4 years without a trophy

JebelSherif

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Read their fake i.d. history. Both Bitters obviously. They usually claim to be United fans, or some neutral I.e. non rival fan, like 'no club in particular' or Huddersfield Town, then post a load of bitter bile re United's players etc...full of personal bitter that no real Huddersfield fan would ever feel re United.
UAE paid trolls.
Bit harsh, I live in Huddersfield and have done for some years and I believe in supporting ones home-town club. When I registered for this site it said non-Man Utd. fans were welcome and I think I have been measured in my posts and I have told the truth. Sorry it makes bad reading, but try following HTFC!
 

Bastian

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I miss seeing us dominant and playing top level football a lot more than winning cups. It's been a lot longer too.
 

Zaphod2319

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This was on my feed yesterday. I thought I remember seeing a thread about this.

 

Denis79

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I miss seeing us dominant and playing top level football a lot more than winning cups. It's been a lot longer too.
Me too, then again what we want is much harder to achieve than winning trophies.
 

JebelSherif

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SirReginald

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So many responses to this thread are along the lines of: "I will wait till the transfer business is concluded before giving an opinion".

Well, if Jadon Sancho turns out to be the only major purchase this summer, will it be enough to end this mini-drought?

P.S. Excellent summary of his potential for Utd. here:

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...russia-dortmund-bruno-fernandes-b1875847.html
Sancho is not peak Messi or Ronaldo. He won’t singlehandedly turn finals into trophies. In fact I expect him to struggle in the beginning. His record for Dortmund is great but he doesn’t come close to replicating that for England and I feel it’s that level he will be at for the first few weeks. Especially with Ole as manager, he doesn’t really get the best out of players or use them effectively.
 

Wilt

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Ole has got his man! If Ole can use Sancho to his expected levels, surely we can only improve.

Make or break season.
 

JebelSherif

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Some really good performances from Utd. players playing for England at the Euros, do people think if things go well this next week they could come back with renewed confidence that will ultimately benefit Manchester Utd. in the forthcoming season?
 

R'hllor

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Dunno why such thread when winning shit stopped being important for few years now in here. Being winner and winning trophies had value only when used as a hammer vs potential managers like Pochetino etc.
 

laughtersassassin

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Dunno why such thread when winning shit stopped being important for few years now in here. Being winner and winning trophies had value only when used as a hammer vs potential managers like Pochetino etc.
Winning is the only thing that matters at the end of the day.
 

JebelSherif

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Still can't hardly believe what is happening at the Euros and well done England.

But I wonder - what could this run right through the tournament mean for the forthcoming Premier Season?

I remember last year both Man Utd. and Man City had a delayed (and slow start) due to no pre-season - could a similar thing happen again?

City and Utd. have several key players with England, but other 'rivals' not so many: Arsenal: Sako, Spurs: Kane, Liverpool: Henderson, Chelsea: Mount/Chillwell (who hasn't really played much).

How long will they get to rest: isn't there a rule that they have to have 3 weeks? The charity shield is less than a month away and we still have this game on Sunday to enjoy/endure!

I wonder if this tournament, great though it is, will have a knock on negative effect, especially for the Manchester clubs. If Utd. are to break this long (for them) trophy-less period, the last thing they need is a slow start to the Prem, in mid-August.

P.S. Before anyone says, '....they are young lads, 3 weeks is plenty of time to recover' can I say this: if England win on Sunday, what are those three weeks going to be like!? Open top bus tours, interviews on TV shows & companies will be all over them like never before to promote and advertise stuff... it wont exactly be a rest period. This is a really big thing.
 

Bondi77

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Still can't hardly believe what is happening at the Euros and well done England.

But I wonder - what could this run right through the tournament mean for the forthcoming Premier Season?

I remember last year both Man Utd. and Man City had a delayed (and slow start) due to no pre-season - could a similar thing happen again?

City and Utd. have several key players with England, but other 'rivals' not so many: Arsenal: Sako, Spurs: Kane, Liverpool: Henderson, Chelsea: Mount/Chillwell (who hasn't really played much).

How long will they get to rest: isn't there a rule that they have to have 3 weeks? The charity shield is less than a month away and we still have this game on Sunday to enjoy/endure!

I wonder if this tournament, great though it is, will have a knock on negative effect, especially for the Manchester clubs. If Utd. are to break this long (for them) trophy-less period, the last thing they need is a slow start to the Prem, in mid-August.

P.S. Before anyone says, '....they are young lads, 3 weeks is plenty of time to recover' can I say this: if England win on Sunday, what are those three weeks going to be like!? Open top bus tours, interviews on TV shows & companies will be all over them like never before to promote and advertise stuff... it wont exactly be a rest period. This is a really big thing.
Well if we have players in our team that are good enough to represent their country and that country is successful then that is the price we pay.
If a club doesn’t have these sort of players then I think it is highly doubtful that they will be around when it comes to the business end of the season anyway.
 

