Some of the posters are a disgrace.

McTerminator

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Well yes perhaps you have thought about it, but I guess it didn't come across that way in your OP.
Perhaps not, but for me fans should go into a season with a set of expectations. If their expectations are met then they should back their manager and players and revise those expectations for the following season as appropriate.

If Ole gets top 4 this season with the way other teams strengthened then I think he’s earned himself another year to mount a title challenge.

if the glazers fail to back him properly (or Woodward fails to get him the players he needs) should he achieve consecutive champs league qualification then I think that’s probably as damning an indictment of our club as anything over the last seven years.
 

alexthelion

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That's part of the unwritten code of being a "true" United fan. Anything good = manager. Anything bad = players.
What's the code for Ole outers? Anything good=players, anything bad=Ole.

What's the difference?
 

Cloud7

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What's the code for Ole outers? Anything good=players, anything bad=Ole.

What's the difference?
They’re culpable in different ways. It’s not that simple. For example things like Pogba giving away a penalty at arsenal, or Maguire tackling Shaw against Spurs, these are down to the players. Individual moments of error are down to them. When the team as a whole looks like they don’t know what they’re doing going forward, or the entire defense looks like they have no sort of idea where they should be, that’s on the manager.
 

tenpoless

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How many Ole in/out threads have we had this season? just posters pointing at the opposite group when the timing is theirs.
If we lose the next game, the Ole out will be out. If we win the next game, the I-told-you's will be out.
They seem to be making the other Ole threads theirs as well.
 

Eriku

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They’re culpable in different ways. It’s not that simple. For example things like Pogba giving away a penalty at arsenal, or Maguire tackling Shaw against Spurs, these are down to the players. Individual moments of error are down to them. When the team as a whole looks like they don’t know what they’re doing going forward, or the entire defense looks like they have no sort of idea where they should be, that’s on the manager.
Ole-outers can just cite "moments of individual brilliance" saving the day. You had some people saying that after Everton, even though two of our goals were the longest sequences of passing leading to a goal in the EPL this season.
 
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Ole-outers can just cite "moments of individual brilliance" saving the day. You had some people saying that after Everton, even though two of our goals were the longest sequences of passing leading to a goal in the EPL this season.
I don’t quite understand that argument. When weren’t you able to give credit to a team winning through a player scoring a brilliant individual goal?
 

Wedge

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Name and shame then ban, the caf has gangrene we need to cut off the foot to save the rest of the body or something.
 

tomaldinho1

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Ole-outers can just cite "moments of individual brilliance" saving the day. You had some people saying that after Everton, even though two of our goals were the longest sequences of passing leading to a goal in the EPL this season.
Those people are idiots though, there are some proper dunces on both sides.
Bruno's headed goal in particular I liked because we as a team really struggle for those types of goal usually. The second was a nice passage although obviously it was a cross, not shot from Bruno and the third is what we've always been class at. Was a good mix of goals and not just a case of winning a penalty/scoring a scruffy goal and then sitting back to counter. We went behind and dug ourselves out.
 

Eriku

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I don’t quite understand that argument. When weren’t you able to give credit to a team winning through a player scoring a brilliant individual goal?
If we need a crazy solo run or long shot to save the day, and we can’t get our goals through patterns of play that reliably get us chances, then we have players winning in spite of what Ole does. Or so the reasoning goes.
 

ThatsGreat

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Apparently in some people's mind, there's a clear cut definition of a "True Fan". That includes to NEVER want your team lose, for whatever reason. Not even for the bigger picture reasoning. I think it's pretty narrow minded definition. There's always exception to the rule.
Exactly. True fans is someone who thinks for the long term.
It only makes any kind of sense if you can be certain you will be better in the long term.

As it is it's just their opinion that we'll be brilliant straight away under Poch with barely any basis for it. Just like you are barely any better under Arteta.
Yes, you might not be better under Poch. Or you might be much better under him. Neither viewpoints have any right to think that theirs is the only correct opinion. If someone has come to the conclusion that the best interests of Utd are not served with Ole in the long term, then they have every right to hope that the individuals in the team don't bail the manager out.
 

Dr. StrangeHate

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Unsurprisingly a lot of fans were just supporting United for the trophies.

For their own mental health they should just stop posting and move to another team. United are clearly making them miserable.
We haven't won a significant Trophy other than the Europa League since Fergie. There are no more glory hunters left.
 

romufc

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Ole-outers can just cite "moments of individual brilliance" saving the day. You had some people saying that after Everton, even though two of our goals were the longest sequences of passing leading to a goal in the EPL this season.
I have heard this so much, I just cannot understand it. It is clear that we have a pattern of play which comes down the left. Most our goals come down the left because thats how we play, the close interchanges between Shaw and the forwards.

