442

Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by charlenefan, Mar 7, 2018.

  1. Apr 15, 2019
    #81

    Jacob Full Member

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    I don't buy into the theory of the traditional 442 being dead. I miss the good old days when we were a threat down the flanks. It's much harder to defend against if you have good crossers/dribblers on both sides of two attackers that can focus on being threats in and around the box. We often find ourselves in a situation where we lack bodies in the box.

    Someone like Pogba is suited to this kind of formation imo. I see him as more of an 8 than 10. Combine him with a word-class energetic 6 and I think we could tick.


    DDG

    RB----------LINDELÖF----------CB----------SHAW

    RW-------------CM-----------POGBA-----------LW

    CAM
    ST
    You only see four names here since I'm thinking long-term, the unfilled positions needs recruiting for obviously. There seems to be so many talented 10s (e.g. Felix) out there today, none of them seem to fit our current style of play. Some of you might hate me for saying this but I see Rashfords long-term future as a winger. He is not a naturally instinctive striker.
  2. Oct 1, 2019
    #82

    SadlerMUFC Full Member

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    I really think we should be playing a 4-4-2 against the smaller clubs. We play way too narrow with 3 midfielders. Please bring back a classic 4-4-2 for most of our matches. Bring the width and with 2 strikers we will have more than 1 target inside the 18. I would set it up like so:

    ---------------------De Gea----------------------
    AWB---------Lindeloff-------Maguire-------Shaw
    Perriera------McTominay--Pogba----------James
    ---------------Rashford-----Martial----------------

    Greenwood can rotate with any of the wingers/strikers. I think we can beat any team outside of the projected top 6 with this formation. And when we are playing the projected top 6, we can switch to a 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 to strengthen the midfield. In fact, call me an optimist, but against the projected top 6 right now we are 2-1-0 with 6 goals for and only 1 against. It's when teams sit back against us that we really have trouble and having more players in the attacking area can only be a good thing...
  3. Oct 1, 2019
    #83

    UNITED ACADEMY Full Member

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    We are basically playing 442 when defending but 4231 when attacking. The issue is that we need a second striker or false 9 for this role like Reus at Dortmund but what we have is Lingard & Mata.
  4. Oct 1, 2019
    #84

    SadlerMUFC Full Member

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    I don't want a 4-2-3-1 when attacking. I want 2 strikers. Forget Mata or Lingard. I want it just like how SAF used to do it. And also just like how SAF used to do it, switch to some variation of a 4-3-3 against better teams (or 4-5-1 as we used to call it). But I want to see 2 strikers leading the line and any combo of Rashford, Martial and Greenwood will do...
  5. Oct 1, 2019
    #85

    meamth Full Member

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    Thing is, even in football manager, changing from 4-3-3/4-2-3-1 to 4-4-2 takes a lot of time and effort.
    You want a consistent team who plays the same tactics to gain form along the season, so you need players, proper players.

    1. You can't have many CAM/Attacking midfielders, they will have reduced playing time. Needs to sell all of them to change.(Currently we have: Mata, Andreas, Lingard, Gomes)
    2. You need 4/5 strikers in the squad. (Currently we have: Martial, Greenwood. Rashford is dead to me as a striker) :nervous:
    3. 4/5 Inside forwards/ Wingers in the squad. (Currently we have: James, Rashford, Chong) :houllier:

    Sadly this is why we can't play 4-4-2 anymore:

    CF: 2/4
    WF: 3/5

    Ultimately we need to get rid of CAMs. Realistically I don't see that happening.
  6. Oct 1, 2019
    #86

    SadlerMUFC Full Member

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    SO you're saying we can't play a 4-4-2 because that would take game time away from Mata and Lingard? I'm failing to see the problem here. I also think that Lukaku would have thrived in this formation, but there's no point in talking about that...

    As for the formation, these are professional players. If they don't know how to switch to the simplest of formations then they shouldn't even see the field, never mind play for one of the biggest clubs in the world...
  7. Oct 1, 2019
    #87

    Hawks2008 Full Member

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    Could Rashford be developed into a second striker type? I'm thinking in a 4411 with Martial leading the line and Rashford slightly off him with license to drift wide or deep as he sees fit. Could be untapped potential in this kind of partnership.
  8. Oct 1, 2019
    #88

    meamth Full Member

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    No what I'm trying to say is if we go 4-4-2, we will be less effective than what we are now (we're already shyte).

    We can't get results by playing players to their strengths, what do you expect from changing their preferred positions?

