European Super League

Do you want the ESL to happen?


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That_Bloke

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Laughable. The "Owners" (as they are, I suspect deliberately referred to) are clueless. This isn't the NFL where the players have no option but to be part of the league, the players will have other options if they wish.

Clearly the ESL is going to generate increased revenue - there's talk of £300 million a season. That's not going to result in every player being recompensed enough over and above what they earn now to give up International games. Some, obviously will, but ta lot of players will have their pick of other wealthy clubs.
That's my opinion too. This crap has been made to save the spanish and italian clubs who are drowning in debts and particularly hit by Covid (Look at the board) and the big six owners saw an opportunity to make even more cash with zero risk. For the Glazers it's even more incentive, being guaranteed to cash in an enormous amount of money without investing in the squad.

What I don't understand is why Chelsea and ManCity gave in. They don't need it, they aren't in the board, and it's specially designed to counter them.
 
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Infra-red

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Aside from a risible interview with Perez in Spain, it has largely been radio silence from the SL clubs. All a bit bizarre - you'd expect some massive press launch with requisite fanfare and endorsements from legends of the game and mega-sponsors. But nothing. Even the players/managers at the clubs involved don't have a clue what's happening.

Meanwhile there's meetings going on at UEFA, at the FA and at the Premier League with statements of condemnation and endless gnashing of teeth in the media - all of it going unanswered.

Amazing how badly it has been managed.
 

Drainy

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Its amazing how so many club owners were sold on this when there appears to have been so little thought put into the business model, branding, comms etc

The detail we have seen so far seems like it has been put together as part of an a-level business studies project
I definitely agree with that
 

Dr. Dwayne

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That's my opinion too. This crap has been made to save the spanish and italian clubs who are drowning in debts and particularly hit by Covid (Look at the board) and the big six owners saw an opportunity to make even more cash with zero risk. For the Glazers it's even more incentive to not spend more while being guaranteed to cash in an enormous amount of money without investing in the squad.

What I don't understand is why Chelsea and ManCity gave in. They don't need it, they aren't in the board, and it's specially designed to counter them.
For Chelsea, Roman won't be around forever. So to guarantee massive income for 23 years is good for the club.

City don't want to be left behind while the genuinely massive teams go off and form an exclusive club.
 

Majima

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The Glazers involvement in this is tragically hilarious. Many of the other owners actually put money into their clubs and while it comes from a place of greed have a better standing to say they want higher returns on what they expended. Glazers haven't spent jack, threw us in debt and are now mortgaging the goodwill built from a 100 years of history to say they deserve even more. At least these leeches are now everyone's problem, not just us
Yep, it's the only good thing to come out of all this. Remember when people used to say we've spent lots over the years under the Glazers, what are we so upset about? Now everyone outside can see them for what they are too.
 

NinjaZombie

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I just find it so pathetic from clubs like ourselves and Liverpool.

We have literally handed clubs like Barcelona a lifeline to stop them from going bankrupt and sold a huge amount of our respect to do so. In case it gets lost on anyone, Spanish clubs barely have 2 pennies to rub together and we have played the biggest roll in building a league that means that we are sustainable and yet because they asked nicely and sold the Glazers on bigger dividends we have thrown that all away.
Exactly. I started watching back in the 90s when the Italians and the Spanish clubs were the top spenders. We couldn't compete with them on that front. We couldn't afford wages for the likes of Kluivert, Batistuta etc.

They offloaded their unwanted players to the Premier League. Retiring players like Casiraghi, Ravanelli. Players who failed there like Henry, Bergkamp. The English league lost the likes of Mark Hughes, Gary Lineker and Ian Rush to Barcelona.

Still, we did it the right way. Shared TV money almost equally amongst our competitors and created a competitive league that many around the world enjoy.

Now Barca and Madrid are skint and their leagues have become so uncompetitive due to TV money distribution that it's unappealing to people. This was what Perez was talking about when he said people want to see competitive matches. The cheek of him when his club is largely responsible for turning La Liga into a joke.

