clearly he likes Frenkie as he didn't want to sell him to Barca when he left Ajax and given the working relationship it's no surprise he wants him to be the face of the rebuild
Frenkie de Jong | The last muppeting lap
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
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Even if we do sign De Jong, we need to sign a player to play beside him. Something we never managed to do with Pogba.
Its time for the position to become a genuine strength of the team. A holding midfielder must be signed - and this time we should avoid a Chelsea castoff who was in decline before we signed him.
Its time for the position to become a genuine strength of the team. A holding midfielder must be signed - and this time we should avoid a Chelsea castoff who was in decline before we signed him.
Personally, I think it's unlikely given his history with ten Hag and the fact that he's a very good player that he would be a disappointment if we do get him but there's always a chance.
As for hearing about it, it's Barca, Man Utd and a high profile player so the press will be all over it. As usual, we're going to hear a LOT of speculation and bs between now and Sep 1st, so buckle up if you're getting frustrated already.
here's Johnny Murtough
Is Frenkie De Jong really 80m Euros better than giving Donny a proper go?
I'd rather spend the 80m on a world class DM and play Donny and Bruno ahead of that player.
If money is no object then sure let's get Frenkie too but it unfortunately is. We don't have 250/300m to spend.
I'd rather spend the 80m on a world class DM and play Donny and Bruno ahead of that player.
If money is no object then sure let's get Frenkie too but it unfortunately is. We don't have 250/300m to spend.
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Dealio soon to be doneio.
We really need two big Midfield signings.
Without it can't see how we can have any confidence going into next season
Without it can't see how we can have any confidence going into next season
Frenkie and Donny are entirely different players. Also, one of em is world class and one of em is bang average.
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I feel like we have been 'making do with what we have' instead of investing in CM since about 2011
My point was that neither are DM's. They both play slightly different midfield roles but are definitely more attacking than they are defensive.
Also is Frenkie really world class? What's he done to achieve that title? He's been bang average for Barca. Potentially world class I think is an argument. He's definitely not there yet.
“giving Donny a proper go” at what? They’re totally different players. Donny is simply incapable of doing what De Jong would bring.
Donny and Bruno aren't good enough. A world class DM still needs a controller next to them and Frenkie is one of the best there is at controlling games.
I must say that the amount of people who seem underwhelmed by him on here is surprising. If he joins, he's going to shock a lot of people at just how much he improves us under ten Hag.
We must be watching other games. The first 2 years FdJ at Barca has been absolutely bossing it with Messi. By far their most important player. For the NT he is clearly bossing it as well.
This year he has performed less but still put in a lot of world class performances.
Consistently voted the MVP at the Barca reddit with Pedri.
Nah. They're very, very different players.
In playstyle terms, De Jong is Verratti and Donny is Thomas Muller.
Anyone comparing Frenkie and McT should have their eyesight and brains tested
Is it worth spending money on a central midfielder or should we cram a goal poacher in there instead? That is perhaps the greatest dilemma of all time.
An important thing to consider in years gone by is why players failed. Most of them weren't bad players. But they were purchased without a clear idea on how to settle in a team. Without a clear role. Without a team that compliments them. They also came to a team that really just was not coached with a clear system that can enhance them and get the best out of them. It's hard to perform as a player in those circumstances, or reach your potential as a young player.
I don't think anyone can claim that Ten Hag doesn't have a clear plan for Frenkie de Jong. For the first time we're going for a coach who specializes in actual coaching, who is focused on coaching us to be a cohesive, attacking unit. It's a lot more hit and miss if you're a Mourinho/Ole type of manager in those systems when you sign players. Or at least, it's harder to perform at your best when the system is built around individualism.
Don't underestimate how important a good coach is to a team! More important than any single player.
Yes he is
I know he is DLP but each one of them is a little bit different, so for him to work in that position in ETH system does he need a DM alongside or nr 8 ?
Because if he need a DM we must buy 2 midfielders and if he needs an 8 then Fred, Garner and Hannibal should be ok just to test them out.
Because if he need a DM we must buy 2 midfielders and if he needs an 8 then Fred, Garner and Hannibal should be ok just to test them out.
Neither are DM's though.
De Jong is not a DM though. We'd still play Fred next to him if he joins.
Had he been that good they wouldn't be forcing him out.
Your Ajax and Dutch bias is coming through.
His best position is playing from deep. He may not be your traditional DM like Makelele but he is the closest you can get to a play maker from deep.
Didn't Barca still play Busquets in that role ahead of him?
I like him and he's a good player but I'm not convinced he can anchor a PL midfield. In fact I'm certain he can't. Could he play next to or slightly ahead of a DM for us? Absolutely.
That's what our system is going to end up being anyway. I'd prefer a 4-3-3 with a solid DM behind two 8s, but I think it'll end up being the pivot no matter who we sign.
De Jong isn't a pure DM, but he is a sitting-type midfielder and would be better positionally than the likes of McTominay out of possession, and obviously on a different planet when we have the ball.
Let's roll back to 2019 when Real Madrid played Ajax and slaughtered Madrid 4-1. The midfield selection was as follows:
------- van de Beek -------
-- de Jong ---- Schöne --
We'd basically need a more defensive player to take over the Schöne role. McTominay would 100% not be capable of doing it, Fred would be ok but improvable. We basically don't have a defensive minded midfielder in the squad so we'd need one anyway. This is ultimately the problem we have right now with the midfielders we have in the squad, they're all basically competing with one another for 2 slots but none are proper DMs.
He's clearly on a different level to Mctominay. I didn't say he wasn't.
I would just rather spend that amount of money on the DM.
ETH has used a DM next to him because FDJ has a tendency to step out of DM role during the play. So I would assume we would also use someone who is tactically disciplined to play next to him.
I dont know if he has played as a DM for Barca.
Doesn't have to be a defensive player though, since Schöne was a winger/attacking midfielder. The midfielders just have to be able to work together and you'll be fine.
Dude, they are such different players...
Yes, that's why he isn't used correctly at Barca . He isn't exactly your traditional DM and can't hold the defensive midfield on your own. But with a player alongside , he can definitely dictate play from deep.
Barca with their 433 setup, they have better cost effective options in Pedri and Gavi .
Yeah, he probably does need a more disciplined partner. And yeah we should be bringing in a pair of midfielders.
Basically, we've got to replace both Pogba and Matic. Not because we'll miss their minutes based on last season, but because we're a couple of years late doing it. And we have to replace them with players that gel with how Ten Hag wants to play.
So if we sign FDJ we’re going to need another midfielder to play alongside him, preferable a more defensive minded player. Don’t see how FDJ and mctominay/Fred would improve us. Seems like they’d still get walked through far to easily. FDJ with a more natural DM would be a good shout. If we can get that done then surely there’s a cheaper striker out there who scores tons of goals that will cost less then Nunez? At the minute it seems like we’re just targeting 1 mid, 1 striker and 1 cb when ideally we need at least 2 midfielders.
Yeah fair enough, potentially world class. Part of the problen at Barca though is that Barca thinks he's an offensive player. He isnt. For our national team he is posted just in front of the defense to move the ball up the pitch to the attackers.
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