[Neil_Buchanan]

There's got to be a reason behind his lack of appearances as it doesn't make sense.

 

[Marcelinho87]

There's got to be a reason behind his lack of appearances as it doesn't make sense.

He is refusing to sign and will move on a free is my thinking.

 

[Red_toad]

He is refusing to sign and will move on a free is my thinking.

So is Chong, so how does that make any sense?

I believe he’s going to sign a new contract in the very near future. We shall see....

 

[0le]

What did the original tweet say that Gomes was retweeting?

 

[top1whoisman]

What did the original tweet say that Gomes was retweeting?

”Angel Gomes apparently late for training so was sent straight home. No chance he was going to start against Tranmere.

Funny how people moan about Ole team selections when they’ve no idea what goes on behind the scenes - including me!”

 

[Jonno]

Something clearly going on that we don’t know about.

In terms of pure footballing ability, he hasn’t shown me much to say he’s going to be a top level player so far

 

[Marcelinho87]

So is Chong, so how does that make any sense?

I believe he’s going to sign a new contract in the very near future. We shall see....

Ah shit yeah, forgot about Chong.

 

[Keirl]

Simon Stone on Twitter (pre-match):
‘Angel Gomes travelled to Tranmere with
@ManUtd today but not picked. Am told suggestions he was sent home from training not true.’

Would link the tweet directly but still limited as a newbie.

Still not clear what’s going on with Gomes - surely must be that Solskjaer just doesn’t rate him? Contract shenanigans doesn’t seem to be stopping Chong getting minutes.

 

[Oldyella]

So is Chong, so how does that make any sense?

I believe he’s going to sign a new contract in the very near future. We shall see....

And Chong seems to be getting some decent opportunities, despite showing very little each time.

 

[Lost bear]

And Chong seems to be getting some decent opportunities, despite showing very little each time.

Although I was pleasantly surprised by Chong today- I thought he played well, with nice quick passing, dangerous on the wing and unlucky not to score with a great attempt. I think so much of the dross we've seen is down to lack of confidence not just from the youngsters but from the mature players too. Can't help but wonder if its linked to the coaching and tactics.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

Feel sorry for him that he didn’t even make the bench today. I thought this was the best opportunity, playing against team from league one who got tired after playing against Watford few days ago.

 

[bsCallout]

Although I was pleasantly surprised by Chong today- I thought he played well, with nice quick passing, dangerous on the wing and unlucky not to score with a great attempt. I think so much of the dross we've seen is down to lack of confidence not just from the youngsters but from the mature players too. Can't help but wonder if its linked to the coaching and tactics.

Thought Chong was awful! Ran into dead ends non stop.

 

[theklr]

He is refusing to sign and will move on a free is my thinking.

But why even include him in the squad then? If you arent playing him anyway?

Feels more like a snub from OGS than anything else...

 

[Utdstar01]

Strange that he wasn't involved at all especially considering he did an interview with MUTV on the sites main page a couple of days ago.

 

[MiracleInMadrid]

And Chong seems to be getting some decent opportunities, despite showing very little each time.

Makes no sence really. He's getting opportunities from time to time, but nowhere near a continuous run of games/sub appearances. Probably due to him not impressing when used. But why does Ole keep picking him over other prospects then. In addition, Chong has actually been rumoured away with his agent spotted in Milano. Maybe we just read to much into that, but it does come of rather strange.

 

[POF]

Pre-season and his first competitive game, in the Europa League (the best performance seen from someone operating in the no.10 role up to that point).

Pre season and Astana at home? Well if that isn't proof that he's ready for first team football I don't know what is!

As for the other posts below wondering why he wasn't involved vs Tranmere and Chong was? That absolute swamp of a pitch might have had something to do with it.

 

[Bastian]

Is he being punished for not signing a contract? I don't see any football reason why he hasn't played a minute during our disastrous last 5-6 weeks.

 

[Wumminator]

Is he being punished for not signing a contract? I don't see any football reason why he hasn't played a minute during our disastrous last 5-6 weeks.

he has.

 

[Bastian]

he has.

You know what I mean. I know you have to keep up with the contrarian stuff, but give it a rest for five minutes. I'm asking why he's not featuring. Go make a new thread or something.

 

[Wumminator]

You know what I mean. I know you have to keep up with the contrarian stuff, but give it a rest for five minutes. I'm asking why he's not featuring. Go make a new thread or something.

but your question has been asked on this verypage twice already.

I don’t like how we have to pretend like there’s some big mystery.
The reason Gomes doesn’t start is because ....
He isn’t good enough to start.

