‘No value in the market’ - 2026

[Josep Dowling]

I think the worrying point is season after season we are now missing out on top targets. When City are outspending United I can understand as they have a bottomless pit of money. When Spurs take one of your key signings that when you have to worry. United are no where near competing and falling further behind.

We still don’t get our business done early, we still don’t sign enough players when we get back into the Champions League, we still can’t seem to find enough good quality players outside of very obvious targets. The club has got player recruitment wrong for so long. The minute we knew Casemiro was leaving they should have had their top target sewn up quickly.

 

[sp_cgb]

I just don’t want us buying players because they are cheap. Well, there is scope for that amongst all recruitment, but we definitely need to be bringing in at least one midfielder this summer whose selling point is not that he was attractively priced. I suspect we have signed Ederson because he was cheap. We have briefed that Bruno Guimaraes is too old for our recruitment strategy at 28, yet seem to have briefed that Sander Berge is not at 28, presumably because he costs less. If this ownership just approaches recruitment by shopping in the reduced aisle I fear we will not move forward as a team.

While I actually agree that pulling out of the Fernandes wasn't the worst decision considering the circumstances, I also very much agree with your point here.

It's all fine and dandy to draw a line in the sand sometimes, when a deal is clearly manipulated by agents/intermediaries to extract maximum value for themselves. Though to persevere with some sort of rigid stance from now on, that we won't move for players as soon there's moderate competition and a bit of a price push, will undeniably lead to us being left behind in this current league environment. We arguably overpaid for both Mbeumo and Sesko last season, but in term reaped the rewards, because they're quite obviously really good players and improved us greatly. So in certain cases some uncompromising value approach shouldn't be the primary driving force for our recruitment decisions. I don't think any big club out there, with the stated objective to win the biggest trophies, operates like that. We will have to act as an actual sporting institution first and a business second, if we ever want to reclaim our spot again.

 

[Bilbo]

I think we should have gotten the player, and I think it’s becoming very clear to all that we should have got the player.

Despite your attempts to ram this point home throughtout the thread, which you're entitled to do as you clearly feel strongly about it, I see the majority of posters feeling the opposite.

We all wanted the player, but not at any cost. You simply cannot justify the salary package. It undoes, or at least threatens to which is enough, everything the clubs been trying to do to control our wage bill. Something thats taken several years to do.

I think the squad would accept a player coming in on near Bruno money, and i think the club WILL spend a near 9 figure sum, if they were seasoned, experienced quality. Fernandes isnt even close to being that. He might never be that.

Time to move on from this player and wait and see what the club manage to achieve in this window.

 

[Trigestis]

Why do people post such juvenile drivel as if it strengthens their argument, who exactly is making the bolded point? Obviously no one because it's a stupid point.

The data had Anderson and Fernandes as stand outs across the top 5 leagues for the role we were looking to fill. That's why, so no not 'just because'

People are talking up trusting our data teams process whilst at the same time downplaying the key data because it doesn't suit their views.

How exactly do you have any insight whatsoever into what data we're using? Assuming you're right, are you actually saying/believing Mateus Fernandes is the second best midfielder available in the world?

He isn't a stand-out midfielder talent, so yes, it would be spending 85m on a midfielder just because we need a midfielder. There are a bunch of midfielders like him in the world at any time. If the data considered him to be the second best target in the world that's available at this present time, then maybe we should just wait instead of wasting 85m on a midfielder that's not particularly special? It would be repeating the same mistakes that we've been laughed at for years. Rabiot is better than him and he cost AC Milan £7m, and it may be a poor example given his age, but you get the idea.

 

[Rozay]

Despite your attempts to ram this point home throughtout the thread, which you're entitled to do as you clearly feel strongly about it, I see the majority of posters feeling the opposite.

We all wanted the player, but not at any cost. You simply cannot justify the salary package. It undoes, or at least threatens to which is enough, everything the clubs been trying to do to control our wage bill. Something thats taken several years to do.

I think the squad would accept a player coming in on near Bruno money, and i think the club WILL spend a near 9 figure sum, if they were seasoned, experienced quality. Fernandes isnt even close to being that. He might never be that.

