Honest question: What are the top 3 clubs you think would buy McTominay if he wanted to move today?

Zippycup said:

Let me ask you this question.
If Henderson was in the current Manchester United team do you think his vision, movement and passing would be better than McTominays?

Who exactly was McTominay supposed to pass too? You can only have good vision if somebody actually makes a run. The amount of times I've seen our midfield hold on to the ball for too long or making a sideways/backwards pass because no forward player is making a run made me pull my hair out. And I'm bald.

You also stated that Hendersons overall game is better than many made out. I agree.
What do you think changed? The fact that Liverpool started competing or that Henderson got better? I can assure you it's the former.

You are judging one player based on his ability in a world class team and comparing him to a player who is in a team that is so dysfunctional that I'd question their professionalism.

Is McTominay the answer? Who knows. All I will say is he isn't anywhere near as bad as the majority make out.

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Good post.

Give her/him a reaction point, I says.

Idxomer said:

If McTominay were from Liverpool's academy, they would've sold him years ago to Bournemouth for £25m.

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This bit I agree with. We have to get better at moving players on when they're still considered on the up and in the 'could be anything' bracket.

It's better to take your £25/30m and put that towards an £80m superstar than dobbling about with these 'not-quite-good-enough' Academy lads.

I have been split on James Garner because I do believe he might take a bit more time to develop, like, say, a Michael Carrick for example. However, after watching Forest regularly at the end of last season, I just don't ever see him being 'elite' and therefore again, it makes sense to me to ask Forest for £25m + £5m in realistic add-ons with a £55m buyback clause.

Likewise, I'd probably be touting Elanga about on the quiet now...sounding clubs out, see if we can get £30/35m. If we can, much as I like the lad, it's a "sell" for me at that price.

I think McTominay is appreciated more in the club and around the league than he is by our own fan base. While I don't think he has the discipline to be a DM, I think he can be a very good #8 and definitely has a place in our squad...

SadlerMUFC said:

I think McTominay is appreciated more in the club and around the league than he is by our own fan base. While I don't think he has the discipline to be a DM, I think he can be a very good #8 and definitely has a place in our squad...

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I don't have a major issue with McTominay but I do think we have gotten ourselves into a position were basically all of our team is available at the right price - if we feel we can re-invest the money elsewhere and increase the overall level of the XI

Ideally, you want a squad of 23 really good players but since we're in such a mess, we don't have that luxury. I'd almost say it's worth leaving ourselves light from a squad perspective if it means we can immediately address the issues with the starting XI.

Case in point, if someone will give us £30m for McT and £50m for Rashford, I'd take that and buy a quality CF/CM/WF - in addition to the targets we already have lined-up (FDJ, Tyrell Malacia etc...)

Zippycup said:

Let me ask you this question.
If Henderson was in the current Manchester United team do you think his vision, movement and passing would be better than McTominays?

Who exactly was McTominay supposed to pass too? You can only have good vision if somebody actually makes a run. The amount of times I've seen our midfield hold on to the ball for too long or making a sideways/backwards pass because no forward player is making a run made me pull my hair out. And I'm bald.

You also stated that Hendersons overall game is better than many made out. I agree.
What do you think changed? The fact that Liverpool started competing or that Henderson got better? I can assure you it's the former.

You are judging one player based on his ability in a world class team and comparing him to a player who is in a team that is so dysfunctional that I'd question their professionalism.

Is McTominay the answer? Who knows. All I will say is he isn't anywhere near as bad as the majority make out.

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Henderson would look worse in United’s team - this is true. But he would still perform better than McTominay because he is a superior footballer in pretty much every way.

Both have been starters for their clubs for the last few years. They are literally both in the centre of their teams. Henderson isn’t a bit-part player picking up medals from the sidelines. He is a key part of Liverpool’s midfield.

United is dysfunctional. But when I look through your team it’s full of players who have played to a very high level - either at United in the past, at former clubs or for their national team.

