A Solskjaer Masterclass. Whoop Whoop!!!

georgipep

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Ole does great when we play counter, thus we always looked good when we play big teams as they attack, nothing changed from last season (Wins againt city etc). The inconsistency comes when team sit back and let us play, its too early to say we are back, it ha sbeen almost 2 years with the same rollercoaster results!
Not sure what your definition of 'teams sit back' is but let's say every team that is not Liverpool, Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal, Tottenham, is that fair? (I'm not counting Everton, Leicester or Wolves as 'big' teams) If so, since the Burnley debacle on the 22nd of January (we lost 0:2 at home), this is our record:

  • Watford at home, 3:0 win
  • Everton away, 1:1 draw
  • Derby County away for the FA Cup, 3:0 win
  • Sheffield United at home, 3:0 win
  • Norwich, neutral for the FA Cup, 1:2 win after extra time
  • Brighton away, 3:0 win
  • Bournemouth at home, 5:2 win
  • Aston Villa away, 3:0 win
  • Southampton at home, 2:2 draw (the game we lost Shaw to injury)
  • Crystal Palace away, 2:0 win
  • West Ham at home, 1:1 draw
  • Leicester away, 2:0 win
  • Crystal Palace at home, 1:3 loss (new season)
  • Luton away for the Carabao, 3:0 win
  • Brighton away, 3:2 win
  • Brighton away for the Carabao, 3:0 win
  • Newcastle away, 4:1 win
Well, not sure what do you see as inconsistency but to me a record of 13 wins, 3 draws and 1 loss is not one.
 

8thWonder

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Ole must have known that Bailly and Tuanzebe were injury prone. So he had 80m in the banks and 2 'reliable' CBs in Lindelof and Smalling. Its evident that he didn't trust Smalling which is quite strange considering that Hodor was rapid and he was suited more for the English game (tall, strong, physical etc). So he needed to find a partner for Lindelof. Honestly I've yet to understand what Lindelof is good at but he's certainly not fast. Which makes us spending 80m on Maguire is crazy. In my opinion he should have gone for someone like Konate. He's got Maguire's characteristics (tall, good in air) + he's got pace.

Matic rightly lost his place at the start of last year as he was dreadful. After December he improved and he won it back which is fair enough really.

Regarding Aurier, Spurs had a nightmare season in 19/20 which is comparable to our nightmare season of 18/19. Usually Aurier is better attacking wise then AWB is.
We get it that you have a bee in your bonnet about Maguire (as many united fans do at the moment), but there is/was a reason that Mourinho wanted him, Pep wanted him, Ole got him and Fergie supposedly singled him out at a young age also...

He's had some high profile mistakes and he's having to deal with that. However there aren't many centre backs around that on their day tick the boxes of being Aerially dominant, a leader, good on the ball and a good defender. Very few have that combination, he was bought to provide that (obviously it hasn't quite gone exactly to plan). So for example Konate wouldn't have provided leadership which we were in desperate need of last summer and a huge requisite of any centre back we brought in, so Maguire was an obvious choice to make despite paying over the odds imo.

This is factually not true the past 8 months.
And yet people still mention it all the time don't they? When we've been physically at the races then we've been pretty good at winning these types of games for a while which points to genuine progress under Ole.

Caveat of if we stay inconsistent then Ole obviously won't last long. But I think the signs have been pretty positive for awhile, barring the awful start to the season. If people have put that down to Ole and tactics then I understand the doubts, if people (like me) believe that it has a large amount to do with the non existent pre-season then I think you have to give a little bit of leeway.
 

devilish

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We get it that you have a bee in your bonnet about Maguire (as many united fans do at the moment), but there is/was a reason that Mourinho wanted him, Pep wanted him, Ole got him and Fergie supposedly singled him out at a young age also...