He hasn’t shown enough in his first team appearances. That’s it. Williams and Greenwood did. So they’re around the first team.

People say “he can’t be worse than Lingard of Perreira” but, yes he can. Lingard is an england regular who has scored in FA Cup finals. Perriera will move to a decent side when he moves on. It’s a very hard position that Gomes isn’t ready for.

Whenever we get a little techno midget they’re hyped up to all hell before often fading away. I’ve watched Gomes for years now, but he just might not make the jump despite how talented he is.
I hate how we treat our young players on this forum. We build them up just to knock them down after a year in the first team, focusing on the next player we haven’t seen.
Gomes could make it. As of yet he doesn’t deserve to start and today we already had enough youth players starting. He will come in when he’s good enough or we can afford to bed him in.

 

[Bastian]

but your question has been asked on this verypage twice already.

I don’t like how we have to pretend like there’s some big mystery.
The reason Gomes doesn’t start is because ....
He isn’t good enough to start.

He hasn’t shown enough in his first team appearances. That’s it. Williams and Greenwood did. So they’re around the first team.

People say “he can’t be worse than Lingard of Perreira” but, yes he can. Lingard is an england regular who has scored in FA Cup finals. Perriera will move to a decent side when he moves on. It’s a very hard position that Gomes isn’t ready for.

Whenever we get a little techno midget they’re hyped up to all hell before often fading away. I’ve watched Gomes for years now, but he just might not make the jump despite how talented he is.
I hate how we treat our young players on this forum. We build them up just to knock them down after a year in the first team, focusing on the next player we haven’t seen.
Gomes could make it. As of yet he doesn’t deserve to start and today we already had enough youth players starting. He will come in when he’s good enough or we can afford to bed him in.

I'm not knocking our young players after a year in the first team. You might be referring here to Pereira, whom I've been very critical of when he's played in midfield (a position that I don't think he can play, though against Tranmere it was OK). I wasn't suggesting that Gomes would slot into the middle either. But he's definitely looked good to me when he's had chances here and there. He has ability that's not common in our team, receiving the ball in tight spaces, quick movement, some intelligent play in the final third. Yes, it's a tough position, but the benefit of playing him is he'll learn and improve - for me it's not a huge risk playing him.

As for Lingard, I used to defend him on here, especially during the Mourinho era. But he's at what should be his peak and he's peripheral. I would honestly rather see Gomes given chances over Lingard.

edit: granted, I was lazy in not reading the previous posts.

 

[sherrinford]

Pre season and Astana at home? Well if that isn't proof that he's ready for first team football I don't know what is!

As for the other posts below wondering why he wasn't involved vs Tranmere and Chong was? That absolute swamp of a pitch might have had something to do with it.

Again, in terms of assessing which of our young players looked physically ready to play senior football he was the standout.

As you move up the levels, the most noticeable difference in physical quality is sharpness - reactive speed and footwork. Many lower league players could run 100 meters as quickly as top tier ones, or lift more in the gym. Put them on the same pitch and the lower calibre player spends all game chasing shadows.

In the case of both Greenwood and Chong, I would argue that the same games (pre-season, Astana) indicated that they weren’t ready to compete in the way that Gomes was. Greenwood very obviously has something about him, but the argument for involving him in the senior squad even at that point was his goal scoring/ box instincts, something not offered by our other forwards, and his general play has been littered with moments that show he is not quite fully developed yet. Chong is supposed to be a quick winger but generally looks slow and weak and struggles to maintain possession, precisely because he does not have the requisite sharpness at this level.

Gomes had it. Astana wasn’t an outstanding performance or anything, but very promising. The best attacking player on the night and, as I said, the best produced by someone in the no.10 role for us up to that point of the season. For me, it confirmed that Gomes could begin to be introduced into Premier League football in the same way that Greenwood already had been.

He wasn’t - barely got a look in and spent time injured too. The Gomes who came on against Man City last time out just wasn’t the same player, but then he had barely played and it was City. Gomes had no confidence or authority in his play at all, and looked like a boy against men - I found it strange that some posters saw it as a positive, or in any way impressive, cameo. That doesn’t change the fact that it was evident going into the season Gomes was physically ready for the step up.

Despite the reservations of many here, I actually think he is physically very gifted. Modric, Isco, Xavi, Iniesta, David Silva, De Jong, Arthur Melo, Thiago Alcantara, Verratti, maybe Bernardo Silva - there are shades of some outstanding players in Gomes’ balance and agility, such is his grace in manipulating the ball.

 

[Bastian]

The Athletic has a piece on this situation now (Whitwell). When Garner and Greenwood signed new deals, and Chong and Gomes stalled, Ole didn't pick them. But the speculation is that for Gomes (at least) the hesitation is over game time. He's been at the club since he was six. United through and through.