Time to move on from this player and wait and see what the club manage to achieve in this window.

I don’t think the majority of posters feel differently. And even if they do, my feeling is many of them will not as we move through the weeks. When we are going after underwhelming (albeit cheaper) midfielders all summer, and there seems no prospect of either a top shelf player or top shelf talent, the idea that the last one that was available slipped through our fingers because we didn’t want to push 5-10% on our offer will look more questionable.

I’ve said all along, if we go and get Zaire-Emery or Neves for the same or less, you won’t hear a word from me. Fernandes isn’t the only top young midfielder in the game. But he is the best one who was available this summer. Or second best maybe, after Anderson.

So many posters seem to care more about balance sheet than the football team. I’m not saying we should have bought Fernandes for 150m. His price, and wages, is money we are capable of spending, it wouldn’t break our record, and is in our position of greatest need. If we can get s better midfielder than Fernandes this summer, I’d be delighted, as that’s ultimately my main priority - not winning a moral expenditure window. But I am not optimistic. And the difference between 80m and 85m or the difference between £170k and 195k isn’t significant enough to have us in this position that looks like scrambling now to find quality midfield additions. And the prices out there are not even much better.

 

[Frank Grimes]

I preferred when we used to sign players 'over the odds'.

 

[Bilbo]

I don’t think the majority of posters feel differently. And even if they do, my feeling is many of them will not as we move through the weeks. When we are going after underwhelming (albeit cheaper) midfielders all summer, and there seems no prospect of either a top shelf player or top shelf talent, the idea that the last one that was available slipped through our fingers because we didn’t want to push 5-10% on our offer will look more questionable.

I’ve said all along, if we go and get Zaire-Emery or Neves for the same or less, you won’t hear a word from me. Fernandes isn’t the only top young midfielder in the game. But he is the best one who was available this summer. Or second best maybe, after Anderson.

So many posters seem to care more about balance sheet than the football team. I’m not saying we should have bought Fernandes for 150m. His price, and wages, is money we are capable of spending, it wouldn’t break our record, and is in our position of greatest need. If we can get s better midfielder than Fernandes this summer, I’d be delighted, as that’s ultimately my main priority - not winning a moral expenditure window. But I am not optimistic. And the difference between 80m and 85m or the difference between £170k and 195k isn’t significant enough to have us in this position that looks like scrambling now to find quality midfield additions. And the prices out there are not even much better.

Personally I dont think you're giving anywhere near enough consideration on how negatively it could, IMO would, impact the dressing room if we bought in this type of player on £13m a season.

I dont expect you to agree though, so for me I think the time to re-enter this thread is when we've seen what the club have done at the end of the window.

 

[Rozay]

I preferred when we used to sign players 'over the odds'.

We shouldn’t be stupid, but there is obviously a right time to do just that.

I gave the example earlier about when Bayern lost Lewandowski. The right player was far more important to Bayern than the right price. As it turns out, they broke their transfer record and also gave Kane £400k. They just lost a big part of their team, their main source of goals. They were absolutely right to not just ‘go and get a different cheaper player’. If Kane was the guy they identified, the need demanded they got Kane. The only issue would have been Kane not wanting them, and I’m sure giving him £400k was part of ensuring he did.

Our midfield situation is similar. We have lost Casemiro directly from our first XI, in a pivotal (literally) position. If we thought Fernandes was the guy, then this isn’t the transfer to approach frugally. Of greater importance is getting the man. I’m not saying we couldn’t have abandoned Ederson because we only wanted to pay 30m and not 35m. But based on us offering 85m, I am presuming that we identified Fernandes as the main guy we wanted to bring in for midfield. If he was just a ‘nice to have’, fair enough, but the bid doesn’t suggest that to me. He is not Harry Kane, but he was Harry Kane enough for us to be bidding big numbers for him, so I think we saw him as our Harry Kane in the circumstances. And even if not, the player that we did was Anderson, yet we still went with the ‘not interested at those figures’ line. We seem to be approaching this midfield rebuild without the required emphasis to me.

This is the time to put the player above the price. Not every time, but definitely this time, IMO.

