A salary cap would hurt us more than them. We just need to buy better, manage better and perform better.
Another boring one horse race
- Thread starter Schmeichel's Cartwheel
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
So basically we need to do everything better
15 games left to play and we're already sure City will win them all and romp the league? Okay then...
Anyone that expected us to win the league this year probably needs a reality check anyway.
Anyone that expected us to win the league this year probably needs a reality check anyway.
It wouldn't be if we held on against Everton and beat wba and Sheffield United
This. We can't blame City for us bottling it against relegation fodder. It's our fault we're not in the race.
In a nutshell.So basically we need to do everything better
City spending isn’t responsible for us not winning a single top 6 fixture thus far, they aren’t responsible for losing against the bottom of the league team and drawing against 2nd to bottom, they aren’t responsible for our defence shitting the bed against Leicester and Everton.
If you look across the top leagues, Atletico have 54 pts after 21 games, Inter 50 after 22 games, Bayern have 48 after 20 games, so 53 after 23 is right about where a league leader is supposed to perform. They are on course for a 88 pts finish which is still a sizeable drop off from their record setting seasons, and in line with plenty of past PL winners. If the other teams decided to shit the collective bed and not give them a challenge then it’s not their fault.
We have only ourselves to blame for bottling the best chance we have for the title since Fergie left in such a pathetic fashion. Despite all the guffs about improvement in mentality, they will do no better next season, or the one after that, and blaming City’s spending won’t solve that issue.
If you look across the top leagues, Atletico have 54 pts after 21 games, Inter 50 after 22 games, Bayern have 48 after 20 games, so 53 after 23 is right about where a league leader is supposed to perform. They are on course for a 88 pts finish which is still a sizeable drop off from their record setting seasons, and in line with plenty of past PL winners. If the other teams decided to shit the collective bed and not give them a challenge then it’s not their fault.
We have only ourselves to blame for bottling the best chance we have for the title since Fergie left in such a pathetic fashion. Despite all the guffs about improvement in mentality, they will do no better next season, or the one after that, and blaming City’s spending won’t solve that issue.
For most of English football history the best competition was the FA Cup. Cups are always more exciting than league titles. This is always liable to happen. The only reason why that changed was because of Sky TV marketing and money.
It’s depressing when you see mid-table teams put out second teams in the FA Cup so they can finish 13th instead of 14th. The whole reward system is broken. A lot of league football in the final third of a season is meaningless crap, no matter how well it is marketed. Fantasy football was a god send for the PL bosses because it’s the main way that is keeping a lot of people still engaged.
It’s depressing when you see mid-table teams put out second teams in the FA Cup so they can finish 13th instead of 14th. The whole reward system is broken. A lot of league football in the final third of a season is meaningless crap, no matter how well it is marketed. Fantasy football was a god send for the PL bosses because it’s the main way that is keeping a lot of people still engaged.
You are only complaining because Man united is not the one running away with it.
Is CITY the reason we wasted a lot of money on bang average defenders? Is CITYs money the reason Liverpool won it last season and matched them the season before?
What about the reason why we capitulated to lose the last 3 champions league games? Or the reason we dropped points recently vs Everton, Sheffiled and West Brom?
Trying to stifle City is just a cop out to lower the quality of the league overall....it wont improve our bang average defence. It wont stop us from leaking like a sieve even against any team we face.
Rather than try to lower the bar, let us focus on improving our level.
Is CITY the reason we wasted a lot of money on bang average defenders? Is CITYs money the reason Liverpool won it last season and matched them the season before?
What about the reason why we capitulated to lose the last 3 champions league games? Or the reason we dropped points recently vs Everton, Sheffiled and West Brom?
Trying to stifle City is just a cop out to lower the quality of the league overall....it wont improve our bang average defence. It wont stop us from leaking like a sieve even against any team we face.
Rather than try to lower the bar, let us focus on improving our level.
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Can hardly blame city. It's a bit ridiculous that no one team looks likely to pick up 80+ points this season to muster a challenge.
