My personal preference, I'd rather have Grealish than Bruno. I prefer Grealish's overall play.
Grealish To City? | City bid £100M
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Let's be honest here, with the amount of time he spends on the ground he is more Russel than Grealish.
Getting my coat...
Getting my coat...
why are we even comparing Grealish and Sancho. They are both excellent players who I love to watch. Greelish and Sancho can play on the same team along with Bruno. Just imagine them interchanging throughout the game and supply the ammunition for Cavani or whoever our striker is. I would love Greelish and Sancho on either wing. Rotate Sancho, Rashford and Greelish, and even Bruno.
I've been lurking here for more than a decade, and I've never seen this level of personal fealty to an opposition player, to the point of putting down our own best players to compliment the other guy (not just you, it's happening through this entire thread).
Not saying they're anywhere near the same level as players, but the last personality cult that was this over the top (relative to player accomplishments) was the James McCarthyites in 2014. Maybe the one or two Longstaff defenders from a couple of years ago.
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Geez. You call yourself a United fan?
He's the one who carried the ball too often because Villa built a team for him. But, it wouldn't work if the opposition side keep fouling him to stop the attacking momentum.
This is why Southgate didn't started him, and only sub him on when the players were tired with more cautious about getting yellow.
Still a great player though, It would be intersting how pep will manage him. Will he build a team for Grealish like Villa did, or just make him a bench players like England did?
This is why Southgate didn't started him, and only sub him on when the players were tired with more cautious about getting yellow.
Still a great player though, It would be intersting how pep will manage him. Will he build a team for Grealish like Villa did, or just make him a bench players like England did?
Statscafe summed up here. The biggest problem with today's football fans. Everything should be about stats.
This is weirdo behaviour. You’re typing up paragraphs because I said I prefer Grealish’s play. How exactly have I “put down” Bruno by saying I have a personal preference? Are you feeling OK?
Yes.Don't use Southgate preference as reason to justify players merits, Southgate didn't play Sancho much too, is Sancho a player with notable weakness or issues then?
Your problem with this is that most of us prefer the more productive player? Why exactly should we want the less productive player instead?
My problem is you have to consider footballing ability as well as stats. Saying x player is a better footballer because his stats are better is just plain stupid which people here never seem to understand.
Remind me again which stats show the weight of the pass, the first touch to get away or control a difficult pass, the ability to get away in tight spaces, the right decision making when you can either pass or shoot, the dribbling into space, how you protect the ball etc. etc.
Why is it so hard for people to understand?
It's hilarious. I mean yeah he is a very good player but the way people hype as if he is some Ronaldinho.Agree wholeheartedly, the cult of Grealish is close to overtaking the player himself.
Feck me
He’ll find an absolute cure for Covid in his spare time also.
He may prove to be ‘better’ than Sancho [I don’t know as I can’t tell the future] but feck me our fanbase are disgusting, Sancho is a 21 year old wunderkind who has been likened to Neymar et al. & people are crying because City are buying yet another good player.
Get a grip gentlemen.
Few more weeks, same posters will talk about him as one of the best in PL history, couple of seasons he will be in GOAT category.
"SAF wouldn't have let this happen" takes must be the dumbest, as if no PL clubs signed good players when we had SAF.
So completely unquantifiable stuff that can never be proven or disproven. Even if Grealish is better at all this than Sancho (which he isn't, Sancho is phenomenal at "dribbling into space" and "getting away in tight spaces"), why does any of it matter if he can't help his team put the ball in the net?
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100m can get you Ruben Neves + Varane and still have a lot of money to buy a lifetime supply of NikNaks.
Thats the point right there. You don’t know that and stats can’t measure that. If it is Sterling instead of Grealish, he delays that perfectly weighted ball to Shaw (Euro) and the chance to cross is gone.
There are no “involved in the goal” stats. If it is De Gea instead of Henderson, he doesn’t release Shaw early with that long throw and we don’t score that goal.
There are other things that stats can not measure. How will a player perform under pressure, how he’ll play in a different league etc. etc.
Grealish is a better footballer because he is technically better. He dribbles better and makes the right decisions. Sancho is young and can get better but at this moment, Grealish was and is the safer bet.
It would have been amazing if he had gotten either of them a year ago instead of wasting money on DVDB.
And this is what I have an issue with. You're saying this like it's truth but it isn't...it's just your opinion, one that I don't agree with.
I also think the fact that Sancho has more goal contributions than him over the last several seasons supports my view that he's a better, more effective player. I guess we'll see over the course of the season.
Nope, Southgate uses Grealish as a secret weapon, everyone konws he is a quality player. He always coming off the bench, but Sancho or Rashford didn't.
For Sancho, it's a different issue. Southgate wants a traditional left-footed RW or Sterling. Pretty sure Sterling-Kane are his talismans who must playing, but when it didn't works he subs Grealish on. Sancho is still young, it's understandable why he wasn't playing.
