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2019-20 Performances


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Jeppers7

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Please tell me more about how Angel played last night seeing as you didn't even watch the match. Perfect for insights.

You've tried to act smart telling someone they didn't watch and then tried to tell them how Angel played when you didn't even watch and they did. I don't know what bizarre means where you're from but that's it.
:lol: Well said. Can't believe this guys still digging :houllier:
 

Rocknrolla69er

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I think the frustrating thing is the obvious lack of creativity from the attacking midfielder, we've got Pogba sulking in the deeper midfield role, as Pereira, Mata and Lingaard labour and struggle to offer any form at the spear tip of the midfield, ones too slow, ones clearly just not good enough and the other is a headless chicken. And while Ole continues to persist with the obvious, people will get frustrated.

We looked a lot better with Pogba at the tip of the midfield.
But Ole obviously prefers Lingaard, Pereira or Mata in the team rather than Matic or Fred in a deep role, that's the conundrum Ole has. Personally I think he needs to be brave and ease Gomes in asap, I think there's a more urgent need for this type of player rather than Greenwood who's getting gametime
 

Dan_F

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Why are we all so crazy about Man United? I don’t think it is just because we won in the past. Is it because watching inventive people execute disruptive plans at an elite level is exhilarating for us humans?

Gifted, intelligent athletes like Rashford and Mason Greenwood will likely turn out to be stars for us but the people who most embody this principle are people who are not absolutely top-drawer athletes like Scholes, Beckham, Berbatov, Pogba (he is an athlete too which makes his ceiling incredible), Ravel Morrison and now Angel Gomes.

Scholes and Beckham were thrown into the deep end as kids and, because they were inventive, created space for themselves. Ole needs to do that with Angel. Now.
They were both 20, Gomes has just turned 19. Beckham even went out on loan. The standard of the league was much lower. They were introduced into a team that had recently won league titles and had multiple leaders in the dressing room. Albeit a few of them were sold soon after.

It’s just not the same situation.
 

Treble

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Overrating youngsters is a classic example of how preconceptions and wishful thinking might influence perception. Ole and his staff don't think he's ready, England's U21 manager agrees with them but some caftards know better. Not impossible but highly unlikely.
 

Red_toad

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I think the frustrating thing is the obvious lack of creativity from the attacking midfielder, we've got Pogba sulking in the deeper midfield role, as Pereira, Mata and Lingaard labour and struggle to offer any form at the spear tip of the midfield, ones too slow, ones clearly just not good enough and the other is a headless chicken. And while Ole continues to persist with the obvious, people will get frustrated.

We looked a lot better with Pogba at the tip of the midfield.
But Ole obviously prefers Lingaard, Pereira or Mata in the team rather than Matic or Fred in a deep role, that's the conundrum Ole has. Personally I think he needs to be brave and ease Gomes in asap, I think there's a more urgent need for this type of player rather than Greenwood who's getting gametime
Do we? I thought he was very mobile and worked hard, abet giving the ball away a fair bit due to his higher risk passing that's not really suited to him playing further back.

Gomes will get chances over the coming weeks, I don't get all the panic, he loves it here.
 

Bestietom

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Our whole midfield is in a mess and needs sorting, and until January Ole needs to trust the Young players like Gomes and Garner by introducing them ASAP. They just can't be any worse than what we have atm.
We were left short in this transfer window by not replacing Herrera and Lukaku and it's down to Woodward not Ole.
Now Ole needs to be brave and play Garner and Gomes to speed up the play, and create more chances for our forwards.
 

pascell

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Have I read that right, that someone has based their judgement on Gomes' performance having not watched the match but what others have told him?
 

P-Nut

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Any news on his injury? You'd expect him to get his chance if he is fit after the international break with league cup and Europa League coming up.
 

Adnan

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Overrating youngsters is a classic example of how preconceptions and wishful thinking might influence perception. Ole and his staff don't think he's ready, England's U21 manager agrees with them but some caftards know better. Not impossible but highly unlikely.
We don't know what Ole is thinking. But it seems to me he's showing a bit too much faith in players he's coached at under 23 level in the past who have been extremely underwhelming since breaking into the first team. Is it beyond the realms of possibility that he's showing favouritism towards the likes of Lingard?
 

Treble

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We don't know what Ole is thinking. But it seems to me he's showing a bit too much faith in players he's coached at under 23 level in the past who have been extremely underwhelming since breaking into the first team. Is it beyond the realms of possibility that he's showing favouritism towards the likes of Lingard?
It is possible. But I guess success is more important to him than being on good terms with Lingard. If he thought Angel was ready, he would have given him more playing time in pre-season and include him in the match group.
 

reddev3

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I want him to start just as much as anyone and think Lingard is beyond awful but for a little bit of perspective Lingard was meant to have played in a reserve game with Gomes about 2/3 weeks ago (after the first prem game I think) and supposedly scored two goals.
 

Adnan

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By far the most pages of all our player threads for someone who is yet to make one squad this season.
It's the potential he has over the likes of Lingard, Pereira etc that is leading people to come to this thread to display their frustration after yet another bad performance against Southampton. It's the absolute dire state of our central areas and our inability to create chances from those areas that is another factor.

People want to see a first 11 picked due to a meritocracy and not a favouritism stance, as I suspect.
 

Irwin99

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This could be similar to the situations of Dalot and Pereira last year where some fans were screaming 'why aren't they playing, can the manager not see their talent, etc etc.' and then when we actually see them play and realise, 'oh that's why they weren't getting games'.