The one thing that really annoys me is when Ole puts out a line up like Saturday, we have better fight, better balance and some fans keep saying "Why cant Donny play instead of McTominay" he is better. Well Donny played DM in Istanbul and we were left open.. thats why he cannot play there.

Then, when we play Donny, Pogba, Bruno and we score goals like V Newcastle, "Good players can play with each other and score good goals" but when we play like we did V Arsenal.. The manager needs to find a system to play them.

Ole cannot win with certain fans. I just think the Ole out agenda is so far that people have forgotten to understand football.

I am not Ole in, I prefer to see the reasoning behind his decisions.
 

Tom Cato

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Ole-outers can just cite "moments of individual brilliance" saving the day. You had some people saying that after Everton, even though two of our goals were the longest sequences of passing leading to a goal in the EPL this season.
Apart from positioning, everything that happens on the pitch ARE moments of individualism.
 

el3mel

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We haven't won a significant Trophy other than the Europa League since Fergie. There are no more glory hunters left.
Some people seem to not realize it. We are now longer a team who has fans because it wins a lot. We are more like Arsenal now, usually a laughing stock for the neutrals whenever we lose.
 
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We haven't won a significant Trophy other than the Europa League since Fergie. There are no more glory hunters left.
we’ve won the FA Cup, which is far more significant (in my opinion ) than the europa league and also the League Cup. The charity shield doesn’t count though (Jose...).
 

RedDevil@84

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Another "true fan" thread. Fans want team to lose to get a manager fired, or lose so that you don't want team to play Thursdays, or lose in cups so that team will be fresh for PL campaign etc etc.
Just the reason changes as and how it chooses.

I cannot go into a match wanting my team to lose. Even if I say it, I won't be able to watch a game and clap when other team scores.
But I can understand if someone can do that.
 

glazed

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If Ole gets top 4 this season with the way other teams strengthened then I think he’s earned himself another year to mount a title challenge.

if the glazers fail to back him properly (or Woodward fails to get him the players he needs) should he achieve consecutive champs league qualification then I think that’s probably as damning an indictment of our club as anything over the last seven years.
It's not that I find this unfair or unreasonable. But the reality is that we know the Glazers won't back him and we know the kind of structural reforms needed and we know why they won't happen. So it's all a bit parallel universe imho
 

KennyBurner

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This thread is so funny because the OP makes it seem like Fans have not always been toxic. Its just an excuse to make another pointless thread. Get over it! Negativity is basic human nature. It doesn't help when after so many years and we still look stranded in the wilderness.

Let fans be toxic in peace.
 

KennyBurner

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It's not that I find this unfair or unreasonable. But the reality is that we know the Glazers won't back him and we know the kind of structural reforms needed and we know why they won't happen. So it's all a bit parallel universe imho
Its hard to say a manager hasnt been backed when he gave the go ahead to secure an average defender for 80 million. Most of the fanbase is so far from reality that they actually believe United haven't tried to compete in the market. Misuse of resources is down to Woodward, Ole and all the other useless managerial appointments not the Glazers.
 

2mufc0

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Amerifan

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This thread is so funny because the OP makes it seem like Fans have not always been toxic. Its just an excuse to make another pointless thread. Get over it! Negativity is basic human nature. It doesn't help when after so many years and we still look stranded in the wilderness.

Let fans be toxic in peace.
It’s more the other way around. Folks come here to enjoy something but have to put up with toxic whiners, some of whom apparently hate *everything* about the club except the name. Whining is like a second job for them. Football should be fun. If they aren’t having fun, what are they doing here. Find something enjoyable to spend their free time on and give the rest of us a break.
 

Ludens the Red

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Its hard to say a manager hasnt been backed when he gave the go ahead to secure an average defender for 80 million. Most of the fanbase is so far from reality that they actually believe United haven't tried to compete in the market. Misuse of resources is down to Woodward, Ole and all the other useless managerial appointments not the Glazers.
Yuh, the theory is the managers are never backed by Woodward etc. The actual problem is they over back them financially at first and then subsequently pull out from backing them the next summer. That is why they are so shit, did the same things with van Gaal and Mourinho, allowed them to bring into many of their own choices and then decided to pull the plug, it’s such a bizarre way of working.
Similarly inconsistent decision making can be seen when they hired Ole. The caretaker appointment was a wise decision which they then ruined by making it permanent.
 