I don't think being a talisman at Villa is a weakness, nor being a secret wepon either. And for Sancho, I don't think being so young as a weakness.
I hope he does go to City so we can have an end to the cult of Grealish.
But that's not what you've said in your original post. You clearly stated that playing Grealish wouldn't work for England as attack momentum could be easily contained by opponents should he start, as he controls the ball too often, and you are using Southgate decision not to start him to further justify this claim. This does somewhat imply weakness or issues on him.
Regarding Sancho, you are suggesting his young age as the reason of why he is not playing, yet Saka being younger started games ahead of him under Southgate. Do you think Saka is better than Sancho then?
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I agree with you and hopefully you’re right. Its just that we’re letting City sign Grealish is the problem with a lot of us. If it was any other club, it wouldn’t have been an issue.
Grealish can be immense in the right system and with the right players. That is what scares me. No matter how much we improve and add the right players season after season, City always go one step ahead.
That's an over-simplistic view, just because stats are numbers doesn't mean they allow for like-for-like comparisons or show the objective truth. If it was a 100m sprint sure, but football is a team game. There's about 10 different factors you have to take into account when comparing stats for someone like Sancho and Grealish.
For instance, assists. In Villa's first season up, their strikers Samatta and Davies managed 1 league goal between them in 36 games. They sign watkins and the assists go up.
Goal's scored. Sancho's got more in the league in the last 2 seasons, but the % of their teams goals they've scored is pretty much the same, because Dortmund simply create and score far more goals (and that too in 34 games).
Then you have the rest of the team, what do the midfielders do, what does the other wide forward do, what's the style of play of the team they come up against? Stats isn't just plucking out numbers and comparing them, it's interpreting the data, combining it with other stats, and when it comes to football crucially still relying on the eye-test and expert opinion on players to discern a player's level.
For me it's simple having watched most of Villa's games over the last 2 seasons, with better players around him Grealish's stats will shoot right up. He'll spend more time near the opposition goal, won't be the only creator, will have multiple players that can finish, make space with runns. In fact I'd be far happier if they signed Kane, despite City needing a striker, because I think Grealish is the more unique player. The ability to beat a man, play the perfectly weighted pass, all of that is rarer and rarer at the top level.
I sense a bit of sarcasm there? Stats tells you how good a player really is and what they can produce…. Does it or does it not? Are teams going to buy a striker that’s scored 5 goals or 20 goals a season?
Grealish is older and more the finished product so in the short term may do better. From what I've seen, Sancho will be the better player in the long run and is a the better investment to make. I'd happily us have paid 100 million for Sancho than 75 for Grealish even though I rate the latter
Of course there are so many factors which will impact their careers. Grealish will for the next few years play under one of the great manager's and in a better team
Of course there are so many factors which will impact their careers. Grealish will for the next few years play under one of the great manager's and in a better team
It's going to become bigger actually, especially if god forbid, Sancho doesn't have a good start here.
Let's be honest, Villa fans would have looked for any excuse to be unhappy about the timing. He has no control of when City make a bid. The Euros were on and it seems Villa have known this move might happen for a while.
You can't begrudge him this move.
What about Grealish in the Championship when Villa had Tammy Abraham in the Championship vs Sancho?
It seems like Grealish fans if anything underrate Sancho's technical ability. Like as if it's Rashford's level.
I swear people aren't ready for what Bruno, Rashford and Sancho are going to do together. We've assembled the best attack since Rooney-Ronaldo-Tevez. If Greenwood comes of age as Cavani's successor, that's the best attack in the premier league.
This Grealish obsession is getting out of hand. Why take Grealish when you have Bruno? Man had 30 goals and assists in the Premier League! Only Harry Kane has more. It's Bruno and KDB in the Top 10 for midfielders! And KDB is 10th! I don't understand some "fans". And don't give me that stats isn't everything bullshit. These are the kind of stats that Messi and Ronaldo walk around with year on year and people celebrate those numbers all the time. Stats are cold hard truths, feelings are just that... feelings. Grealish is 25. Bruno is 26! I don't understand how our own fans could pick Grealish over Bruno.
I understand why Villa fans love him. He's a hero for them. For us, that guy is Bruno. LITERALLY, turned around the whole club by himself.
This Grealish obsession is getting out of hand. Why take Grealish when you have Bruno? Man had 30 goals and assists in the Premier League! Only Harry Kane has more. It's Bruno and KDB in the Top 10 for midfielders! And KDB is 10th! I don't understand some "fans". And don't give me that stats isn't everything bullshit. These are the kind of stats that Messi and Ronaldo walk around with year on year and people celebrate those numbers all the time. Stats are cold hard truths, feelings are just that... feelings. Grealish is 25. Bruno is 26! I don't understand how our own fans could pick Grealish over Bruno.
I understand why Villa fans love him. He's a hero for them. For us, that guy is Bruno. LITERALLY, turned around the whole club by himself.