Ronaldo
Sancho
Rashford
Bruno
Pogba
Varane
Maguire
de Gea

They’ve all had standout seasons or tournaments. They are several major trophy wins within that group of players. There is some basis for the benefit of the doubt outside of their recent disappointing campaign(s) for United. But McT? He has no previous high standards to return to.

Zippycup said:

Let me ask you this question.
If Henderson was in the current Manchester United team do you think his vision, movement and passing would be better than McTominays?

Who exactly was McTominay supposed to pass too? You can only have good vision if somebody actually makes a run. The amount of times I've seen our midfield hold on to the ball for too long or making a sideways/backwards pass because no forward player is making a run made me pull my hair out. And I'm bald.

You also stated that Hendersons overall game is better than many made out. I agree.
What do you think changed? The fact that Liverpool started competing or that Henderson got better? I can assure you it's the former.

You are judging one player based on his ability in a world class team and comparing him to a player who is in a team that is so dysfunctional that I'd question their professionalism.

Is McTominay the answer? Who knows. All I will say is he isn't anywhere near as bad as the majority make out.

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If Henderson were in the current Man Utd team, he would certainly have better vision, movement and passing than McTominay does. Just like Fred, Pogba and Matic are better at all those aspects than Scott is. The overall team performance certainly plays a part in how well a player performs, but you can't just use that as an excuse of why a player has very notable weaknesses in significant aspects of his game. Otherwise you could pick some random player from a relegation team and say that, despite performing poorly himself, it's only because the team as a whole is poor.

Put McTominay in Liverpool and he'd look better than he does for us (although in reality he would barely get a game). Put Henderson at Utd and he'd look worse than he currently does. But Henderson is simply a better player, regardless of the team around him. His level is more similar to the other player that people try to compare Scott to - Fletcher. Whereas I'd say Scott as a central midfielder is closer to Fellaini (maybe slightly above but not much), which is obviously a couple of steps down. He can improve and I'd love to be proven wrong, but I highly doubt he can improve enough.

You mention how bad the team is, but an argument could be had that McTominay is actually having the single biggest impact on that. A central midfielder with poor positioning, poor vision, poor passing, poor movement, poor at winning the ball without giving away needless fouls...almost all our players are going to have to improve but Scott is probably the one who will have to improve the most.

Fred is the one that most of the things you are saying is true for IMO. He does have his limitations but he also has his strengths and mentality on the field, and it's fairly easy to see how he could fit into a well-run midfield.

Daydreamer said:

Which top 4 club would Henderson get into? He captains Liverpool.

I’ve read in this thread (and seen with my own eyes) that McT’s major weakness is receiving the ball under pressure. And that he will surely improve that with coaching.

I would have thought that the ability to receive the ball is fundamental for a midfielder and not something you try to pick up at the age of 25.

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Hmm.. Sir Alex was interested in Henderson when United were the top dog of the League. vHe just worried about potential injury because of Henderson's way of running.

I think you didn't watch the young Henderson much. And before Klopp, Liverpool didn't have good managers also.

Lentwood said:

I don't have a major issue with McTominay but I do think we have gotten ourselves into a position were basically all of our team is available at the right price - if we feel we can re-invest the money elsewhere and increase the overall level of the XI

Ideally, you want a squad of 23 really good players but since we're in such a mess, we don't have that luxury. I'd almost say it's worth leaving ourselves light from a squad perspective if it means we can immediately address the issues with the starting XI.

Case in point, if someone will give us £30m for McT and £50m for Rashford, I'd take that and buy a quality CF/CM/WF - in addition to the targets we already have lined-up (FDJ, Tyrell Malacia etc...)

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And I wouldn't take that. We are talking about two players who are not only good enough to play here, but also want to play here and are United supporters. Especially Rashford. Just over a year ago he was considered the most valuable player on the planet (ahead of M'Bappe). One bad season doesn't all of a sudden mean we put a youth product up for sale.

