Mbeumo is a decent player and as you say, has been fairly prolific in the last couple of seasons. I wouldn't be jumping to bring him in though. Granted, Welbeck has begun thus season with a few goals, but he consistently averages around 6 league goals a season. Not someone who I'd want leading the line for us over the last couple of years.
Alejandro Garnacho appreciation thread
- Thread starter Tony247
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Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) discuss United's fantastic win away against Athletic Club in the semi-final of the Europa League.
They also pick out the positives of United's 4-3 loss away at Brentford, and Nik reviews a day out at Old Trafford watching Manchester United Women qualify for the Champions League.
Who would you prefer a free transfer and 2 year stop gap for wellbeck or £40m on Zirkzee when that £35-40m could go get you an elite Left wing back like Alt nouri as well?
I wouldn't have signed Welbeck under any circumstance. Whether Zirkzee proves himself to be a good signing or not remains to be seen. I would have much preferred to have moved on Rashford or Bruno. Both of them ideally. Then we could have reinvested in other areas.
Couldn't agree less, he's one of the most productive players for a really bad team at 20 years old. He takes the wrong option and tries to do it himself at times but he can develop and learn that part of the game with experience and good coaching.
I think he looks like he has enough ability to become a consistent starter for Argentina.
Rudolf Ragnick made him the player he is now
There are a number of things he needs to improve, which is not surprising given his age.
But his attitude is the thing I like most.
He might sky a good opportunity.
But unlike some others, he just keeps going and doesn't drop his head.
But his attitude is the thing I like most.
He might sky a good opportunity.
But unlike some others, he just keeps going and doesn't drop his head.
I think what you tend to see with young players is inconsistency and that's what we're getting with Garnacho. There's enough evidence there to see that he's going to he a phenomenal player. It is crucial he has the right people around him and the club keep him grounded, he also needs to have the right mentality and work himself.
I'm very happy with his career so far. He has been excellent. People forget how young he is.
I'm very happy with his career so far. He has been excellent. People forget how young he is.
Needs to be sold. And yes that my appreciation of him. United fk up players all the time and if we do play a 3-4-3 with two 10's then that is not his game. All it will do is stifle his growth and he will end up like Rashford.
Considering he is our top scorer, had that freak goal at Brighton disallowed, missed the open goal against Fulham and has hit the woodwork a few times, he could easily be in double figures already for the season.
What I love about Garnacho is the relentlessness of his game. Always taking on the opponent, always wanting the ball, always running, always working his socks off, and always being a threat in general
He's on the cusp of a 30 goal season when it all clicks. Ridiculous talent.
What I love about Garnacho is the relentlessness of his game. Always taking on the opponent, always wanting the ball, always running, always working his socks off, and always being a threat in general
He's on the cusp of a 30 goal season when it all clicks. Ridiculous talent.
Except he isn't.
Kids vastly overrated in terms of his ability. Good mentality though.
Good post, a little introspection and humility would go a long way on here
It's the #1 trait he has honestly. I'm not as bullish on his overall ability as some, but there are many examples of footballers making up for what's not quite elite level ability/talent with an elite attitude/mentality/doggedness that he certainly has.
Ironically, he's the perfect Atletico type player. Those types are really valuable to have in your squad even if he doesnt' become some World XI level player, because you can always rely on them to bring that absurd engine and fight with them.
Agreed. People praise a profligate 25 year old Darwin Nunez for 'creating chaos' but a 20 year old Garnacho is labelled as 'greedy' and 'stupid' for being wasteful in front of goal even though he regularly creates those chances for himself out of nothing. He's got a very high ceiling.
Did you see him score against Everton? Amazing goal, wonderful technique and I struggle to think of another player who could do that. It’s no surprise it was compared to the Rooney vs City who is a club legend and record club goal scorer.
Amazing kid. Just imagine what he can do in the next
What is he doing spending time on social media instead of focusing on football 24/7?
Because now is a social media era. You cannot expect everyone to be quiet like a mouse.What is he doing spending time on social media instead of focusing on football 24/7?
I would say his biggest weakness is decision making, not ability. He can shoot, pass and dribble very well, but he just chooses the wrong moments to do any of that.
He reminds me of prime Nani a little bit.
Player he most reminds me of potentially being is Sadio Mane. He’s got a similar mentality on the pitch. Lots of his finishes are similar. He’s got similar weaker points. I don’t worry about his finishing long term. It’s just something that will click like it did with Luis Suarez (IMO). I think he could definitely put everything together and become 20-30 goals a season.
Problem is, I think his best place in Amorim’s system right now would be wing-back, and I don’t see him being happy with that. I definitely don’t see him staying around if he’s unhappy. There’s always been talk of him leaving.