 

[Rozay]

Personally I dont think you're giving anywhere near enough consideration on how negatively it could, IMO would, impact the dressing room if we bought in this type of player on £13m a season.

I dont expect you to agree though, so for me I think the time to re-enter this thread is when we've seen what the club have done at the end of the window.

Well what about Anderson? Our ‘priority target’. Was he too much too? We just seem to be prioritising building our midfield on a budget rather than with the best players. This midfield summer has been coming for years now. I expected more so far that’s all.

As you said, we’ll see what happens at the end of the window. It also depends on how you want to judge our summer at the end of the window. Will our success be measured by net spend or quality of player we bring in? Fernandes isn’t the best midfielder in the world. But I doubt the better ones are for sale. But we will see.

 

[Rudi Skacel]

Patrick Berg has been an absolute stand out tonight and he wouldn't cost all that much. Might be worth a look.

 

[Frank Grimes]

We shouldn’t be stupid, but there is obviously a right time to do just that.

I gave the example earlier about when Bayern lost Lewandowski. The right player was far more important to Bayern than the right price. As it turns out, they broke their transfer record and also gave Kane £400k. They just lost a big part of their team, their main source of goals. They were absolutely right to not just ‘go and get a different cheaper player’. If Kane was the guy they identified, the need demanded they got Kane. The only issue would have been Kane not wanting them, and I’m sure giving him £400k was part of ensuring he did.

Our midfield situation is similar. We have lost Casemiro directly from our first XI, in a pivotal (literally) position. If we thought Fernandes was the guy, then this isn’t the transfer to approach frugally. Of greater importance is getting the man. I’m not saying we couldn’t have abandoned Ederson because we only wanted to pay 30m and not 35m. But based on us offering 85m, I am presuming that we identified Fernandes as the main guy we wanted to bring in for midfield. If he was just a ‘nice to have’, fair enough, but the bid doesn’t suggest that to me. He is not Harry Kane, but he was Harry Kane enough for us to be bidding big numbers for him, so I think we saw him as our Harry Kane in the circumstances. And even if not, the player that we did was Anderson, yet we still went with the ‘not interested at those figures’ line. We seem to be approaching this midfield rebuild without the required emphasis to me.

This is the time to put the player above the price. Not every time, but definitely this time, IMO.

Agree, it's very situational. Good post.

 

[Adamsk7]

We needed quality midfielders to take our team on. They have so far failed miserably no matter what you think of the prices for the players that have moved. If we end up with Sander Berge and Santos we should riot. We won't, but we should

 

[sp_cgb]

We shouldn’t be stupid, but there is obviously a right time to do just that.

I gave the example earlier about when Bayern lost Lewandowski. The right player was far more important to Bayern than the right price. As it turns out, they broke their transfer record and also gave Kane £400k. They just lost a big part of their team, their main source of goals. They were absolutely right to not just ‘go and get a different cheaper player’. If Kane was the guy they identified, the need demanded they got Kane. The only issue would have been Kane not wanting them, and I’m sure giving him £400k was part of ensuring he did.

Our midfield situation is similar. We have lost Casemiro directly from our first XI, in a pivotal (literally) position. If we thought Fernandes was the guy, then this isn’t the transfer to approach frugally. Of greater importance is getting the man. I’m not saying we couldn’t have abandoned Ederson because we only wanted to pay 30m and not 35m. But based on us offering 85m, I am presuming that we identified Fernandes as the main guy we wanted to bring in for midfield. If he was just a ‘nice to have’, fair enough, but the bid doesn’t suggest that to me. He is not Harry Kane, but he was Harry Kane enough for us to be bidding big numbers for him, so I think we saw him as our Harry Kane in the circumstances. And even if not, the player that we did was Anderson, yet we still went with the ‘not interested at those figures’ line. We seem to be approaching this midfield rebuild without the required emphasis to me.

This is the time to put the player above the price. Not every time, but definitely this time, IMO.

