2022 World Cup Qatar thread

do.ob

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I think you missed the point. He wasn't comparing the two.
He was quoting a post complaining that homosexuality is banned in Qatar.

He responded with: "Lot of things are banned in many countries by law. Prostitution too but does it effect anyone?"
 

Sayros

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He was quoting a post complaining that homosexuality is banned in Qatar.

He responded with: "Lot of things are banned in many countries by law. Prostitution too but does it effect anyone?"
It doesn't mean a comparison between the act of homosexuality or prositution, but that things that are illegal aren't at all things that can't happen in a country, sometimes without much hassle at all though I wouldn't know the particulars in Qatar myself.
 

RedDevilMachine

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Flick is a good coach, but the quality of the squad also went down a bit after he left. So it's not all about him.
Since there is no undisputed favorite this time around there is of course always a chance that they can win it, but if I look at the squad there's few players at their peak and a lot more, who probably need a few more years to get there.
I rate Flick very highly and I do agree with you that the quality of the squad isn't as great as 2014 but past German teams always excel because of their collective team unity, system setup and mental strength rather than individual brilliance but this doesn't seem to be the case now especially with the mental toughness and efficiency following the debacle of the 2018 World Cup. Most of the talented up-and-coming players in 2018 are now entering into their peak years - Kimmich, Goretzka, Gnabry, Draxler - 26-28. The only thing that Germany lacks is a clinical striker upfront like Klose which I don't see Werner being able to do what Klose does. However, like you said as there is no standout favourite this time, it then comes down to the mental strength and efficiency so if Germany can become the old Germany, I do see them winning the World Cup again. I think we will see a lot of penalty shootouts in the knockout stage.
 

troylocker

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Basic criterias for a country hosting a WC should be:

- A lawfully elected government elected by the people (where every citizen of a certain age is allowed to vote)
- Freedom of speach
- Freedom of religion
- Freedom of sexual orientation and sexuality
- Equal rights between the sexes
- Respect for UNs human rights

This WC host fails on all points.
 

antk

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Basic criterias for a country hosting a WC should be:

- A lawfully elected government elected by the people (where every citizen of a certain age is allowed to vote)
- Freedom of speach
- Freedom of religion
- Freedom of sexual orientation and sexuality
- Equal rights between the sexes
- Respect for UNs human rights

This WC host fails on all points.
Most of those things are not binary but a spectrum, and one could argue that most if not all countries fail to meet those criterias as well.
 

troylocker

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Most of those things are not binary but a spectrum, and one could argue that most if not all countries fail to meet those criterias as well.
Is this really the hill you want to fight and die on?

Regarding point 1 and 6, I'll agree there is a spectrum, but:

Point 1: Qatar is as far in the opposite direction of the criteria as possible. Leaders born in to positons of absolute power.
Point 6: Without freedom of speach, freedom of religion, freedom of sexual orientation/sexuality, working conditions for foreign workers etc. you end up in the bottom end of the this creteria as well.

We live in 2022 and it is really shocking that as you say many countries struggle to meet these creterias.

Qatar is a country that legally pursue women who are sexually abused by people other than their husbands, homosexual behaviour is legally pursued, publically criticizing the authorities is legally pursued, criticizing Islam or openly not being a muslim is legally pursued, 6500+ foreign construction workers has died because of their poor working conditions since 2010 etc. The list goes on.

Imagine you're a woman and visit Qatar - You get sexually abused and tell the local police, then you get arrested and receive a sentence of 7 years in prison plus 100 lashes with a whip for out of marriage sex. This happened in Qatar as late as in 2021.
 

stevoc

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Basic criterias for a country hosting a WC should be:

- A lawfully elected government elected by the people (where every citizen of a certain age is allowed to vote)
- Freedom of speach
- Freedom of religion
- Freedom of sexual orientation and sexuality
- Equal rights between the sexes
- Respect for UNs human rights

This WC host fails on all points.
FIFA have their own list of criteria.

-£$£$£$£$£$£$£$£$£$£
 

antk

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Is this really the hill you want to fight and die on?

Regarding point 1 and 6, I'll agree there is a spectrum, but:

Point 1: Qatar is as far in the opposite direction of the criteria as possible. Leaders born in to positons of absolute power.
Point 6: Without freedom of speach, freedom of religion, freedom of sexual orientation/sexuality, working conditions for foreign workers etc. you end up in the bottom end of the this creteria as well.

