil@84 said:
Ancelloti
Jose
Klopp

marktan said:
3. Mourinho

Andycoleno9 said:
Tier A. World class. Top managers who make teams better than they are. Excellent in every area of manager's job.
Mourinho

Feck me, this thread is either a club for the long term memory loss afflicted, or a wormfest for all the Mou fans who has kept silent when everyone else has said he is a dinousaur until ... one game ago.

arthurka · Oct 19, 2020

1. Pep
2. Klopp
3. Bielsa
4. Ancelotti
5. Mourinho
6. Hasenhutl
7. Santo
8. Dyche
9. Hodgson
10. Rodgers
11. Ole
12. Wilder
13. Potter
14. Bruce
15. Bilic
16. Moyes
17. Smith

bosnian_red · Oct 19, 2020

People are funny ranking Arteta highly. He's defensive as feck, obsessed with playing out from the back with no intent on creating/dragging positions around. Theyre 18th in the league in shots per game so far, despite having Aubameyang, Lacazette, Pepe, Willian, etc. Doesn't even keep possession that well (purely mid table in possession for the year), but always plays it "safe" (thus having the 3rd best pass accuracy).
Like Van Gaal with no CV or no personality.

Its early days, but he should by no means be anywhere outside of the wildcard grouping with Ole and Lampard, who have little to no experience or reason for being managers of big clubs other than being previous players at those clubs.

roonster09 · Oct 19, 2020

Andycoleno9 said:
I have no idea what to say about Parker tbh.

Others:
Tier A. World class. Top managers who make teams better than they are. Excellent in every area of manager's job.
Mourinho

Grande · Oct 19, 2020

For a sense of perspective: Solskjær took over the squad Mourinho ruined, Mourinho took over the squad Pochettino built, and Solskjær is still ahead of him in The Mourinho Table.

bosnian_red · Oct 19, 2020

Grande said:
Feck me, this thread is either a club for the long term memory loss afflicted, or a wormfest for all the Mou fans who has kept silent when everyone else has said he is a dinousaur until ... one game ago.

Hes still someone who you can bet on having a big season within his first 2 years. Not a long term guy, but doesn't have to be. His previous job at United, he won 3 trophies in year 1 and finished 2nd with 81 points in year 2. Job before that he won the title with Chelsea before it collapsed. He's absolutely in the top 4.

Andycoleno9 · Oct 19, 2020

roonster09 said:

I know i know...what can i say? But at least i know that i am deluded

AshRK · Oct 19, 2020

Overrating of Arteta in this thread is funny as feck. The guy's football would make Pulis proud. Moyes' westham outplayed him at Emirates 3 weeks ago and they were fortunate to scrap 3 points. Also, it seems people have forgotten Jose's third season here and how crap we were.

SadlerMUFC · Oct 19, 2020

I just love how our manager brought our team to 3rd place last season yet most here don't even have him in the top 10. Bunch of ungrateful pratts...

SadlerMUFC · Oct 19, 2020

AshRK said:
Overrating of Arteta in this thread is funny as feck. The guy's football would make Pulis proud. Moyes' westham outplayed him at Emirates 3 weeks ago and they were fortunate to scrap 3 points. Also, it seems people have forgotten Jose's third season here and how crap we were.

Everyone is very "knee jerk" around here. The same people who couldn't stand Mourinho while he was here and likely the same people saying he's one of the top managers in the league. They will give him all the credit for that win over us last week but completely ignore the 3 goal lead his team gave up yesterday to West Ham...

Member 90887 · Oct 19, 2020

The first poster after the OP was spot on. he said, this is just a 20 - Ole thread. Couldn't agree more, extremely dishonest from our fanbase, but creative, i'll five people that.

You had one poster say that they left out Lampard because he is new when Ole barely started half a season before Lampard and when Lampard had a full season in his belt.

You also have people saying that Ole can't even do better than Moyes because he has no system while these same people were saying that Moyes had no system when he was coaching us.

Our fanbase is as toxic as any. The thing we have more than other fanbases is that our is relentless. they'll do the same thing to the next manager.

AshRK · Oct 19, 2020

SadlerMUFC said:
Everyone is very "knee jerk" around here. The same people who couldn't stand Mourinho while he was here and likely the same people saying he's one of the top managers in the league. They will give him all the credit for that win over us last week but completely ignore the 3 goal lead his team gave up yesterday to West Ham...

I don't care people not liking Ole, but stop making excuses for other managers. Just to bash Ole they will say Arteta and Lampard are promising, I mean have you even seen arteta's brand of football. He makes Jose's football exciting. Isn't it too soon to judge him and put him in top 10. Point is grass is always greener on the other side.

I also don't get the argument of people saying he wouldn't get another job. How do we know? If Ole leaves the job today, the history will say he did a better job at United than Moyes. Who is to say he doesn't have good connection and may land up a decent job. How do we have the metrics that he is a championship level manager when he has beaten the likes of Pep multiple times and finished 3rd. Again, one doesn't need to rate Ole and may even say he is not good enough to manage Manchester United, but to say he is the worst of the lot or he is just a PE teacher who will not even find a job at championship club doesn't add up or make sense.

RedDevil@84 · Oct 19, 2020

Grande said:
or a wormfest for all the Mou fans who has kept silent when everyone else has said he is a dinousaur until ... one game ago.

My post was a bit bad I agree. I hadn't read the OP properly. I didn't think in terms of forever ratings of coaches.

And on Jose, the "Hate Jose" cult is way bigger and stronger on caf. Any positive performance by Jose team has to be frowned upon. Jose can only be abused/mocked.
Strange behavior.

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