The kid has got massive potential but obviously the coaching staff don't think he's quite ready yet. Europa League is round the corner and i expect him to get more time there (or at least make the bench).
 

golden_blunder

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The frustration for me is not the same because he’s in his last year of contract it’s even more frustrating because I think he may walk if he doesn’t get game time soon
 

lysglimt

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The goal was really good, apart from that he was average. Of course West Ham were a lot better than all other teams we have played, but James Garner have completely dominated every game he has played this season- Gomes didn't.
 

Adnan

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The goal was really good, apart from that he was average. Of course West Ham were a lot better than all other teams we have played, but James Garner have completely dominated every game he has played this season- Gomes didn't.
You said he was 'really poor' yesterday, but today he's improved in that respect and was average according to you.

I thought he played very well considering it was the best u23 opposition we've faced this season by quite a margin IMO and he scored a brilliant goal to boot.
 

lysglimt

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You said he was 'really poor' yesterday, but today he's improved in that respect and was average according to you.

I thought he played very well considering it was the best u23 opposition we've faced this season by quite a margin IMO and he scored a brilliant goal to boot.
Yeah I was a bit harsh on him when I first summed it up - and changed it slightly when I did my rating. Poor would be a better word than really poor. But that I stand by - the goal was great, apart from that he really didn't do much. But as I said in another post, the opposition was much better yesterday however his performance was not at the same level as what James Garner has shown so far this season.

If Gomes can be a bit more consistent - he should be a first-team regular within 2 years (if he stays with us) - but as long as I have seen him play, he goes missing for long periods of time. That is the only concern I have with Gomes.
 

Andersonson

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Our whole midfield is in a mess and needs sorting, and until January Ole needs to trust the Young players like Gomes and Garner by introducing them ASAP. They just can't be any worse than what we have atm.
We were left short in this transfer window by not replacing Herrera and Lukaku and it's down to Woodward not Ole.
Now Ole needs to be brave and play Garner and Gomes to speed up the play, and create more chances for our forwards.
They cant be worse? Of course they can. The difference between u23 and premier league is insane.

Have you ever considered they 're not ready?
 

SteveW

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He was poor. Against West Ham reserves. So your wild claims about him ripping it up against top opposition ring a little hollow.

Basically you’re doing what people always do. Reading far too much into preseason games where the vast majority of the players don’t really give a shit. That and the other classic redcafe trope. Thinking they’re better judges of reserve player’s quality than the coaching staff.
To be fair it's his first bad game in 2019 and he still scored a cracker of a goal and played some lovely through balls.
 

SirAF

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Angel Gomes, who has entered the last year of his current deal, is one of those set for negotiations, with James Garner, Tahith Chong, Brandon Williams and Ethan Laird also likely to receive upgrades.
- The Athletic

From an article about Greenwood getting a new contract
 

fps

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Do we? I thought he was very mobile and worked hard, abet giving the ball away a fair bit due to his higher risk passing that's not really suited to him playing further back.

Gomes will get chances over the coming weeks, I don't get all the panic, he loves it here.
I haven't seen Pogba sulk or shirk responsibility once this season, he's got his head down and is doing the job the manager's asked of him.
 

jesperjaap

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Absolutely, and it's the same with Tuanzebe. They don't have 5 full games between them but they're being hyped up as the saviours of our season. They're both exciting prospects but have so far done absolutely nothing to suggest they're ready to be thrown into a Premier League starting lineup. They need to come in slowly over the course of the season and then we will see how good they really are. I'd like to see him regularly on the bench but that's about it for now.

I disagree that it won't hurt him, this over-hyping eventually seeps into the media and has had an effect on plenty of our players in the past. All it takes is one good game and he'll be all over the newspapers.
This is true and often as probably now, due to the preseason performances, always happens with youngsters.....of course the other reason is the players in front of them are just so average, we want and need saviours. Personally think they should be getting chances off the bench as sadly overhyped or not....they are actually probably the best options we have NOW
 

Bestietom

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They cant be worse? Of course they can. The difference between u23 and premier league is insane.

Have you ever considered they 're not ready?
Have you ever considered that they have to start somewhere sometime, and now is the time as the clowns we have in midfield are just not good enough, or what are you watching.
 

JJ12

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Gomes would be given a contract but the question is would he want to sign it if Lingard, Mata etc gets ahead of him but don’t even perform?
He has to buy into the progression to first team. If he's being promised first team football this season then he needs to be patient for it and take his chance when it comes.

Or maybe we are saying he needs to sign the contract before we play him (highly doubt it).

We just don't know what's being said and what the plan is coming up.
 

Cassidy

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He has to buy into the progression to first team. If he's being promised first team football this season then he needs to be patient for it and take his chance when it comes.

Or maybe we are saying he needs to sign the contract before we play him (highly doubt it).

We just don't know what's being said and what the plan is coming up.
Im sure he will be patient. Im also sure he will sign nothing until the promises are kept
 

Andersonson

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Have you ever considered that they have to start somewhere sometime, and now is the time as the clowns we have in midfield are just not good enough, or what are you watching.
Yes. And I have faith in the coaches who see them every day and went through the same themself. Solskjaer is all for giving youth a chance. But cleary he isnt ready.

You think Lingard and Gomes are the same level? You base that on what, if so?
 

Adcuth

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Did he get called up to an England youth squad or was that just Greenwood?
 

MrBest

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Yes. And I have faith in the coaches who see them every day and went through the same themself. Solskjaer is all for giving youth a chance. But cleary he isnt ready.

You think Lingard and Gomes are the same level? You base that on what, if so?
Without meaning to interupt your debate, Lingard is on a higher level but only because he has more experience. Lingard is a average player, he has hit his peak and does not fit in with this team. I would disagree that Gomes is not ready from what i saw in pre season. The kid is majorly talented and if you have ability you should be tried especially given what we have is not working and is terrible. I think Ole knows he is ready but is waiting for the league cup and europa league to unleash him.