Exactly. Imagine wanting someone who does well at Villa compared to someone who slowly but surely wakes up a sleeping giant of a club. When it comes to Bruno for some people it doesnt matter if he scored+assisted 30 goals in a season. If he completed a match with less than 85% pass accuracy and scores a penalty it doesnt count as a good match. Idiotic really.
With better players around Jack, his numbers will shrink. He will see less of the ball, more goals will be scored and created by other players so that coveted percentsge of all goals stat will shrink. Look at his England career as a perfect example. 12 games, 4 assists. Thats it. His Stats arent through the roof when hes playing with Kane then so why should it be at City?
Having a bigger impact in a side that scores more is a bigger achievement simply because Sancho has to produce more to compete
Bruno with 74% pass completion doesn't know the value of possession and is not fit to play Pep's football. Grealish with 78% pass completion is perfect Pep player.
KdB with 76% pass completion is Pep's best player since he took over.
(Stats from fbref)
This perfectly illustrates how KDB gets it wrong about as much as Bruno. Remember, Grealish has NO WHERE NEAR the same passing range as Bruno and KDB. Grealish plays like a winger. His pass accuracy ought to be better!
Good post. I’m in Group A as well.
I had a feeling the other players who like to take risks also have similar average pass completion but this stats really confirm it for me so thanks. I remember when we had no creative players or risk takers outside of Pogba. People were complaining about our players always passing it sideways. Now that things have changed and Bruno has massively improved our productivity and creativity, some of them complain about shit pass conpletion. Like what do they want really. You cant have your cake and eat it too. What matters for attacking midfielders is not pass completion but to take risks to increase the output of himself and other players while not losing the ball in the dangerous areas. Grealish is the same and should be judged as such.
Grealish is currently not better than KdB nor Bruno, we all know that. There is just something about his personality that makes people think he is a superstar but in reality, he is not yet a superstar. I'm not worried too much that he joins City and we got Sancho instead, in fact thats how its suppossed to be done. Don't get the moaning and belittling of our own players just because Grealish isn't ours. If we spent 100m on him instead of Sancho all the people in charge of transfer should be sacked. Pogba, Bruno, Grealish in the same team and we put Daniel James on the right are you kidding me.
It feels a bit odd to come to a Manchester United forum and have fans suggesting they'd swap their talisman and most productive player in recent years for Jack Grealish, a talented player, but one with only 15 goals and 16 assists in 96 matches.
Fernandes has managed 26 goals and 19 assists in almost half as many Premier League games.
Maybe it's Grealish's 34% shooting accuracy? Or perhaps it's his 23% cross accuracy? It could even be the 26 "big chances" he's created in his ninety six Premier League matches. Perhaps it's Grealish's youth? At an entire year younger than Bruno Fernandes, he has the potential to play for a couple of extra seasons in which to close the glaring statistical gap, though he's already squandered the opportunity in the 45 more Premier League games he's played than Fernandes.
I dunno, get rid of Fernandes and pay twice what he cost the club for a player who has achieved half as much? Maybe, he sure does have nice hair.
Fernandes has managed 26 goals and 19 assists in almost half as many Premier League games.
Maybe it's Grealish's 34% shooting accuracy? Or perhaps it's his 23% cross accuracy? It could even be the 26 "big chances" he's created in his ninety six Premier League matches. Perhaps it's Grealish's youth? At an entire year younger than Bruno Fernandes, he has the potential to play for a couple of extra seasons in which to close the glaring statistical gap, though he's already squandered the opportunity in the 45 more Premier League games he's played than Fernandes.
I dunno, get rid of Fernandes and pay twice what he cost the club for a player who has achieved half as much? Maybe, he sure does have nice hair.
Sign me up for Group A as well.
People calling for Grealish over Bruno have incredibly short memories over how much we needed a personality like Bruno, as much as his talent. Just another example of grass is greener. Had Bruno turned in seasons at City like he has here people would be crying themselves to sleep that they got him
Who's crying? What's disgusting about saying Grealish is better than Sancho?Agree wholeheartedly, the cult of Grealish is close to overtaking the player himself.
Feck me
He’ll find an absolute cure for Covid in his spare time also.
He may prove to be ‘better’ than Sancho [I don’t know as I can’t tell the future] but feck me our fanbase are disgusting, Sancho is a 21 year old wunderkind who has been likened to Neymar et al. & people are crying because City are buying yet another good player.
Get a grip gentlemen.
I am old enough to remember the impact Rodney Marsh had on a very slick City side which boasted Summerbee, Bell, Lee and Young as its attackers. Allison was sort of the Pep of his day and thought that adding the 'Grealish' of his time (although personally I think Marsh was twice the player) would take City to the peak of Europe. Instead he completely spoiled the chemistry of the team. History probably won't repeat, as this time City have too many good players, he just won't play very much.
Agreed, I think the leadership aspect is overlooked too.
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