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This!!Imagine if he had a decent team around him, imagine if at 20 he wasn't our only attacking threat in the team, imagine he was allowed to play less often and have less of a burden on him all the time. He's literally our only attacking player that looks capable of doing something, he's our only attacking player capable of getting you off your seat, but he basically has to do it all himself, other than Bruno, who's all over the pitch, he's our only creative outlet.
If he was part of a proper squad and a proper team he would develop into one of the best players in the world. If we sell him we will be regretting it within a couple seasons.
But this is sort of the issue. I agree that his attacking instincts and general movement are the most promising parts of his game, but just blindly assuming "oh yeah he'll get more clinical and become a better finisher and decision maker" without any evidence to support it is just sort of living on a prayer. He's not some supremely gifted technician or ball striker where it's just a matter of slowing the game down a bit and having some more composure. McTominay and Mainoo have far better instincts/composure in the box than Garnacho ever has and both of them are midfielders. I don't think it's just a matter of him continuing to get countless chances presented to him just for him to fluff them all in the name of "development".A lot of criticism aimed at Garnacho stems from him being extremely wasteful. However, one needs to remember that he gets into those positions. A player like Antony never got into positions. Højlund doesn't get into positions; Sancho didn't etc, etc.
I think Garnacho's greatest attribute is his ability and timing to get into positions, either in behind the defense or to find space to get a shot. He is wasteful, but if he wasn't - if he was more lethal, he would be a 20 a goal player, easily, and we would be raving about him instead of discussing if he is great at taking on players or not - Salah never goes past a man anymore. I'm not sure what Garnacho's game is going to be, but his ability to get into the right positions is of very high quality, and when/if he becomes more clinical, he is suddenly a helluva player to have - because amongst other things he also works hard on and off the ball.
But this is sort of the issue. I agree that his attacking instincts and general movement are the most promising parts of his game, but just blindly assuming "oh yeah he'll get more clinical and become a better finisher and decision maker" without any evidence to support it is just sort of living on a prayer. He's not some supremely gifted technician or ball striker where it's just a matter of slowing the game down a bit and having some more composure. McTominay and Mainoo have far better instincts/composure in the box than Garnacho ever has and both of them are midfielders. I don't think it's just a matter of him continuing to get countless chances presented to him just for him to fluff them all in the name of "development".
Not quite sure I agree. Plenty of attacking players have been largely hit and miss when young - exciting, but wasteful is quite common. Then as they get more experienced many get more clinical. Even Salah wasn’t clinical at 20. Most players sre not. It’s always difficult to predict their future development though, so he needs to improve in these aspects of his game. It is promising that he gets into those positions though.But this is sort of the issue. I agree that his attacking instincts and general movement are the most promising parts of his game, but just blindly assuming "oh yeah he'll get more clinical and become a better finisher and decision maker" without any evidence to support it is just sort of living on a prayer. He's not some supremely gifted technician or ball striker where it's just a matter of slowing the game down a bit and having some more composure. McTominay and Mainoo have far better instincts/composure in the box than Garnacho ever has and both of them are midfielders. I don't think it's just a matter of him continuing to get countless chances presented to him just for him to fluff them all in the name of "development".
Imagine if he had a decent team around him, imagine if at 20 he wasn't our only attacking threat in the team, imagine he was allowed to play less often and have less of a burden on him all the time. He's literally our only attacking player that looks capable of doing something, he's our only attacking player capable of getting you off your seat, but he basically has to do it all himself, other than Bruno, who's all over the pitch, he's our only creative outlet.
If he was part of a proper squad and a proper team he would develop into one of the best players in the world. If we sell him we will be regretting it within a couple seasons.
Agree with that. The reason he starts and is in the team is because no one else really offers what he does, and though he is wasteful, he’s very rarely anonymous.A lot of criticism aimed at Garnacho stems from him being extremely wasteful. However, one needs to remember that he gets into those positions. A player like Antony never got into positions. Højlund doesn't get into positions; Sancho didn't etc, etc.
I think Garnacho's greatest attribute is his ability and timing to get into positions, either in behind the defense or to find space to get a shot. He is wasteful, but if he wasn't - if he was more lethal, he would be a 20 a goal player, easily, and we would be raving about him instead of discussing if he is great at taking on players or not - Salah never goes past a man anymore. I'm not sure what Garnacho's game is going to be, but his ability to get into the right positions is of very high quality, and when/if he becomes more clinical, he is suddenly a helluva player to have - because amongst other things he also works hard on and off the ball.
The fact is we even sold Ronaldo for the "right" price".
Juventus sold us Pogba for the "right price" too.
Barcelona sold Neymar for the "right price".
The right price is a transfer fee in correlation with or over a players value.
If Napoli came with a 50-65 million offer then most likely it would be regarded as something that matches Garnacho's value to us.
Whether he fits the system or not doesnt matter, you can't sell a Porsche for the price of a Suzuki just because it doesn't fit in your garage.
If the right offer comes he can go, but otherwise he stays.