JebelSherif

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It's going to be a real struggle for me to except that England last won a trophy before United.
Bloody Hell, I have just noticed you have made 742 posts on here but you are still classed as a 'Newbie'. I was hoping when I went through the 100 barrier, which was recently, that my label might change!

When do you stop being a 'Newbie' on here! I find it slightly embarrassing, zoinks.
 

BFernandes

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Bloody Hell, I have just noticed you have made 742 posts on here but you are still classed as a 'Newbie'. I was hoping when I went through the 100 barrier, which was recently, that my label might change!

When do you stop being a 'Newbie' on here! I find it slightly embarrassing, zoinks.
I wouldn't worry about it, you're well on track to get there before me. You've got a reaction score of 6 for only 104 posts :cool:
 

JebelSherif

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I wouldn't worry about it, you're well on track to get there before me. You've got a reaction score of 6 for only 104 posts :cool:
Oooo, I'm chuffed, what is that then and how does it work?

I have been wondering actually, how does one 'like' posts on here as can be done on facebook and other social medias?
 

Tom Cato

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Bloody Hell, I have just noticed you have made 742 posts on here but you are still classed as a 'Newbie'. I was hoping when I went through the 100 barrier, which was recently, that my label might change!

When do you stop being a 'Newbie' on here! I find it slightly embarrassing, zoinks.

Make posts that contribute greatly to a thread, offer insight or a well rounded opinion and you'll cross the newbie threshold fast enough.
 

JebelSherif

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Make posts that contribute greatly to a thread, offer insight or a well rounded opinion and you'll cross the newbie threshold fast enough.
OK! And what about being funny? I don't think my Pogba/ABBA joke in the discussion about how penalty shoot-outs should run was well received, but I was pretty proud of it!
 

BFernandes

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Oooo, I'm chuffed, what is that then and how does it work?

I have been wondering actually, how does one 'like' posts on here as can be done on facebook and other social medias?
I think it's only the admin and mods than can like a post I believe
 

charlenefan

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Still can't hardly believe what is happening at the Euros and well done England.

But I wonder - what could this run right through the tournament mean for the forthcoming Premier Season?

I remember last year both Man Utd. and Man City had a delayed (and slow start) due to no pre-season - could a similar thing happen again?

City and Utd. have several key players with England, but other 'rivals' not so many: Arsenal: Sako, Spurs: Kane, Liverpool: Henderson, Chelsea: Mount/Chillwell (who hasn't really played much).

How long will they get to rest: isn't there a rule that they have to have 3 weeks? The charity shield is less than a month away and we still have this game on Sunday to enjoy/endure!

I wonder if this tournament, great though it is, will have a knock on negative effect, especially for the Manchester clubs. If Utd. are to break this long (for them) trophy-less period, the last thing they need is a slow start to the Prem, in mid-August.

P.S. Before anyone says, '....they are young lads, 3 weeks is plenty of time to recover' can I say this: if England win on Sunday, what are those three weeks going to be like!? Open top bus tours, interviews on TV shows & companies will be all over them like never before to promote and advertise stuff... it wont exactly be a rest period. This is a really big thing.
No you cannot

It's a pretty insignificant point, players can jet back and forth from wherever they're holidaying to be part of any potential open top bus parades it's not a big deal likewise if media want interviews with them then the media companies can jet the interviewer out to wherever the player is

The players themselves will be under pretty strict instructions from their clubs on what they should be doing during the close season and when they are expected back

Our last pre-season game is 4 weeks after the final, I would expect the majority of the squad to be involved in that game with very few exceptions
 

JebelSherif

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No you cannot

It's a pretty insignificant point, players can jet back and forth from wherever they're holidaying to be part of any potential open top bus parades it's not a big deal likewise if media want interviews with them then the media companies can jet the interviewer out to wherever the player is

The players themselves will be under pretty strict instructions from their clubs on what they should be doing during the close season and when they are expected back

Our last pre-season game is 4 weeks after the final, I would expect the majority of the squad to be involved in that game with very few exceptions
Perhaps I didn't express myself as well as I could have, I focused on the physical aspect of this Euros run, when I really should have asked: what about the mental impact?

It is well known that Southgate motivates the players by telling them that they have the chance to do something that will be remembered for the rest of their lives. That is no exaggeration. Look how often we have had to see that Gazza vs Scotland goal these last 3 weeks, this last 25 years and he didn't even get to the final!

England are now in the final, heck, they may even win it!

