TsuWave
Full Member
- Joined
- Oct 12, 2013
- Messages
- 15,607
Nope, you’re wrong.
If you think that was one of his best displays in a United shirt - I cannot discuss football with you. Politely, have a good day.
Nope, you’re wrong.
I'm going to suggest they don't mean mph.
Always fit, can play multiple positions. He should stay.
Good teams have players like him.
That depends on what you think was the 1st.What was the 2nd time?
I just want everyone to remember that Ten Hag looked at this demon, and then started Omari Forson over him.Glad Ten Hag isn’t around to keep ignoring this lad.
You must have missed the first goal
I think he will convince the manager to use him in AM, but he showed that he can play wingback very well with his pace, dribbling and found a good cross for Rashford to finish. These are some of his best attributes
Playing further forward and inside will enable him to start his attacks further up the pitch than he did for the first goal and be more of a threat to the opposition keeper. But he was fantastic at wingback as well.
Really hope we tie him down to a long contract soon. It's a bit worrying that he only has this season and a one year option left.
A winger which follows the LB is how Amorim sees his RWB. Thats not too different from normal Winger.
It's not so much the key passes, which I expect Amad will do very well when he gets in the right positions. More just the normal progressive passing that helps the team move forward and get on the front foot rather than back to the central defenders. Nothing wrong with passing it back when needed, but against Ipswich it definitely happened too often IMO. Perhaps that was due to teammates not making themselves available (it's a bit hard to tell sometimes on television), but at the time it felt like Amad was just playing too safe a lot of the time.
Ultimately, if Amad is going to play that role regularly, the two things that I definitely want to improve is him progressing the ball better (whether through passing or carrying it) and he himself getting into attacking positions more often. Considering this was the first ever time he's played that position and the first time the team has played that formation, it's something that could easily just improve with time. But right now I tend to think both he and the team would be better off with him closer to the opposition goal in one of the #10's.
"Fantastic" is a bit of a stretch. He wasn't able to run up and down, constantly owning that flank, due to physical limitation. He spent majority of his time defending than attacking, which is a waste of his most excelled attributes. ANd the worse thing is, he played there to accommodate a lesser attacker.
But anyway, probably that's where he'll be. And I don't really care, if it means the attack will progress smoothly.
It's definitely possible, and in fact I expect it was a contributing factor. But Dalot actually did manage to progress the ball quite a bit in the first half, sometimes just with a pass and other times by carrying it past one player and opening space to then pass into. He actually seemed to be our outball while Amad, De Ligt, Evans and to a slightly lesser extent Mazraoui mostly just passed it sideways to each other until it got to Dalot on the left. That's kind of what I'm expecting whoever plays as our wingbacks to do as a bare minimum as things settle into place.I think you're being too harsh on Amad there and it's more to do with the bolded. In the first half, both wide CBs in Mazraoui and Evans were sat far too deep and narrow. Mazraoui obviously had a good game and improved much better in the second half but Amad was often receiving the ball in his own half with the Ipswich players pressing him high; Dalot's was in the same shoe on the other side. Positionally (when receiving the ball) he was closer to a full back, which make sense seeing he was RWB. However most of the game Eriksen, Casemiro and Bruno were rarely seen in the middle of the pitch so you can't really expect Amad to receive the ball way behind the halfway line and then front up an opposition player and 'progress' either with dribbling, which would be very risky or passing with little passing options. I think he was conservative with his passing out of necessity. It's also damned if you do and damned if you don't because Amad recognised we had difficulty building from the back so he gave Mazraoui an easy passing angle every single time. He could have 'easily' sat high and wide but 1) Amorim didn't want this and 2) it would have been to the detriment of the team.
It's definitely possible, and in fact I expect it was a contributing factor. But Dalot actually did manage to progress the ball quite a bit in the first half, sometimes just with a pass and other times by carrying it past one player and opening space to then pass into. He actually seemed to be our outball while Amad, De Ligt, Evans and to a slightly lesser extent Mazraoui mostly just passed it sideways to each other until it got to Dalot on the left. That's kind of what I'm expecting whoever plays as our wingbacks to do as a bare minimum as things settle into place.