As you say, pulling out of the Fernandes deal isn't an inherently wrong decision, even if he was high on our list. It will become a major mistake though, if our alternative plan is to go for average, cheaper candidates just to patch up the midfield again and essentially kick the can down the road. If we do that, then not stretching the budget a little more to secure the deal will obviously have to be seen as a massive blunder.

 

[Someone]

At the end of the day if our goal is to compete for the league and the CL, then we need to build teams equal or stronger than our competition. Our only true star is 31 years old, and we aren't going to bridge the gap by trying to find value in the market.

We also need to remember that we probably wasted close to a billion trying to find a long term top midfielder in the past 15 years or so and the last decent one is still Carrick. We chronically get midfield signings wrong. So saving few millions from top targets doesn't mean we're going to save any money long term. It looks like we're going to spend around 150m this summer on 3 ok players, but we needed the best quality possible and we aren't getting that.

I really believe the current ambition is to stay in europe, and the focus this summer is to add numbers because the squad is thin, but I doubt we'll be going for any top quality players, and I predict that we'll crash and burn next season.

 

[Bwuk]

I don’t get all the bed wetting. Fernandes was never going to be signed to start next to Mainoo. He’d of been an option to replace/rotate with Mainoo but that’s not the priority, and for a non priority signing it’s a lot of £££.

Anderson - huge loss but he didn’t want to come. Is what it is.

Neither of those two would win us the league. Which has to be the aim.

 

[Frank Grimes]

Not securing Fernandes has made this window a failure. We can spin it whenever way we want but when you lose out to Spurs for an important player it is disgusting, abject decision making.

This is what you get when you let 'ex' city into Old Trafford.

 

[KStandBarmyArmy1993]

Of course - we will be buying Everton (no disrespect) quality players and we will by paying Everton fees and Everton wages.


If offered a chance would you pay 200 mil and pay 400k pw for Prime Messi? I guess not.

I think everyone would agree that 200 million for prime Messi would be worth it.

The issue people are having is spending 85 million on a player who is still young, still relatively inexperienced at the highest level and who's career could go in a million different directions. If we'd spent that money on Fernandes and it wasn't an immediate success, the same people would be having a meltdown saying we need to be careful about our reckless spending again.

Not securing Fernandes has made this window a failure. We can spin it whenever way we want but when you lose out to Spurs for an important player it is disgusting, abject decision making.

This is what you get when you let 'ex' city into

Are we talking about the same Mateus Fernandes here? Not sure if you're on a wind up here or not.

I don’t get all the bed wetting. Fernandes was never going to be signed to start next to Mainoo. He’d of been an option to replace/rotate with Mainoo but that’s not the priority, and for a non priority signing it’s a lot of £££.

Anderson - huge loss but he didn’t want to come. Is what it is.

Neither of those two would win us the league. Which has to be the aim.

This is the best point I've seen on here for ages.

If we're all agreeing that Mainoo is a starter then we need someone to compliment him. Fernandes isn't that man.

And if anything the thing we're gonna miss most about Casemiro is his experience at the highest level. Again, you're not getting that with him or Anderson.

I'm very much of the opinion that we need three midfielders this window. Two squad players and that almost guaranteed starter. Ederson and Santos for around 80 million (same price as Fernandes...) combined is about 10 million too much perhaps but at strengthens the depth in that area of the pitch. The priority then is getting that Casemiro replacement.

 

[Red Comet]

Neither of those two would win us the league. Which has to be the aim.

Not that I disagree with your points on Anderson and Fernandes, I’m just curious from your perspective which player on the market right now would you think as being capable of “winning us the league”, is available for a reasonable price, and wants to come to Utd.

 

[sp_cgb]

I don’t get all the bed wetting. Fernandes was never going to be signed to start next to Mainoo. He’d of been an option to replace/rotate with Mainoo but that’s not the priority, and for a non priority signing it’s a lot of £££.

Anderson - huge loss but he didn’t want to come. Is what it is.

Neither of those two would win us the league. Which has to be the aim.

Again. No issues on my end not playing West Ham/Mendes' game and as a consequence pulling out of the Fernandes deal. But if there's no real, solid alternative plan in place as to where we realistically go next, then what have we been doing for last two to six months preparing for this window? Players like Tyler Adams, Berge, Santos and whatnot can't be the vision to set us up for a title challenge as per our CEO's own words. If at the end of this summer, there's no Tchouameni, or equally established top class, ready-made player among our options to slot into midfield, they will simply have failed miserably.