He's had some high profile mistakes and he's having to deal with that. However there aren't many centre backs around that on their day tick the boxes of being Aerially dominant, a leader, good on the ball and a good defender. Very few have that combination, he was bought to provide that (obviously it hasn't quite gone exactly to plan). So for example Konate wouldn't have provided leadership which we were in desperate need of last summer and a huge requisite of any centre back we brought in, so Maguire was an obvious choice to make despite paying over the odds imo.
I don't accept that. I raised concerns about Maguire, long before we signed him. I always said that he was slow, that he's overrated, that he doesn't fit what we need, that he's no leader and that he's overpriced.

Let us be clear though. I don't hate the guy. I wish him all the best and I think he's a better CB then he is currently showing.
 

devilish

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This is the problem with our fan base, masters of hindsight. So Ole should have known that Tuanzebe is injury prone? When the season before he played 25 championship games?

You are so quick to criticise and give alternatives. You wanted us to sign a 21 yr old CB, inexperienced, he would have cost £40/50m anyway. Go have a look at last season, he was injured for most part of the season as well. So its not fair on criticising Ole for signing Maguire who played every game, criticising him for not knowing Tuanzebe is injury prone and giving an alternative who was injured for most part of last season too?

I dont know how good Konate is but I can tell you a fit Maguire is still better than a injured Konate...

Okay, Aurier had a bad 19/20, so what stats have you got to back yourself saying he is better than AWB going forward?

Tuanzebe had lost 97 days in 2018. Irrespective of that he was so green that he pissed grass. We knew that Bailly was injury prone as well so our options were Lindelof and Smalling. Ole didn't trust Smalling so Maguire was set to play with Lindelof ie two extremely slow CBs.

I very much doubt that Konate would have costed us 40m-50m. Irrespective of that, I'd rather see us buy a potentially WC CB who would fit in our system then spend 80m on someone who has neither the characteristics nor the talent to ever be WC. An 80m rated CB should be carrying the defence. Instead we're talking about which player can be best suited in carrying erm complimenting the guy.

AWB - 80 games, 7 assists
Aurier - 60 games, 10 assists

https://www.premierleague.com/players/11293/Serge-Aurier/stats
https://www.premierleague.com/players/14164/Aaron-Wan-Bissaka/stats
 
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devilish

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Ah okay, thanks for that clarification. I guess the fact that we had the third best defensive record (one behind City) with 18 goals fewer versus the season before would lead me to disagree with you.
The season before United were a mess with Mou losing the dressing room and getting sacked mid way of the season. We conceded way less goals in 2017-2018 (28 goals) and in 2016-2017 (29) then we did last season (36). That despite the lack of 130m investment. This year we are currently 15th place and had already conceded 12 goals
 

cyberman

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Tuanzebe had lost 97 days in 2018. Irrespective of that he was so green that he pissed grass. We knew that Bailly was injury prone as well so our options were Lindelof and Smalling. Ole didn't trust Smalling so Maguire was set to play with Lindelof ie two extremely slow CBs.

I very much doubt that Konate would have costed us 40m-50m. Irrespective of that, I'd rather see us buy a potentially WC CB who would fit in our system then spend 80m on someone who has neither the characteristics nor the talent to ever be WC. We all know that Leicester had laughed their way to the bank by now

AWB - 80 games, 7 assists
Aurier - 60 games, 10 assists

https://www.premierleague.com/players/11293/Serge-Aurier/stats
https://www.premierleague.com/players/14164/Aaron-Wan-Bissaka/stats
3 more assists while crossing to Kane..
Impressive stuff alright.
 

romufc

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Tuanzebe had lost 97 days in 2018. Irrespective of that he was so green that he pissed grass. We knew that Bailly was injury prone as well so our options were Lindelof and Smalling. Ole didn't trust Smalling so Maguire was set to play with Lindelof ie two extremely slow CBs.

I very much doubt that Konate would have costed us 40m-50m. Irrespective of that, I'd rather see us buy a potentially WC CB who would fit in our system then spend 80m on someone who has neither the characteristics nor the talent to ever be WC. An 80m rated CB should be carrying the defence. Instead we're talking about which player can be best suited in carrying erm complimenting the guy.

