[AndySmith1990]

Another massively overrated young player, quite frankly.

 

[Woodywizz]

The fact he just sat there shaking his head after the substitution says it all.

Bad attitude. We don’t need his bullshit, not when he provides so little.

 

[Uncle Mainoo]

I was one among those who said back in 2003/2004 to sell CR7 and buy Simao for our left wing.

Just saying!

I’m still in this camp.

The kid will probably turn into Salah 2.0 once he finally realises the benefits of the gym and gains confidence. That would just p me off.

 

[Kingslayer18]

He seems to have picked up bad habits and not improved his workons. Still not effecient enough when shooting or through on goal, doesn't pick his head up when dribbling and selfish in his play. When he burst on the scene, we were all excited but now I think either he was overhyped or he has regressed. While I like his relentlessness in his play and is an outlet for us, it seems that is his main attribute rather than outstanding dribbling ability or outright speed. I don't think he will be effective enough as an inside 10, so I think if we get a 50m+ bid in the summer, we should sell and get a player who will fit that role better.

 

[Schmeichels pinky]

The fact he just sat there shaking his head after the substitution says it all.

Bad attitude. We don’t need his bullshit, not when he provides so little.

That’s what’s bothering me. I’m all for giving young players many chances and have patience with them if they fight for the team. But this selfish entitled mentality Garnacho has should not be tolerated.

 

[Shaw's Shank Redemption]

Is his sulking for getting substituted or from him having a poor performance?

Him sulking over a poor performance is fine with me

 

[Dannn411]

He is at risk of becoming an also-ran rather than a true great if his bad traits are not caoched out of him. Incredibly selfish, petulant attitude and rarely ever plays with his head up.

 

[Schmeichels pinky]

Is his sulking for getting substituted or from him having a poor performance?

Him sulking over a poor performance is fine with me

Well, he’s shown bad attitude many times before so even with benefits of the doubt here we can safely say he needs to either grow up or leave

 

[mk7]

Could have squared the ball for all of his side-netting efforts, acts like he is one of our star players - get rid if a suitable offers comes in.

 

[Aint gota Kalou]

With all our other attackers injured he's crucial to have a threat on the break. Was poor and wasteful overall but we looked a lot worse with Eriksen coming on.

 

[Xeque_279]

I think it's more just lack of intelligence - he squared it for the goal and also used Dalot on the overlap for our other big chance in the first half. The two poor near post efforts from him were the wrong decision but in terms of where he directed them - shooting was the correct decision on both occasions.

Yeah correct. Should've been more of a cross cum shot. I feel like playing on the right he needs to think more, on the left it comes naturally to him which is why he does the same thing again and again.

 

[Champ]

Lucky to have him, without Garnacho last night we would have been completely toothless.

Great work rate, good attitude and bar a couple of wrong decisions another good performance overall.

 

[Paul778]

Lucky to have him, without Garnacho last night we would have been completely toothless.

Great work rate, good attitude and bar a couple of wrong decisions another good performance overall.

Lucky to have him..? Trying to work out if this is a wind up

Think of all the amazing wingers we've had over the years. Then think of all the mid tier ones as well. Then put them in order of ability and end product - xGA or whatever you'd like.

Right now I'm thinking Moorhouse has got to be an option for minutes from the bench.

 

[Champ]

Lucky to have him..? Trying to work out if this is a wind up

Think of all the amazing wingers we've had over the years. Then think of all the mid tier ones as well. Then put them in order of ability and end product - xGA or whatever you'd like.

Right now I'm thinking Moorhouse has got to be an option for minutes from the bench.

It's all relative, look where we are right now, we aren't the team we used to be.

Without Garnacho last night we would have had near enough nothing going forward.
It's a take which is very hard to argue against, as it's completely true, just needs people to take off their blinkers to realise it.

 

[Paul778]

It's all relative, look where we are right now, we aren't the team we used to be.

Without Garnacho last night we would have had near enough nothing going forward.
It's a take which is very hard to argue against, as it's completely true, just needs people to take off their blinkers to realise it.