I think Jordan Henderson is a massively underrated player. He's a much better than he's given credit for. It feels like people think he's only in the team for passion and running about a lot. His touch, passing and positioning are far better than McT's. No chance McT would be anywhere near as good as Henderson in Liverpool's midfield. Having Fabinho behind him isn't going to turn him into a different player. Henderson has been a mainstay in a world class Liverpool team.

Our managers clearly see something in McT, though. He gets talked about highly by all of them, but the stats and eye test aren't showing me what he's offering to the team. You can talk about his teammates not being great, but I see a player that plays consistently worse than whoever his partner is in midfield. People already think/thought that his partners aren't good enough, so why would someone worse than them be good enough?

In a midtable team, I think McT would be a good player. Less pressure and need to be as good on the ball. For a team that should be competing for trophies, we need much better.

probably Roma tbh.

Jose would be drooling if Mct was up for grabs.

He is IMO a like for like for McArthur at Palace, Doucoure at Everton/Watford. Basically he is good enough to do a job for lower mid table teams

Three clubs.

West Ham/Everton/Leicester

SadlerMUFC said:

And I wouldn't take that. We are talking about two players who are not only good enough to play here, but also want to play here and are United supporters. Especially Rashford. Just over a year ago he was considered the most valuable player on the planet (ahead of M'Bappe). One bad season doesn't all of a sudden mean we put a youth product up for sale.

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If you look at my post-History though, I have never been a Rashford fan and I'd say apart from the little purple-patch at the beginning of his career, he's never shown the level of form required consistently to be a starter in a good Manchester United side. I don't want to hear about that "20 goals in all comps" season either, for a multitude of reasons, but mainly because we played about 60 games and half of those were penalties!

Generally I like your positivity and willingness to defend the players so I'm not looking for an argument. Personally, my belief is Rashford was never a £70/£80m player, so we should have taken that when we had the chance. Likewise, going back to my earlier point, it's not that I don't rate McTominay, it's just that again, he's never going to be good enough to be a starter in a 'top' Manchester United side.

So what do we do? Hang on to these players and rest assured we have good backup options for a 'quite good' XI or do we take the money and invest in the first-team? I'd do that, personally. Similar to how Liverpool evolved from being a poor side with loads of players, to a good side with about 13/14 good players, to all of a sudden being a good side and having a really good squad.

MadDogg said:

If Henderson were in the current Man Utd team, he would certainly have better vision, movement and passing than McTominay does. Just like Fred, Pogba and Matic are better at all those aspects than Scott is. The overall team performance certainly plays a part in how well a player performs, but you can't just use that as an excuse of why a player has very notable weaknesses in significant aspects of his game. Otherwise you could pick some random player from a relegation team and say that, despite performing poorly himself, it's only because the team as a whole is poor.

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Vision for what? How can you make a pass that isn’t there? If he played the ball into the channel he would be passing it to nobody, our forward players simply didn’t move last season. I’ve never seen a team as static.
Just look at the way RR has the Austria national team pressing after only a couple of games. Our players are lazy they refused to make runs, refused to press and refused to fight for the team. Look at the Liverpool games. We were as static as statues. It was embarrassing to watch professional football players give up the way they did.
You’re trying to use Pogba as a stick to beat McTominay with really? Pogba is arguably the worst signing in the club’s history. Come on. As for Matic. He was slower than a tortoise and couldn’t play a full game.
Fred probably had his best season for us in a United shirt, but his passes are usually short and direct. Personally, I think he will shine under ten Hag

MadDogg said:

Put McTominay in Liverpool and he'd look better than he does for us (although in reality he would barely get a game). Put Henderson at Utd and he'd look worse than he currently does. But Henderson is simply a better player, regardless of the team around him. His level is more similar to the other player that people try to compare Scott to - Fletcher. Whereas I'd say Scott as a central midfielder is closer to Fellaini (maybe slightly above but not much), which is obviously a couple of steps down. He can improve and I'd love to be proven wrong, but I highly doubt he can improve enough.