Its not that complicated but the way some people talk about him is like he is a worthless 20 year old who we should sell as soon as possible to the first bidder.
He is a valuable asset and if another club meets his valuation to the point its hard for both the club and player to say no then he can go.
The level of hate and analysis the kid get with "supporters" trying to almost force him out of the club is evil and people feel like this can't be felt because they are just typing behind a computer.
My biggest regret of falling in love with Manchester United is there's a real lack of family and support. I can even sense it in players commentary like Scholes, Keane & Neville - people I like less and less as I hear more and more.
I don't really care about made up bullshit like xg, I watch the game, he's the only player on United that gets you out of your seat, maybe if you put the phone down and stopped worrying about invented stats to try to make online tacticos look smarter and paid attention to the game you would see the potential he has to change a game.Interesting use of the word "literally" here, especially when it's followed by information that's utterly false. In terms of creativity in the league per 90 minutes, he's 9th in our squad for expected assists, 8th for assists, 7th for chances created, 14th for through balls played, 18th for crossing success rate, 19th for passing success rate (16th for final third passing success rate), 6th for progressive carries, 8th for shot conversion rate, 13th for xG per shot, all from Opta.
He isn't close to being among our most creative players, doesn't look capable of doing something nor gets anyone off their seat if they've been paying any attention to him. He's simply lacking talent in almost all areas of the game, being among the worst dribblers in the league (his success rate puts him in the 17th percentile), with the main exception being his workrate which is pretty good.
If he was part of a proper squad and a proper team he would develop into a reasonably good option to bring off the bench, as is his ceiling. The idea that an attacker who's so poor at shooting, passing, dribbling, and crossing would end up as one of the best players in the world is laughable.
I don't really care about made up bullshit like xg, I watch the game, he's the only player on United that gets you out of your seat, maybe if you put the phone down and stopped worrying about invented stats to try to make online tacticos look smarter and paid attention to the game you would see the potential he has to change a game.
I don't really care about made up bullshit like xg, I watch the game, he's the only player on United that gets you out of your seat, maybe if you put the phone down and stopped worrying about invented stats to try to make online tacticos look smarter and paid attention to the game you would see the potential he has to change a game.
He’s also the player that makes me want to throw my TV out the fecking window the most, due to how frustratingly yet consistently poor his decision making and finishing is.
A bunch of posters felt this way about Nani. If we had him now he'd be up with Bruno as our best player
I'm not disagreeing with this, but most of the time other young players in this mold often are explosive physically or exceptional technically (or sometimes both), in a way that you can see how they'll affect the game if their end product/final third play takes that next jump. Garnacho isn't either of these, though; he's decent physically but not a young Rashford that threatens any defender on and off the ball, and he's a poor technician as well. So you have to hope that he just suddenly improves and sharpens his attacking play while he's not going to threaten much otherwise.Not quite sure I agree. Plenty of attacking players have been largely hit and miss when young - exciting, but wasteful is quite common. Then as they get more experienced many get more clinical. Even Salah wasn’t clinical at 20. Most players sre not. It’s always difficult to predict their future development though, so he needs to improve in these aspects of his game. It is promising that he gets into those positions though.
I don’t really care if a bunch of posters felt this way about Nani - he was head and shoulders above Garnacho in terms of skills and productivity.
A bunch of posters felt this way about Nani. If we had him now he'd be up with Bruno as our best player
Yes he was, but he was behind several of our attacking players at the time when he was 20. He wasnt our only threat running with the ball and our player most likely to get a shot on target. He got going and had 18 months of incredible form as one of our best players but that certainly wasnt at 20.
I think he can forecast, assuming the Cunha links are true, his spot is likely gone if we assume Cunha/Amad will be the 10s. If someone offers close to the £60m fee that was bandied around, whack a sell on clause on it and we've suddenly freed up major funds. I think that is Ineos plan, to be honest, sell him and Mainoo if the prices are right and we're basically able to spent insane amounts.I think this is probably the summer he is sold and moves on. He's going to want assurances around being a starter (especially if, as we predict both a AM and CF will arrive) which the club/Amorim won't be able to provide. Garnacho doesn't seem like someone who wants to only play a bit part role and rightfully so, in terms of his own development. If this is the case, i just hope we reinvest and spend wisely.
Yeah can’t argue with any of that. I hope we keep Mainoo though - even if it’s difficult to see where exactly he fits into an Amorim system.I think he can forecast, assuming the Cunha links are true, his spot is likely gone if we assume Cunha/Amad will be the 10s. If someone offers close to the £60m fee that was bandied around, whack a sell on clause on it and we've suddenly freed up major funds. I think that is Ineos plan, to be honest, sell him and Mainoo if the prices are right and we're basically able to spent insane amounts.
I have a lot of time for him, bar his selfishness though that gets solved when he is off the right where he would be competing with Amad directly, he has the skillset to be a good player - tenacious, fast with the ball, decent burst of acceleration, good touch, decision making has been a huge issue, as has the blinkers for shooting but he is suffering from the simple truth that very few 19/20 year olds should be starting for a club who want to be where we want to be. He should be behind a senior player banging in the goals that he then grows into the role and looks to push past in a year or two.
