Manchester tier 3 - no fans allowed. London and Liverpool Tier 2 and can have fans.

Doesn't matter if you can't shout and chant, going to games is a relief for many outside of work etc.

Those who have been/still are key workers, going to a game will be a welcome break for them. Maybe those clubs that can have fans, should give key workers priority.

pascell said:

Doesn't matter if you can't shout and chant, going to games is a relief for many outside of work etc.

Those who have been/still are key workers, going to a game will be a welcome break for them. Maybe those clubs that can have fans, should give key workers priority.

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Great idea.

The Cat said:

So that's 2 seasons in a row with an asterisk attached.

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Yep, I don`t see how anyone can think it is fair for some to have fans and others not.

Ekeke said:

Once again speak for your own area

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I can speak for every area. There's good and bad everywhere and in every region.

up here in Aberdeen we had a trail game with fans back in September. Set of rules were posted on the do’s and don’ts

300 fans got in all season ticket holders

all in one stand with all spread out

all had to enter at different times into the ground

masks were to be worn while remaining in your seat

no shouting or singing allowed

was no food Stalls open

once game was over you needed to wait for stewards to advise you to leave going by row you were in

TrueRed1999 said:

Lets be clear this is a POLITICAL decision due to the Mayor of Manchester calling out the corrupt tory government and fair play to him least some one is trying to stick up for the North, and football 2000 fans won't make a pinch of a difference to top club incomes I would say it is even more against those who desperately who are just trying to survive, they need fans more than the likes of the Scousers and the rest.

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Burnham is as corrupt/incompetent* as the rest of the political pyramid, they're only in it to see what they can get for themselves (all parties and political hues).


* delete as appropriate.

Wedge said:

I feel this payback for the mayor of Manchester pushing back against boris.

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Serves him right for being a prick.

So I’ve just read that the north west actually has the lowest R number and growth rate in the entire country. Do we still blame it on the people in the area?

romufc said:

Tell that to Manutd players when they play away games and there is 2000 away fans.. ask the players if that makes a difference?

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Are you talking about 2000 fans packed into a corner, manage to make some noise, or 2000 fans spread over a 60K stadium?

You are comparing winning a lottery of 1m, Vs 1m lottery pay off over 10000 years.

Can't fathom why fans should be allowed in (no matter the number) when there are still considerable number of active cases around.

We just had 28-days straight of zero case days here in Melbourne, Australia, and that was after over 100 days of relatively strict lockdown.

Even now, I doubt our state government would permit any outdoor/indoor gatherings of that scale (i.e. 2000) just because of the precariousness of the entire situation. All it takes is one infected person to cause another community outbreak/cluster.

Beyond that, it does also attribute unfair advantage to teams who are allowed small crowds. I'd assume that the psychological advantage of having any number of fans in the stadium does wonders in terms of individual confidence and drive - you are playing for people who have come to watch the game in person. That makes a difference.

The only reason why pool can have fans is because if you dont let them that will instead cause more of their fans to flood the stadium in protest and of course more online petitions.

Moorie86 said:

up here in Aberdeen we had a trail game with fans back in September. Set of rules were posted on the do’s and don’ts

300 fans got in all season ticket holders

all in one stand with all spread out

all had to enter at different times into the ground

masks were to be worn while remaining in your seat

no shouting or singing allowed

was no food Stalls open

once game was over you needed to wait for stewards to advise you to leave going by row you were in

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Brighton experimented with same idea in a friendly against Chelsea with 2500 allowed into the ground at the end of August, it was meant to be a trial for the rest of the league, but then the second wave happened.

RonaldoVII said:

Will clubs even want just 2000 fans in? Surely that can't be profitable.

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Some income is better than none considering they're already paying all their staffs even without any fans.

DRJosh said:

Can't fathom why fans should be allowed in (no matter the number) when there are still considerable number of active cases around.

We just had 28-days straight of zero case days here in Melbourne, Australia, and that was after over 100 days of relatively strict lockdown.

Even now, I doubt our state government would permit any outdoor/indoor gatherings of that scale (i.e. 2000) just because of the precariousness of the entire situation. All it takes is one infected person to cause another community outbreak/cluster.

Beyond that, it does also attribute unfair advantage to teams who are allowed small crowds. I'd assume that the psychological advantage of having any number of fans in the stadium does wonders in terms of individual confidence and drive - you are playing for people who have come to watch the game in person. That makes a difference.

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You have a Government that cares about its citizens more than £$€ unlike UK

SER19 said:

Of course 2000 fans, especially now, will make a difference.

its an unfair advantage to have and saying so doesn’t mean you think there’s a ‘conspiracy’, it’s just clearly unfair. the difference playing in a dead stadium like we’ve been watching and having 2000 supporters is massive as any person who’s ever been to a non league game can attest.

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2000 fans that are not allowed make noise will not make a difference in stadiums like OT and the other large grounds. It will be hard to even spot them.

djembatheking said:

Yep, I don`t see how anyone can think it is fair for some to have fans and others not.

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Well, the alternative would be to not re-open any stadiums until the whole country is safe enough. Corona measures aren't fair, and cannot be, and shouldn't be - they have to reflect the epidemiological situation.