AWB - 80 games, 7 assists
Aurier - 60 games, 10 assists

https://www.premierleague.com/players/11293/Serge-Aurier/stats
https://www.premierleague.com/players/14164/Aaron-Wan-Bissaka/stats
So Tuanzebe was green after 1 season in the championship but Konate is a potential WC CB? how have you come with that difference? What makes Konate WC potential and Tuanzebe crap.

Again, go check how long Konate was out for in 19/20 and how long Maguire was out for in 19/20. I would rather have a CB who plays than one on the injury table.

Secondly, you are rating him as a young potential WC CB but would be cheap? Let me name a few that have gone over the past few years.

De Ligt - £60m
Hernandez -£70m
Laporte - £60m

Upemaceno was £60m rated so how is a potential WC player going to be cheaper than £40m?

Regarding the right back, first and foremost you need you RB to defend. Please do not compare Aurier defensively to AWB, AWB is better in all defensive actions.

He has 3 more assists wow, our right back must be completely rubbish considering he played a season at Palace who dont score goals.

You are really clutching at straws thinking Aurier is better than AWB.
 

8thWonder

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I don't accept that. I raised concerns about Maguire, long before we signed him. I always said that he was slow, that he's overrated, that he doesn't fit what we need, that he's no leader and that he's overpriced.

Let us be clear though. I don't hate the guy. I wish him all the best and I think he's a better CB then he is currently showing.
Possibly a little knee jerk here, and we disagree on Maguire obviously, but in regards to 'he doesn't fit', I see a potentially perfect partner in Axel. One aerially dominant, one a little quicker and composed, both talkers... On paper and obviously injuries and form permitting, they genuinely could be a very strong partnership Imo.
 

Zlatans Knee

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The season before United were a mess with Mou losing the dressing room and getting sacked mid way of the season. We conceded way less goals in 2017-2018 (28 goals) and in 2016-2017 (29) then we did last season (36). That despite the lack of 130m investment. This year we are currently 15th place and had already conceded 12 goals
There are various reasons to our shit start to the season and it would be wrong to pin it on individuals. The seasons with Mou we parked a bus behind the ball in every game. If you don't think that we looked better as a unit 2nd half of last season compared to previous seasons then I don't know what to tell you.
 

Twins

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3 more assists in 20 less games.
Why would you even compare the two? Aurier is 27 years old and in his peak, while Awb is 22 and still developing. I know who I prefer to have in my team.
 

romufc

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Why would you even compare the two? Aurier is 27 years old and in his peak, while Awb is 22 and still developing. I know who I prefer to have in my team.
The problem with some fans is they think a RB should have RW output. 3 more assists = better player.

Completely ignore the fact that one is Very very good defensively and one is poor. They prefer one with better attacking numbers.
 

devilish

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The problem with some fans is they think a RB should have RW output. 3 more assists = better player.

Completely ignore the fact that one is Very very good defensively and one is poor. They prefer one with better attacking numbers.
It wasn't the case. I was just suggesting that these days wingback need to be able to go forward and create chances. Then it went out of hand from there
 

romufc

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It wasn't the case. I was just suggesting that these days wingback need to be able to go forward and create chances. Then it went out of hand from there
Fair enough.

AWB showed us against PSG his qualities, one of the best RB performances in that game keeping Mbappe and Neymar relatively quiet.

Hopefully he can get 5/6 assists a season.

We also have to note that we have 1 player in the box when the players get it out wide, which means there is no cross into the box, how Digne, Trent, Robbo get their assists.
 

Bebestation

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Our need of a certain type of Fullback is dependent on the striker and formation we use.

AWB & Shaw are good enough if we stick to Martial in the middle with Greenwood and Rashford out wide because our creativity should be coming from the midfield then. We saw this with our attacking looking one of the best in the league last season with minimal crosses etc.

If we play Cavani or Ighalo ( even another tanky player we buy in the future) we need more crossing of the ball from deep.