Perhaps the competition within each individual season hasn't always been super exciting at the very top but we've had 4 different winners in the past 6 years (likely to be 4 in 7).
For comparison in the same period, its 2 in France, 1 in Germany, 1 in Italy, 3 in Spain.
For comparison in the same period, its 2 in France, 1 in Germany, 1 in Italy, 3 in Spain.
I agree. People didn’t complain about the lack of competition when we won 13 Titles in 25 years.
I wouldn't. They'd find a way to stop relegation and I'm done with football if that ever happens.
When you look at football for pretty much last 50 years there's always been long periods of dominance by a single club, Liverpool in late 70s and much of the 80s, Man. United in 90s and second half of 2000s and Man. City entering that period with 4 title wins in 2010s.
What's changed is lack of rotation below 1st place. In the 80s likes of West Ham and Watford could get promoted and finish 2nd pretty much straight away, Ipswich also did it. Now a promoted team getting to 7th is seen as completely amazing and the limit to what can happen bar the Leicester miracle a few years back.
At least the oddness of this season means the top 6 isn't a closed shop this year and it's much more competitive top half.
estimated wage bills... dunno how accurate it is but for sure a salary cap would hurt us more than most
MU £175m
MC £137m
CHE £133m
ARS £131m
TOT £129m
LIV £119m
https://www.spotrac.com/epl/payroll/
Spent our own money buying what between 1-3 players per summer? hardly what City have done is it.
I 100 percent agree with this! Can’t argue one bit.
We should be mid table fodder on merit really by now going on how shambolic our club is usually ran truth be told.
Our budget is the only thing that stops it.
Happens when you get teams like us who go on a points dropping spree for fun once we’re on top of the league.
Leicester (and Wolves to a lesser extent) coming from the lower leagues to the Premier League and establishing themselves as top-half teams or even top 4 contenders has been a nice storyline the last decade imo. What you're describing is definitely true but I don't think that happens in other leagues either. I don't follow them that closely but usually it's the same teams in Italy and Spain as well that go up and down, let alone establish themselves as top quality first division teams. Doesn't happen in Belgium either because the money just isn't there - the logical cycle is coming up with a good team, perform well for one or two seasons but then drop off again just because they're not able to keep their best players. In that respect I think Wolves (due to their Portugese connection) and Leicester are anomalies (due to Vardy/Schmeichel staying there and buying young talents that view Leicester as a step up like Tielemans, Praet, Ndidi) but unfortunately that can't be expected from most teams. I mean do you expect Villa to be a regular top-10 club should Grealish leave this offseason? I'd want it to be true but will be a hard task imo.
If Utd was as good as they thought they were a month ago they'd be in the middle of a title race with City now, but they picked up 6 points out of their last 15 and now there's no title race anymore. That's not down to City but to Utd (and by extension the other contenders) just not being good enough this season. It's unfortuante, everyone loves a good title (and relegation) race but it is what it is - better to focus on the top 4 race which is shaping up to be an incredibly exciting one with so many teams in the mix. It's not playing for a trophy but at least it's a storyline to keep watching the Premier League as a whole (for me).
We could just go down the City route of under the table payments instead, problem solved!
To be fair without all the money our owners drain out of us in management fees and interest we probably wouldn't need to
But we already have the highest wage bill in the league so we probably should be careful in wishing for a salary cap
Imagine reading this thread as a Leicester fan...
United are one of the richest clubs in the history of football, they have the highest wage bill in England and have the most expensive defender and midfielder in the league (ever!).
If you wanna whine about other clubs, ask yourselves what they are doing differently and try to step up your own game rather than play the victim card.
Look at the coaching at City and Liverpool, look at the recruitment at Leicester, look at the guts to get rid of bad apples at Chelsea, look at the DOF at City, and so on.
United are one of the richest clubs in the history of football, they have the highest wage bill in England and have the most expensive defender and midfielder in the league (ever!).
If you wanna whine about other clubs, ask yourselves what they are doing differently and try to step up your own game rather than play the victim card.