Of course, perhaps Dalot did have options to pass to while Amad didn't (due to either our players on that side not moving as well or the opposition players on that side covering better). In the second half Dalot didn't seem to be able to do it either.
I think the last match can’t be the template for how Amorim wants us to play. He needs to start somewhere, and defensive structure is the normal place to start when rearranging a team’s play. So this was what Amad looked like as a beginner WB in a team with defensive structure as main focus and two days of training.This would hold true if we were able to dominate possession and spend most of the game in the opposition’s half. However, in the last match, he often dropped deeper than Casemiro and Eriksen, essentially operating as a right-back for significant portions of the game.
Garnacho is really not all that. Some of you guys need to give your head a wobble.Best player on the pitch alongside Onana. Just appreciate the fact that we do have 2 talented young wingers. Yes they aren't perfect but Garnacho carried us last season and so far Diallo is playing great. Excited to see both of them develop further and we'll see how well Antony/Dalot can play as a backup in this role to judge whether Amad is better as a no 10.
His first touch in the opposition box was the assist, his 2nd and 3rd/final were in the 92nd minute. He went a full 90 minutes without touching the ball in the opposition box.
Playing him at wingback is a hate crime. He doesn't have the legs to get up and down the line like that, which means his time in the areas he's actually good at is totally non-existent. I thought he actually did an admirable job given his limitations, but to describe his performance as anything other than "diligent at best" is not being able to see the wood for the trees.
Get him back behind the striker.
I mean this is easy enough to google for you. He had 3x as many in the Leicester and Southampton games this season, 4x as many vs PAOK. Vs Brighton he only had one more, but more than half of his touches where in the opponents half, compared to only 22% in this game.I don't understand why people are saying this? How many additional touches in the box do you think he would have got otherwise?
Diallo is one of our better players out wide, when the ball is played to feet, he holds it well and makes a good decision generally.
He got an assist from wing back, so this wasted theory is nonsense.
We barely got to their box as a team, so him being behind the striker would make no difference until we can build up properly as a team.
How many touches was he getting in the box when he was playing RW?
Cuadrado was an extremely powerful athlete, Amad is nippy and very difficult to knock off the ball but he's not a man you want making box to box sprints all game.For some reason, I just thought about a skillful attacking player that often played as a wingback. Cuadrado.
I mean this is easy enough to google for you. He had 3x as many in the Leicester and Southampton games this season, 4x as many vs PAOK. Vs Brighton he only had one more, but more than half of his touches where in the opponents half, compared to only 22% in this game.
And I'm sorry, but one assist in the first 90 seconds of the game and then nothing for 91 minutes isn't making good use of him. It's not a theory, he was wasted. Having our best close quarters dribbler and one of our better passers in between the lines at rightback all game (which is where he actually was) is one of the reasons we struggled to get into the box. He's one of our better players out wide in the opposition 3rd, but we basically never got him there.
Do you understand now?
I have no idea where "statmuse" get's their stats from but whoscored literally have an event mapI have just checked... Leicester he had 5 touches.. Ipswich 3 and Southampton 9. 3 against Brighton and 3 against Fulham. He actually got the most touches he has had this season in this game. So I am not sure where you are getting your stats from.
https://www.statmuse.com/fc/player/amad-diallo-309/game-log
No.. we have played Amad Diallo in alot of games this season and we have continuously failed to get into the opposition third.
Your logic... he has 3 more touches in the area in a few games so playing in RW is wasting him and a hate crime... Acting as if he is been told to play CB.
I mean look at where they were compared to the Leicester game and tell me if you think him having all those touches there is a good thing or not.He actually got the most touches he has had this season in this game.
You have to account for laughably bad Leicester were against us as well.I have no idea where "statmuse" get's their stats from but whoscored literally have an event map
You can have a look yourself and see how realistic 5 looks...