Roane

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Those people are idiots though, there are some proper dunces on both sides.
Bruno's headed goal in particular I liked because we as a team really struggle for those types of goal usually. The second was a nice passage although obviously it was a cross, not shot from Bruno and the third is what we've always been class at. Was a good mix of goals and not just a case of winning a penalty/scoring a scruffy goal and then sitting back to counter. We went behind and dug ourselves out.

The second goal by Bruno was "made" by Rashford actually being in the box and leading to the cross and importantly putting of Pickford whose first reaction was to go where Rashford would have headed it.

This is key in how we have been lately. We haven't done this enough. Even our penalties show the panic our players cause in the box and I for one want to see more runs into the opposition box.
 

RedDevilCanuck

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Wow, some really precious snowflakes around. Let's talk about our hurt feelings.

How anyone can get so worked up over differing opinions or random statements by a total stranger, in a DISCUSSION forum no less, really is beyond me. The problem seems to be that in 2020, noone really wants discussion anymore. It's just about throwing a statement out there and reveling in a shower of agreement. Thanks Twitter et al.

Everybody who disagrees is wrong, 'pathetic', 'disgraceful' - an enemy basically. That's why threads like Ole out are just a rehash of the same 4-5 arguments for almost two years now. People just don't really want to listen to each other, all they want is to be right. OP is basically the same, throwing out his opinion on 'how to be a proper fan' and hoping for the sweet sweet online appreciation.

I'm afraid that's just the time we're in, everything has to be black or white, there's less and less room in between and disagreeing is more and more seen as an insult - which in turn leads to real insults, more hurt feelings and an even lower tolerance for differing opinions. But this too shall pass. Until then, try to at least not take everything oh so seriously :)

Also, please refrain from telling people how they should support their club. It's insulting and frankly, that's something I find 'disgraceful'. On the other hand, I don't really care, it's the internet after all and I could be a dog for all you know.
Well said.
 

Rightnr

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Wow, some really precious snowflakes around. Let's talk about our hurt feelings.

How anyone can get so worked up over differing opinions or random statements by a total stranger, in a DISCUSSION forum no less, really is beyond me. The problem seems to be that in 2020, noone really wants discussion anymore. It's just about throwing a statement out there and reveling in a shower of agreement. Thanks Twitter et al.

Everybody who disagrees is wrong, 'pathetic', 'disgraceful' - an enemy basically. That's why threads like Ole out are just a rehash of the same 4-5 arguments for almost two years now. People just don't really want to listen to each other, all they want is to be right. OP is basically the same, throwing out his opinion on 'how to be a proper fan' and hoping for the sweet sweet online appreciation.

I'm afraid that's just the time we're in, everything has to be black or white, there's less and less room in between and disagreeing is more and more seen as an insult - which in turn leads to real insults, more hurt feelings and an even lower tolerance for differing opinions. But this too shall pass. Until then, try to at least not take everything oh so seriously :)

Also, please refrain from telling people how they should support their club. It's insulting and frankly, that's something I find 'disgraceful'. On the other hand, I don't really care, it's the internet after all and I could be a dog for all you know.
Spot on. OP doesnt' even realise the irony of making this thread.
 

McTerminator

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It's not that I find this unfair or unreasonable. But the reality is that we know the Glazers won't back him and we know the kind of structural reforms needed and we know why they won't happen. So it's all a bit parallel universe imho
I can agree with that.

However, if we assume no manager will get backed properly, then Ole's transfer business and his track record with bringing youth through, on top of the fact that he genuinely cares for the club surely puts Ole ahead of most, despite current inconsistencies?
 

glazed

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Misuse of resources is down to Woodward, Ole and all the other useless managerial appointments not the Glazers.
Is it though? Or is that signings have consistently been done for non-footballing reasons? Like resale value. Like marketing value.

I can agree with that.

However, if we assume no manager will get backed properly, then Ole's transfer business and his track record with bringing youth through, on top of the fact that he genuinely cares for the club surely puts Ole ahead of most, despite current inconsistencies?
Well yes. Except he was only given the job in the first place because his popularity with the fans acted as a lightning conductor shielding Ed form criticism. No one can seriously claim he was appointed on merit.
 

RedDevil@84

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Misuse of resources is down to Woodward, Ole and all the other useless managerial appointments not the Glazers.
One would assume such an incompetent CEO would have been fired by the owners, unless of course they thought he is doing a good job or what they are asking him to do.
 