The sad thing is I could have said the same thing not about ex-united players but no10s from all the current EPL teams.

 

[Ezkay]

Lucky to have him, without Garnacho last night we would have been completely toothless.

Great work rate, good attitude and bar a couple of wrong decisions another good performance overall.

I agree, I find it so hard to be annoyed at him most the threat comes from him. End product isn’t there but we’ve all seen how stale we look without him. Created our goal yesterday and nice play to pass to Dalot who crossed to Bruno for what was another great chance. The sheer persistence and volume you don’t find often especially in such a mentally weak team

 

[Paul778]

Another thing that is also annoying me is his selfish shot selection. Not just fact that he's taking the shots but his choice of where to try and put it.

When he is inside the box, ,more often than not he tries to shoot to the goalkeepers near post it seems. This is the low percentage chance since keepers are always taught first and foremost to cover your post. However, beyond that it removes any chance of a 2nd phase chance. If he shoots across the goalkeeper, it opens up the chance of another getting a decisive touch if it's going wide or a potential tap in if the goalkeeper spills it.

Shooting nearside means if the goalkeeper blocks or parries it will not end up anywhere near another player.

 

[Marwood]

It's all relative, look where we are right now, we aren't the team we used to be.

Without Garnacho last night we would have had near enough nothing going forward.
It's a take which is very hard to argue against, as it's completely true, just needs people to take off their blinkers to realise it.

So just to clarify, when Amad is out we don't miss him.

But when Garnacho is out we definitely do miss him?

 

[FlawlessVictory88]

It's all relative, look where we are right now, we aren't the team we used to be.

Without Garnacho last night we would have had near enough nothing going forward.
It's a take which is very hard to argue against, as it's completely true, just needs people to take off their blinkers to realise it.

Well sure but that's not saying much since we've sold Sancho/Greenwood, loaned out Rashford/Anthony and Amad is currently injured. There's not a single left winger in the squad for him to compete with.

If any of the above players where in the United squad we'd be saying the exact same thing about them since there's literally no competition.

It doesn't change the larger point people are making that he simply isn't good enough. The fact that United don't have anyone in the squad currently to replace him doesn't change that.

 

[Champ]

Well sure but that's not saying much since we've sold Sancho/Greenwood, loaned out Rashford/Anthony and Amad is currently injured. There's not a single left winger in the squad for him to compete with.

If any of the above players where in the United squad we'd be saying the exact same thing about them since there's literally no competition.

It doesn't change the larger point people are making that he simply isn't good enough. The fact that United don't have anyone in the squad currently to replace him doesn't change that.

Good enough for past squads? Probably not.
Good enough for this squad? Most definitely.

He's still very young and has raw attributes which he will within time iron out I'm sure, but currently he's our best attacking threat and has been most of the season.
He works hard, his attitude is near enough spot on despite what some might say on here, he constantly makes the right runs, wins the ball back, and gets into great positions. All good attributes for a top player.
His decision making at times is very suspect, but again he's young still and this I'm sure will be improved.
As I say, we are lucky to have him available in the squad.

 

[Champ]

So just to clarify, when Amad is out we don't miss him.

But when Garnacho is out we definitely do miss him?

I stated we won't miss Amad because we have other players like Garnacho and Bruno who can step up to the plate in an attacking way, which is what is happening.

Take Garnacho out of that team, we have zero pace or runners beyond, so yes we would miss him more than anyone else right now.

 

[RedStarUnited]

I’m still in this camp.

The kid will probably turn into Salah 2.0 once he finally realises the benefits of the gym and gains confidence. That would just p me off.

He has nowhere near the rapid acceleration Salah. And I don't think he lacks confidence at all.

 

[Red00012]

He has nowhere near the rapid acceleration Salah. And I don't think he lacks confidence at all.

There is certainly nothing wrong with his confidence anyway

 

[Apokalips]

Why sell him and advocate buying other young players just to do the same to them when they're not the best in the world at 20. He has shown a lot of promise and should be nurtured and coached to improve, which is our responsibility as a club - what happened to our patience in developing young talents. He should not be expected to carry the team nor make perfect decisions, which is why we are supposed to have a few quality, experienced players ahead of him (Rashford, Sancho, Antony, Martial, etc. were supposed to be that).