Maticmaker said:

No, its good old fashioned politics,. Burnham sat up and begged for it, he wanted to show he could face down Boris, but lost out and now we all (in Manchester)got it right in the kisser instead. Well done Andy champion of the people my a**e!

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So what you are saying is that nobody should ever call out the PM on his policies and if they do it is right and proper for said PM to punish everybody in their area, Greater Manchester in this case, disproportionately because somebody dared to disagree with him.

This is the type of thing you hear being done in a dictatorship and it's not something that I would want to be seen as acceptable in our country.

McGrathsipan said:

2000 fans that are not allowed make noise will not make a difference in stadiums like OT and the other large grounds. It will be hard to even spot them.

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They absolutely will. The very fact that there'll be a buzz about the 'return of fans' gives home teams an edge. Instead of dealing in mine or your gut feelings and speculations the sane thing to do is what any reasonable competition does and apply the same rules for all. It's madness not to.

McGrathsipan said:

2000 fans that are not allowed make noise will not make a difference in stadiums like OT and the other large grounds. It will be hard to even spot them.

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Not true. Would make a massive different and you’d easily spot 200 fans never mind 2000 when there’s nobody else there.

philipos said:

Will 2000 fans really make that much difference?

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Yes

DRJosh said:

Can't fathom why fans should be allowed in (no matter the number) when there are still considerable number of active cases around.

We just had 28-days straight of zero case days here in Melbourne, Australia, and that was after over 100 days of relatively strict lockdown.

Even now, I doubt our state government would permit any outdoor/indoor gatherings of that scale (i.e. 2000) just because of the precariousness of the entire situation. All it takes is one infected person to cause another community outbreak/cluster.

Beyond that, it does also attribute unfair advantage to teams who are allowed small crowds. I'd assume that the psychological advantage of having any number of fans in the stadium does wonders in terms of individual confidence and drive - you are playing for people who have come to watch the game in person. That makes a difference.

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How many spectators were allowed in yesterday's India vs Australia cricket match in Sydney? I didn't get to watch the match but it had been advertised over here in India that fans were returning for this series. Is Sydney further along than Melbourne in number of days without cases? Seeing as how apparently fans were allowed in there but you say they wouldn't be in Melbourne.

King7Eric said:

How many spectators were allowed in yesterday's India vs Australia cricket match in Sydney? I didn't get to watch the match but it had been advertised over here in India that fans were returning for this series. Is Sydney further along than Melbourne in number of days without cases? Seeing as how apparently fans were allowed in there but you say they wouldn't be in Melbourne.

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We had a horrid second wave in Melbourne due to a lapse in hotel quarantine measures back in July. Since then our state government has employed an aggressive suppression strategy that comprised of lockdowns and curfews. We’ve since had 28 days of zero cases (whilst being almost fully open) but continue to have measures in place on crowd sizes and mandatory indoor mask wearing measures in cafes etc

we’re doing better than Sydney now but they aren’t that far behind.

Moorie86 said:

up here in Aberdeen we had a trail game with fans back in September. Set of rules were posted on the do’s and don’ts

300 fans got in all season ticket holders

all in one stand with all spread out

all had to enter at different times into the ground

masks were to be worn while remaining in your seat

no shouting or singing allowed

was no food Stalls open

once game was over you needed to wait for stewards to advise you to leave going by row you were in

Click to expand...

Sounds like the fooking hunger games.

I'm sorry but who the feck would pay to go to a socially distanced match at a EPL stadium? It'd be awful. Sat on your larry, nothing to drink, no singing and no mixing with anyone else there. Sure it's good to be able to see the whole game happen, but for the amount it would cost? Not a chance. No atmosphere, no point.

Fully Fledged said:

This is the type of thing you hear being done in a dictatorship and it's not something that I would want to be seen as acceptable in our country.

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I'm afraid its been going on for years in this country, especially when one side has a large majority in Parliament.

Labour did it with banning of Fox hunting, as 'payback' to Tory (the 'Shires' mainly, Fox hunting communities) for the handling of the second miners strike, that devastated mining communities.
Lots of political 'payback' goes on, out of sight and sound mostly, but when you can deliver a public humiliation to your opponents it makes the revenge sweeter.
Of course we like to think our political masters wouldn't stoop to these methods, but I'm afraid they do, it also goes on within political parties, especially when a Government gets things wrong, certain 'nuisance' ministers find they become the whipping boys and are sent to the back benches... all part of the rich tapestry of party political life in the UK, its gets much worse elsewhere... as you have already mentioned!

Maticmaker said:

I'm afraid its been going on for years in this country, especially when one side has a large majority in Parliament.

Labour did it with banning of Fox hunting, as 'payback' to Tory (the 'Shires' mainly, Fox hunting communities) for the handling of the second miners strike, that devastated mining communities.
Lots of political 'payback' goes on, out of sight and sound mostly, but when you can deliver a public humiliation to your opponents it makes the revenge sweeter.
Of course we like to think our political masters wouldn't stoop to these methods, but I'm afraid they do, it also goes on within political parties, especially when a Government gets things wrong, certain 'nuisance' ministers find they become the whipping boys and are sent to the back benches... all part of the rich tapestry of party political life in the UK, its gets much worse elsewhere... as you have already mentioned!