KennyBurner

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Yuh, the theory is the managers are never backed by Woodward etc. The actual problem is they over back them financially at first and then subsequently pull out from backing them the next summer. That is why they are so shit, did the same things with van Gaal and Mourinho, allowed them to bring into many of their own choices and then decided to pull the plug, it’s such a bizarre way of working.
Similarly inconsistent decision making can be seen when they hired Ole. The caretaker appointment was a wise decision which they then ruined by making it permanent.
Its why I split the blame between Woodward and Ole. The reality is that we are always willing to spend. The problem is that we have done an awful job spending the money.

There were many of us against the transfer of Maguire. It didn't make sense spending that money just because we are United and we needed a supposedly WC centerback. A year later and Im positive 90% of the forum would not have wanted us to go through with the transfer. Its decisions like this that justify the negativity.

Im a big supporter of Woodward just because he is willing to spend on transfers but even I know he needs to go along with Ole. We are just ahead of Barcelona for the worst managed club in the world. Not just because we overspend on targets but also because our footballing department/culture is similar to that of a Championship side. How is it possible nobody at the club after 5+ years has identified our biggest problem is we lack a right winger? That question alone justifies all the negativity.

I will never wish United lose a game. Those sort of comments should remain on twitter but I dont mind the Ole out comments weekly. We have seen more than enough to know he cant take us any further.
 

norm87cro

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I have my own opinion about lots of important issues at United (Glazers, OGS, Pogba, our defence etc.) but at no point do I want this beloved club to lose a game ever.
 

MackRobinson

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Wow, some really precious snowflakes around. Let's talk about our hurt feelings.

How anyone can get so worked up over differing opinions or random statements by a total stranger, in a DISCUSSION forum no less, really is beyond me. The problem seems to be that in 2020, noone really wants discussion anymore. It's just about throwing a statement out there and reveling in a shower of agreement. Thanks Twitter et al.

Everybody who disagrees is wrong, 'pathetic', 'disgraceful' - an enemy basically. That's why threads like Ole out are just a rehash of the same 4-5 arguments for almost two years now. People just don't really want to listen to each other, all they want is to be right. OP is basically the same, throwing out his opinion on 'how to be a proper fan' and hoping for the sweet sweet online appreciation.

I'm afraid that's just the time we're in, everything has to be black or white, there's less and less room in between and disagreeing is more and more seen as an insult - which in turn leads to real insults, more hurt feelings and an even lower tolerance for differing opinions. But this too shall pass. Until then, try to at least not take everything oh so seriously :)

Also, please refrain from telling people how they should support their club. It's insulting and frankly, that's something I find 'disgraceful'. On the other hand, I don't really care, it's the internet after all and I could be a dog for all you know.
That would be a great response if it had anything to do with what the OP was talking about.

Right I understand when we have a bad result all the Ole out are in sticking the boot in and vice versa when we have a good result.

I’ll start by saying I think he isn’t the right manager and feel we should get rid but I was happy with the performance today and delighted with the result yet on my break in work earlier I wasn’t logged in and was reading posts and it seems a lot where upset that we won because Ole kept his job.

Remember at the end of the day players, legends owners etc don’t matter you support the club and want them to do well, yes I know what people where thinking if we lose it might be better long term but I have never wanted United to lose and never will.

Im sorry I had to make a thread but I feel it’s a big problem here. Yes everyone loves Ole and him performing well would see everyone happy and I’m sure everyone wants him as our manager winning trophies.

But you support Manchester United so remember that I can’t believe some weren’t happy with the win(I know it’s a small minority) but still.
The OP was pretty clear in what he was trying to communicate. You and others who want to jump on him b/c you're too proud to confront the absurdity of a fan rooting against his own team should stop listening to the sound of their own voice. The complete spin-doctoring is on par with Breitbart.
 

tomaldinho1

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The second goal by Bruno was "made" by Rashford actually being in the box and leading to the cross and importantly putting of Pickford whose first reaction was to go where Rashford would have headed it.

This is key in how we have been lately. We haven't done this enough. Even our penalties show the panic our players cause in the box and I for one want to see more runs into the opposition box.
Yh sure, I wasn't saying anything different. Just really nice to see a CM getting a headed goal, must be a collectors item for us.
 

Roane

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Yh sure, I wasn't saying anything different. Just really nice to see a CM getting a headed goal, must be a collectors item for us.

Yeah I was more reinforcing that movement and runs from our forwards can create all sorts of issues that would be beneficial and that we don't see this enough.

I agree with you basically