[lex talionis]

I agree with this in the main. But Edwin is definitely regarded as one of the best keepers of all time and was far more influential than Schmeichel was in the position. He brought a new perspective to goalkeeping and inspired the likes of Manuel Neuer and other modern day greats.

I made an argument to this effect a few weeks ago here but was shouted down by the chorus. As great as Pete was, and he was great, Edwin was the better keeper.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

If we had to rank the top 3 United keepers over the last 20 years everyone would agree on Schmeichel and Van Der Sar 1/2, but maybe not in that order. Dave 3 for sure. Onana doesn't come anywhere near those 3, but we were told at the time we brought in Onana that we needed a "modern keeper" whose abilities on the ball would improve our buildup play, leading to better quality chances.

But that never happened. Onana's first touch on the ball is without question outstanding, his actual passing ability is no better than De Gea's passing ability -- De Gea's first touch was atrocious. And De Gea's shot stopping, even in his decline, was better than Onana's shot stopping ability.

With the end of Dave's contract coming up it made perfect sense to look around for better options, but Onana was not a better option than Dave. If we had to get rid of Dave we should have kept Henderson. And if we had to get rid of Dave and get rid of Henderson (because of the bitter interview he gave) we should have kept Kovar. True, Kovar had never made a first team appearance but he had and has all the tools we expect of a modern keeper. Would Kovar have been brilliant for us? I have no idea, but he wouldn't have cost us anything and could not be worse than Onana, whose passing is average at best, has no command of the box is his shot-stopping is not that impressive, particularly on shots that require a dive to save.

We're a badly managed club and even if we can attribute the problem children of Greenwood, Rashford and Sancho directly to them and not the club, the dysfunction of the football management of United (not the Glazers...that's a related but different problem) is best exemplified by the buys of Antony and Onana, both players who had a previous relationship with ten Hag and had one or two amazing performances for the prior clubs but have been flops at Old Trafford.

Disagree with this. De Gea's very first touch was actually, usually, pretty good... it's the touches that came after the first touch that weren't usually great.

 

[Rossa]

I agree with this in the main. But Edwin is definitely regarded as one of the best keepers of all time and was far more influential than Schmeichel was in the position. He brought a new perspective to goalkeeping and inspired the likes of Manuel Neuer and other modern day greats.

Yeah, I suppose he is regarded as such. Schmeichel was also a very modern goalie for his day. He included handball techniques and although not to VDS's standards, he was a great distributor for his time. He was a greater shot stopper than VDS and much better at controlling the box; he was also far stronger one on one - a few strikers basically said they shat themselves when facing him one on one. He was also one helluva leader at the back.

VDS on the other hand had amazing positioning, great at communicating with his defense and made extremely few mistakes (Schmeichel was more proactive though).

Overall, I think Schemichel was more of a gamechanger and could make saves that VDS simply couldn't. As a modern goalie, VDS is more influential, that I agree with.

 

[lex talionis]

Disagree with this. De Gea's very first touch was actually, usually, pretty good... it's the touches that came after the first touch that weren't usually great.

Interesting, since I don’t remember it that way at all. I very distinctly remember De Gea having at best a sufficiently competent first touch but substandard relative to most modern keepers today. But to be fair to De Gea, when he began his tenure at Old Trafford the notion of a modern keeper didn’t even exist. It became a fad at the end of his United career and by then he was known as an outstanding shot stopper (but in decline) but had never developed the skills expected of a modern keeper.

What separates Onana, admittedly not a great keeper, from most other keepers is first touch, not his actual passing.

 

[Ezkay]

Interesting, since I don’t remember it that way at all. I very distinctly remember De Gea having at best a sufficiently competent first touch but substandard relative to most modern keepers today. But to be fair to De Gea, when he began his tenure at Old Trafford the notion of a modern keeper didn’t even exist. It became a fad at the end of his United career and by then he was known as an outstanding shot stopper (but in decline) but had never developed the skills expected of a modern keeper.

What separates Onana, admittedly not a great keeper, from most other keepers is first touch, not his actual passing.

Don't know if I agree with the whole first touch thing, seems a very random point to make about a goalkeeper but what also separates Onana is also the all round comfort he has with the ball at his feet, he can hold the ball for a few seconds, he can switch direction with his sole on top of the ball, he's got feints and his short passing is really good. It's very difficult to find a goalkeeper with that level of comfort, however his long passing has been very disappointing (which is actually something I was warned about in analysis videos of him) and his ability to save shots is mediocre.

 

[lex talionis]

Don't know if I agree with the whole first touch thing, seems a very random point to make about a goalkeeper but what also separates Onana is also the all round comfort he has with the ball at his feet, he can hold the ball for a few seconds, he can switch direction with his sole on top of the ball, he's got feints and his short passing is really good. It's very difficult to find a goalkeeper with that level of comfort, however his long passing has been very disappointing (which is actually something I was warned about in analysis videos of him) and his ability to save shots is mediocre.

The "first touch" does seem like a minor, perhaps even irrelevant, issue to mention regarding the skillset of a keeper, but it actually is an important quality for a keeper in the modern game that relies heavily on involving the keeper in buildup play. One thing I don't like about Onana is that he keeps the ball way too long most of the time, but that aside if he's given a ball his first touch on it is quite good, even if his subsequent pass is nothing special. But squirming out of any danger with that first touch is important.

But if he could add shot-stopping that would be a huge bonus. Not to dive, pun intended, into it here but his anticipation and placement are what butcher his shot-stopping skills more than his actual hands. He doesn't move well toward the ball, but he's in the right area on the dive he's got pretty good hands.