What is he doing spending time on social media instead of focusing on football 24/7?
I thought the "influencer" said it to his face when he was signing autographs for other fans? It is not really a case of him paying attention to social media
Amorim will love him. Hes one of the few players we have that is good at carrying the ball forward.
It made me so angry. First, because he doesn’t deserve that level of criticism, and second, because he’s getting those kinds of nasty comments from an online nobody just trying to get some likes. Pathetic
His attitude is so good. All the clever bits and maturity will come, but the lad is fearless on the field. We need to look after him. I'd like to see him given the chance to play centrally. There's a certain unavoidable predictability when you have a player like him restricted to cutting inside from the wing. Think ultimately that is Antony's problem too.
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It's fine to be on social media. But if you're going to do it, you have to have thick skin and not let yourself get bothered by some idiots criticizing you. And likewise if somebody criticises you in person. You are a footballer playing for one of the biggest clubs in the world who is also underperforming. Of course people are going to talk shitWhat is he doing spending time on social media instead of focusing on football 24/7?
I'm sorry, but I cannot take this seriously.
Let's not forget that Garnacho is 20 and very much still in the learning curve, yet he has already shown so many moments of brilliance this early in his career. However, the fact that he hasn't quite refined his game and taken those chances while still in the relative infancy of his professional career is something to criticise him for? Is that what you're implying here? Ridiculous if so.
People need to rewind 4 or 5 yrs back and watch someone like Vini Jr at Madrid and think about how inconsistent he was and how frustrating he must have been.
I'm not saying Garnacho is going to become a world class player with absolute certainty. However, I find it extremely odd that people who watch him consistently don't believe that he can do that with the proper mentality, coaching and guidance.
I think the part of his game that he's really missing is that in contrast to his dribbling style, he's the exact opposite with his passing choices. He's extremely cautious and almost always prefers a square or a back pass.
He never tries forward low passes or through balls through the center. It's easy to see why Hojlund doesn't get the balls; Garnacho instinctively just doesn't play forward creative and progressive passes.
He never tries forward low passes or through balls through the center. It's easy to see why Hojlund doesn't get the balls; Garnacho instinctively just doesn't play forward creative and progressive passes.
If you watched Vini you could still see the ridiculous level of ball mastery and ability to manipulate the ball under pressure. He could comfortably beat a man without having to kick and run. There is no comparison besides being raw in terms of decision making.
Garnacho just doesn't have that level of technique, it's clear to see. He doesn't even consistently beat his man.
I've seen players far inferior to Garnacho score wonder goals, but that's not what I mean by technique. Like I mentioned in my previous comment, he just doesn't really have great mastery of the ball and the ability to keep it under pressure. Technical security doesn't mean you can't produce a moment of brilliance.
He's great off the bench because he's a try hard, and it's good to have that in any team. But I don't think he'll ever be an elite player.
By the way, his goal against Everton is probably the best United goal alongside Ronnie's against Portos.
He was also heaving criticised in his early days for lack of finishing ability, as is normal when you're 20.
Scoring incredible goals like against Brentford and Leicester is just not normal and something to sit up and take notice of. Garnacho delivers these types of moments fairly regularly too.
I believe he's shown enough to be very excited about what type of player he will be in 3/4 seasons, but I do see where you're coming from too. Time will tell, but I think it's nuts to focus on the limitations in a 20 year olds game. With Garnacho, I don't think what you've pointed out is enough of a fundamental flaw when weighed up against other standout qualities in his game.
Agreed his ceiling isn't Vini but he has all the qualities to become a very efficient winger for us. He has some qualities over others because he's more tenacious, direct and better off the ball than many wingers.
I think he'll end up at Athletico. Proper Simeone kind of guy, not the most talented player in the world, but will run hard and give his all.
I don't think he needs to be the most talented player in the world to be a leading Premier League wide player. Just having 7/10 talent, combined with a top attitude/application would propel him to heights that he'd have 'no right' to reach.
Only caveat of course is how he fits into Amorim's system, be it is an attacking wing-back or as one of his number 10's.
Players like Son, Saka are very good wingers in the league despite not having that ball master quality. It’s very possible to succeed in the premier league by just being efficient.
I was delighted that Talk of the Devils devoted a segment to him. Mitten and Whitwell seem to think his future is completely uncertain and there have of course been the links to Conte's Napoli and Chelsea. The last transfer gossip says United want 65m from Chelsea, whereas before he was linked to Napoli for 45-50m.
