Chelsea appoint Thomas Tuchel

Blackwidow

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Tuchel just has to get a tune out of Werner and Havertz, or at least definitely instill some confidence into Werner..... Get Pulisic back on song and he'll be on to something.
Will he do it? Who knows

Probably find Mount will play a little less now. As i think Tuchel seems someone who goes for experience over youth. Also wonder whether theyll give him any room to move in the last week of the window

EDIT: Expect Rudiger and Jorginho to play often, too
He was not very successful with Draxler at Paris. I am not sure if that the no. 10 types like Havertz are really his types of players. I think he prefers hardworking players more - that is why I think Mount is a type of players Tuchel will even like more...

Before you can profit of fast transistions and play more direct you have to work for it...
 

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Not a bad manager, so in that regard I think it’s a good move. That said, the sacking of Lampard is a bad move. Managers need to get more time, especially the young ones. I can’t understand why they even appointed him in the first place if his not given time :houllier:
 

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Ooh, harsh. I have my doubts as to Eddie's capability to run a big club but I certainly wouldn't want to see any fatalities.
In fairness, this is Roman we're talking about. He could certainly be capable of punishing failure in such a drastic manner.
 

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He was not very successful with Draxler at Paris. I am not sure if that the no. 10 types like Havertz are really his types of players. I think he prefers hardworking players more - that is why I think Mount is a type of players Tuchel will even like more...

Before you can profit of fast transistions and play more direct you have to work for it...
I feel like that's a bit of a tough example - are you really going to pick Draxler over Neymar, Mbappe, Di Maria, and Icardi? Maybe the latter but that'd require a change of system, because Mbappe is hardly the sort to lead a line - he's far more effective as an inside forward or in a pairing.

I'd also argue that for all his foibles this season, a lack of workrate can't be pinned on Havertz. He's been very diligent in his defending consistently, almost to a fault as it's hampered his ability to be an outlet at times. I'd not argue he's better out of possession than Mount, but compared to Draxler I'd say Havertz works considerably harder off the ball.
 

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If The Athletic are to be believed, he was very cliquey - he was not shy about making his favourites known and he'd neglect to talk to those outside that inner circle, to the point where those on the fringes felt they had no avenue back into the squad.

This seemed quite evident given his team selections at times - pushing CHO to the fringes while giving huge minutes to Pulisic has made zero sense on the basis of form. Hence many players feeling that the selection wasn't down to merit.
I find that quite surprising, it’s not necessarily what I would have expected from Lampard, or any younger manager to be honest. I’m guessing there’s some truth to it though, I feel it’s usually a case of no smoke without fire with these things.
 

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We have far too many happy clappers who just accept mediocre performances. The decision to remove Lampard was correct gives us a really good platform to build for the remainder of the season and hopefully set targets to challenge next season.

Last season was nothing short of miraculous. Lampard got the best out of a squad of mostly younger players including Kepa in goal. That’s enough for knighthood.

However when he has really been asked to step up and manage a good squad, he couldn’t stand the pressure and he has failed miserably against any decent team. As a lot have mentioned, Chelsea was a job too soon for Lampard. He needs to get more experience, develop his own style and stamp his authority. The pressure bowl of top end Premier League is not the place for Lampard right now.

I’d love to see him succeed though and he will be hurting right now but he needs to really work on his coaching and game management which really let him down at Chelsea. Always a legend.
 
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If The Athletic are to be believed, he was very cliquey - he was not shy about making his favourites known and he'd neglect to talk to those outside that inner circle, to the point where those on the fringes felt they had no avenue back into the squad.

This seemed quite evident given his team selections at times - pushing CHO to the fringes while giving huge minutes to Pulisic has made zero sense on the basis of form. Hence many players feeling that the selection wasn't down to merit.
Cant see how that’s the case, I mean who has been frozen out of the squad exactly?

From what I’ve seen he’s tried playing the new signings, they’ve been poor so he’s reverted back and forth to the players who performed well last season.

Stinks of players making excuses for seemingly downing tools.
 

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I find that quite surprising, it’s not necessarily what I would have expected from Lampard, or any younger manager to be honest. I’m guessing there’s some truth to it though, I feel it’s usually a case of no smoke without fire with these things.
Yeah it's definitely odd given how many years he spent learning from Mourinho and Ancelotti in particular - both definitively players' managers who could relate to their squad and would always have their backs. Some of Lampard's conduct in interviews this year has pointed towards more or less the opposite approach; he's been far to willing to throw his players under the bus for my taste. He seems a very prickly sort with a thin skin all things considered, so as you say I think it's a case of smoke where there's fire.
 