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You would be saying the exact same thing about Henderson if he played for United as you do for McTominay. Id guarantee it. Liverpool fans were saying it about Henderson before the team started to become successful.
I’ve said this before. You only see the benefit of a player like McTominay when he is playing in a winning team. He does all the dirty work, he follows the managers instructions to the letter. He does the type of work that goes unnoticed by fans, but is appreciated by those within the game. I posted a thread in the newbie section in regards to social media and the effect it has on fans perception of players. McTominay falls into that category

MadDogg said:

You mention how bad the team is, but an argument could be had that McTominay is actually having the single biggest impact on that. A central midfielder with poor positioning, poor vision, poor passing, poor movement, poor at winning the ball without giving away needless fouls...almost all our players are going to have to improve but Scott is probably the one who will have to improve the most.

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Even you can’t believe that. No player had a good season last year and it was simply down to lack of effort, lack of professionalism and lack of belief.
I’ll ask again. Who was he supposed to pass too? There was no movement

Lentwood said:

If you look at my post-History though, I have never been a Rashford fan and I'd say apart from the little purple-patch at the beginning of his career, he's never shown the level of form required consistently to be a starter in a good Manchester United side. I don't want to hear about that "20 goals in all comps" season either, for a multitude of reasons, but mainly because we played about 60 games and half of those were penalties!

Generally I like your positivity and willingness to defend the players so I'm not looking for an argument. Personally, my belief is Rashford was never a £70/£80m player, so we should have taken that when we had the chance. Likewise, going back to my earlier point, it's not that I don't rate McTominay, it's just that again, he's never going to be good enough to be a starter in a 'top' Manchester United side.

So what do we do? Hang on to these players and rest assured we have good backup options for a 'quite good' XI or do we take the money and invest in the first-team? I'd do that, personally. Similar to how Liverpool evolved from being a poor side with loads of players, to a good side with about 13/14 good players, to all of a sudden being a good side and having a really good squad.

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To improve a team first you have to get rid of the worst players and replace them with better. Start at the bottom. Sell the players who just aren't going to be good enough for the first team (Rashford has proved that he is despite your "opinion"). We are Manchester United. We are not meant to "cash in" on players. We buy high and sell low. That's how top clubs are meant to operate (other than the odd sale). So take last year out of the equation and there is only one player in our team who is better than Rashford on the left wing and that's Sancho. So why sell your second best left winger? And please don't say Elanga is better. He isn't. It's just that the expectations on him are lower.

SadlerMUFC said:

To improve a team first you have to get rid of the worst players and replace them with better. Start at the bottom. Sell the players who just aren't going to be good enough for the first team (Rashford has proved that he is despite your "opinion"). We are Manchester United. We are not meant to "cash in" on players. We buy high and sell low. That's how top clubs are meant to operate (other than the odd sale). So take last year out of the equation and there is only one player in our team who is better than Rashford on the left wing and that's Sancho. So why sell your second best left winger? And please don't say Elanga is better. He isn't. It's just that the expectations on him are lower.

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Yes, all great in theory, but who is going to take our 'worst players' and if they do, how much can we realistically get for them?

My entire point revolves around all of our players being available at the right price, if we think we can re-invest the money in more +EV areas

In brief, would you rather have three lads who can do a good job on the left but only FDJ in CM and no support for Ronaldo - or would you rather sell one of the 3 we have on the left and use that money to buy a second top CM or a really brilliant young striker? I agree Sancho is first choice. Personally, I don't think there's a huge amount between Elanga and Rashford. Rashford probably has or had a higher ceiling but Elanga works harder and is tougher/more dynamic. Since we could probably get more money for Rashford....that's what I would do.

Honestly?

McTominay is a Championship level midfielder, and that's a fact.

If it wasn't for him coming through the academy, he would have been shipped off, a long time ago.

He can't pass the ball, his positional awareness is terrible, and he is just an all-around liability, whenever he plays for us.