I like the fact that we have 2 defensive minded fullbacks and now we got an attacking Lwb in Telles, if someone like Laird can step up as a RWB or even someone like James - I think we are sorted to adapt our formation & players depending on what we need on the pitch.
 

pocco

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4 losses in last 32 games :confused:
Not all about losses but performances. 2 wins out of 4 in the league this season, including one very lucky win where we got smashed to bits and dominated by Brighton. 66 points last season, 12 draws and 8 losses. Let's not pretend it's all been rosy. That points total generally gets you 6th or 7th in every PL season. Look at our start to last season up until Christmas, it was terrible and only saved post lockdown when other teams seemed to be in a malaise.

There's a genuine debate to be had here, whether you like it or not. Perhaps Ole will prove us wrong, we'll play amazing football and show some return on the money spent. Or perhaps we'll have a purple patch followed by a poor run, which has happened every other time we've been looking poor under Ole. We'll see what happens.
 

devilish

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Fair enough.

AWB showed us against PSG his qualities, one of the best RB performances in that game keeping Mbappe and Neymar relatively quiet.

Hopefully he can get 5/6 assists a season.

We also have to note that we have 1 player in the box when the players get it out wide, which means there is no cross into the box, how Digne, Trent, Robbo get their assists.
There's no doubt that AWB had played great against PSG. However we defended with numbers during that game with 8 defensive minded players (De Gea; Wan-Bissaka, Tuanzebe, Lindelof, Shaw, Telles, Fred and McTominay). The tactics were spot on but its easier to defend a result that way. I used that same argument in a thread meant to demonise Maguire as well.
 

sammsky1

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Not all about losses but performances. 2 wins out of 4 in the league this season, including one very lucky win where we got smashed to bits and dominated by Brighton. 66 points last season, 12 draws and 8 losses. Let's not pretend it's all been rosy. That points total generally gets you 6th or 7th in every PL season. Look at our start to last season up until Christmas, it was terrible and only saved post lockdown when other teams seemed to be in a malaise.

There's a genuine debate to be had here, whether you like it or not. Perhaps Ole will prove us wrong, we'll play amazing football and show some return on the money spent. Or perhaps we'll have a purple patch followed by a poor run, which has happened every other time we've been looking poor under Ole. We'll see what happens.
There is no debate. Ole is the manager, has the confidence of all his players, the board and vast majority of fambase.
And he will remain Manager, no matter how much you dislike it or want to change. That’s it. The end.
 

devilish

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There are various reasons to our shit start to the season and it would be wrong to pin it on individuals. The seasons with Mou we parked a bus behind the ball in every game. If you don't think that we looked better as a unit 2nd half of last season compared to previous seasons then I don't know what to tell you.
There were various reasons why we conceded so many goals during Mou's last year as well. Strangely enough you prefer to compare last season's goal conceded with that season rather then to what happened prior to that. Regarding Mou's record we won the EFL and the Europa league during the 2016-2017 season and we ended second during the 2017-2018 season. Those two seasons were better then last year.
 

devilish

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Possibly a little knee jerk here, and we disagree on Maguire obviously, but in regards to 'he doesn't fit', I see a potentially perfect partner in Axel. One aerially dominant, one a little quicker and composed, both talkers... On paper and obviously injuries and form permitting, they genuinely could be a very strong partnership Imo.
Maguire need a rapid CB. Maybe Tuanzebe can save his career with United. Big fee signings in defence should elevate the current defence rather then expect others to make it work. I can't recall us worrying which player can make Pally, Stam, Rio and Vidic look good.
 

amolbhatia50k

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Tuanzebe had lost 97 days in 2018. Irrespective of that he was so green that he pissed grass. We knew that Bailly was injury prone as well so our options were Lindelof and Smalling. Ole didn't trust Smalling so Maguire was set to play with Lindelof ie two extremely slow CBs.

I very much doubt that Konate would have costed us 40m-50m. Irrespective of that, I'd rather see us buy a potentially WC CB who would fit in our system then spend 80m on someone who has neither the characteristics nor the talent to ever be WC. An 80m rated CB should be carrying the defence. Instead we're talking about which player can be best suited in carrying erm complimenting the guy.