That latest Simon Stone article, while utterly boring, makes for grim reading. They better have some aces up their sleeves over the next few weeks and once the World Cup is fully winding down. Otherwise we're in trouble. No matter how positive anyone wants to be about next season. The competition will be fierce and is not resting on their laurels either.

 

[AndySmith1990]

Again. No issues on my end not playing West Ham/Mendes' game and as a consequence pulling out of the Fernandes deal. But if there's no real, solid alternative plan in place as to where we realistically go next, then what have we been doing for last two to six months preparing for this window? Players like Tyler Adams, Berge, Santos and whatnot can't be the vision to set us up for a title challenge as per our CEO's own words. If at the end of this summer, there's no Tchouameni, or equally established top class, ready-made player among our options to slot into midfield, they will simply have failed miserably.

That latest Simon Stone article, while utterly boring, makes for grim reading. They better have some aces up their sleeves over the next few weeks and once the World Cup is fully winding down. Otherwise we're in trouble. No matter how positive anyone wants to be about next season. The competition will be fierce and is not resting on their laurels either.

People are always dramatic during transfer windows and proclaim stuff like "competition will be fierce". I think the problem is there seems to be this automatic assumption that every player our rivals buy will be a success, so we're going yo be left behind.

Spurs have been buying players that looked decent for years, and they've finished 17th for the past two seasons. Liverpool had the greatest transfer window in the history of transfer windows, and got worse.

We comfortably finished 3rd and so far have only lost Casemiro. As long as we adequately replace him we're no worse than last season, and there's no reason being as good as last season won't see us back in the top 4.

At the end of the day, buying no one would be preferable to spending hundreds of millions on utter fecking dross like Antony, Sancho, and countless other fools we've wasted money on

 

[Borys]

People are always dramatic during transfer windows and proclaim stuff like "competition will be fierce". I think the problem is there seems to be this automatic assumption that every player our rivals buy will be a success, so we're going yo be left behind.

Spurs have been buying players that looked decent for years, and they've finished 17th for the past two seasons. Liverpool had the greatest transfer window in the history of transfer windows, and got worse.

I don't think this is really a major worry for United fans when it comes to Fernandes/Tonali joining Spurs. The problem is none of our supposed targets is anywhere close to joining United, and we look close to going for Plan D/E (?).

We comfortably finished 3rd and so far have only lost Casemiro. As long as we adequately replace him we're no worse than last season, and there's no reason being as good as last season won't see us back in the top 4.

At the end of the day, buying no one would be preferable to spending hundreds of millions on utter fecking dross like Antony, Sancho, and countless other fools we've wasted money on

Surely this isn't the whole case though as we are going to play significantly more games next season. In fact, even if Casemiro stayed for another year we would be in big big trouble as one of the main reasons he had a good campaing is because he could spend 4 days after each game soaking feet in hot water - and still had a few days to train for the next one (meaning he had a lot of rest, a luxury that our midfield won't be given next season).

The reason we are properly fecked is because we need both quality AND the numbers. We are going to overpay one way or another, imo this is inevitable considering the situation we are in. And I don't blame the club for pulling out of Fernandes deal, all of this is to be judged once the transfer window is closed.

 

[sp_cgb]

People are always dramatic during transfer windows and proclaim stuff like "competition will be fierce". I think the problem is there seems to be this automatic assumption that every player our rivals buy will be a success, so we're going yo be left behind.

Spurs have been buying players that looked decent for years, and they've finished 17th for the past two seasons. Liverpool had the greatest transfer window in the history of transfer windows, and got worse.

We comfortably finished 3rd and so far have only lost Casemiro. As long as we adequately replace him we're no worse than last season, and there's no reason being as good as last season won't see us back in the top 4.