Zippycup said:

Vision for what? How can you make a pass that isn’t there? If he played the ball into the channel he would be passing it to nobody, our forward players simply didn’t move last season. I’ve never seen a team as static.
Just look at the way RR has the Austria national team pressing after only a couple of games. Our players are lazy they refused to make runs, refused to press and refused to fight for the team. Look at the Liverpool games. We were as static as statues. It was embarrassing to watch professional football players give up the way they did.
You’re trying to use Pogba as a stick to beat McTominay with really? Pogba is arguably the worst signing in the club’s history. Come on. As for Matic. He was slower than a tortoise and couldn’t play a full game.
Fred probably had his best season for us in a United shirt, but his passes are usually short and direct. Personally, I think he will shine under ten Hag

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As an overall player for what they bring to the team, I'm more than happy to say that McTominay was a more important midfielder than Pogba and Matic have been the last couple of seasons. I've said it multiple times during those seasons. That's very much a sad indictment on them though than anything positive about McTominay. Despite all his limitations and weaknesses, he still provided a better base and stability than what they did with their incredible inconsistency.

But we're talking specifically about vision, movement and passing. You seem to be saying that what McTominay was providing was the best you could possibly get in a dysfunctional team, yet all three of our other midfielders prove that wrong. They all found it much easier to move into the correct spaces to get on the ball, and then have the vision and the ability to play better passes than what Scott does. They aren't even particularly great at it themselves, yet they are still clearly better at it. It wasn't just last season either, which is the other thing you seem to be claiming. It's been a constant throughout his entire time in the team (although admittedly the lack of movement around him is something that's also been there his entire time). Henderson would also do it better than what McTominay would, as would I suspect over half the first choice midfielders in the Premier League. It's a massive weakness of Scott's, no matter how the team around him performs.

Zippycup said:

You would be saying the exact same thing about Henderson if he played for United as you do for McTominay. Id guarantee it. Liverpool fans were saying it about Henderson before the team started to become successful.
I’ve said this before. You only see the benefit of a player like McTominay when he is playing in a winning team. He does all the dirty work, he follows the managers instructions to the letter. He does the type of work that goes unnoticed by fans, but is appreciated by those within the game. I posted a thread in the newbie section in regards to social media and the effect it has on fans perception of players. McTominay falls into that category

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If I get your point right, you're saying that the negative perception of McTominay is related to social media and how they talk about him?

I would actually make the exact opposite argument with McTominay. For most of his time here social media and the media in general has been incredibly kind to him, treating him much nicer than what they have most other players in our team despite them outperforming him. His normal partner Fred is the obvious example; the level of criticism and outright dislike for him absolutely dwarfs what Scott has had, yet he's been comfortably better pretty much the entire time. It was only during last season that it started to change a bit and the media started highlighting Scott's flaws.

The one thing I will say is that there have been the odd games here and there which has given me hope that Scott does actually have the ability to do much better than what he has, but he just needs the correct training. And I'm not talking about the matches against Leeds or whatnot where he does well on a purely individual level. As a central midfielder his most important job is to, in one way or another, provide the framework for the team to function and perform better. He did it for a few matches when Rangnick took over, I remember he did it very well against Spurs in 20/21, and he did have a period in 18/19 (or it may have even been 17/18) where he seemed to be developing that aspect. The issue is that those are basically the only times he's done the most important basics of a central midfielder well. If he was younger I'd have more hope that maybe ETH could develop that aspect of him, but I just see it as very unlikely at this point. As I said before though, I'd love for him to prove me wrong. I certainly don't have any personal dislike for him or anything.

Leicester, West Ham, Brighton

Leeds, Celtic, Forest

BootsyCollins said:

Exactly this

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Don’t Everton have pretty good CDM duo? Don’t think he’d actually get into the Everton team, or West Ham team.

