Messi always pressed though.
Champions League Group F
Manchester United 3:2 Atalanta
OId Trafford
- Kick-off
- Wed, 20 October 2021 @ 8:00pm BST
- Status
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Closed
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
Discussion Your Lineup Prediction
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well one of them is actually a fact
uh oh I may have fallen asleep zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzHoping Ole pulls a Fergie!? Dreams can’t be buy
No he doesn't. He's in the bottom 7% of forwards for pressures.
To be fair Mourinho had done what he wanted to (win a couple of trophies) and was looking to get sacked to get a payday and feck off for a year.Anticipating a United win. I can feel it in my bones
Is that van de beek won't play by chance?well one of them is actually a fact
Great to hear
I mean when he was younger, hes just collecting wage packets.An early goal followed by a couple more later on all whilst keeping a clean sheet please. That too much to ask for? Fine, I’ll take a 2-1 win after conceding first from one of our own corners then.
In all seriousness I’m looking forward to tonight. From what I’ve seen of Atalanta (which isn’t much), their style should suit us. Reminded me of uni on the night before the exam. Great stuff.
Even when he was younger. He has never had good pressing stats & on top of that he has never been a player to track back either, he consistently statistically covers the least distance in a game. I'm not calling him bad because of it, the point was to argue against the idea that you're somehow bad if you don't constantly press. The scapegoating on Ronaldo right now is unreal.We must be very wary of Ilicic.
He's a big man and the central defenders will have a difficult night against him.Why am I always filled with optimism before a match when my head knows what is likely to happen?I'm excited about this one as long as there's a bit of a change in the system. I was wary of Villarreal as they already proved they could were capable of beating us in the Europa League final but this one I think should be more routine, a nice boost after the recent league performances. Just give me anything other than McFred - 3 - Ronaldo.
Zapata as well, no idea how he’s not got a big move yet. If Gasperini has watched even one of our games, he’ll play him on Lindelof.
You mean Maguire?
Because why even be a fan if you're not going to be happy and excited about the team playing?
I fecking hate the negativity in the matchday threads before a single kick on the ball from a lot of the frequent posters (not yours).Interesting that United are massive favourites in the betting market despite our recently poor form. Are Atalanta really that bad?
It's because United is a big name club and they are not a big name club. They play much better football than United do and are coached really well, and have a very good group of players. They're probably the most difficult opponent in the group (and considering our form this year, likely the best team?).
Can you share the source please.
Who said Ole has no tactics?
According to Spanish website Sport, as of the beginning of March in the 20/21 Season Messi was the second most effective of forwards in pressing. Under Koeman Messi had pressed more than he had done in years, in fact.
Lewandowski at first with 73 recoveries, 214 pressures at 34.1% effectiveness per press.
Messi at second with 69 recoveries, 209 pressures at 33% effectiveness per press.
Messi pressed more times than Suarez, Benzema, Ronaldo (131 pressures), Ibrahimovic, Mbappe (135), Haaland, and Neymar.
The only forwards who attempted more than him by March was Salah, Lewa and Rashford (equal with Messi at 209).
So, Messi pressed, and did lots of it, and very well.
A quick google turns up this site https://fbref.com/en/players/d70ce98e/Lionel-Messi
They have match logs back to 2004 but I think the defensive pressures were only tracked from 2014 onwards. You can use this link https://fbref.com/en/players/d70ce98e/matchlogs/2014-2015/defense/Lionel-Messi-Match-Logs to check his 2014-15 defensive stats & you'll see he makes less than 10 presses per game on average which on any given season will land you in the bottom 5-10% of pressures when compared with other forwards.
Efficacy is not a good way to show Messi is a pressing player. If I take 1 penalty and score it I have 100% efficacy compared with a player that took 100 and scored 90 to only have 90% efficacy. Does my 1 penalty make me the better penatly taker? Come on, use some sense.
Didn't this happen in another game this season (to an opposing team)?