He is probably our most dangerous player after Bruno and Amad and we should nurture that to be a star for us in the future, but we really need the quality, peak players to have him work alongside and in support to while he continues to learn and develop. He has shown more than enough to be given that opportunity to grow here, I feel that our lack of threat and goals has probably encouraged him to be overly aggressive and force things which is creating bad habits.

 

[FlawlessVictory88]

Good enough for past squads? Probably not.
Good enough for this squad? Most definitely.

He's still very young and has raw attributes which he will within time iron out I'm sure, but currently he's our best attacking threat and has been most of the season.
He works hard, his attitude is near enough spot on despite what some might say on here, he constantly makes the right runs, wins the ball back, and gets into great positions. All good attributes for a top player.
His decision making at times is very suspect, but again he's young still and this I'm sure will be improved.
As I say, we are lucky to have him available in the squad.

Good enough for the worst squad in decades again doesn't change the point people are making that he's not good enough.

Well all of the data that tracks his performances disagrees with most of what you're claiming. "Works hard/wins ball back". He's in the bottom 20% of wingers for tackles/clearances and almost as bad for blocks. Ironically the only stat I can see him being in the elite category is "Fouls committed" where he's 97th percentile but that's because he's not making almost any tackles.

His decision making isn't suspect it's non existent. Assists bottom 25%, progressive passes bottom 10%, passes into final 3rd bottom 5% (jesus) passes into oenalty area bottom 10%, crosses into penalty area bottom 5% (again jesus) through balls bottom 4%.

I mean it's not just bad it's genuinely suggesting he should be playing in the championship.

So yeah he works very hard except that he barely makes any tackles/blocks/clearances and overall ball recovery has him as significantly below average.
I'm sure his decision making will improve as well but that's because you can't get much worse than being in the bottom 5%.

 

[bond19821982]

Why the comparison? Even at his most frustrating, Ronaldo always had the sheer talent level to be one of the best in the world (if not the best, before Messi came along anyway). Garnacho isn't even close to that talented. Rashford was more talented, let alone Ronaldo.

Except Ronaldo's freakish raw ability was obvious to everyone. The bet was just on whether he'd hone it.

That ability isn't present with AG. Not even close. Much of what makes him "highly rated" for now is his half decent G/A stats for his age, but the amount of actual quality 90's the guy has had for us might not be more than 2 or 3 in his entire career.

Sorry, what are you trying to say?

It's not a comparison. Young players grow at a different rate. We had a great team and a manager back then and we used to win matches . Yet - CR7's inconsistency and sulking used to frustrate us.

We are now expecting Garnacho to win us matches while he isn't ready for it. At a time when he should be slowly coming off the bench , the whole pressure is on this kid to win us games.
Look at the age group of players who started yesterday.

Dorgu - 20
Yoro - 18
Garnacho - 20
Zirkzee- 22
Hojlund- 22

They are kids and will be inconsistent . Our team is inconsistent because players are inconsistent. They are inconsistent because they are kids.

Name one team who is starting these many kids and yet, playing well consistently?

Our model is wrong and is our recruitment. We need some players who is at their peak and ready to deliver instantly. So cut these kids some slack. its so tiring.

 

[Champ]

Good enough for the worst squad in decades again doesn't change the point people are making that he's not good enough.

Well all of the data that tracks his performances disagrees with most of what you're claiming. "Works hard/wins ball back". He's in the bottom 20% of wingers for tackles/clearances and almost as bad for blocks. Ironically the only stat I can see him being in the elite category is "Fouls committed" where he's 97th percentile but that's because he's not making almost any tackles.

His decision making isn't suspect it's non existent. Assists bottom 25%, progressive passes bottom 10%, passes into final 3rd bottom 5% (jesus) passes into oenalty area bottom 10%, crosses into penalty area bottom 5% (again jesus) through balls bottom 4%.

I mean it's not just bad it's genuinely suggesting he should be playing in the championship.

