African Cup of Nations 2021 (played in 2022) | Final: Senegal v Egypt, 7 PM UK time

WeePat

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What a tournament. I've been throughly entertained :lol:
 

WeePat

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I mean fecking hell, I'm in actual tears. I can't believe I decided to pop to the supermarket while this was going on.

 

Lay

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What a shite tournament so far. A real lack of goals too, there's been seven 1-0 wins and two 0-0 draws in 10 games so far :lol:

Not even going to go into the farce today either.
 

DutchRed7

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Man do I love AFCON. Only for the tackles it's worth watching.
 

90 + 5min

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Absolute shocking start of the tournament in every aspect. You can't pick what is worst.
 

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What a shite tournament so far. A real lack of goals too, there's been seven 1-0 wins and two 0-0 draws in 10 games so far :lol:

Not even going to go into the farce today either.
And like half the goals are from penalty kicks! Worst AFCON ever! Embarrasing!
 

V.O.

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Pretty sure the Gambia manager is the protagonist from Disco Elysium.

I'm fascinated by the random no mark French/Belgian managers that seem to roll around Africa managing every single national team.
 

WeePat

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Pretty sure the Gambia manager is the protagonist from Disco Elysium.

I'm fascinated by the random no mark French/Belgian managers that seem to roll around Africa managing every single national team.
I actually really hate how these random low level European managers that 2nd division European clubs wouldn't look twice at somehow dupe African federation into giving them the keys to the national team.
 

Chipper

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Pretty sure the Gambia manager is the protagonist from Disco Elysium.

I'm fascinated by the random no mark French/Belgian managers that seem to roll around Africa managing every single national team.
That got me googling to find out/remember the name of that odd-looking one.

The legendary Claude LeRoy!
 

P-Ro

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I actually really hate how these random low level European managers that 2nd division European clubs wouldn't look twice at somehow dupe African federation into giving them the keys to the national team.
The Egyptian manager's CV is pretty stacked: Manchester United, Real Madrid and throwing a bib at Roy Keane.
 

NYAS

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This is what makes the whole thing stranger, he is (was?) one of the top African refs, having coached at world cup level (including under 17s WC, under 20s WC and two matches at the main WC in 2018), plus many AFCON games, notably the final in 2017. In fact he has been ref'ing AFCON matches since at least 2012 so this was very odd from him. I wonder what happened there. Very strange indeed.

However, it's not a representation of African football or African refereeing in anyway whatsoever, just one really very poor performance by an otherwise normally decent ref. Hope no one makes any extrapolations or generalisations using this random occurence.
The referee in question is established, however this sort of thing from CAF is really not as random as you make out.

The CL final VAR farce a few years ago comes to mind.

The wrong national anthem being played in this current game.

Those are two examples off the top of my head.

And I don’t say this intending to bash African football, it’s certainly much better than the Western media think it is, but stuff like today really doesn’t help and we can’t pretend there isn’t a trend.
 

the_cliff

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I actually really hate how these random low level European managers that 2nd division European clubs wouldn't look twice at somehow dupe African federation into giving them the keys to the national team.
That's one thing I've never understood. Especially considering African teams usually do better when they're managed by Africans.

I remember Shehata with Egypt. Algeria with Belmadi.

Nigeria look a lot better with Eguavoen than they did under Rohr.

Although I guess there are some success stories with European managers, Herve Renard with Zambia and Ivory Coast springs to mind.
 

WeePat

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That's one thing I've never understood. Especially considering African teams usually do better when they're managed by Africans.

I remember Shehata with Egypt. Algeria with Belmadi.

Nigeria look a lot better with Eguavoen than they did under Rohr.

Although I guess there are some success stories with European managers, Herve Renard with Zambia and Ivory Coast springs to mind.
Even Renard. He went from managing some no mark French club languishing in the 5th division to the Zambian national team just like that. He's since managed 4 other African national teams with a varied levels of success but he certainly didn't get his foot in the door on merit.
 