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So many words to push the usual 'they're all at it' bollocks defence.

Maticmaker said:

No, its good old fashioned politics,. Burnham sat up and begged for it, he wanted to show he could face down Boris, but lost out and now we all (in Manchester)got it right in the kisser instead. Well done Andy champion of the people my a**e!

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Burnham did the right thing by sticking up for the people of the North. He can’t help it if Bojo is a vindictive cnut...

Nou_Camp99 said:

If the North had the lowest rates and lowest hospital admissions and it was the South mainly in tier 3.....do you think theyd be allowing fans in the North but not the South? Yeah me neither.

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This!!!

If we let fans back in we'll probably start playing badly again so we should barricade the gates and preempt that.

Sounds like a Professional league with lots of integrity and moral. Letting some teams have fans supporting them in the stadium and some teams not, where is the logic? Same rule should apply to everyone, none of this Tier stuff.

groovyalbert said:

I'm sorry but who the feck would pay to go to a socially distanced match at a EPL stadium? It'd be awful. Sat on your larry, nothing to drink, no singing and no mixing with anyone else there. Sure it's good to be able to see the whole game happen, but for the amount it would cost? Not a chance. No atmosphere, no point.

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It'd be nice to do something different compared to what we've been doing since bloody March, even if it would not be the same as what we're used to. I'd pay for sure.

Pagh Wraith said:

I'm happy for every club that can have fans back in the stadium and for every single fan who can attend. Don't understand this "I want everyone else to have it as bad as me" attitude that has come to the surface during Corona times. Plus 2000 or 4000 will not make much of a difference.

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I don’t think it’s a case of wanting everyone else to have it as bad. It’s about a level playing field for everyone in a competition. It’s like giving home teams that aren’t allowed fans a slightly smaller goal than the opposition...we wouldn’t do that because it’s also an unfair advantage. (...but it’s only an extra inch or two missus fnar etc...)

DevilRed said:

Sounds like the fooking hunger games.

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Haha, yeah sounds like someone in charge of the rules was on a proper power trip...

Camilo said:

Perfect, our victim mentality fanbase have a perfect excuse for our shitness now.

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What the fook is this all about...!?

Covid doesn’t exist in parts of southern England so I’m really not surprised by this. Meanwhile, smaller clubs in more rural parts of the country are being left to fester and die.

I’m pleased for the fans that can go, mind. Good on them. I don’t give a shit about the ‘fairness’ argument either. It’s probably unfair that United get 76,000 through the gate every week, too. Others don’t. It’s just the way it is.

Maticmaker said:

I'm afraid its been going on for years in this country, especially when one side has a large majority in Parliament.

Labour did it with banning of Fox hunting, as 'payback' to Tory (the 'Shires' mainly, Fox hunting communities) for the handling of the second miners strike, that devastated mining communities.
Lots of political 'payback' goes on, out of sight and sound mostly, but when you can deliver a public humiliation to your opponents it makes the revenge sweeter.
Of course we like to think our political masters wouldn't stoop to these methods, but I'm afraid they do, it also goes on within political parties, especially when a Government gets things wrong, certain 'nuisance' ministers find they become the whipping boys and are sent to the back benches... all part of the rich tapestry of party political life in the UK, its gets much worse elsewhere... as you have already mentioned!

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So that had nothing to do with fox hunting being barbaric? If you need to cull the fox population use poison, shoot or trap them but watching dogs rip them to pieces is not and should never be a sport.

Fully Fledged said:

So that had nothing to do with fox hunting being barbaric? If you need to cull the fox population use poison, shoot or trap them but watching dogs rip them to pieces is not and should never be a sport.

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Of course it did, the point I am making is that for many Tories in the Shire Countys' Fox Hunting was part of their community and had been for years, just as Mining had been at the heart of many Labour communities.

When the Tories started in on the miners, it wasn't just about reforming a bloated Nationalised industry that had been at the heart of the first miners strike, the second round was political, about decimating hardened Labour communities, places where as the saying went, they didn't count the Labour vote they weighed it!
Then the next Labour government, who some might argue had better things to do with the Parliamentary time, made time to start in on taking down Fox hunting. It is true there were and had been for a while, many objections to Fox hunting, both vocal and via demonstrations etc. but remember this so called 'sport ' had been going on for years under previous Labour Governments, but no attempt to make it illegal had been taken.

I am not suggesting any government would simply take action just to start a fight or just to get even, but when in Government you get to choose the order of business, set the agenda, etc. especially with a whopping majority it is inevitable a Government will seek /choose those matters which need to be done, but will also give the opposition a 'bloody-nose'. It is in the nature of 'combative politics', especially in a two party set up.

Would 2000 fans be enough to suck the ball in?

A Virus so deadly the MP's had a vote to what tier we go into but that's another story, if the PL allows fans to some games and not others then feck them as it's a mockery of the sport!!!!

Theres a far bigger picture at stake than some equality in the PL... if we just continue to delay marginal moves to normality on competition equality rules, it'll take forever.