What might that do to the players (and I don't just mean the Utd. ones), but obviously this is a Utd. fans website so I have to pose the question: if England do win on Sunday, will the Utd. players return with greater confidence that could mean an end to the mini-drought being discussed in this thread? Alternatively, could they come back so emotionally drained that England's success hampers Utd. giving those clubs with only the odd player with the national team, or maybe no players at all, a chance to make a better start to the new league season? Because Utd. don't want to be playing 'catch-up', not in these days when leagues are being won with 90+ points.

(this is my last post today as I've used up my 5 lives, so if anyone I have been discussing stuff with thinks I'm a bit quiet, that is the reason - I'm in isolation again so it's easy to do!)
 

Raredaredevil

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The Europa League final still hurts even though it was only a month and a half ago. That was our best chance to finally win something and we lost to the last spot kick of a shootout from our goalkeeper.
 

The holy trinity 68

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Sancho is not peak Messi or Ronaldo. He won’t singlehandedly turn finals into trophies. In fact I expect him to struggle in the beginning. His record for Dortmund is great but he doesn’t come close to replicating that for England and I feel it’s that level he will be at for the first few weeks. Especially with Ole as manager, he doesn’t really get the best out of players or use them effectively.
Luke Shaw says hello.
 

JebelSherif

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When does the season start? Yesterday I kept turning the TV off, the radio off; just didn't want any football talk at all.

But today I'm starting to miss it!
 

Lentwood

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The "xxx years without a trophy" line is a pointless statement really.

Of course, every team wants to win trophies and it is ultimately (rightly) how the relative success and ability of a team is measured over a given period of time.

However, there are only really four trophies up for grabs, and it's really debatable as to whether the League Cup actually counts - would a League Cup in the last four years really have changed anything about this squad or how it's viewed? Not for me.

For me, what really counts is starting to challenge for the title. Winning a cup is fine, but there's often a large amount of luck involved and it doesn't really prove progress, unless you're regularly picking up FA Cups/League Cups year in, year out.

What does prove real progress in my book is challenging for the title. Over a 38 game season, its very difficult to "fluke" a league position, despite what some of the dafter anti-Ole posters might have had you believe. In recent years, we have made definite progress in that respect and we're doing it with a very young squad who will only get better.

At some point, City will have an off-season for one reason or another, or hopefully even a period where they don't quite hit the heights. We need to make sure that we are ready and waiting. We also need to make sure that we are putting the pressure on well into April. By being close, you put pressure on teams. City ran away with it last year but we dropped key points in crucial games at bad times (WBA away and Everton at home). If you win those games, you start to put doubts into the minds of the City players. 0-0 or 1-1 I'm a game after 65 minutes is fine if you're 9pts clear but it affects your mindset in a totally different way if there are only a couple of points in it either way.

For me, a sign of continued progress next season isn't a binary "will we win a trophy?" but a "do we throw down a real challenge for the league?".
 

AneRu

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The "xxx years without a trophy" line is a pointless statement really.

Of course, every team wants to win trophies and it is ultimately (rightly) how the relative success and ability of a team is measured over a given period of time.

However, there are only really four trophies up for grabs, and it's really debatable as to whether the League Cup actually counts - would a League Cup in the last four years really have changed anything about this squad or how it's viewed? Not for me.

For me, what really counts is starting to challenge for the title. Winning a cup is fine, but there's often a large amount of luck involved and it doesn't really prove progress, unless you're regularly picking up FA Cups/League Cups year in, year out.

What does prove real progress in my book is challenging for the title. Over a 38 game season, its very difficult to "fluke" a league position, despite what some of the dafter anti-Ole posters might have had you believe. In recent years, we have made definite progress in that respect and we're doing it with a very young squad who will only get better.

At some point, City will have an off-season for one reason or another, or hopefully even a period where they don't quite hit the heights. We need to make sure that we are ready and waiting. We also need to make sure that we are putting the pressure on well into April. By being close, you put pressure on teams. City ran away with it last year but we dropped key points in crucial games at bad times (WBA away and Everton at home). If you win those games, you start to put doubts into the minds of the City players. 0-0 or 1-1 I'm a game after 65 minutes is fine if you're 9pts clear but it affects your mindset in a totally different way if there are only a couple of points in it either way.

For me, a sign of continued progress next season isn't a binary "will we win a trophy?" but a "do we throw down a real challenge for the league?".
Sustained progression is OK for me too and we are making the right moves in the market so form and fitness permitting we should be more competitive this season and possibly pick up a trophy or two. What's more important to me is to establish the team as a bona-fide top three club in the league and CL because I believe that if you are there or thereabouts consistently you will eventually pick up some silverware along the way.
 

