Really? Like what? They’re commonly used among circles of friends?
FA to investigate Edinson Cavani | This thread is taking a break
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Yes it would have because in English it’s more clear cut, he’s a Spanish speaker though. I don’t know how many languages there are in the world but I do know that every single one of them have their own nuances. Cavani is a Spanish speaker so the comment needs to be investigated in regard to that context. Would be a completely different story had Harry Kane posted that.
That Bernardo Silva one was a banter, where to the outsider, it does sound "offensive". Just the common nature of banter.
This Cavani's though. Unless he knows the other person he replied to personally, there's no reason to do "banter" and went with offensive way.
This Cavani's though. Unless he knows the other person he replied to personally, there's no reason to do "banter" and went with offensive way.
I fully agree
The test would be if you had a friend that was, in fact, Jewish. Would you still use the same language and tell him/her to “stop being such a Jew”?
Think about it is all I ask.
You’ve missed this one totally
What? i was talking about context, as it does actually matter.
Yes and you missed it. No banter involved with Cavani and also no offence
As for Bernado I think that one has been done already
He basically wrote the equivalent of "thanks mate", absolutely nothing in it. He could have easily written "gracias guacho", which means and communicates the same but the literal translation is "thanks orphan" and could be deemed offensive to orphans all across the world. We don't have a word for mate/matey (saying amigo/friend is more common in the tropics, not down here), we indistinctly use terms like guacho (orphan), papo (daddy), nene (kiddo), or the nickname, which in this case happened to be negrito.
That he is working in a country where PC has gone mad and beyond will only be too clear to him by now, seeing as he deleted the post. I would expect him to say something along the lines of being sorry if anyone was offended and move on swiftly, but knowing the English press they won't let go and it will start doing his head in. My hope is he knows full well they are off their rocker from all the way back in South Africa and the Suarez handball incident, he should easily work out he will never really "get it".
Yes. I'm a Muslim and my mates always tell me to try a bit of crackled pork or bacon as a joke. I know it's a joke and I find it hilarious.
It's about not being so uptight and taking everything so personally. It's for a laugh
At the very least you're promoting an antisemitic trope. You're wrong to use that. It's far from the subject of the thread though.
I'll be absolutely amazed if he doesnt end up with a 3 game ban for that.
Context will be deemed irrelevant because that's the age we're living in.
Context will be deemed irrelevant because that's the age we're living in.
What has eating pork as a Muslim when its clear Muslims are not supposed to (so yes I see the joke) Got to do with a false representation of Jewish people as stingy?
In a few words, the english are going to tell him that saying negro is racist and in the process they will shat in the latin american culture
One is commonly used between UK Pakistani's, but much like the N word, I'd never refer to someone using that word.
If you're stuck for what words, go google it.
You really need to educate yourself on the history of antisemitism. It's idiotic to say it's just a laugh, or to equate a comment by your mate about you eating pork.
It was actually the Americans...
Well it might be not as idiotic as you make it. Picture that this has been the way him, his family, his neighbourghs use with each other to be kind, to show love. I absolutely not agains making this note and try to break down what appears to be normal but hides some very serious historic shame and guilt as racism is and has been. But you'd also need to know that there's absolutely no harm ment whatsoever in saying "negrito" to a friend of yours, more over if you love them or care for them.
You also feel a lot of proud of being able to recognize that Latin America is as Latin as it is African.
Gotta agree. And knowing what wankers they are, and this being a United player, pretty sure they'll "make an example" out of him. Sickening.
It can simultaneously be ok in South America and not ok in UK without either culture being 'shat on'.
It's just about trying to understand the customs of the country you are in. Which does take time when moving to a new country.
Context in use of language and culture are important here.
Though not deemed racist terms. We use the c word and others as terms of endearment in Ireland. I am not sure if it's the same in England, but I would assume there are similar ways of using certain words as such. Maybe to someone somewhere else that's going to seem offensive, if taken out of context.
If he uses it as a friendly term due to language/colloquialism. If that is how it is used to a friend in his home country, then it's absolutely stupid to be dragging it out as racist and be looking for a ban. This is how it seems.
If not, then ban away.
Though not deemed racist terms. We use the c word and others as terms of endearment in Ireland. I am not sure if it's the same in England, but I would assume there are similar ways of using certain words as such. Maybe to someone somewhere else that's going to seem offensive, if taken out of context.
If he uses it as a friendly term due to language/colloquialism. If that is how it is used to a friend in his home country, then it's absolutely stupid to be dragging it out as racist and be looking for a ban. This is how it seems.
If not, then ban away.
Do your friends tell you to stop being such a Muslim?
The only racists around are those who think he should be banned.
Deciding in their Anglo ivory tower what a South American can or cant say to his mates because they are the arbiter of language. What a joke.
Deciding in their Anglo ivory tower what a South American can or cant say to his mates because they are the arbiter of language. What a joke.
Cavani is not a racist. The comment wasn't either. It's banter.
Wasnt bernardo silvas tweet to his mate too. Why does that matter.
Interesting. Context and cultural norms are obviously different. The US and UK are diverse and are much more sensitive about racial issues. Latin American countries are not. It’s acceptable and common practice to call your darkest friend negrito, or the chubbiest one of the group gordito, or the one with the smallest eyes chinito, etc. Even in Peru when Fujimori was president he was often referred to as El Chinito even though he was Japanese.
If the person cavani said that to is a friend then it’s a nothing issue really. But obviously he now needs to learn it’s not accepted in England and needs to be careful.
This!
Yeah, it's a shame so many threads always seem to get overtaken with them, and are, ironically enough, always so very sensitive and over the top.