He still attempted more presses. Joint third most press attempts in that list of ten. Even if you discount the efficacy you can't negate the facts of the number of the attempts. It is what it is. If he was lazy in the press he'd be near the bottom. Spoiler. He's not.
Fecking running hard would be a start.
Quick incisive passes if I'm being greedy.
In that very select list that included players like Suarez, Ibrahimovic & Ronaldo? So he presses more than people that literally don't press? Here are his stats for that 20-21 season you were referring to.
Yes, his success rate is incredibly high, placing him in the 97th percentile but his attempts are the bottom 7%. He does not press, stop trying to create a false narrative. I don't know why you're even trying to piggyback on this conversation to defend a player that I'm not even trying to criticise. I don't care that he doesn't press, my point is that him not pressing doesn't make him a bad player & so the same logic should be applied to Ronaldo but yet lots of posters want to blame everything on Ronaldo because he doesn't press.I really think this is a massive game for Ole... If he doesn't get 4 Points from the Atalanta games it might get ugly earlier than some of us are predicting. If we lose one of these games and don't go on to qualify, it has to be seen as a catastrophic failure. Atalanta and Villareal are of course no mugs, but we couldn't have asked for a much better group.
Hoping to see some cutting edge and clinical attacking play.
I remembered England fans firing off fireworks outside the Italian national team's hotel at night on the eve of the Euro finals last summer.
I suspect we might nick a win but I wouldn't expect a stellar performance with our current coaching setup. Its going to be the usual Ole masterstroke of Bruno/Ronaldo/Greenwood pulling off a worldie, their players making a costly mistake and De Gea continuing with his Brad Friedel act this season.
Bayern play against Benfica at 8pm. Hope this helps.
Im thinking with pep everyone worked hard, but after him that dropped significantly and became much weaker because of it
All that did was put a rocket under the Italians.
Literally
Even under Pep he was always criticised for walking everywhere around the pitch. It's fine, not every player has to be a Jamie Vardy. Messi is still one of the greatest ever.
I think you’ll get almost exactly what you’re describing. McFred- Rash/Bruno/Greenwood - Cavani
But CR will be subbed on at some point.- Status
Man of the Match
Runners-up
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27%
Bruno Fernandes
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20%
David de Gea
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8%
Aaron Wan-Bissaka
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8%
Fred
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5%
Marcus Rashford
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1%
Victor Lindelof
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1%
Luke Shaw
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1%
Paul Pogba
Player Ratings
Total Average Rating
Highest Rated Player
Lowest Rated Player
Compiled from 319 ratings.
Score Predictions
153,68,58
- Man Utd win
- Atalanta win
- Draw
Detailed Results
- 20% Man Utd 2:1 Atalanta
- 11% Man Utd 1:1 Atalanta
- 10% Man Utd 1:2 Atalanta
- 9% Man Utd 2:2 Atalanta
- 8% Man Utd 2:0 Atalanta
- 8% Man Utd 3:1 Atalanta
- 6% Man Utd 1:0 Atalanta
- 5% Man Utd 0:2 Atalanta
- 4% Man Utd 3:0 Atalanta
- 4% Man Utd 1:3 Atalanta
- 4% Man Utd 3:2 Atalanta
- 3% Man Utd 0:1 Atalanta
- 2% Man Utd 4:1 Atalanta
- 2% Man Utd 4:0 Atalanta
- 1% Man Utd 5:0 Atalanta
- 1% Man Utd 0:3 Atalanta
- 1% Man Utd 2:3 Atalanta
- 1% Man Utd 0:0 Atalanta
- 1% Man Utd 0:5 Atalanta
- 0% Man Utd 5:1 Atalanta
- 0% Man Utd 3:3 Atalanta
Match Stats
- Man Utd
- Atalanta
- Possession
- 56% 44%
- Shots
- 22 13
- Shots on Target
- 9 6
- Corners
- 8 5
- Fouls
- 10 12
Referee
Szymon Marciniak
Man Utd Lineup
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replaced by Nemanja Matic
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replaced by Paul Pogba
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replaced by Edinson Cavani
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replaced by Jadon Sancho