    We have at least 60 games to play this season, 4-4-2 will make us even more thin into the season. You're risking to not play first team players and that will make them fairly useless without form.

    We have to use the squad, not blindly changing formations if things aren't going well.
  9. Oct 1, 2019
    #89

    meamth Full Member

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    EDIT:

    The state of the squad is dire,
    We need to get rid of CAMs (Mata, Lingard has to go)
    Clear out Center backs.
    Add a couple of Fullbacks.
    Sign at least 1 or 2 more CMs.
    We need a couple of wingers.

    Then we can play 4-4-2 permanently.
  10. Oct 1, 2019
    #90

    BigMacBaz New Member

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    No because you would have to be an intelligent footballer to make such a transition and Rashford certainly isn't intelligent.
  11. Oct 1, 2019
    #91

    UNITED ACADEMY Full Member

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    His decision making is poor for the role.
  12. Oct 1, 2019
    #92

    Invictus Poster of the Year 2015 & 2018 Staff

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    Erm, Rashford should focus on the wide forward role instead of being distracted — the kid blatantly needs direction and individual/collective coaching and a proper structure because while he's talented, he hasn't come up leaps and bounds over the last couple of seasons (and might actually be regressing as time goes on). Consider some of the best second-strikers of the years gone by: Rivaldo, Cantona, Raúl, Bergkamp, Yorke, Kaká, Del Piero, Rooney, Zola, Müller, Totti, Griezmann, Sheringham — to a man, they had an innate creative spark (Cantona) or were technical dribblers (Del Piero) or had fantastic interpretation of space (Müller) or receded deeper to influence things in midfield (Rooney) or had exceptional decision-making (Bergkamp) — or a couple (or more) of those qualities combined, and Rashford doesn't quite fit the mold.

    If he absolutely must play as a second-striker for some odd reason, United will have to either move to a diamond formation with a #10 behind Rashford and Martial, or use the old-school scheme of little second-striker + tall lead-striker or employ a False-9 type of center forward ahead of him to balance things out (think of someone along the lines of Firmino at Liverpool, Tadić at Ajax or Falcao ahead of Mbappé when Monaco reached the Champions League semi-final). Plus, our midfield is defensively suspect and isn't set up for a 4-4-1-1, especially considering Rashford can't influence the game in deeper areas of the pitch as a conduit, and the whole structure will restrict Pogba (on top of putting unimaginable amounts of pressure on his defensive-minded central midfield partner).
  13. Oct 1, 2019
    #93

    mjstokes85 New Member

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    Pleasantly surprised to see so many on her championing 4-4-2, I've thought for years it would be our best approach, especially against "lesser" teams.
  14. Oct 1, 2019
    #94

    InLevyITrust Full Member

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    4-4-2 isn't dead, but you need 2 very strong, very disciplined and very good all-round CMs.
  15. Oct 1, 2019
    #95

    SadlerMUFC Full Member

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    Whose preferred position am I changing for a 4-4-2? Mata and Lingard. That's basically it. And the last time Lingard played as a striker in a 4-4-2 we beat Chelsea 2-0 in 2017
  16. Oct 1, 2019
    #96

    stepic Full Member

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    we should be playing 433. it frees up Pogba who is our best outfield player. Rashford on left, Martial up top, James on the right, Pogba, McT and Matic* in midfield (*i guess. we should have replaced him in the summer but hey ho. or try and train McT or Fred into a defensive mid).
  17. Oct 1, 2019
    #97

    Bestietom Full Member

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    Pereira is not good enough to be here. Greenwood would be better choice. I would even play Young there before Pereira. Ole has to try something different.
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2019
  18. Oct 1, 2019
    #98

    SadlerMUFC Full Member

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    He's not good enough, and we definitely need a new winger, but I see Pereira as a winger more than I see him as a centre midfielder. He can at least put in a cross and is good on set plays. But perhaps Young would be the better option...for now
  19. Oct 1, 2019
    #99

    bond19821982 Full Member

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    Need a proper striker to play 442. We just sold one .
  20. Oct 1, 2019

    Jinn Full Member

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    No we didn't. Proper strikers can hold the fecking ball up.
  21. Oct 1, 2019

    AceUnited New Member

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    How about 4231:

    -------------------------De Gea------------------------

    AWB -------Linde/Axel ------ Maguire---------Shaw

    ----------------Mc.T ---------------- Pogba-----------

    ---Mason----------------Rashy ----------------James

    ------------------------Martial------------------------


    don't laugh... it is just a suggestion.