DWelbz19

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I remember last year both Man Utd. and Man City had a delayed (and slow start) due to no pre-season - could a similar thing happen again?
It’s possible, yeah. Both clubs didn’t get going until about game week 10 last season. I guess the good thing this time is that the players who are still at the club (Henderson, AWB, Greenwood, Martial being the main ones + maybe Telles/VDB) will actually get a full pre-season which starts this weekend. It’s better than last year at least. Those who crashed out earlier (Pogba, Lindelof, Bruno etc) should be back to play a couple. I reckon the English boys will get some time off.

Last season as you mention was insane though. 16th August 2020 was when we finished the 2019/20 season. The players were given 2 weeks off, we had one pre-season game against Villa on the 12th of September, and then our season started on the 19th! That’s all the rest and prep we had!
 

AFC NimbleThumb

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The dismissal of cup competitions really is baffling when we’re losing in the latter stages of them with our best available 11 on the field.

There is quite obviously a pyramid in terms of trophies, I’d love it if we won the Champions League + League every year.l but simply taking League position/points total as a barometer isn’t really fair as I think we could play better next season & with the suspected re-emergence of Pool finish lower in the League.

Inherently I think it’s rather backwards to dismiss competitions we can’t win currently win when playing our best team. We didn’t lose to Sevilla, Villarreal or Leicester cause we were ‘unlucky’ imo.
 

Lentwood

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Sustained progression is OK for me too and we are making the right moves in the market so form and fitness permitting we should be more competitive this season and possibly pick up a trophy or two. What's more important to me is to establish the team as a bona-fide top three club in the league and CL because I believe that if you are there or thereabouts consistently you will eventually pick up some silverware along the way.
Yes I agree because the fact is we haven't been established as a top three team for a while now post-SAF.

I kept correcting posters who referred to us as "the new Arsenal"...I was pointing out Arsenal famously, under Wenger, qualified every single year for CL! We craved that stability from 2014 onwards!

Once we have truly established ourselves as a top three team (and I firmly believe we are on that path under Ole) we can then take a judgement team on whether Ole is the right man to actually start winning trophies.
 

AneRu

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Yes I agree because the fact is we haven't been established as a top three team for a while now post-SAF.

I kept correcting posters who referred to us as "the new Arsenal"...I was pointing out Arsenal famously, under Wenger, qualified every single year for CL! We craved that stability from 2014 onwards!

Once we have truly established ourselves as a top three team (and I firmly believe we are on that path under Ole) we can then take a judgement team on whether Ole is the right man to actually start winning trophies.
Agreed mate, people forget how low we fell under Moyes-LVG-Jose. I believe stability breeds success and we are yet to see ourselves established as a top three side, lets achieve that first and then look to win titles (I wouldn't mind the odd trophy or two btw).
 

Swedish_Plumber

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I have this really nice feeling that next season is where we show real potential for winning trophies in the long run.
Not sure where it’s coming from but I’m optimistic we see more consistent performance levels.
You’ll find me at the bottom of a pit of despair if it turns out I’m completely wrong.
 

Flytan

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Luke Shaw says hello.
I think ole does a good job getting the best out of players but his biggest issue is just tactical. He doesn't know how to rotate or make subs in games. He doesn't prepare against teams that defend deep and often we come out flat until the opposing team scores. I don't think he'll ever win a significant trophy here unless he surrounds himself with smart people who handle tactics better and he takes a more supervisory rope as the manager. I don't know what McKenna, Carrick,.or.others actually do but you'd think the club would shuffle around the assistant coaches or hire different people after seeing ole's weakness. If we don't have a title challenge this year he should go regardless, we spend too much to not
 

Champagne Football

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The obsession should never be to do a Jose and spend zillions to win an instant FA Cup. The obsession should always be to try and hoover up the world's most talented kids, and give them a 4 year patient plan, where top 4 is minimum each year, and hope after 4 years a few of them eventually turn into world stars that can deliver a sustained period of trophy winning.
 

thundercats

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4 years without a trophy is not rare for Utd, it happened a lot pre Ferguson. What is abnormal though is being happy with a top 4 place. It is not necessarily the fault of the board or the players to be happy with just a top 4 place. It is the fault of the system where top 4 grants you access to the millions of the CL. The premier league trophy in this sense is just the icing on the cake. When football wasn't money driven top 4 was decent now top 4 is basically a trophy. Places 1 to 4 are all equal, place nr 5 is a failure. In the old days place nr 1 was so much more than place nr 2.

The winners mentality is not here, it will only come through... winning. If I knew which players have that unstopping desire for winning I would tell you their names but I don't know.
 
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wolvored

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It will be a lot harder, I think, this next season with Chelsea and Liverpool a lot stronger. Maybe winning a domestic cup will be all we manage. Let's hope this Ramsay chap and new signings can push us on to gaining another 10-12 points in the league