We live in 2022 and it is really shocking that as you say many countries struggle to meet these creterias.

Qatar is a country that legally pursue women who are sexually abused by people other than their husbands, homosexual behaviour is legally pursued, publically criticizing the authorities is legally pursued, criticizing Islam or openly not being a muslim is legally pursued, 6500+ foreign construction workers has died because of their poor working conditions since 2010 etc. The list goes on.

Imagine you're a woman and visit Qatar - You get sexually abused and tell the local police, then you get arrested and receive a sentence of 7 years in prison plus 100 lashes with a whip for out of marriage sex. This happened in Qatar as late as in 2021.
I have no hill to die on as I wasn't intending this as a whataboutism to defend Qatar, but it may have come across otherwise as English isn't my native language. The WC should never have been given to Qatar, and should have been canceled multiple times since.

Just a bit worried about the illusion of other countries, including mine and major european countries, meeting all those criterias in absolute, when many of our home countries here have also terrible records regarding for example freedom of press or equal rights between genders. Even if they're a lot better than Qatar's.
 

Sky1981

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Is this really the hill you want to fight and die on?

Regarding point 1 and 6, I'll agree there is a spectrum, but:

Point 1: Qatar is as far in the opposite direction of the criteria as possible. Leaders born in to positons of absolute power.
Point 6: Without freedom of speach, freedom of religion, freedom of sexual orientation/sexuality, working conditions for foreign workers etc. you end up in the bottom end of the this creteria as well.

We live in 2022 and it is really shocking that as you say many countries struggle to meet these creterias.

Qatar is a country that legally pursue women who are sexually abused by people other than their husbands, homosexual behaviour is legally pursued, publically criticizing the authorities is legally pursued, criticizing Islam or openly not being a muslim is legally pursued, 6500+ foreign construction workers has died because of their poor working conditions since 2010 etc. The list goes on.

Imagine you're a woman and visit Qatar - You get sexually abused and tell the local police, then you get arrested and receive a sentence of 7 years in prison plus 100 lashes with a whip for out of marriage sex. This happened in Qatar as late as in 2021.
Dude. I'm no fans of qatar but the last part is not how syariah works.

Please dont make absurd assumption based on wrong premises.

Many females goes to islamic nation and dont get raped plus whipped

Maybe educate yourself and see the world more beyond your local news outlet
 

RoyH1

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Dude. I'm no fans of qatar but the last part is not how syariah works.

Please dont make absurd assumption based on wrong premises.

Many females goes to islamic nation and dont get raped plus whipped

Maybe educate yourself and see the world more beyond your local news outlet
There's been a quite visible case lately with a Mexican woman who was sexually assaulted in Qatar. She has been acquitted, but only after she got big time support from the Mexican government that paid her lawyer fees and sent their FM to argue her case.

I tried to find something that wasn't the local news outlet :D

https://www.gob.mx/sre/prensa/legal...qatar-come-to-a-favorable-conclusion?idiom=en
 

troylocker

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Dude. I'm no fans of qatar but the last part is not how syariah works.

Please dont make absurd assumption based on wrong premises.

Many females goes to islamic nation and dont get raped plus whipped

Maybe educate yourself and see the world more beyond your local news outlet
I’m not saying there is a bigger chance of getting sexually abused in Qatar vs other countries. I think most women visiting Qatar doesn’t get sexually assaulted. It’s just shocking that the victim of a rape or sexual abuse can be criminally pursued….

I find it desturbing that 100% of the replies I’ve received on my latest post regarding Qatar and human right has been defensive….

Inspire positive change!
 
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troylocker

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Sky1981

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There's been a quite visible case lately with a Mexican woman who was sexually assaulted in Qatar. She has been acquitted, but only after she got big time support from the Mexican government that paid her lawyer fees and sent their FM to argue her case.

I tried to find something that wasn't the local news outlet :D

https://www.gob.mx/sre/prensa/legal...qatar-come-to-a-favorable-conclusion?idiom=en
Sexual assault happens everywhere including the west. It's not only happening because it's qatar.
 

Sky1981

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I’m not saying there is a bigger chance of getting sexually abused in Qatar vs other countries. I think most women visiting Qatar doesn’t get sexually assaulted. It’s just shocking that the victim of a rape or sexual abuse can be criminally pursued….

I find it desturbing that 100% of the replies I’ve received on my latest post regarding Qatar and human right has been defensive….

Inspire positive change!
Maybe because you really cant trust the media and their biased publication.

