Amadou Onana | Ornstein: Villa agree ~50m deal
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Jamie (@Vault Dweller) are here to talk about United's dreadful home defeat at the hands of Big Ange's Tottenham Hotspur. Should this have been the end of Ten Hag? How long does he actually have left? And does Nik finally want ETH out?!
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Well yeah I'm assuming we're trying to move forward, to be more dominant, more technical etc etc.
Would he improve us if we were substituting say Mctom with him instead in this hypothetical scenario? For sure but will he help us move towards what I previously said? I certainly doubt that.
I dont see who we're being strongly linked with that would suggest we're going to be a possession heavy side moving forward. Ugarte is another one that is more useful to the team we are than the team that dominates.
Who won both games last season?
Who finished ahead of who?
Who finished 8th last season? Let's not do this. Hopefully we get some good players in over the next couple of weeks and then I might revaluate my prediction.
We'll struggle in the league games straight after CL. We've basically imitated Newcastle for the last three years so having that type of season won't shock me although they were still in contention for top 6 on the final day.
They had a lot of injuries, Tonali was banned and i'd say their gameplan needed or used a lot more energy than most.
I dont think the Champions League is harder to recover from than Europa League games in far flung corners. Knockout rounds can change things but i'd be surprised if you played many to be blunt.
That composite is doing the player dirty. Strabism and all the liveliness of a FIFA 22 model.
Fab should have gone for the T-Pose.
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He isn't that good.
That might make sense positionally but basically you've switched a better central midfielder for a worse one and paid some money on top.
Maybe Luiz was kicking off and demanding a move, I didn't see anything about it.
Gutted about this. He was the right player for us to target as a DM. He can play in a 2 and as a single pivot. Tall, fast, athletic with underrated technical ability and still young so has untapped potential. He would’ve been the perfect partner for Mainoo and bring height and steel to our midfield. I have to assume we didn’t go for him as we were targetting Branthwaite first and didn’t want to help Everton with PSR. A good deal for Villa at 50m, they’re building a good squad. I’m much higher than him than Ugarte, who’s more limited.
I wonder who Everton is going to buy in return so they can continue to help eachother fiddle PSR books.
Oh well Branthwaite deal is dead then
Oh well Branthwaite deal is dead then
PSR rale basically.
Don’t be too upset because you are wrong when you say he can play in a single pivot. I don’t believe he can effectively. He’s a good player in the right circumstances, and as part of a double pivot he is quite effective, but a single pivot requires a highly press resistant player who has an excellent first touch that creates space and allows him to turn and move the ball forward, Onana doesn’t have that from what I have seen. When he receives the ball in deep areas, facing his own goal, if there is any semblance of pressure he just plays it back, or at best sideways. But usually back.
In a single pivot system the DM bears a lot of weight in the build up phase, and you need someone that can receive the ball deep and play incisive passes through the lines. Onana isn’t that player. He has great athleticism, covers the ground well, carries the ball fairly well, and is a tidy passer, but he isn’t a single pivot. If he was our sole DM, we wouldn’t be able to build out from the back effectively at all. He needs someone alongside him as a double pivot, or to play slightly further forward himself as an 8.
In terms of what he offers, I think he has a fairly similar profile to Ugarte, just in a different package. I don’t think either are suited to being single pivots. Both are more suited to being ball winning, and ball carrying players in a double pivot system. Similar to Kante. I just think Ugarte is all around a higher quality player with a higher ceiling. But the difference isn’t huge. Both would require being deployed as a double pivot alongside Mainoo, with Mainoo being the one responsible for dropping deepest to receive the ball.
People see a tall, athletic midfielder, who is decent technically, and highly proficient at ball winning, and they think they are suited to being a one man defensive midfield machine. But it’s only half the equation. What you really want from a sole DM is someone who is at the right place at the right time, who plays with their head more than their body. Someone who cuts out passes and blocks passing lanes, more than they actually engage in 1v1 duels. And most importantly, a player adept at receiving the ball and dictating play through the lines.
Onana isn’t any of those things. He’s much better with the play in front of him and moving forwards to chase it down. Ugarte is actually very good at taking up the right positions and blocking passing lanes, often by stepping up and making aggressive interceptions, but he is far from elite in receiving it deep, facing his own goal, and turning to play it forward. But while he is far from elite in that area, Onana is light years from it.
He’s a good signing for Villa and will suit them as a double pivot alongside Tielemans. He could have been a good player for us too, I am sure. But not in the way you perhaps imagine.