AWB - 80 games, 7 assists
Aurier - 60 games, 10 assists

https://www.premierleague.com/players/11293/Serge-Aurier/stats
https://www.premierleague.com/players/14164/Aaron-Wan-Bissaka/stats
Totally agree. Even when the Maguire hype started - during the world cup - my impression was that he was a good/decent CB but never a top class one. And fail to see why any club would spend a record fee for a defender on someone who is fairly solid but clearly not genuinely brilliant at his role. It either smacks of desperation, which I'd argue is never a good enough reason when it comes to players who aren't of the highest level, or a over emphasis on the "English core". And I believe the latter played a big part in this transfer. Ole wanted his English spine, someone who will be a leader for his Manchester United team. But I believe he terribly misjudged or didn't emphasize enough of his actual quality first and foremost as a defender. And while it's definitely good to have the spine of your team being of the nationality of your league it should not supercede quality.

As for this thread, absolutely delighted with the result and performance against PSG. I won't pretend to be convinced by Ole as a manager but hopefully we do kick on after this and move from strength to strength.
 

Bobcat

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Our need of a certain type of Fullback is dependent on the striker and formation we use.

AWB & Shaw are good enough if we stick to Martial in the middle with Greenwood and Rashford out wide because our creativity should be coming from the midfield then. We saw this with our attacking looking one of the best in the league last season with minimal crosses etc.

If we play Cavani or Ighalo ( even another tanky player we buy in the future) we need more crossing of the ball from deep.

I like the fact that we have 2 defensive minded fullbacks and now we got an attacking Lwb in Telles, if someone like Laird can step up as a RWB or even someone like James - I think we are sorted to adapt our formation & players depending on what we need on the pitch.
The problem with AWB and Shaw is not so much their crossing, but rather their attacking movement. AWB tends to stick wide too much and there have been several occasions of Bruno having played a smart ball between the CB's and fullbacks and AWB not being there because hes parked at the touchline

Shaw makes those kinds of movements more often (when in form) but hes almost always a tad to slow so the defense manages to reposition themselves and sniff him out.

Its also worth noting that until after post lockdown we, did not really have a settled player at RW, so AWB and Greenwood have not really played so much together that they have had time to form a proper partnership. Much more concerned with that left side tbh, where Rashford and Shaw have played for much longer and it still seems they lack a proper understanding of one another
 

devilish

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Totally agree. Even when the Maguire hype started - during the world cup - my impression was that he was a good/decent CB but never a top class one. And fail to see why any club would spend a record fee for a defender on someone who is fairly solid but clearly not genuinely brilliant at his role. It either smacks of desperation, which I'd argue is never a good enough reason when it comes to players who aren't of the highest level, or a over emphasis on the "English core". And I believe the latter played a big part in this transfer. Ole wanted his English spine, someone who will be a leader for his Manchester United team. But I believe he terribly misjudged or didn't emphasize enough of his actual quality first and foremost as a defender. And while it's definitely good to have the spine of your team being of the nationality of your league it should not supercede quality.

As for this thread, absolutely delighted with the result and performance against PSG. I won't pretend to be convinced by Ole as a manager but hopefully we do kick on after this and move from strength to strength.
I fully agree. The irony in all this is that we already had a British core with Smalling, Shaw, Jesse, Rashford, McT and Young + Greenwood, Henderson and Tuanzebe coming through. Don't take me wrong, I am not against us spending big money on British players. However the talent and the age need to fit the bill. Such rule apply irrespective whether the player is British or foreign.

United have 2 problems regarding transfers

a- we allow business men to negotiate with players and clubs. That lead to a situation were players were overpaid, players like Jones were giving ridiculously long contracts to protect the 'asset' etc
b- we allowed managers to dictate whom we bring. That might have worked in the past but not now. Managers don't have the time to scout players, they are too busy thinking of the now rather then the future and when the manager changes then the squad will probably need to change as well.