Sure some workers died. And this has been debated somewhere here that most of the numbers they quote has nothing to do with building a stadium. And it's not like they're chained and whipped, the definition of slavery is loosely used when it comes to politics.

Many nations used migrant worker from bangladesh, and poorer countries looking for better future. There are shady mafias that enables them to work for a cut, and normally this has something to do with "if you dont pay us or run away we will make your family back home pays" kind of deal, and yes they'll hold your passport until they deem you finished your obligation. But most of this are 3rd party contractor, the hiring party seldom deals witht the worker directly.

They normally funded everything from paper, passport, tickets that enables you to work, and once you got paid they got the cut. Many woulrd chooses to run away and become illegal immigrant hence mostly they only send people with "hostage" back home that they can use as leverage to make you work and behave.

We're sending workers previoulsy officially labelled as Indonesian women worker (TKW) to arabic countries to work as inhouse maids. Most of them are doing fine and sending money back home, not that i agree with the practise. We've had some who got into legal preceding because they're sexually assaulted and treated maliciously but normally it wasnt a methodical state sanctioned. It's just a case of bad employer. Got better as times since our government now provide legal counsel.

Shady dealings and local mafia? You bet. But state sponsored slavery? I dont think so.
 
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troylocker

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Sexual assault happens everywhere including the west. It's not only happening because it's qatar.
The problem highlighted here isn't the sexual assault (as you point out, that happens all around the world and is a problem for women all over the world), it is the fact that she was legally pursued for being sexually assaulted......
 

lex talionis

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The right thing to do is to refuse to watch this abomination, but whether I'm capable of doing the right thing remains to be seen.
 

paraguayo

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Japan will knockout either Spain or Germany in their group
 

Bluelion7

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All ethical stuff aside … and this monstrosity will be painful when it happens… going forward if the tournament has to be fundamentally changed you can’t host, period.
 

Reiver

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The right thing to do is to refuse to watch this abomination, but whether I'm capable of doing the right thing remains to be seen.
This is exactly how I feel about it. Been against their hosting it from the start. With Scotland not being there, it will be easier for me not to watch but can I avoid it completely?
Besides, there will be at least three opponents of England to cheer on.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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The right thing to do is to refuse to watch this abomination, but whether I'm capable of doing the right thing remains to be seen.
Yes it is not great. Will be hard time to ignore it though.

I will look at the sponsors and make sure I never deal with them as much as I can.

Usually sponsors never effects me either way. I do normally not care about Uniteds or Liverpools sponsors.
 

Ayoba

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Why is the nations league on after such a long season and knowing that the WC will be in december? I usually don't have much sympathy for today's overpaid footballers but it seems rather harsh they're still playing football in June!
 

Impulse

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Why is the nations league on after such a long season and knowing that the WC will be in december? I usually don't have much sympathy for today's overpaid footballers but it seems rather harsh they're still playing football in June!
They had to be moved forward because of the World Cup. These games would have been played in the October and November international breaks if we had a regular summer World Cup this year.
 

calodo2003

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Why is the nations league on after such a long season and knowing that the WC will be in december? I usually don't have much sympathy for today's overpaid footballers but it seems rather harsh they're still playing football in June!
Straight cash, homie.
 

sun_tzu

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How is Qatar preparing for hosting these games?

Transit systems... recruiting and training staff for the event?

Most notibly how are their police being trained to deal with tens of thousands of drunken fans as I'm guessing that's not something they encounter very often

Have a feeling it will look nice on TV but will be somewhat shambolic off camera
 
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McGrathsipan

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How is Qatar preparing for hosting these games?

Transit systems... recruiting and training staff for the event?

Most notibly how are their police being trained to deal with tens of thousands of drunken fans as I'm guessing that's not something they encounter very often

Have a feeling it will look nice on TV but will be somewhat shambolic off camera
Isnt booze illegal in these places ?
 

JJ12

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Isnt booze illegal in these places ?
Drinking in public and being drunk in public is illegal. There will be drinking zones I’d imagine but as we know that won’t be adhered to, so look out.
 

calodo2003

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They are going to allow drinking in fan parks and in the desert camps they are planning for fans

I have my doubts they know quite what they are letting themselves in for
They have an idea as they have had to deal with drunk Americans from the airbase, but they will probably be unprepared for the scale of the WC.
 

Big Ben Foster

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Something about these desert camps screams "Fyre Festival" to me. Hopefully everything works out, but could end up being a massive catastrophe.