So what? Even at 20 his shooting, crossing and dribbling technique was significantly sharper than Garnacho’s are at 20.
What point are you trying to prove here by comparing Garnacho to more talented players from our past?
Im not. You are
Im comparing Nani and how he was treated relative to his teammates to how Garnacho is relative to his teammates by posters. Nani was obviously a better player, but played with better teammates and there were higher expectations on players. But he was considered frustrating, even when he played well posters would slate him. Garnacho has the same. But given hes only 20 he might learn to be less frustrating in a couple of years as he matures
Are you feeling ok? You were the one brought Nani up. I made no mention of him until you replied to me and started going on about Nani for some bizarre reason.
Comparing Nani and Ganrancho is asinine. Different players with different talents in dramatically different periods of our club. I really don’t see the point.
If your point is that football fans on football forums criticize players then yes, well done, that is indeed a timeless feature of football forums.
Yes. I said that Nani was considered frustrating, which is true. You then compared them.
I've not once said that Garnacho is as good as Nani
You brought Nani into this as a point of comparison. No one here was comparing them until you decided to compare them.
I’m still not sure why you felt the need to bring a player from our distant past into this. The comparison is asinine.
Yes you comparing them and still being twisted into a pretzel thinking about it now is asinine. I can see you're too confused to contribute further.
I'm not disagreeing with this, but most of the time other young players in this mold often are explosive physically or exceptional technically (or sometimes both), in a way that you can see how they'll affect the game if their end product/final third play takes that next jump. Garnacho isn't either of these, though; he's decent physically but not a young Rashford that threatens any defender on and off the ball, and he's a poor technician as well. So you have to hope that he just suddenly improves and sharpens his attacking play while he's not going to threaten much otherwise.
It's not a great bet to make for a team skint for cash and needed multiple upgrades all over the pitch.
Freddie LljunbergYeah, I'm not sure who I can compare him to. The Nani comparisons are completely off the mark - very different players both stylistically and athletically.
What Garnacho brings is his uncanny ability to be in the right place and time his runs, create space for himself without being blistering - he's still quite fast, faster than Mahrez ever was for instance - nor is he a playmaker, so he's not your typical young winger, but nor is he a 10.
He has good technique, but it's erratic. Just as he has good finishing, but it's erratic.
I still have hope for him, and as I said, if he had capitalised on his chances instead of some erratic finishing and sometimes poor decision making, then we would be having a different discussion.
Which is a sure sign of how our standards have massively droppedA bunch of posters felt this way about Nani. If we had him now he'd be up with Bruno as our best player
I think this is probably the summer he is sold and moves on. He's going to want assurances around being a starter (especially if, as we predict both a AM and CF will arrive) which the club/Amorim won't be able to provide. Garnacho doesn't seem like someone who wants to only play a bit part role and rightfully so, in terms of his own development. If this is the case, i just hope we reinvest and spend wisely.
Yeah, completely agree. I personally think there’s a role for him (in the squad) in an Amorim system - especially coming off the bench and stretching teams out wide with his pace and directness (he offers what nobody else in the squad does), but as we’re both pointing out - Garnacho would want more then that and he’s one of our few sellable assets who can help us generate cash for incomings.I think this is correct, Garnacho probably sees himself as a starting player as he's been around the squad as a starting regular for a while now.
Reality is though - Amorin's system doesn't suit and it is clear a good few players will be ahead of Garnacho for one of the two starting spots.
We are 100% signing attacking players, so if the links to Cunha play out he's ahead of Garnacho. Amad is our best attacking outlet and will be ahead of him also. I'd also say Mount, Mainoo and Fernandes would be more likely to start ahead of Garnacho as a 10 (Fernanded dependant on who we sign for a DM/CM role obviously)
Garnacho also represents one of the few players in this squad who we could sell for big money. Selling him pays for Cunha. Seeing as Garnacho doesnt suit the system - surely that's a win from a financial viewpoint as well as improving the squad
I think this is correct, Garnacho probably sees himself as a starting player as he's been around the squad as a starting regular for a while now.
Reality is though - Amorin's system doesn't suit and it is clear a good few players will be ahead of Garnacho for one of the two starting spots.
We are 100% signing attacking players, so if the links to Cunha play out he's ahead of Garnacho. Amad is our best attacking outlet and will be ahead of him also. I'd also say Mount, Mainoo and Fernandes would be more likely to start ahead of Garnacho as a 10 (Fernanded dependant on who we sign for a DM/CM role obviously)
Garnacho also represents one of the few players in this squad who we could sell for big money. Selling him pays for Cunha. Seeing as Garnacho doesnt suit the system - surely that's a win from a financial viewpoint as well as improving the squad
He is only dangerous if you are sitting in the stand.Imagine hating a 20 years old , who is our most dangerous player .