 

[G97]

Interesting, since I don’t remember it that way at all. I very distinctly remember De Gea having at best a sufficiently competent first touch but substandard relative to most modern keepers today. But to be fair to De Gea, when he began his tenure at Old Trafford the notion of a modern keeper didn’t even exist. It became a fad at the end of his United career and by then he was known as an outstanding shot stopper (but in decline) but had never developed the skills expected of a modern keeper.

What separates Onana, admittedly not a great keeper, from most other keepers is first touch, not his actual passing.

You are right and that often gets overlooked by fans, De Gea’s peak years was before this current ‘ball at his feet’ obsession we have with keepers. It was about making saves and for a period of 5-6 years he was arguably one of the best shot stoppers in the games history.
Now people judge try and judge De Gea by modern standards and that’s unfair, because the goalkeeping position basically advanced 20 years in 5 years.

He’s comfortably the clubs third best keeper in history (no disrespect to the likes of Stepney) and had he left the club following his last great season 2017/18, before his mistakes came commonplace, he’d arguably be looked at by some fans as our best keeper. He was constantly credited and praised for keeping us in the top half of the table by consistently saving unstoppable shots. He gets flack by lots of fans now and it’s quite saddening really.

 

[roonster09]

Anyone have the count of goals we have conceded from his weak saves? Forget the total blunders, the ones where his goto save is just to push the ball to dangerous area and w concede from the rebound.

 

[Erics_Collar]

Worst starting keeper in the league? Is that too harsh? Does anyone else make as many mistakes?

 

[Atheist]

He needs to be among the first to go in the summer. Offers nothing and nearly always a liability.

 

[PoTMS]

Clown. He needs to get fecked off ASAP.

 

[sullydnl]

Have generally been patient with him up to now and there have been periods where he's been good, but nah.

Too many errors, consistently poor handling and his strengths haven't been all that strong.

 

[Lay]

He needs to be dropped.

 

[FrankWhite]

The gift that keeps on giving.

 

[edgecutter]

He's the worst keeper in the league. Mistake after mistake in nearly every game since Christmas. He's very lucky that we have injuries.

 

[Superunknown]

If this guy were a car, he would be made of chalk and his wheels would be on the inside.

 

[Raven]

Needs to go in the summer, I genuinely can't believe how bad he is.

 

[100]

Honestly think it's gone under the radar how much points he costs us.

 

[ThanksBoss26]

He needs to be dropped.

First opportunity we can and then get rid asap in the summer.

 

[Mmm-Qatarian]

I mean I'm not being funny at this stage, even given his lack of senior experience I'm not sure if Elyh Harrison could be any worse than Onana has been recently. Literally all he'd need to do would be to only feck up occasionally and it'd still be better.

 

[2 man midfield]

Sell him to the circus

 

[Annihilate Now!]

Properly shit.

Like, beyond the normal realms of shit.

He. Is. Shit.

 

[edgecutter]

First opportunity we can and then get rid asap in the summer.

Need to get a fee in the region of 30 million for PSR reasons. That ain't happening.

 

[Ronaldo's ego]

His decent save to error ratio is about 1:1. Not gonna bash or name call but simply not good enough.

 

[Squeaky_Bum_Time]

Is he at fault for the second? Consensus seems like he is but he was anticipating Delap getting a touch, and it wasn't enough time to react after that.

Still think that he's a liability, but having a hard time pinning the second goal on him

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

He needs to be dropped.

Unfortunately both other keepers are injured.

He’s an absolute liability, a complete clown.

 

[NotoriousISSY]

He’s very lucky Altay is injured, because he should be dropped. We can all see it.

His distribution was meant to be a big selling point but it’s an abomination, never mind the other nonsense.

 

[Nick7]

I’ve said before that I don’t think he’s priority number 1 to get rid of in the summer, despite thinking he needs to leave. I was wrong. He has to go as soon as humanly possible. Can’t pass, can’t save, can’t organise a defence.

 

[ThanksBoss26]

Genuinely think it's gone under the radar how much points he costs us.

You might be right but it's baffling to me how it has. As I said in the match thread, it's not just the obvious clangers with him, it's also the amount of goals he has a hand in us conceding or where he could do better. It's absolutely loads for this level. He should be out the team at the first opportunity and out the club in the summer.

 

[Frank Grimes]

It's like starting with a goal deficit every game. Worst keeper in PL.

 

[ThanksBoss26]

Need to get a fee in the region of 30 million for PSR reasons. That ain't happening.

Yep that's a problem.

 

[GlazersHater]

Would seriously start a kid from the academy instead of him. I don't remember any other keeper gifting goals as frequently as him. It's beyond words how mistake prone he is. Looks amateurish.

 

[chris123]

I found my answer, this guy is the worst keeper we've ever had. He's worse than Taibi and I'm not even joking.

 

[Marwood]

I can't watch this guy for another season.

Worrying thing is that he seems to think he's done nothing wrong on the first goal.

 

[bringbackbebe]

Can we please call his crap and start with the kids on goal? It can't get worse than this idiot

 

[arthurka]

Wouldn't miss him if I never saw him play for United ever again.

 

[Lay]

Unfortunately both other keepers are injured.

He’s an absolute liability, a complete clown.

Can we not play Lindelof in goal?

 

[Prodigy24]

They could make two hour long movie with all the mistakes that he's made since signing last summer. Needs to go in the summer.

 

[dannyrhinos89]

Load him into a cannon and fire him to the moon.

1000% needs to be gone in summer.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

Bomb scare.