At the end of the day, buying no one would be preferable to spending hundreds of millions on utter fecking dross like Antony, Sancho, and countless other fools we've wasted money on

I must've missed the part where I suggested the club waste our money on "dross", but ah yes so very ("fecking" perhaps?) dramatic of me to suggest, that there will be fierce competition next season and we're currently ill equipped for it. Pardon me.

Of course it's your prerogative to think otherwise. Such is the nature of having an opinion on a message board.

 

[RickFlairsHair]

Not sure why this is so difficult...

United were correct in that Fernandes (who is somewhat overrated) for £80m+ is not good value and made the right call not to buy him.

United were also powerless that City, unfortunately, have greater pull now than us and thus had no chance of signing Anderson (who is underrated on here for some reason).

United, overall and in the absence of any rumours to the contrary, are not winning this summer transfer window. Value exists outside of Fernandes & Anderson, and we're not finding it.

 

[Champ]

But we’re not prepared to pay for the most promising players, is more the point.

Tonali didn’t cost what he cost because Spurs signed Fernandes. His price was his price. Spurs simply decided that for once, they wanted to shop at the highest end of the market. From what I see, we have not made the same decision. We have decided that the highest end of the market is too expensive for us, and as such, are seeking alternatives.

I'd say it's more like we won't pay over the odds for the better players, which is the mistake we have been making for years and has led to our decline.

If Tonali is the high end of the market then it's a very poor market!!
Can you honestly say that from all that Tonali has achieved so far that he's worth the price and wages that Spurs are throwing at him?

 

[ron86]

The new management set a price based on the data they have and they stick to it. Fans will moan now but long term it will pay off. No more shite like Rashford and Sancho hanging around on massive wages

You can't price on data, you price on the market. Yous ay a players worth so much another club then pays more and gets them. If that is our strategy we will really struggle

 

[ron86]

I'd say it's more like we won't pay over the odds for the better players, which is the mistake we have been making for years and has led to our decline.

If Tonali is the high end of the market then it's a very poor market!!
Can you honestly say that from all that Tonali has achieved so far that he's worth the price and wages that Spurs are throwing at him?

Our problem wasn't paying over the odds for the better players, it was paying over the odds for average players and players with bad attitudes.
I agree Tonali is average though and signing him would've repeated old mistakes

 

[McLvnsMuse]

In a world where every position requires a £65-75m investment, a top 4 squad costs ~£800m-£1bn in transfer fees alone every 5 years. Wages add another £1.5-2bn on top.
Against ~£3bn of revenue over the same period…assuming everything goes right.

So the model is: spend ~everything you earn just to hold your place, and one missed CL qualification blows the whole thing up.
Frankly unsustainable. Can’t think of another viable industry that runs like this. It’s gambling where some players have loaded die (city, psg etc).

The real winners are the stable mid table premier league clubs. No
Pressure to over extend themselves

 

[Champ]

Our problem wasn't paying over the odds for the better players, it was paying over the odds for average players and players with bad attitudes.
I agree Tonali is average though and signing him would've repeated old mistakes

Our problem was giving ridiculous wages to players (decent or otherwise ) after signing them for ridiculous money, then being lumbered with these players unable to shift them.
Thankfully we don't seem to want to go down that route again,

 

[RickFlairsHair]

In a world where every position requires a £65-75m investment, a top 4 squad costs ~£800m-£1bn in transfer fees alone every 5 years. Wages add another £1.5-2bn on top.
Against ~£3bn of revenue over the same period…assuming everything goes right.

So the model is: spend ~everything you earn just to hold your place, and one missed CL qualification blows the whole thing up.
Frankly unsustainable. Can’t think of another viable industry that runs like this. It’s gambling where some players have loaded die (city, psg etc).

The real winners are the stable mid table premier league clubs. No
Pressure to over extend themselves

That's assuming we promote zero academy products.

United should be producing 2-3 1st team squad players every season (after revamping our academy model to fall in line with City's or Chelsea's).

That would start to pay for itself quickly.