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The referee in question is established, however this sort of thing from CAF is really not as random as you make out.

The CL final VAR farce a few years ago comes to mind.

The wrong national anthem being played in this current game.

Those are two examples off the top of my head.

And I don’t say this intending to bash African football, it’s certainly much better than the Western media think it is, but stuff like today really doesn’t help and we can’t pretend there isn’t a trend.
Okay, I take it you don't mean to bash but I think you're seeing a trend in African football which is either a set of outliers or a trend in football in general.

VAR farces and football body mis-decision farces are much wider than African football, to be fair. They happen all over the world.

I have seen wrong national anthems played even at the olympics, for crying out loud, and it is by no means common in African competitions.

That's your two examples; it's either outliers you're seeing a trend in, or stuff which happen all over, not specific to African football.
And I am by no means even a supporter of CAF and football governing organisations in general. I think they are a corrupt bunch, all of them.
 

V.O.

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Some properly evil looking clouds forming overhead. What we really need to improve this matchup of shite 5-at-the-back 'shut up shop and hope for the best' merchants is for the second half to be played in a swamp. :drool:
 

NYAS

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Okay, I take it you don't mean to bash but I think you're seeing a trend in African football which is either a set of outliers or a trend in football in general.

VAR farces and football body mis-decision farces are much wider than African football, to be fair. They happen all over the world.

I have seen wrong national anthems played even at the olympics, for crying out loud, and it is by no means common in African competitions.

That's your two examples; it's either outliers you're seeing a trend in, or stuff which happen all over, not specific to African football.
And I am by no means even a supporter of CAF and football governing organisations in general. I think they are a corrupt bunch, all of them.
My problem is with CAF. I was (and still am) hoping things would improve after Ahmed Ahmed left but there’s still a lot of work to do.
 

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That's one thing I've never understood. Especially considering African teams usually do better when they're managed by Africans.

I remember Shehata with Egypt. Algeria with Belmadi.

Nigeria look a lot better with Eguavoen than they did under Rohr.

Although I guess there are some success stories with European managers, Herve Renard with Zambia and Ivory Coast springs to mind.
One positive about this present tournament is that there seems to be a growing number of African teams with national managers. I am delighted to see lots of teams, even the lower ranked ones, going for their national coaches, instead of European rejects like Toni Conceiçao who previously to managing Cameroon had absolutely no experience with African football and such a poor CV that everyone wondered how he was ever seriously considered for the job.

At least, I have way more respect for guys like Didier Gomes (French manager of Mauritania) who coached in lower leagues in France before coming to Africa but has spent the past 10 years coaching club sides in lots of African countries before landing his first NT job with Mauritania. He can boast of having a very good knowledge of African football from his coaching experience.
 

marktan

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Two Adama Troares in the starting lineup for Mali today. There's been a profileration of Dembele's recently but what are the odds of this? Are there just lots of Adama Troares in Mali?

 

Red the Bear

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apparently the sum of of playing time (ball in play) in the tunisia , mali match was 17 minutes and 27 seconds which is absolutely bonkers :lol:
 

Dansk

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The last ten games have been 1-0, 1-0, 0-0, 1-0, 0-0, 1-0, 1-0, 1-0, 1-0, and 1-0. I think this referee just wanted to salvage the view count.
 

the_cliff

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One positive about this present tournament is that there seems to be a growing number of African teams with national managers. I am delighted to see lots of teams, even the lower ranked ones, going for their national coaches, instead of European rejects like Toni Conceiçao who previously to managing Cameroon had absolutely no experience with African football and such a poor CV that everyone wondered how he was ever seriously considered for the job.

At least, I have way more respect for guys like Didier Gomes (French manager of Mauritania) who coached in lower leagues in France before coming to Africa but has spent the past 10 years coaching club sides in lots of African countries before landing his first NT job with Mauritania. He can boast of having a very good knowledge of African football from his coaching experience.
Yeah even Seedorf was an odd appointment by Cameroon, I remember you guys tried with Rigobert Song but it didn't work out unfortunately. iirc Cameroon has had a lot of success with European managers in the AFCON which is the opposite of us (Algeria), who've only won when being coached by managers from our nation.