He's started 74 of the last 100 matches, if I recall it right from the podcast. He's played in every game this season bar the one match against City when him and Rashford were taken out of the side. He's almost always starting. He has the same robustness as Dalot and Bruno, an ever present. And what we saw from him against Brentford with that simple but quick cross to Mount is something that's starting to become more prevalent, better decision making. When the question marks were over Rashford this season over his half-assed work ethic, Garnacho stepped up.
Under Amorim it's bit difficult for him, maybe more than most. The centre backs have been afforded a compromise by Amorim, because he's not had them play high up when they have no recovery pace. But Garnacho has had to figure out a completely new role. Hopefully he continues to adapt and gets maybe the help he needs in taking up the left sided #10 role so he can do what he did against Brentford.
I know we are in a PSR conundrum, but I just don't want him sold. Nor Mainoo, but I assume that's even less likely and would require a higher fee anyhow. I think they are both due a contract worth maybe 120K at the most (whereas Rashford was given 250K a week just before he turned 21 I think), with win/performance bonuses.
Chelsea paid 62m for Mudryk. Garnacho is a lot better. Hope we retain him.
He's started 74 of the last 100 matches, if I recall it right from the podcast. He's played in every game this season bar the one match against City when him and Rashford were taken out of the side. He's almost always starting. He has the same robustness as Dalot and Bruno, an ever present. And what we saw from him against Brentford with that simple but quick cross to Mount is something that's starting to become more prevalent, better decision making. When the question marks were over Rashford this season over his half-assed work ethic, Garnacho stepped up.
Under Amorim it's bit difficult for him, maybe more than most. The centre backs have been afforded a compromise by Amorim, because he's not had them play high up when they have no recovery pace. But Garnacho has had to figure out a completely new role. Hopefully he continues to adapt and gets maybe the help he needs in taking up the left sided #10 role so he can do what he did against Brentford.
I know we are in a PSR conundrum, but I just don't want him sold. Nor Mainoo, but I assume that's even less likely and would require a higher fee anyhow. I think they are both due a contract worth maybe 120K at the most (whereas Rashford was given 250K a week just before he turned 21 I think), with win/performance bonuses.
Chelsea paid 62m for Mudryk. Garnacho is a lot better. Hope we retain him.
It will be a sad day if we sell him for PSR reasons this summer. All so we can afford to sign a wing back or an inside 10.
If we sell him to Chelsea, the whole thing is absolutely fecked.
I think he'll benefit from playing with a good Premier League proven striker next season. If we can get another number 10 with a bit of pace, I think a front three of a new player with Garnacho playing behind even an Ollie Watkins type player would see massive improvement.
If we sell him for PSR reasons, there's zero evidence that we can sign anyone as good for 30-50 million as a replacement. It will also divert attention from crucial areas like a centre forward, keeper and probably a right wing back. In addition, his value is only going up at this stage. If Amorim has settled down this time next year and doesn't see a future for Garnacho then sell him.
Even if he delivers less then 10 goals/assists next season, someone like Atletico Madrid or Inter Milan would still be interested for around 30 million.
I think he'll benefit from playing with a good Premier League proven striker next season. If we can get another number 10 with a bit of pace, I think a front three of a new player with Garnacho playing behind even an Ollie Watkins type player would see massive improvement.
If we sell him for PSR reasons, there's zero evidence that we can sign anyone as good for 30-50 million as a replacement. It will also divert attention from crucial areas like a centre forward, keeper and probably a right wing back. In addition, his value is only going up at this stage. If Amorim has settled down this time next year and doesn't see a future for Garnacho then sell him.
Even if he delivers less then 10 goals/assists next season, someone like Atletico Madrid or Inter Milan would still be interested for around 30 million.
Love the lad! Oozes talent. He's brave, physically and mentally strong. He can take shit from the likes of Höjlund etc. (water off a duck's back to him). Undoubtably our most valuable player moneywise.
A weird skill to rate
Garnacho just needs to pass more, everything else if there. Decision making/calmness in advanced areas will come with time and firm hand from Amorim. The amount of times he's shot into a player right in front of him this season must be like 5+ and he has missed a lot of easy chances. I think it's all the same thing, understanding he has a little more time than he thinks and picking better choices with the ball.
A fast forward who grafts will always find chances, he could easily be on 10+ goals and 10+ assists even in such a disastrous season.
He can be a decent player for us,I hope we don't sell him for a Manager whose long term future I am not sure of.
Because he has played a lot of games at such a young age we forget how young he still is.
He is still rough,he needs a good manager to help him cut out his decision making and selfishness.
Because he has played a lot of games at such a young age we forget how young he still is.
He is still rough,he needs a good manager to help him cut out his decision making and selfishness.