The English 6 have given the Italians and Spanish a way out largely because of how greedy our owners are. The owners of our own United have tarred the legacy of the club at the behest of the struggling continental clubs who used to lord over the English clubs (and for the money as well.) It's kind of heartbreaking.
 

OK_computer

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Spain institutions seem to be as crooked as Perez. Hardly surprising they have set up their little company in Spain.
You basically have no idea what you are talking about or do you actually believe that UEFA has legal ground to expel these clubs from this year's CL?

Oh and btw, I am firmly against this Sl nonsense.
 

Ixion

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I hate Boris but hopefully this happens.

That moment in the Play-Offs was amazing by the way but apparently not entertaining to some as Messi and Ronaldo weren't involved.
 

fergies coat

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Exactly. I started watching back in the 90s when the Italians and the Spanish clubs were the top spenders. We couldn't compete with them on that front. We couldn't afford wages for the likes of Kluivert, Batistuta etc.

They offloaded their unwanted players to the Premier League. Retiring players like Casiraghi, Ravanelli. Players who failed there like Henry, Bergkamp. The English league lost the likes of Mark Hughes, Gary Lineker and Ian Rush to Barcelona.

Still, we did it the right way. Shared TV money almost equally amongst our competitors and created a competitive league that many around the world enjoy.

Now Barca and Madrid are skint and their leagues have become so uncompetitive due to TV money distribution that it's unappealing to people. This was what Perez was talking about when he said people want to see competitive matches. The cheek of him when his club is largely responsible for turning La Liga into a joke.

The English 6 have given the Italians and Spanish a way out largely because of how greedy our owners are. The owners of our own United have tarred the legacy of the club at the behest of the struggling continental clubs who used to lord over the English clubs (and for the money as well.) It's kind of heartbreaking.
I wonder if the Italian clubs would be so eager to join if this happened in the 90s.
 

shabz

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Exactly. I started watching back in the 90s when the Italians and the Spanish clubs were the top spenders. We couldn't compete with them on that front. We couldn't afford wages for the likes of Kluivert, Batistuta etc.

They offloaded their unwanted players to the Premier League. Retiring players like Casiraghi, Ravanelli. Players who failed there like Henry, Bergkamp. The English league lost the likes of Mark Hughes, Gary Lineker and Ian Rush to Barcelona.

Still, we did it the right way. Shared TV money almost equally amongst our competitors and created a competitive league that many around the world enjoy.

Now Barca and Madrid are skint and their leagues have become so uncompetitive due to TV money distribution that it's unappealing to people. This was what Perez was talking about when he said people want to see competitive matches. The cheek of him when his club is largely responsible for turning La Liga into a joke.

The English 6 have given the Italians and Spanish a way out largely because of how greedy our owners are. The owners of our own United have tarred the legacy of the club at the behest of the struggling continental clubs who used to lord over the English clubs (and for the money as well.) It's kind of heartbreaking.
This is the post! Well said.
 

stevoc

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That'd be ridiculous and daft. They can't make the statements that they did yesterday and form a UEFA ESL the next day. Or can they?
Course they can. UEFA doesn't give a feck about the format of the Super League only that they are being cut out of it. This is all about money not the integrity of competition.

The wild cards will be reserved for clubs with the highest Uefa co-efficient - points used to rank clubs based on past European success - who have not qualified for the competition through their league position.
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/56573883
 

Zlatan 7

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50,000 fans... hundred quid a time = £5,000,000 (less costs of staffing etc)
sell the stream of the game for £2 to 5 million people = £10,000,000

For sure there are better ways to make money for clubs than getting in more punters - they could probably give the tickets away for free just for the atmosphere and still make more money by cutting UEFA out of TV negotiations
The kind of atmosphere where there’s music playing and you have to kiss on the big stream, cheesy dance music to entertain the fans. Yep I know that atmosphere, it felt a bit different to being stood in the Stratford end atmosphere though.