SadlerMUFC said:

To improve a team first you have to get rid of the worst players and replace them with better. Start at the bottom. Sell the players who just aren't going to be good enough for the first team (Rashford has proved that he is despite your "opinion"). We are Manchester United. We are not meant to "cash in" on players. We buy high and sell low. That's how top clubs are meant to operate (other than the odd sale). So take last year out of the equation and there is only one player in our team who is better than Rashford on the left wing and that's Sancho. So why sell your second best left winger? And please don't say Elanga is better. He isn't. It's just that the expectations on him are lower.

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Rashford was good enough for the team United has been since SAF's retirement. Bang average. If we're going to genuinely move up a few gears he won't be anywhere near the team.

DeGea’sFeet said:

Don’t Everton have pretty good CDM duo? Don’t think he’d actually get into the Everton team, or West Ham team.

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Maybe not, But i still think thats a fair list of teams that would want to buy him.

Newcastle, West Ham, Roma

A lot of West Hams here, Rice and Soucek are easily better. Perhaps he would have a rotating squad role fitting in case of injury and Moyes would probably like his attitude/him being Scottish. So he may be interested since the question is buying him for a certain price, but not to start.

On the other hand Rushden & Diamonds, Wimbledon, Stockport County.

Wolves, Celtic, Roma

KeanoMagicHat said:

A lot of West Hams here, Rice and Soucek are easily better. Perhaps he would have a rotating squad role fitting in case of injury and Moyes would probably like his attitude/him being Scottish. So he may be interested since the question is buying him for a certain price, but not to start.

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I’ve become strangely fascinated by this question. When you consider the deeper midfielders of the 17 teams that remained in the league…

City - Rodri
Liverpool - Fabinho
Chelsea - Kante
Spurs - Bissouma
Arsenal - Partey
United - McTominay
West Ham - Rice
Leicester - Ndidi
Brighton - ?????
Wolves - Neves
Newcastle - Guimaraes
Palace - Doucoure
Brentford - Norgard
Villa - Luiz
Southampton - Romeu
Everton - Allan
Leeds - ?????

It’s really hard to make a case for McTominay starting ahead of many of them. Brighton and Leeds are on the lookout for new blood in the engine room. Maybe they’ll make a bid.

I do think it raises an interesting point about Academy players. The odds are massively stacked against any individual player making it, but once they do it buys them a great deal of good will.

Everton, Crystal Palace, Forest.

Daydreamer said:

I’ve become strangely fascinated by this question. When you consider the deeper midfielders of the 17 teams that remained in the league…

City - Rodri
Liverpool - Fabinho
Chelsea - Kante
Spurs - Bissouma
Arsenal - Partey
United - McTominay
West Ham - Rice
Leicester - Ndidi
Brighton - ?????
Wolves - Neves
Newcastle - Guimaraes
Palace - Doucoure
Brentford - Norgard
Villa - Luiz
Southampton - Romeu
Everton - Allan
Leeds - ?????

It’s really hard to make a case for McTominay starting ahead of many of them. Brighton and Leeds are on the lookout for new blood in the engine room. Maybe they’ll make a bid.

I do think it raises an interesting point about Academy players. The odds are massively stacked against any individual player making it, but once they do it buys them a great deal of good will.

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Yep in that context I’ve always found it amazing just how many appearances he’s had for United as a starter, relative to his ability. He often doesn’t stand out for Scotland, where McGinn looks better and they often stick him in CB just to fit him in. His positioning is poor and lets too many players past him to be an elite DM, while he’s not good enough technically to be an attacking midfielder. Driving forward from midfielder as an extra scoring option in a limited team is his level I think.

Bit pricey as a backup but West Ham ran Soucek into the ground and #8 in counter attacking side playing a back 4 is probably his idea role, so I think that would be a good fit footballing wise.

Southampton’s attacking mids aren’t very good, so maybe they could buy McTominay and play JWP narrow on the left, get him closer to goal.

Lentwood said:

Yes, all great in theory, but who is going to take our 'worst players' and if they do, how much can we realistically get for them?