TheMagicFoolBus

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Cant see how that’s the case, I mean who has been frozen out of the squad exactly?

From what I’ve seen he’s tried playing the new signings, they’ve been poor so he’s reverted back and forth to the players who performed well last season.

Stinks of players making excuses for seemingly downing tools.
Well, Tomori for one. That whole situation has been bizarre.

Also there's no rational explanation for Pulisic playing over CHO recently, Jorginho playing instead of Gilmour, Rudiger playing over Zouma, Giroud over Abraham, etc. It's less the case that players are being frozen out completely (barring the likes of Alonso) but that they are not being coached properly & aren't being put into positions to succeed. I think there are very valid complaints about whether team selections have been merit-based.
 

Irwin99

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Hate it when clubs have that stupid new manager bounce. You watch them win 5 of their next six games or something like that :rolleyes: .

I think Chelsea have some very very good players in that squad. If they can sort themselves out and get a system that works they could be a tough team to face.
 

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Cant see how that’s the case, I mean who has been frozen out of the squad exactly?
Alonso is the only one where's the possibility of him being toxic.

Rudiger was benched for a while but still on the bench for most of the season (he's started 9 games).

He's not fancied Tomori at all this year but there's zero chance of him being a troublemaker.
 

ZolaWasMagic

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Cant see how that’s the case, I mean who has been frozen out of the squad exactly?

From what I’ve seen he’s tried playing the new signings, they’ve been poor so he’s reverted back and forth to the players who performed well last season.

Stinks of players making excuses for seemingly downing tools.
Alonso is one. Rudiger. Tomori. I reckon he isnt top of Giroud's party invitation list either.

But then you got the ones frozen out completely who may have been treated poorly. Drinkwater. Kepa. Jorginho to an extent. Rumours Kovacic wasnt a big fan, too.

The Athletic article suggests Lamps' man management is pretty poor.
 

ZolaWasMagic

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Well, Tomori for one. That whole situation has been bizarre.

Also there's no rational explanation for Pulisic playing over CHO recently, Jorginho playing instead of Gilmour, Rudiger playing over Zouma, Giroud over Abraham, etc. It's less the case that players are being frozen out completely (barring the likes of Alonso) but that they are not being coached properly & aren't being put into positions to succeed. I think there are very valid complaints about whether team selections have been merit-based.
Dont agree there. Right now, i still think Giroud is the best striker at the club.

Second bolded part, i totally agree. Giroud should have started so much more. And i think Mount has been a lucky boy with his minutes too. Started far too many games, and not always deserved.

I totally agree aswell, without question, Frank had his favourites
 

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I feel like that's a bit of a tough example - are you really going to pick Draxler over Neymar, Mbappe, Di Maria, and Icardi? Maybe the latter but that'd require a change of system, because Mbappe is hardly the sort to lead a line - he's far more effective as an inside forward or in a pairing.

I'd also argue that for all his foibles this season, a lack of workrate can't be pinned on Havertz. He's been very diligent in his defending consistently, almost to a fault as it's hampered his ability to be an outlet at times. I'd not argue he's better out of possession than Mount, but compared to Draxler I'd say Havertz works considerably harder off the ball.
Pressures per 90 minutes - Mount 20.1, successful 6.00 - Havertz 15.9, successful 3.47
Tacklings + Interceptions - Mount 3.88 - Havertz 2.24
 

duffer

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Alonso is one. Rudiger. Tomori. I reckon he isnt top of Giroud's party invitation list either.

But then you got the ones frozen out completely who may have been treated poorly. Drinkwater. Kepa. Jorginho to an extent. Rumours Kovacic wasnt a big fan, too.

The Athletic article suggests Lamps' man management is pretty poor.
Rudiger had been at least on the bench 22 out of 28 games this season. He's not been "frozen out of the squad". He lost his place to Zouma and Silva but he's been 3rd choice.

Alonso is the only one.
 

ZolaWasMagic

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Rudiger had been at least on the bench 22 out of 28 games this season. He's not been "frozen out of the squad".

Alonso is the only one.
not frozen out. But I could imagine him being outside this "clique" which the athletic seem to suggest was happening
 

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A trained monkey could win the French league with PSG. The club has so many billions that none of the other clubs can buy players who are just about as good as PSGs.
In Dortmund he won the DFB Cup, but otherwise nothing. I think it can be difficult for him in the Premier League where there are several rich clubs. The competition is insane and there is no monopoly on the championship as in the French league.
Then how do you explain Ancelotti (a manager who's raved about on this site) and Emery both failing to win woth PSG in their first season?
 