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Not too bothered about missing out on him. I don’t think he’s as good as Douglas Luis, and the players Villa took from Juve won’t move the needle for them. They are doing decent business elsewhere, though. I hope we’re going to get some quality in midfield soon because Mainoo needs better players around him to be at his best. Ugarte would be a decent start but I’d want one more on top of him.
Marks the end of the Branthwaite pursuit I think.
They obviously needed the money but didn't want to sell Branthwaite for under 50m. Onana was one of my top CDMs to sign along with Neves. Shame we're getting nether.
Whilst he’s not the best at receiving the ball under pressure and playing through the lines, he can do it to some fair degree. He’s played as a single pivot for Belgium and has shown ability to do so. I agree he’s best suited in a double pivot, but I still think he has a higher upside than Ugarte. In our midfield where we’re forced to play McT to add some athleticism, Onana would add elite levels of that mixed in with technical ability. Case’s athleticism is waning as he ages, so we need to replace what he and McT offers in our squad. Ugarte gets drawn to the ball a lot and can be bypassed when his aggressiveness doesn’t pay your off. He’s not as press resistant as Onana too and still lacks nous, although that’s probably true of Onana as well. In 2-3 years, with the right coaching, Onana could be far ahead of Ugarte as a player and that’s what we could be getting. Someone who is good enough now but could be elite in 3 years time
According to some 'sources' you tried to hijack the Onana deal but he turned you down because he made a committment already to Villa and Emery.
Should be confirmed this weekend.
Should be confirmed this weekend.
Oh we are back to "ManUtd tried but we beat them for signing" thing 
Oh we are back to "ManUtd tried but we beat them for signing" thing
Oh yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if it is his agent playing games still. Hope Villa enjoy that.
Its some nobody from Twitter reporting it. Maybe he is right maybe not, until some reliable ones report it, I would consider this as someone who is looking for interactions ln twitter.
I didn’t really fancy Onana as a pure DM to be honest but surprised he has gone for that little so may have been a good option at that price.
I suppose the fee may have been inflated if we’d made a serious move for him prior to Villa reaching agreement.
I suppose the fee may have been inflated if we’d made a serious move for him prior to Villa reaching agreement.
I hope it’s true because then my confidence in our talent ID and squad building capability significantly increases. Onana would’ve been the best DM option we could’ve added this summer. If Ugarte is just an alternative, that’s much more promising from this perspective.
I think he'd have been a good bit of business. Would we have got him for that price though? Maybe with this new regime, but I feel like Everton would have tried to fleece us for more.
€60 million!!!! is a huge amount of cash for Villa to spend on Onana
It isn't, it was from Het Nieuwsblad who are normally fairly decent.
Anyone would have got him for that price.
£50 million + sell on is “so little”?
Well not really no but when you see how Everton are posturing for Branthwaite then I would expect to be quoted at least £60m for Onana.
In this day and age if you try and take the best player from another Premier League club then you expect to pay through the nose for them.
That's the price we set for Onana as we have with Branthwaite, it would have only went higher if there was a bidding war really.
Interesting. As a supporter would you have regarded Onana as your best current player? He seemed to be the one who was being linked with the top clubs most often.
Not under Dyche, he wasn't even a regular. I'd say along with Branthwaite he's probably the only one with title challenging potential though.
Ah ok didn’t realise he wasn’t a regular. Did he struggle for form/fitness last season or does Dyche just not see him as a key player?
On the face of it, when you look at the fees for Rice, Caicedo, Lavia etc in the same position last year I just thought £50m would be the minimum you would expect to get for a player of that profile who is only 22, had 3 years on his contract and had been linked with a few of the biggest clubs. So I probably would have expected the asking price to be a bit higher on that basis.
Especially when Branthwaite has been priced significantly above what’s on the market elsewhere.
He doesn't suit Dyche ball. That's all. He does suit the style of what Villa want to do and Emery so I won't be surprised if he replicates his Belgian form and performs really well for them. He's still only 22 so I can see him making another step up by the time he's 25/26 to a title competing side.
Branthwaite and Onana aren't a similar situation though. Onana has been flirting with leaving since he arrived, he's not a key player for Dyche and we were open to selling him. Branthwaite hasn't flirted with leaving, he is a key player for Dyche and we don't want to sell him. The players you mentioned were all key individuals for their side.
It seems that we also only needed to have one big sale this summer to fund our window, with smaller transfer sales being used to supplement PSR issues and further moves. I like the boldness of our transfer strategy this summer if I'm honest in terms of our selling tactic, we have been clear and concise with who we are open to selling/those who we don't want to sell have a clear price. No nonsense, and good clarity between the club and fanbase.
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