I think Covid has encouraged these fools to think football can be played long term without fans in the stadium and to an extent real ‘legacy’ fans at all. Just put some fake crowd noise on Amazon and viewers will be happy.
 

That_Bloke

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For Chelsea, Roman won't be around forever. So to guarantee massive income for 23 years is good for the club.

City don't want to be left behind while the genuinely massive teams go off and form an exclusive club.
That's a good take on it.

It's a double edged sword for both of them in the long-term tough. F. Perez said that the contracts signed on Saturday were binding, so I'm curious to see how any of these clubs would backtrack (if they want to backtrack, that is).
 

Stactix

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So if this did happen how would it work with the domestic leagues and obviously the current European cups. Perez thinks it will save football? I don't agree obviously. It might help those clubs and owners keep their fecking dividends but how does this super league help anyone not involved? Narrator: it doesn't. It fecks them hard imo.

  • If the Champions league/Europa qualifies how do teams join? Could it be the same - Finish top 4 not including the Super 6 and you'll be in next years 'reduced rewards cl' So LCFC win the league, quality for the CL. Southampton Finish 9th, Quality for the CL. Arsenal finish 17th in the league, 20th in the Super League. Get more from just the Super league than LCFC winning the league.
  • How do teams get picked based on 'Merit' finish top of your leagues to have a chance minus super 6 of course.. See how fecking stupid it already sounds? Or will it be a case of bidding to be part of the league, bring out the bribes.
  • The chance of Utd ever playing some sides like Ajax becomes nigh on impossible.
  • Thinking back to some of the shitty preseason tournaments we've played, I'm sure there was one under LVG which Utd won? Beat Madrid, City and Inter.. yet it was still fecking shite.
  • Look at the SL's (I don't see European anywhere) current media strategy.. it's literally consisted of an announcement at 9:30pm on a Sunday and Perez yapping at midnight. Their website is a single page, twitter is empty. While it's been utterly slated by the media/government/Sporting bodies/players/pundits.. There is nothing from them? They knew to an extent how this would go down otherwise I feel they'd be all over selling this. Woodward on every media outlet possible but silence. silent.
  • The Woman's league, would this include the same teams considering many of them are no where near the top in that. Many of the best teams aren't included Wolfsburg for instance.
  • This would have dramatic repurcussions on football teams not involved if it did go ahead, less CL money for those not represented, less PL money and a pointless confusing league if the super 6 stay in the competition.
  • No where in the statements does it say anything about helping clubs outside of the Super League so how this saves football Perez? I would love to know.
Some elements proposed I like but how any 'so called fan' can be in favour of an elite 'invite' only league for billionaire owners to bring their toys and completely dictate I'd love to know because if this was to go ahead, it would continue to move in the direction of lining owners pockets and they'd be in complete control. Less and less about fans, we're legacy fans after all just remember that for those with your heads up the billionaire arses.
 
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The Purley King

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You don't think they haven't factored it in? They could probably give tickets away for free for the atmosphere, and still make more doing it this way. It's horrifying but it's possible. The only thing they haven't factored in is players and managers being unwilling to take part. It's stopped dead then.
They probably have factored this in, I'm saying that it detracts from the spectacle if the stadium is half empty or full of daytrippers who don't really care too much about winning or losing.
Agree that if players stand firm then this will die. Lets hope that is the case.
 

OverratedOpinion

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Exactly. I started watching back in the 90s when the Italians and the Spanish clubs were the top spenders. We couldn't compete with them on that front. We couldn't afford wages for the likes of Kluivert, Batistuta etc.

They offloaded their unwanted players to the Premier League. Retiring players like Casiraghi, Ravanelli. Players who failed there like Henry, Bergkamp. The English league lost the likes of Mark Hughes, Gary Lineker and Ian Rush to Barcelona.

Still, we did it the right way. Shared TV money almost equally amongst our competitors and created a competitive league that many around the world enjoy.

Now Barca and Madrid are skint and their leagues have become so uncompetitive due to TV money distribution that it's unappealing to people. This was what Perez was talking about when he said people want to see competitive matches. The cheek of him when his club is largely responsible for turning La Liga into a joke.