So yeah he works very hard except that he barely makes any tackles/blocks/clearances and overall ball recovery has him as significantly below average.
I'm sure his decision making will improve as well but that's because you can't get much worse than being in the bottom 5%.

So despite being extremely high in the expected goals, shots, shots on target, touches in opposition box, tackles won, interceptions, blocks, ball recoveries, possession won back in the final third, fouls won, very low in the dispossessed column, he hasn't been very effective....

In any performance stats you want to use he ranks pretty highly in attacking and offensive threats, in fact he's nearly level with Amad on progressive carries, which I'd put as one of Amads many strong points in his game,

Its fine to not rate him, but when he is quite clearly our most effective attacking threat it really is a strange point of view.

Would he be good enough to play for a previous winning United side, possibly not, but I can near enough guarantee Sir Alex would have loved to have Garnacho in his squad, in fact he had stated as much previously....

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

It's not a comparison. Young players grow at a different rate. We had a great team and a manager back then and we used to win matches . Yet - CR7's inconsistency and sulking used to frustrate us.

We are now expecting Garnacho to win us matches while he isn't ready for it. At a time when he should be slowly coming off the bench , the whole pressure is on this kid to win us games.
Look at the age group of players who started yesterday.

Dorgu - 20
Yoro - 18
Garnacho - 20
Zirkzee- 22
Hojlund- 22

They are kids and will be inconsistent . Our team is inconsistent because players are inconsistent. They are inconsistent because they are kids.

Name one team who is starting these many kids and yet, playing well consistently?

Our model is wrong and is our recruitment. We need some players who is at their peak and ready to deliver instantly. So cut these kids some slack. its so tiring.

22 really isn’t that young in football. And I’m not expecting Garnacho to be some top level match winner. But the fact is he’s been a regular for now 3 seasons and has gotten worse as he’s played more football.

For a player that people were crying over potentially selling for 60m, that’s just not acceptable. Pretty simple.

 

[Shaw's Shank Redemption]

22 really isn’t that young in football. And I’m not expecting Garnacho to be some top level match winner. But the fact is he’s been a regular for now 3 seasons and has gotten worse as he’s played more football.

For a player that people were crying over potentially selling for 60m, that’s just not acceptable. Pretty simple.

Well this is not technically true. Garnacho was better last season than the one before that. So he did show progress during two years.

This season he has played for two different systems under 2 different managers and under one who arguably hasn't had a single player in the whole squad playing well except Amad & Bruno.

If it wasn't for PSR then no one would want to sell him unless he was the one who was leaking first xi news and continued doing that.

20 years old I was just entering the 2nd year of my university.

Very frustrating player but people act like he does nothing and doesn't get involved in the match when usually he is creating his own chances & runs which he messes up by poor shots or decisions.

 

[bond19821982]

22 really isn’t that young in football. And I’m not expecting Garnacho to be some top level match winner. But the fact is he’s been a regular for now 3 seasons and has gotten worse as he’s played more football.

For a player that people were crying over potentially selling for 60m, that’s just not acceptable. Pretty simple.

22 is still very young and Garnacho is 20. If the idea is to just argue for the sake of it, lets agree to disagree and move on.

Just think about players who made it in world of soccer and compare where they were at the age of 22. Not everyone is Messi or Ronaldo or Mbappe.

 

[Ali Dia]

He looked so good when he first came in (sounds eerily familiar) he used to just play on the shoulder (on the left) and shoot across the keeper. Looks simple but hard to defend against, especially tired defenders as we saw against Socidad and Fulham back then. I agree with posters above saying there is too much pressure on youngsters shoulders when older international players on massive wages just packed it in on live tv right in front of our very eyes over the course of a couple of years. A bit of context is required. This is currently one of the hardest gigs in football and everything can change in a few games or with a signing or two. He's a very promising player who shouldn't be one of our main weapons yet. He is really trying. So is Rasmus. They are embarrassed I'm sure. I feel sorry for them

 

[bosnian_red]

22 really isn’t that young in football. And I’m not expecting Garnacho to be some top level match winner. But the fact is he’s been a regular for now 3 seasons and has gotten worse as he’s played more football.