Look at the coaching at City and Liverpool, look at the recruitment at Leicester, look at the guts to get rid of bad apples at Chelsea, look at the DOF at City, and so on.
Can’t blame City for being decisive in their football. Can blame City for bending every single financial rule there is to satisfy their evil repressive owners in an attempt to launder their reputations.
Oh and can also definitely blame United for dropping points against Leicester, Everton, Sheffield and West Brom (can add Crystal Palace and all the other draws at home, but appreciate the narrative there is “no pre-season” and, in fairness, City looked uncharacteristically shit then too. They just cracked on and improved).
Oh and can also definitely blame United for dropping points against Leicester, Everton, Sheffield and West Brom (can add Crystal Palace and all the other draws at home, but appreciate the narrative there is “no pre-season” and, in fairness, City looked uncharacteristically shit then too. They just cracked on and improved).
We spend more on Goalkeepers wages than leeds spend on their entire squad and we want to moan about city ... no wonder there are so many ABU's
This! When I hear United fans complain about the financial advantage, "doping", that City has makes the competition unfair, I'm simply struck by the level of hypocrisy. All those years that you won the title in the last 20 years, was it a fair competition to whoever finished 10th or 15th or the teams that were relegated?! Did the have a chance to compete for the title?! You were able to finish above those teams because of your financial might led to better quality players and therefore better results. If you want a completely fair competition, then impose a salary cap like the NFL. Please stop the cheap excuses and start investing better in your squad and your coaching. This line of argument by some United fans really is just pathetic and I really expect a better winner's mentality from United fans. You guys are just woefully inconsistent, whenever I watch you play, you are just as likely to drop points as you are to win it!
City show a ruthlessness that we don’t. We give DDG a massive contract despite being on the decline and City got rid of Hart right away. Do City have any crocks like Phil Jones still on their books? A player who has done very little in a decade.
They’re ahead of us on and off the pitch by a country mile. They can cope without KDB and Aguero whilst we can’t muster anything without an on form Bruno
They’re ahead of us on and off the pitch by a country mile. They can cope without KDB and Aguero whilst we can’t muster anything without an on form Bruno
Yep. There overall planning has been, I say this begrudgingly , impressive.
3 years in a 20 year period. Hardly buying the league is it. We didn’t even win the league one of those years.
Was the PL more exciting and competitive when we were running away with League and cups every year during the 90's ?
A salary cap would be more damaging to Utd than to any other club because Utd have the highest salary burden the PL.
It’s an awkward fact but let it sink in and you’ll understand that it renders the OP ridiculous.
Takes the fun out of the league as whole for me when it's decided this early.
Don't really enjoy watching a title race we're not involved in, and even less when there isn't even competition.
Don't really enjoy watching a title race we're not involved in, and even less when there isn't even competition.
Yes, because we barely ever ran away with to the extent you see now in modern times. It was a lot tighter, more ups and downs.
If I remember right it was more often than not a fight til the end, not going into machine mode late autumn and never relenting until May.
Even if they hit a minislump are any of the rest food enough to take advantage?
I wish people would stop pedaling this myth of Utd having the Leagues highest wage bill. It has been proven that City are making off the books payments. It has to be suspect that players like Aguero & KDB stay at City when they could double their reported salaries & play for any of the huge clubs. Players don't go to clubs like City & PSG for the badge.
I guess it must be proven for you to publish such allegations - care to share a link to this proof that Aguero and KDB are in recipt of these off the books payments?
You won the league in 1999 and 2003?
Yes. Hence why I said we didn’t win the league one of those years. Arsenal won it in 2002, iirc we came 3rd that season & you lot finished above us with Igor Biscan & that. Shocking season that.
Would you rather play at City under one of the elite coaches in modern football and win a bunch of titles or earn more at a respectable club like United and win f*ck all?
KDB's wages at City are 350.000/week, by the way. I doubt he would get more at any other club besides the Spanish giants, United and maybe Juve.