We're still hopeless in terms of A and honestly I can't see us improving on it unless we get at least a top DOF but I am glad that we're improving on B.

Finally I am not completely Ole out. Ole has his flaws but there's also huge potential in him as well. For example he learns from his mistakes, he's a superb man manager, his tactics against the big sides tend to be spot on and he's got a good eye for youth talent. However if we want him to succeed then we need to surround him with experience. That means a top DOF, a head of recruitment and coaches that are quality. These changes might irk the manager as well as no one likes to have other stripping away power from them. Which explains the constant moaning and groaning done by Ole mates in punditry regarding our 'shambolic' transfer window. Unfortunately failure in doing so will set Ole to fail just as it set the likes of Mou and LVG to fail as well.
 

Real Name

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There's no doubt that AWB had played great against PSG. However we defended with numbers during that game with 8 defensive minded players (De Gea; Wan-Bissaka, Tuanzebe, Lindelof, Shaw, Telles, Fred and McTominay). The tactics were spot on but its easier to defend a result that way. I used that same argument in a thread meant to demonise Maguire as well.
We defended yes in the first half. Once they scored we changed tactics and pinned them back, our goal was hanging in the air so to say.
 

Zlatans Knee

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There were various reasons why we conceded so many goals during Mou's last year as well. Strangely enough you prefer to compare last season's goal conceded with that season rather then to what happened prior to that. Regarding Mou's record we won the EFL and the Europa league during the 2016-2017 season and we ended second during the 2017-2018 season. Those two seasons were better then last year.
In terms of playing style, they absolutely were not. 1st half of last year I will grant you was shit, but the second half was great. Anyway it is clear that we will not agree. Whilst I think we spent a lot of money on Maguire and AWB I also think that they are good players for our team. They both had a bit of a shaky start to the season but I expect them to kick on from now on. AWB in particular should be full of confidence after his last two performances. Maguire was much better against Newcastle.
 

Bobcat

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I fully agree. The irony in all this is that we already had a British core with Smalling, Shaw, Jesse, Rashford, McT and Young + Greenwood, Henderson and Tuanzebe coming through. Don't take me wrong, I am not against us spending big money on British players. However the talent and the age need to fit the bill. Such rule apply irrespective whether the player is British or foreign.

United have 2 problems regarding transfers

a- we allow business men to negotiate with players and clubs. That lead to a situation were players were overpaid, players like Jones were giving ridiculously long contracts to protect the 'asset' etc
b- we allowed managers to dictate whom we bring. That might have worked in the past but not now. Managers don't have the time to scout players, they are too busy thinking of the now rather then the future and when the manager changes then the squad will probably need to change as well.

We're still hopeless in terms of A and honestly I can't see us improving on it unless we get at least a top DOF but I am glad that we're improving on B.

Finally I am not completely Ole out. Ole has his flaws but there's also huge potential in him as well. For example he learns from his mistakes, he's a superb man manager, his tactics against the big sides tend to be spot on and he's got a good eye for youth talent. However if we want him to succeed then we need to surround him with experience. That means a top DOF, a head of recruitment and coaches that are quality. These changes might irk the manager as well as no one likes to have other stripping away power from them. Which explains the constant moaning and groaning done by Ole mates in punditry regarding our 'shambolic' transfer window. Unfortunately failure in doing so will set Ole to fail just as it set the likes of Mou and LVG to fail as well.
Good post. Fully agreed on a, not quite on b. Its obvious we need to modernize the structure of the club, but i think the manager must have the final say in who goes in and out. Of course a manager needs a good scouting network to find him suitable talent, but i still think he needs to make the final call