My entire point revolves around all of our players being available at the right price, if we think we can re-invest the money in more +EV areas

In brief, would you rather have three lads who can do a good job on the left but only FDJ in CM and no support for Ronaldo - or would you rather sell one of the 3 we have on the left and use that money to buy a second top CM or a really brilliant young striker? I agree Sancho is first choice. Personally, I don't think there's a huge amount between Elanga and Rashford. Rashford probably has or had a higher ceiling but Elanga works harder and is tougher/more dynamic. Since we could probably get more money for Rashford....that's what I would do.

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I would not sell Rashford or McTominay. Rashford is a very talented player who just had a poor year. You don't improve by selling your best players. And I get the feeling McTominay is more respected in the dressing room and around the league than he is within our own fanbase. If I'm going to sell a player who has been a constant in our starting 11 it won't be one who bleeds United through and through. McTominay is not an issue. The issue is that he should be a squad player, not a starter week in and week out. But he can have a very important role in the team and I would sell a player like Fred before I sold McTominay

Shark said:

Rashford was good enough for the team United has been since SAF's retirement. Bang average. If we're going to genuinely move up a few gears he won't be anywhere near the team.

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He has not been bang average. Last year he was poor. Prior to that he's been one of our best players...

Leeds, Celtic, Aberdeen

Zippycup said:

Let me ask you this question.
If Henderson was in the current Manchester United team do you think his vision, movement and passing would be better than McTominays?

Who exactly was McTominay supposed to pass too? You can only have good vision if somebody actually makes a run. The amount of times I've seen our midfield hold on to the ball for too long or making a sideways/backwards pass because no forward player is making a run made me pull my hair out. And I'm bald.

You also stated that Hendersons overall game is better than many made out. I agree.
What do you think changed? The fact that Liverpool started competing or that Henderson got better? I can assure you it's the former.

You are judging one player based on his ability in a world class team and comparing him to a player who is in a team that is so dysfunctional that I'd question their professionalism.

Is McTominay the answer? Who knows. All I will say is he isn't anywhere near as bad as the majority make out.

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A good question to ask once he stops fecking hiding and actually receives the ball.

SadlerMUFC said:

He has not been bang average. Last year he was poor. Prior to that he's been one of our best players...

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That's my point though. He's been best of a bad bunch even when he was firing. He's never reached the heights of players like Salah, Mane or even Sterling. We need to strive for a new standard not reward mediocrity with bumper contracts.

BootsyCollins said:

Exactly this

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No room for Roma? Jose loves him.

I don't think Scott is good enough to play midfield for the top 3/4s of the league.

I'd say he's upper championship or relegation quality at best.

Anyone saying that he's a victim of circumstances at United must have missed his performance vs Republic of Ireland (where he stuck out as being terrible on a field full of terrible midfielders).

He definitely can't play passes that aren't there, the problem is that he can't play the passes that are there either.

If ETH turns him into a champions league quality midfielder he is up there with Klopp/ Pep for me.

Henderson comparisons are way off IMO, if I had to compare him to any recent Liverpool midfielder it would probably be Emre Can (and even then Can was better).

McTerminator said:

No room for Roma? Jose loves him.

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He got Matic

SadlerMUFC said:

He has not been bang average. Last year he was poor. Prior to that he's been one of our best players...

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Rashford has only been one of our best players for one season. 19/20. And even then it was really only for the first half of the season before his back injury.

Before that season he was very inconsistent. Which wasn't too big of a deal considering his age and the fact he did tend to play well against top teams, but he certainly wasn't one of our best. Then in 20/21 he did get a good amount of goals and assists, but it was the classic example of stats not showing the full story as his general performances were almost as poor as they were last season. There was a reason so many people were already criticising him for the exact same things that became even more obvious last season.

I find it strange how many people tend to go to the extremes with Rashford. They either talk about him as if he was a great player up until last season, or they make out that he was never that good and never showed the talent necessary. The reality is that he certainly had the talent and showed it in glimpses, but in his entire career he only put it together consistently for half a season.