 

[NicolaSacco]

Our problem was giving ridiculous wages to players (decent or otherwise ) after signing them for ridiculous money, then being lumbered with these players unable to shift them.
Thankfully we don't seem to want to go down that route again,

The trouble with that is; if you want to be a top team, you deal with that problem by improving your scouting and decision making, and signing players on those kinda wages who ARE worth it. All of the teams who are in with a realistic chance of wining the Prem or the CL have done that, they haven’t just removed themselves from the market for fear of getting it wrong.

I think Utd’s response is what a smaller club, with less ambition, would do. Utd are bigger and better than that.

 

[Fenômeno]

Refusing to outdo that ridiculous fee and salary package for Fernandes was a great decision.

 

[7even]

Since the end of the season, I think the circumstances around our transfer window have changed quite dramatically.

1. Barcelona decided not to complete Rashford’s loan and permanent transfer.
2. Ugarte suffered a serious injury.
3. The club has invested in buying land around Old Trafford, which may have had an impact on the funds available for transfers.
4. City then went out and signed Anderson for a staggering £115m.
5. Spurs went all-in on Mateus Fernandes, matching West Ham’s £85m valuation, and then followed it up by signing Tonali for close to £100m. On top of that, they’re reportedly handing out wages in the £200-300k per week range, which inevitably pushes up salary expectations across the market.

Taken together, I think there’s a good chance United were forced to rethink their transfer strategy.

Several reports have suggested that a significant part of our budget depends on player sales, particularly Rashford, Zirkzee and Ugarte. If one of those sales is no longer possible and another has become much less likely, then our financial flexibility changes overnight.

Based on the club’s Q3 financial report, I believe we’re probably looking at around £150m plus whatever we can generate through sales. Højlund brought in very little profit because the remaining book value after amortisation meant the deal was close to break-even. Zirkzee is in a similar position, where any profit depends entirely on the fee we receive. That leaves Rashford as the obvious sale, but at the moment even that looks uncertain.

One positive, though, was how well Mason Mount played against Brighton. I know he’s not everyone’s favourite, but under the right circumstances I actually think he can be a very useful partner for Mainoo against weaker opposition or when we’re chasing control during the final stages of games.

As things stand, with only Mainoo, Mount and Fernandes available in midfield, our absolute minimum requirement is two new midfielders: one who can rotate with Mainoo and, ideally, a genuine holding midfielder. If we’re serious about competing in both the Premier League and the Champions League, I think we probably need three additions, with at least one genuine top-tier player such as Tchouameni, or at worst someone of Alex Scott’s level.

With all of these changing circumstances, our reported interest in Santos makes perfect sense to me.

Price matters. If we can bring in Ederson and Santos for a combined fee of around £70-75m, it suddenly creates room to make one marquee signing at the very top end of the market.

The club is walking a very fine line between timing, value and opportunity. I don’t think many people criticising our transfer activity fully appreciate how delicate our position really is. Our needs are greater than our resources, which makes every decision far more complicated than simply bidding for the biggest names.

 

[Ahmer Baig]

I wouldnt mind us going for Berg and Berge.

 

[Rozay]

I'd say it's more like we won't pay over the odds for the better players, which is the mistake we have been making for years and has led to our decline.

If Tonali is the high end of the market then it's a very poor market!!
Can you honestly say that from all that Tonali has achieved so far that he's worth the price and wages that Spurs are throwing at him?

I’m not a huge Tonali fan personally, but that doesn’t change his pedigree. He is seen as one of the top PL CMs on the market. He was signed for 55m by a strong club, and I would expect his market value to be in and around 100m. I personally wouldn’t want him, but if I did, I would be expecting to pay around 100m.

Maybe we just didn’t want him, but I doubt that’s true. I think we did. The reports broke some months ago that he was a top target and we were exploring a move. A month later the narrative changed to how the ‘cost of a deal was too high’. That’s pretty much been the narrative around everyone we have looked at so far this summer.

 

[Champ]

The trouble with that is; if you want to be a top team, you deal with that problem by improving your scouting and decision making, and signing players on those kinda wages who ARE worth it. All of the teams who are in with a realistic chance of wining the Prem or the CL have done that, they haven’t just removed themselves from the market for fear of getting it wrong.

I think Utd’s response is what a smaller club, with less ambition, would do. Utd are bigger and better than that.