ZolaWasMagic

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On a side note, how the feck does that Rory Jennings represent Chelsea fans on social media? He's an absolute clown of the highest order
 

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Alonso is the only one where's the possibility of him being toxic.

Rudiger was benched for a while but still on the bench for most of the season (he's started 9 games).

He's not fancied Tomori at all this year but there's zero chance of him being a troublemaker.
Hmmm let's see how these players perform under a new manager.

I thought he won over last season's squad pretty quickly and made a decent job of it. You would expect him to be relatively good at man management to do that.

You have a big squad and I suspect every manager will have a few who they don't fancy.
 

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On a side note, how the feck does that Rory Jennings represent Chelsea fans on social media? He's an absolute clown of the highest order
He was on Eastenders once :lol:

In fairness we do have some decent YouTubers especially when you compare them to the characters Arsenal roll out especially.
 

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Dont agree there. Right now, i still think Giroud is the best striker at the club.

Second bolded part, i totally agree. Giroud should have started so much more. And i think Mount has been a lucky boy with his minutes too. Started far too many games, and not always deserved.

I totally agree aswell, without question, Frank had his favourites
I just think Giroud costs us so much when not in possession due to how immobile he is. And for me the issue with Mount is that Lampard is over-reliant on him and isn't managing his minutes properly; I'd argue he's been easily our best player this season on balance.
 

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On a side note, how the feck does that Rory Jennings represent Chelsea fans on social media? He's an absolute clown of the highest order
His xenophobic rants back when Sarri was around something to behold. Genuinely toxic He seemed pretty harmless before that, and relatively harmless since.
 

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Hmmm let's see how these players perform under a new manager.

I thought he won over last season's squad pretty quickly and made a decent job of it. You would expect him to be relatively good at man management to do that.

You have a big squad and I suspect every manager will have a few who they don't fancy.
I think a problem was we tried to offload some of those players in the summer and for whatever reason none of those moves materialised, and they had to stick around not playing any games, knowing the manager wants to sell them. The story today then was that Lampard hasn't even bothered to man manage them. I remember Gary Cahill complaining about being completely ignored by Sarri and that he had somewhat accepted he wasn't going to be picked but being totally blanked around the training grounds seemed disrespectful. The Athletic story seems to imply something along those lines with Lampard and the fringe players.
 

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Thought the word on Tomori was that he didn’t train well enough for Frank?
I've not read that and would be surprised if it's true. Tomori has been highly spoken of for his professionalism by Lampard, at Derby and at Chelsea.

He's just preferred the other centre back options.

Playing under Maldini at Milan will be a hell of an experience for him!
 

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I've not read that and would be surprised if it's true. Tomori has been highly spoken of for his professionalism by Lampard, at Derby and at Chelsea.

He's just preferred the other centre back options.

Playing under Maldini at Milan will be a hell of an experience for him!
I don't think he meant didn't train hard, just that Lampard didn't rate him compared to the other options based on training.

As a Canadian, we were desperate for him to pick us and join David and Davies in having 3 proper Champions League quality players (presuming Tomori gets there in a few years, he showed enough flashes last year for Chelsea that I think he probably will) after he played in youth tournaments, but always knew he might pick England and I think moved there quite young.
 

NoPace

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Alonso is one. Rudiger. Tomori. I reckon he isnt top of Giroud's party invitation list either.

But then you got the ones frozen out completely who may have been treated poorly. Drinkwater. Kepa. Jorginho to an extent. Rumours Kovacic wasnt a big fan, too.

The Athletic article suggests Lamps' man management is pretty poor.
Yeah, my take from reading it was that it seems like he might have been low maintenance as a player and also he grew up as the son of a pro, so had his own support system within the game, and maybe didn't have enough time to keep a large, rich squad together. Also didn't have one fixed way of playing which I think can make it easier for players to look for a move or change their games/bodies a bit to have an obvious way to fight for a spot as opposed to just being a bit aimless.

I've no idea what Tuchel will do, but I think their best case scenario is maybe the way Wenger had the invincibles set up with Havertz as Bergkmap, Werner in the Henry role, Ziyech as Pires and Pulisic as Ljungberg with Kante as the Vieira and they need a DM to be Gilberto/Petit which is why Lampard wanted Rice. He could also play with one of Pulisic or Ziyech on the right and no real left winger with Werner as a wide forward like we play Rashford, with Mount, Kovacic or another CM in the team to get a 3rd man in the midfield proper. Chilwell is good going forward so they could still have width from him.