The English 6 have given the Italians and Spanish a way out largely because of how greedy our owners are. The owners of our own United have tarred the legacy of the club at the behest of the struggling continental clubs who used to lord over the English clubs (and for the money as well.) It's kind of heartbreaking.
Exactly, just far better said than I did!
 

stevoc

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Yeah I'm actually surprised they're even in this. The whole thing is so to prevent new money from disrupting football and City / Chelsea are the posterboys of new money. They don't give a feck that RM can't compete in a world where nation states can throw their wealth around at prestige projects.
Yeah but they don't want any new new money competing with their new money.
 

Tom Cato

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That's a good take on it.

It's a double edged sword for both of them in the long-term tough. F. Perez said that the contracts signed on Saturday were binding, so I'm curious to see how any of these clubs would backtrack (if they want to backtrack, that is).
Depends a bit if the contracts can even be enforced.

The EU parlament is "on it", whatever that might be, and the British parlament are officially holding hearings and working on legislation to protect 'sanctity of competition and Jeopardy' as it were.

In essence, the men and women that control nations are coming for the small billionaires. I do love it when the people who rely on lawyers and money are challenged by the people that write the laws with pockets deeper than the hole in Ed Woodwards soul.
 

DSG

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Wrong group to bring this up in, I suppose, but what does everyone make of the CL viewership numbers in Gen Z, which lag far behind other age groups. I know this is an excuse, but there is some truth to the fact that no one cares or watches Bayern v Olympiakos in the CL.

Totally against a US-style league with permanent members. There are so many shite teams in those leagues with awful owners.
 

DoomSlayer

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Exactly. I started watching back in the 90s when the Italians and the Spanish clubs were the top spenders. We couldn't compete with them on that front. We couldn't afford wages for the likes of Kluivert, Batistuta etc.

They offloaded their unwanted players to the Premier League. Retiring players like Casiraghi, Ravanelli. Players who failed there like Henry, Bergkamp. The English league lost the likes of Mark Hughes, Gary Lineker and Ian Rush to Barcelona.

Still, we did it the right way. Shared TV money almost equally amongst our competitors and created a competitive league that many around the world enjoy.

Now Barca and Madrid are skint and their leagues have become so uncompetitive due to TV money distribution that it's unappealing to people. This was what Perez was talking about when he said people want to see competitive matches. The cheek of him when his club is largely responsible for turning La Liga into a joke.

The English 6 have given the Italians and Spanish a way out largely because of how greedy our owners are. The owners of our own United have tarred the legacy of the club at the behest of the struggling continental clubs who used to lord over the English clubs (and for the money as well.) It's kind of heartbreaking.
This. This is exactly how I feel. It definitely broke my heart, even if I was already not into football due to the ultra capitalistic view of it. What a fecking farce that our own club is dragged around at the forefront by our inhumane owners...
 

Nogbadthebad

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Here's a simple question that highlights why the idea this won't have an effect on the PL is risible.

Next year, who and how many PL teams qualify for the CL and EL?

Currently our coefficient is based mostly on the performance of teams that are no longer part of either competition, so do the rest of the PL benefit from that, or do we go to three CL teams?

Which teams gain entry? It is entirely feasible that 7th in the league is the highest place non scab team. That could mean 10th place getting automatic qualification into the CL.

Other leagues are not going to accept that when in many third place doesn't get you that privilege.
 

VP89

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I still feel the reaction from managers/players is far too muted.

It reminds me of this:

 

Annihilate Now!

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Course they can. UEFA doesn't give a feck about the format of the Super League only that they are being cut out of it. This is all about money not the integrity of competition.



https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/56573883
You do still have to have qualified for a European competition to be eligible for Wild Card entry though, so there is still at least some (though not much) merit involved.
 

sun_tzu

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roll on for the Man City Vs Chelsea final where they play there reserves because its only the CL and they are resting their players for the start of the superleague in June as all their players are banned from the Euros