Yup agreed, and so far we haven't found anyone worth those wages and fees....so not sure what the issue is here?!

As surely you cannot think that Fernandes and Tonali are worth the fees and wages Spurs are paying?

Nothing unambitious about that, it's called being sensible, look at Arsenal, they've paid the big money when they've need too on the right player (Rice and possibly Havertz), but most other signings are generally around the mid tier level, very similar to Uniteds stance right now.

 

[Champ]

I’m not a huge Tonali fan personally, but that doesn’t change his pedigree. He is seen as one of the top PL CMs on the market. He was signed for 55m by a strong club, and I would expect his market value to be in and around 100m. I personally wouldn’t want him, but if I did, I would be expecting to pay around 100m.

Maybe we just didn’t want him, but I doubt that’s true. I think we did. The reports broke some months ago that he was a top target and we were exploring a move. A month later the narrative changed to how the ‘cost of a deal was too high’. That’s pretty much been the narrative around everyone we have looked at so far this summer.

Because the costs have been too high, again it's down to getting value and also the fact we need more than one player,

signing Tonali for £100m would be a monumental waste of the budget and would not be getting value for money, and it'd leave us with barely anything else to spend on other areas.

 

[AlexUTD]

We will need a strong window to stay in the top 4 tbh

Yes and this is why i am worried

 

[Rozay]

Because the costs have been too high, again it's down to getting value and also the fact we need more than one player,

signing Tonali for £100m would be a monumental waste of the budget and would not be getting value for money, and it'd leave us with barely anything else to spend on other areas.

But not too high for Spurs, who also need more than one player. That’s part of my point. Are we determining that prices are too high based upon yesterday’s prices? And if that is the case, will we be able to achieve what we need to from the market under such guidelines.

Of course, if we simply don’t have any money, then fine. We almost certainly won’t be achieving our objectives regardless if that is the case. But if we just think everything in the shop that says £10 should really say £8, and as such, we walk out with nothing (or go to the pound shop across the street and buy inferior products) - how does that help us?

I think there’s a fine and nuanced line. I don’t want us to be stupid. Heck, I didn’t even want us to sign Tonali. But I don’t want us to walk away from all the good players because we are the only club who thinks they cost too much either.

 

[Champ]

But not too high for Spurs, who also need more than one player. That’s part of my point. Are we determining that prices are too high based upon yesterday’s prices? And if that is the case, will we be able to achieve what we need to from the market under such guidelines.

Of course, if we simply don’t have any money, then fine. We almost certainly won’t be achieving our objectives regardless if that is the case. But if we just think everything in the shop that says £10 should really say £8, and as such, we walk out with nothing (or go to the pound shop across the street and buy inferior products) - how does that help us?

I think there’s a fine and nuanced line. I don’t want us to be stupid. Heck, I didn’t even want us to sign Tonali. But I don’t want us to walk away from all the good players because we are the only club who thinks they cost too much either.

You make good points, but to use your analogy, if a person walks into one shop, and buys an £8 trinket for £10 because someone else bid £8.20, what do you think will happen to the shop next doors prices when that same person walks into theirs and wants to buy and £8 trinket? The shop keeper will be rubbing their hands with delight...
Whereas the other person will just go to another shop and see what they can get for their £8.20...


Its clear United have a finite budget, we need to make it stretch across several areas, buying over the odds will not help us, buying smart and sensible will...

 

[Martial'sEmergingSmile]

Andy Mitten on the latest TOTD podcast mentioned that our transfer budget this summer is "£120-130m" and "you have to be careful not to blow all of that on one player".

Lots more wage stuff from Mitten and Whitwell along the lines of "if Mateus Fernandes, for example, comes in and he's earning more than Cunha, Mbeumo, Mainoo do you not think they're going to go knocking on the door asking why and looking for parity?"

Which creates a weird paradox where we can seemingly only pay legitimate world-class players a high wage, so as not to offend our good but not world-class players... but also we don't have the money to pay transfer fees for the world class players.

Also we quickly realised we wouldn't compete on wages for Elliot Anderson, so we talked to him about potentially being a future captain somewhere down the road instead.