My guess is Tuchel will immediately demand a hard bastard in midfield and a left-sided CB with more pace than Silva who plays there now.
 

shahzy

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We have far too many happy clappers who just accept mediocre performances. The decision to remove Lampard was correct gives us a really good platform to build for the remainder of the season and hopefully set targets to challenge next season.

Last season was nothing short of miraculous. Lampard got the best out of a squad of mostly younger players including Kepa in goal. That’s enough for knighthood.

However when he has really been asked to step up and manage a good squad, he couldn’t stand the pressure and he has failed miserably against any decent team. As a lot have mentioned, Chelsea was a job too soon for Lampard. He needs to get more experience, develop his own style and stamp his authority. The pressure bowl of top end Premier League is not the place for Lampard right now.

I’d love to see him succeed though and he will be hurting right now but he needs to really work on his coaching and game management which really let him down at Chelsea. Always a legend.
This is all good and well but the same could be said of Ole. He looked out of his depth last year, everyone was wanting him to be fired including myself. But somehow he has us in an around the top of the league. Which just goes to show progression isn't necessarily linear. It can look like you're going backwards and then suddenly it clicks. Lampard imo had shown he had a good idea of how to play attacking wise. Just his defensive coaching needed improvement which he can do. i think its premature. If you're going to go down the young manager route, you have to expect that there will be times when it looks like it cant get any worse before it gets better
 

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The Chelsea board must be bi-polar. They hired Frank because he was a young, up & coming manager who will learn along the way. So the first real wobble he has, they sack him?
Then why hire him to start with?
This. They are 5 points off 4th, still in the CL so its hardly a crisis. I get that they are doing worse than last season despite outspending everyone else this summer, but i still think its a weird call.

They are not BM or RM and acting like they are wont do any good in the long haul
 

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The Chelsea board must be bi-polar. They hired Frank because he was a young, up & coming manager who will learn along the way. So the first real wobble he has, they sack him?
Then why hire him to start with?
Well Tuchel is still only 47, 5 years older than Lampard but with much more experience. I think the timing is more about Chelsea being afraid of missing out on Tuchel (the fact that they have german players also played a part surely?) than how Lampard is doing this season.
 

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Lampard imo had shown he had a good idea of how to play attacking wise.
You say that but the reason our recent run wasn't even worse was because of Thiago Silva and Mendy.

Lampard did have a good attacking philosophy but when we but the wall this season he seemed to panic and revert to cross ball Moyes style.
 

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I am very worried about this appointment. Chelsea have a lot of attacking talent and could surge up the table. And as for Tuchel, his 2016-2017 Dortmund were the last great Dortmund side who had brilliant attacking play and had a points tally which would win the Bundesliga most years except that Pep's Bayern went even more supernova.

I hope journalists realise that Roman's Chelsea have never been about bringing youth players to the first team. All those articles praising Chelsea's 'youth movement' last year were nauseating. I was hoping they will let Lampard see out this season, but apparently Abramovich got very angry after the CIty and Leicester defeats. It is even more imperative that we don't lose our way this season.
 

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I am very worried about this appointment. Chelsea have a lot of attacking talent and could surge up the table. And as for Tuchel, his 2016-2017 Dortmund were the last great Dortmund side who had brilliant attacking play and had a points tally which would win the Bundesliga most years except that Pep's Bayern went even more supernova.

I hope journalists realise that Roman's Chelsea have never been about bringing youth players to the first team. All those articles praising Chelsea's 'youth movement' last year were nauseating. I was hoping they will let Lampard see out this season, but apparently Abramovich got very angry after the CIty and Leicester defeats. It is even more imperative that we don't lose our way this season.
15/16 season you mean, in the 16/17 season they came third behind RB (though they won the DFB Cup).

That 15/16 team was certainly the last great Dortmund side, though Favres Dortmund which came 2 points from winning the title a couple of seasons ago was also good. Tuchels team that summer was gutted though with Gundogan, Hummels and Mhikitaryan leaving, which also pisses Tuchel off because he was assured they wouldn't be.
 

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15/16 season you mean, in the 16/17 season they came third behind RB (though they won the DFB Cup).

That 15/16 team was certainly the last great Dortmund side, though Favres Dortmund which came 2 points from winning the title a couple of seasons ago was also good. Tuchels team that summer was gutted though with Gundogan, Hummels and Mhikitaryan leaving, which also pisses Tuchel off because he was assured they wouldn't be.
Oh, I messed up with the exact season. Tuchel is a very good coach and he could turn around their season drastically.
On a side note, still can't believe that Hummels went to Bayern, after he came out and said previously that he won't be going back. That was a snake move and I was even more in disbelief when Dortmund welcomed him back. Lost a lot of respect for him.