I mean look at where they were compared to the Leicester game and tell me if you think him having all those touches there is a good thing or not.
Amad's numbers vs Leicester were in no way an outlier though, it's about bang average of where he's been all season regardless of the strength of the opposition. So I'm not sure you can claim that as the reason.You have to account for laughably bad Leicester were against us as well.
My take is this:
- It's one bloody game under the new manager. Implementing a system takes time. If gifted players are willing to put in a shift to help with that transition then it's a positive, not a negative.
- With Casemiro and Eriksen being old farts, in a hotly contested away game like that, we clearly struggled to build up play as we've done all season in these sort of games and I saw Amad - arguable the most technically gifted player we have aside from Mainoo - dropping deep in wide areas as a decent outlet. It doesnt' mean that his position forever, but I thought in the circumstances it helped us.
- For all we know, putting him in the front three might have seen him terribly isolated - maybe the manager will try that soon and we'll see.
- All in all, I thought he had a very good game - taking attacking and defensive aspects into account. The other wing was where we struggled much more.
I mean look at where they were compared to the Leicester game and tell me if you think him having all those touches there is a good thing or not.
Cuadrado was an extremely powerful athlete, Amad is nippy and very difficult to knock off the ball but he's not a man you want making box to box sprints all game.
As a general point on skilful wingbacks - Cuadrado is a great example. Marcelo, maybe? Depends how loose you are with the difference between a wingback and a fullback.Cuadrado wasn't powerful, he was skinny and fairly easy to push around, though he was feisty. But my comment was solely about a very skillful player that plays wingback.
This just isn't true though, because if you look at Garnacho's map from Ipswich it's very similar to Amad's for Leicester, attacking players touch maps are slightly more diffuse than defensive ones. It's pretty obvious which position he's playing in both matches. He's the right sided attacker in one and right fullback in the other.I think its a good thing. It shows that we are playing a system actually.
when you look at the Leicester heat map, it doesn't really show what position he is playing.
I would rather see players get touches in the positions they play
Cuadrado was a powerful runner. We're not talking Lukaku style power here, we're talking Jordi Alba style sustained speed up and down the pitch kind of power. Cuadrado had that in absolute buckets, Amad just isn't that type of player (and that's not a slight on him, he's got loads of tools someone like Cuadrado doesn't. His ability in tight spaces alone demands a place in the attacking part of the pitch).Cuadrado wasn't powerful, he was skinny and fairly easy to push around, though he was feisty. But my comment was solely about a very skillful player that plays wingback.
As a general point on skilful wingbacks - Cuadrado is a great example. Marcelo, maybe? Depends how loose you are with the difference between a wingback and a fullback.
On Amad specifically — I think he’s too good in tight spaces and on the half turn to waste in a wingback spot.
This just isn't true though, because if you look at Garnacho's map from Ipswich it's very similar to Amad's for Leicester, attacking players touch maps are slightly more diffuse than defensive ones. It's pretty obvious which position he's playing in both matches. He's the right sided attacker in one and right fullback in the other.
You could put Onana there and all his passes would be "in the position they play" but it still wouldn't be a good idea.
Cuadrado was a powerful runner. We're not talking Lukaku style power here, we're talking Jordi Alba style sustained speed up and down the pitch kind of power. Cuadrado had that in absolute buckets, Amad just isn't that type of player (and that's not a slight on him, he's got loads of tools someone like Cuadrado doesn't. His ability in tight spaces alone demands a place in the attacking part of the pitch).
Yeah, I'm happy for you to describe it however you like as long as we're both on the same page. Maybe stamina or stride length that is a factor in it too, it's a special type of fitness/physicality to be able to get up and down the pitch box to box and still be able to explode to top speed for 90 minutes.I tend to not use powerful runner in that context. Valencia was a powerful runner in the sense that it was straight line speed with powerful steps and he was immovable while running. That doesn't match with Cuadrado who was a shiftier, weaker runner but to be fair to your point his short distance acceleration was powerful, so I can see the distinction you make with Amad.