For a player that people were crying over potentially selling for 60m, that’s just not acceptable. Pretty simple.

He's 20. He's not Ronaldo, but for comparisons sake... Ronaldo at 20 scored 5 league goals that season, playing for Sir Alex and a functional United team that had lots of world class players around and had reliable scorers & creators in the team so all the pressure wasn't on him to do the scoring or creating. Which is how you are supposed to develop young players.

 

[Hammondo]

He's 20. He's not Ronaldo, but for comparisons sake... Ronaldo at 20 scored 5 league goals that season, playing for Sir Alex and a functional United team that had lots of world class players around and had reliable scorers & creators in the team so all the pressure wasn't on him to do the scoring or creating. Which is how you are supposed to develop young players.

You could say that about any player though, we would never sell a player 20 or under.

 

[The Mitcher]

Beyond being selfish with the ball (which being a 20 year old foward...yeah he will be) what's he done recently to warrant the stain of "bad attitude." He's not lazy on the pitch, and the last time he got attacked online for walking to the changing rooms it wasn't even being petulant, he was going to get changed. The fans seem to have it in for him as they usually do, especially on here. Maybe it's time you spent most of your ire on the people managing the club instead?

 

[FerociousCorgis]

Beyond being selfish with the ball (which being a 20 year old foward...yeah he will be) what's he done recently to warrant the stain of "bad attitude." He's not lazy on the pitch, and the last time he got attacked online for walking to the changing rooms it wasn't even being petulant, he was going to get changed. The fans seem to have it in for him as they usually do, especially on here. Maybe it's time you spent most of your ire on the people managing the club instead?

i mean if you just watch him he seems to spend a shit ton of time sulking. And if im not mistaken didnt he not come back out for the second half of that game to sit on the bench with the rest of the players? Mustve been a long time changing then.

 

[Zumbi]

So despite being extremely high in the expected goals, shots, shots on target, touches in opposition box, tackles won, interceptions, blocks, ball recoveries, possession won back in the final third, fouls won, very low in the dispossessed column, he hasn't been very effective....

In any performance stats you want to use he ranks pretty highly in attacking and offensive threats, in fact he's nearly level with Amad on progressive carries, which I'd put as one of Amads many strong points in his game,

Its fine to not rate him, but when he is quite clearly our most effective attacking threat it really is a strange point of view.

Would he be good enough to play for a previous winning United side, possibly not, but I can near enough guarantee Sir Alex would have loved to have Garnacho in his squad, in fact he had stated as much previously....

No, he doesn’t. For assists he ranks joint 132nd in the league. For goals, he ranks joint 70th.

Bruno is quite clearly our most effective attacking threat, because he absolutely dwarfs Garnacho this season when it comes to goals and assists. If Garnacho was a better finisher or passer he would be more effective than he is now, but he’s consistently poor at both those things.

 

[Vidooq]

I really don't like that video circling from Garnacho ignoring a young fan, on the phone while driving... That looks so wrong.

 

[That_Bloke]

I’m still in this camp.

The kid will probably turn into Salah 2.0 once he finally realises the benefits of the gym and gains confidence. That would just p me off.

Not in a million years.

 

[SATA]

What happen to his finishing? That part of his game was very good last season and now he seems to be terrified of scoring. And he’s not going to get any stick from me, he’s only 20 and shouldn’t be carrying the team at this age. His sulking looks more like disappointment in his performances than petulance

 

[Zumbi]

Beyond being selfish with the ball (which being a 20 year old foward...yeah he will be) what's he done recently to warrant the stain of "bad attitude." He's not lazy on the pitch, and the last time he got attacked online for walking to the changing rooms it wasn't even being petulant, he was going to get changed. The fans seem to have it in for him as they usually do, especially on here. Maybe it's time you spent most of your ire on the people managing the club instead?

He’s already been dropped from squad for attitude and training issues this season, and with that context, doing things like storming down the tunnel and then not returning for the second half is going to elicit some scrutiny.