I do worry a bit about our scouts though. They seem to be doing well at the academy level, but its been quite some time since we unearthed a hidden gem that went straight into the first team
 

pocco

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There is no debate. Ole is the manager, has the confidence of all his players, the board and vast majority of fambase.
And he will remain Manager, no matter how much you dislike it or want to change. That’s it. The end.
You don't know any of that for a fact though. Lose a couple of games and you won't be sticking your neck out saying that, just like you weren't prior to the Newcastle game. Before which, there were various stories of players being unsure of him/his tactics or whatever, which could be bollocks, but we don't know. Football is a fickle place and 'the majority of fanbase' backing Ole today, after 2 good results, means nothing. They were probably the same calling for his head a week ago. Fair enough though, you aren't fickle because you have made up your mind on him and will stand by that, just like you once did for Jose, lavishing him with unrelenting superlatives. But I'm the same, I'm not fickle. I don't want to dislike him (as a manager), I pay good money and invest a lot of time in going to watch United all around the country, why would I want anything other that us to be at our best? And that is where the issue lies, though I will happily accept that I'm wrong if and when the time comes that he has changed my mind. Just as you may do if things ever got so bad. Let's not pretend it has been smooth sailing though. Ole is now doing what many of us have suggested he should and, lo and behold, results and performances follow. This justifies the criticism even more.

You can try to be dismissive or think you are some sort of authority on United/Solskjaer and what is going on behind the scenes, but you're just a guy sitting wherever you are in the world, giving your opinion. That's all.
 
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sammsky1

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You don't know any of that for a fact though. Lose a couple of games and you won't be sticking your neck out saying that, just like you weren't prior to the Newcastle game. Before which, there were various stories of players being unsure of him/his tactics or whatever, which could be bollocks, but we don't know. Football is a fickle place and 'the majority of fanbase' backing Ole today, after 2 good results, means nothing. They were probably the same calling for his head a week ago. Fair enough though, you aren't fickle because you have made up your mind on him and will stand by that, just like you once did for Jose, lavishing him with unrelenting superlatives. But I'm the same, I'm not fickle. I don't want to dislike him (as a manager), I pay good money and invest a lot of time in going to watch United all around the country, why would I want anything other that us to be at our best? And that is where the issue lies, though I will happily accept that I'm wrong if and when the time comes that he has changed my mind. Just as you may do if things ever got so bad. Let's not pretend it has been smooth sailing though. Ole is now doing what many of us have suggested he should and, lo and behold, results and performances follow. This justifies the criticism even more. You can try to be dismissive or think you are some sort of authority on United/Solskjaer and what is going on behind the scenes, but you're just a guy sitting wherever you are in the world, giving your opinion. That's all.
Erm, yes I was.
 

sammsky1

Pochettino's #1 fan
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You were backing him, but you weren't making such definitive statements like you are now. I don't care anyway, you said the same sort of things about Jose, who I was also behind, but we were wrong. One of us will be wrong again. Hopefully it's me and a club legend can prove to be a top class manager, but we will see.
Erm, yes I was.
 

devilish

Juventus fan who used to support United
Joined
Sep 5, 2002
Messages
61,526
Good post. Fully agreed on a, not quite on b. Its obvious we need to modernize the structure of the club, but i think the manager must have the final say in who goes in and out. Of course a manager needs a good scouting network to find him suitable talent, but i still think he needs to make the final call

I do worry a bit about our scouts though. They seem to be doing well at the academy level, but its been quite some time since we unearthed a hidden gem that went straight into the first team
DOFs and HORs had been in football for quite some time so modern managers lack the experience needed to spot talent or deal with agents. Players know of their power so if the manager try to bring competition, let alone replace, an influential player then he might end up losing the dressing room. Not to forget that the Sir Alex like managers are gone. Most managers care of themselves/their favourites and they care of the now. They won't be there in 5 years time so why bother? Which explains the staggering amount of former players the managers post Sir Alex had brought or tried to bring to the club. Fellaini (Moyes), Blind, Valdes and Bastian (LVG) and Matic and Lukaku (Mou).

A solid DOF can work on scouting and transfers nearly 24/7. Since he's at board level he's untouchable by players. Actually the DOF and the manager can play bad cop-good cop with the DOF taking the tough decisions and the manager defending his own men up until they reach a 'compromise'. That happened a few years back at Juventus with an ageing Del Piero. The DOF thought that he wasn't good enough to stay with Juventus anymore, the manager defended him and they reached a 'compromise' were Del Piero would remain but only after accepting a huge pay cut.