If he says it in person to his friend, then it's not an issue, once it goes on social media, it's going to blow out of all proportions.
That's his social media. It's his friend. You want to censor it because of english standard? To a non english speaking person?
This is an interesting happening to observe, and I will be very interested to see what the actual outcome of this.
On one hand, there are a fair few South Americans in here, including some Uruguayans, explaining that this term, and others similar to them, are indeed used as terms of endearment in their country. Speaking from my experience in a part of the world right next to South America, I can definitely confirm that we use a lot of terms among each other as friends, that might be considered offensive if someone were to just take the words at face value. It's clear that this was posted as something between Cavani and someone he considers a friend, and there's no sort of ill intent present at all, like there was with Suarez and Evra, for example. The culture in these places, in my home, etc., are very different to the US and the UK, and so the norms of language and how you speak to your friends is different.
On the other hand, Cavani doesn't live or work in Uruguay right now. He's in a country where that term is not used in an endearing way, but more often than not a racist one. You wouldn't see Maguire replying this to AWB, for example. Especially in light of recent happenings in England and around the world with respect to issues of racism being brought to light and spoken out against, broadly speaking it's not really the best thing to be posting on social media.
What it comes down to then, is how much should someone unfamiliar with a culture be expected to conform to the norms and values held up by the society that they find themselves in. Racism crosses the line into one of those territories that are not acceptable, and not something that should be tolerated just because someone is unfamiliar with a culture. There are places in the world where women are still treated as purely second class citizens, for example, but if someone from one of those places were to go somewhere else and still treated the women there in a derogatory way, there is no chance I would say that that is acceptable. Similarly, even if he's speaking to a friend in an affectionate way, hopefully he now understands that while he resides in England, he should stay away from using words like that in the public eye.
That being said, there should be some room to allow for the context of the situation to determine the outcome, and I do hope that he doesn't get any sort of severe ban, since this is very different from the Suarez situation.
On one hand, there are a fair few South Americans in here, including some Uruguayans, explaining that this term, and others similar to them, are indeed used as terms of endearment in their country. Speaking from my experience in a part of the world right next to South America, I can definitely confirm that we use a lot of terms among each other as friends, that might be considered offensive if someone were to just take the words at face value. It's clear that this was posted as something between Cavani and someone he considers a friend, and there's no sort of ill intent present at all, like there was with Suarez and Evra, for example. The culture in these places, in my home, etc., are very different to the US and the UK, and so the norms of language and how you speak to your friends is different.
On the other hand, Cavani doesn't live or work in Uruguay right now. He's in a country where that term is not used in an endearing way, but more often than not a racist one. You wouldn't see Maguire replying this to AWB, for example. Especially in light of recent happenings in England and around the world with respect to issues of racism being brought to light and spoken out against, broadly speaking it's not really the best thing to be posting on social media.
What it comes down to then, is how much should someone unfamiliar with a culture be expected to conform to the norms and values held up by the society that they find themselves in. Racism crosses the line into one of those territories that are not acceptable, and not something that should be tolerated just because someone is unfamiliar with a culture. There are places in the world where women are still treated as purely second class citizens, for example, but if someone from one of those places were to go somewhere else and still treated the women there in a derogatory way, there is no chance I would say that that is acceptable. Similarly, even if he's speaking to a friend in an affectionate way, hopefully he now understands that while he resides in England, he should stay away from using words like that in the public eye.
That being said, there should be some room to allow for the context of the situation to determine the outcome, and I do hope that he doesn't get any sort of severe ban, since this is very different from the Suarez situation.
The irony of this is those upset are no different from the actual racists who tell you that all immigrants have to adapt to our culture. Condemning him is just saying that he can’t speak his native tongue because a non-offensive word in his language is 2 letters off being an offensive word in another language.
and those saying the outrage is from the anti-PC crowd, really? Someone screenshoted his IG story for the express reason to say “look I found racism”.
Some common sense needs to be applied here, but I’m sure he’s going to get banned for this.
and those saying the outrage is from the anti-PC crowd, really? Someone screenshoted his IG story for the express reason to say “look I found racism”.
Some common sense needs to be applied here, but I’m sure he’s going to get banned for this.
So.... time to the club to ban all social media for our players? it’s fecking stupid is what it is, doesn’t serve any purpose other than to open yourself to insane shit like this.
Was just checking to see if anyone posted this.
Regardless, this was incredibly stupid, and someone should've had a word when he signed.
I don't think anyone in this thread has said he should be banned. People are just giving different views on the issue.
It's hardly controversial to state that the phrase is normal in one culture but not normal in a different culture.
I haven't read any posts that suggest people are upset or offended.
Just fairly nuanced points about how words and phrases can be normal in one culture and not normal in another culture. But you really need to try and adhere to the social norms of the country you're in (which takes time to learn and adapt to).
You would think he would have remembered the Suarez furore and been aware of what to say and not say.
He seems to be intelligent enough up to now
The problem is the scousers and press will try their hardest to compare this and the Suarez/Evra incident as like for like. When in reality, they are worlds apart.
Now he’s a match winner and looking like he could be an important player for us, they’ll come after him even harder.
Now he’s a match winner and looking like he could be an important player for us, they’ll come after him even harder.
Any culture where it's acceptable to refer to someone as a nickname by their skin color is in the wrong in my book. It was fine in English 100 years ago. It's not anymore. It's just not OK, in my opinion, to refer to someone by their skin color. I don't care if it's been engrained for a long time and it's a term of endearment. Bosnian has loads of casual things that are "harmless" but are actually slightly racist. It's just stuff that takes a while to move away from but once the world does, it's better for it.
Jesus...
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