Aliou Cisse has done well with Senegal, but I fear he'll be sacked if they don't win this tournament and replaced with a Conceiçao like European manager.
 
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V.O.

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Another 1-0 snoozefest in the books. At least the game was won by the single moment of any quality at all that happened.
 

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This AFCON have been disappointing in terms of quality, but it suits perfectly with how underwhelming have been the last international tournaments in the past decade...only Euro 2012 was enjoyable.

I think the fact that games are more tactical now doesn't help either, so many defensive matches everywhere.
 

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And this incident is exactly why the CAF is not taking seriously and is classed as a second rank international competition

How can a referee who was under investigation for corruption in 2018 be allowed to referee an international match again, and then do this by with blowing the whistle early, 2x, plus no added time. Not saying he shouldn't be a referee, just do it at a level where the corruption isn't at an international stage
 

Dansk

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European rejects like Toni Conceiçao who previously to managing Cameroon had absolutely no experience with African football and such a poor CV that everyone wondered how he was ever seriously considered for the job.
Haha, I just looked him up. He's had like 18 different managerial appointments since 1999, including three different stints at CFR Cluj several years apart, in which he was sacked within a year all three times. The majority of his manager jobs have started and ended within one calendar year. As a player, he once won the title in Portugal with a single appearance for Porto. It's like when I made it through college on perpetual academic probation, doing the absolute barest minimum required to avoid getting kicked out.
 

Lay

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Another 1-0 :lol:

Now I don’t have much to go on, but over a decade ago I recall a few African ex players bemoaning the amount of European coaches in Africa, that it’s making the matches boring as they’re too tactical and defensive. Does that have any merit or is just other factors?
 

the_cliff

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Another 1-0 :lol:

Now I don’t have much to go on, but over a decade ago I recall a few African ex players bemoaning the amount of European coaches in Africa, that it’s making the matches boring as they’re too tactical and defensive. Does that have any merit or is just other factors?
I don't think so. I think the number of European managers have actually decreased since then.

I think it's normal, beginning of tournaments teams are usually more conservative in their style of play. It should get better from the second round of fixtures which starts tomorrow. Teams are going to have to go for it more.

You have to realise it's also 30 odd degrees. That could add to it tbh.
 

rimaldo

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caf president, patrice motsepe, has broken his silence on today’s match between tunisia and mali, saying “events today have moved me, to a bigger house!”
 

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Yeah even Seedorf was an odd appointment by Cameroon, I remember you guys tried with Rigobert Song but it didn't work out unfortunately. iirc Cameroon has had a lot of success with European managers in the AFCON which is the opposite of us (Algeria), who've only won when being coached by managers from our nation.

Aliou Cisse has done well with Senegal, but I fear he'll be sacked if they don't win this tournament and replaced with a Conceiçao like European manager.
That's the sad thing. Happens with most African teams, a local manager is given one chance to win a trophy and they are out. At least Aliou CIsse kept his job after failing in the finals last time.



Haha, I just looked him up. He's had like 18 different managerial appointments since 1999, including three different stints at CFR Cluj several years apart, in which he was sacked within a year all three times. The majority of his manager jobs have started and ended within one calendar year. As a player, he once won the title in Portugal with a single appearance for Porto. It's like when I made it through college on perpetual academic probation, doing the absolute barest minimum required to avoid getting kicked out.
And you get a job at NASA after that. Madness! (Okay, Cameroon NT might not be quite comparable to NASA but still)
 

Ogaranya

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Hannibal is still not physically strong for epl, he was manhandled by the Mali midfielders
 

adexkola

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What a shite tournament so far. A real lack of goals too, there's been seven 1-0 wins and two 0-0 draws in 10 games so far :lol:

Not even going to go into the farce today either.
Why are you still watching it then? I felt the same way about '89 Serie A and I switched off after the first 3 games...