Managers should be constantly consulted regarding targets and transfers. You can't have a silly situation were let's say a manager asks for a young LB to act as cover and he ends up with a 28 year first team striker. He should also have a final say on who stays at the club. Else the club risks making players bigger then the manager himself. However the manager should not have the final say on transfers. He lacks the time to properly scout players, he lacks the expertise to do so and honestly, he needs to be shielded from taking tough decisions that can easily lead to him losing the dressing room.
 

pocco

loco
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Keep a clean shit tomorrow, United is my final bus
Erm, yes I was.
Erm, no you weren't. You might think you were in your head, but you weren't. Just a couple of examples (there are many more) to compare to your current stance of 'Ole will remain manager. End of' type spiel..

Ole isn't getting sacked for a good while yet.
My opinion is if he is backed with 2 more good players this window, then top 4 becomes un-negotiable. If he doesnt get those players, then Id have to reevaluate my expectations,

If he fails in that, then we have a serious discussion. But not before then.
if only the energy and commitment from all the gloaters in this thread, went towards getting Woodward sacked, or even the Glazer's out, our club would benefit a great deal more. Ole is not the biggest problem at this club. Not even the 2nd or third.
 

Foxbatt

New Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2013
Messages
14,297
It was a masterclass and I think it was forced onto him by the absence of Greenwood, Maguire and Cavani. He should go with this against Chelsea too. But credit to all the players too who played so well and so tactically disciplined too. I hope he gets them to play the same way tomorrow too.
 

sammsky1

Pochettino's #1 fan
Joined
Feb 10, 2008
Messages
32,841
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London
Erm, no you weren't. You might think you were in your head, but you weren't. Just a couple of examples (there are many more) to compare to your current stance of 'Ole will remain manager. End of' type spiel..
Not sure what you think you proved with reposting those. :confused:
 

passing-wind

Full Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2013
Messages
3,041
We are awful to watch in possession of the ball. Mourinho was hounded for this fact whereas Ole seems to be getting praised. One thing that both Mourinho and Solskjaer have in common is the lack of consistency in on field performances. It ultimately cost Jose his job and it will do the same for Ole.
 

Stig

Full Member
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Feb 26, 2019
Messages
1,473
What were these great tactics that everyone is so pleased with ? I didn't see the game, only the highlights once I knew the score and you can't see tactics from highlights.
 

Foxbatt

New Member
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Oct 21, 2013
Messages
14,297
What were these great tactics that everyone is so pleased with ? I didn't see the game, only the highlights once I knew the score and you can't see tactics from highlights.
Two up front with Bruno dropping deep and playing Scot and Fred in midfield and playing 3 at the back with AWB and Telles as wing backs. We played a bit narrow so it did not give PSG much open space to run at our defence like in other games when we had a back 4 and three up front with just three midfield players. Playing Tuanzabe also made Lindelof look better because Tuanzebe had the pace and strength to keep up with Mbappe. Then later in the second half he brought in Pogba to keep control of the ball and James to run like crazy. it worked. It may or may not work again but I would say it should work as one of our biggest problems this season has been that we are too open at the back. Yes Fred and Scott played a very good game and kept the intensity high in midfield. David played a blinder but his saves were all we expect him to make when he is on form.
 

MikeKing

Full Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2017
Messages
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Bournemouth
Sometimes our players seem to drop a level if a game is too easy. Why is that? It makes no sense to me. If you are a good team you should be able to turn in on and take advantage of the other team lack of tempo, not slow things down to their level and make it harder. It's the thing Ole needs to fix first and foremost, and it's not so much about tactics that one, I don't think.

The way Rashford took that shot against PSG after finding the space epitomises what I'm asking to see more of from this team. So many times, in less important games, we play far too casual when there is obvious space to make use of. I hope VdB can influence us positively this season regarding this issue.