For me, he's clearly not been given the chance he deserves.

 

[Bondi77]

I can remember a few years ago there was a really good talent at Utd called Mats Daehli who is small in stature and he was tipped fo do big things in football and it was a big surprise when he left us and linked up with Ole at Molde.
When Ole took the job at Cardiff he brought Mats with him and the young man struggled to make an impact and I think he lasted about one season before he was shipped out.
I know I could be wide off the mark but maybe Ole has that at the back of his mind when he thinks about giving Angel game time.

 

[Gordon S]

How will we know if he will be good enough or not if doesn't get to play? Either with us or on a good loan deal.

 

[fergieisold]

How will we know if he will be good enough or not if doesn't get to play? Either with us or on a good loan deal.

yeh he needs game time. Looks talented but whenever he has played in the first team I don’t think he looks ready.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

Maybe he is not convincing at all in trainings eg. lost physical battles against our physical defenders and midfielders.

 

[Inigo Montoya]

Maybe he is not convincing at all in trainings eg. lost physical battles against our physical defenders and midfielders.

He’d lose a physical battle with a new born baby

 

[Arka_BleedingRed]

I can remember a few years ago there was a really good talent at Utd called Mats Daehli who is small in stature and he was tipped fo do big things in football and it was a big surprise when he left us and linked up with Ole at Molde.
When Ole took the job at Cardiff he brought Mats with him and the young man struggled to make an impact and I think he lasted about one season before he was shipped out.
I know I could be wide off the mark but maybe Ole has that at the back of his mind when he thinks about giving Angel game time.

I think Mats Daehli is probably at Belgium with Genk. With him, it was more about injuries rather his physical attributes(or lack of).

The fact remains that Gomes has hardly been given enough first team chances to make an impression Ole. Being a player who has regularly been the pride of our academy before the rise of Greenwood, he deserved a proper chance to impress unlike the likes of Lingard who has been consistently poor, match after match, yet given endless chances.

 

[Marcelinho87]

The Athletic has a piece on this situation now (Whitwell). When Garner and Greenwood signed new deals, and Chong and Gomes stalled, Ole didn't pick them. But the speculation is that for Gomes (at least) the hesitation is over game time. He's been at the club since he was six. United through and through.

For me, he's clearly not been given the chance he deserves.

How do you know what he deserves?

 

[Oldyella]

yeh he needs game time. Looks talented but whenever he has played in the first team I don’t think he looks ready.

But Chong looks just as unready but has actually had the opportunities for us to tell that, and by all accounts is even more open to leaving than Gomes.

Who knows? It's a weird one, maybe Ole is just concerned about his size.

 

[Adam-Utd]

There's got to be a reason behind his lack of appearances as it doesn't make sense.

Ole just doesn't like him, he isn't athletic enough.

 

[fergieisold]

But Chong looks just as unready but has actually had the opportunities for us to tell that, and by all accounts is even more open to leaving than Gomes.

Who knows? It's a weird one, maybe Ole is just concerned about his size.

Good point. Not sure what the difference is! I think Chong will probably be leaving us soon, he doesn't look good enough for a top team!

 

[POF]

Again, in terms of assessing which of our young players looked physically ready to play senior football he was the standout.

As you move up the levels, the most noticeable difference in physical quality is sharpness - reactive speed and footwork. Many lower league players could run 100 meters as quickly as top tier ones, or lift more in the gym. Put them on the same pitch and the lower calibre player spends all game chasing shadows.

In the case of both Greenwood and Chong, I would argue that the same games (pre-season, Astana) indicated that they weren’t ready to compete in the way that Gomes was. Greenwood very obviously has something about him, but the argument for involving him in the senior squad even at that point was his goal scoring/ box instincts, something not offered by our other forwards, and his general play has been littered with moments that show he is not quite fully developed yet. Chong is supposed to be a quick winger but generally looks slow and weak and struggles to maintain possession, precisely because he does not have the requisite sharpness at this level.

Gomes had it. Astana wasn’t an outstanding performance or anything, but very promising. The best attacking player on the night and, as I said, the best produced by someone in the no.10 role for us up to that point of the season. For me, it confirmed that Gomes could begin to be introduced into Premier League football in the same way that Greenwood already had been.

He wasn’t - barely got a look in and spent time injured too. The Gomes who came on against Man City last time out just wasn’t the same player, but then he had barely played and it was City. Gomes had no confidence or authority in his play at all, and looked like a boy against men - I found it strange that some posters saw it as a positive, or in any way impressive, cameo. That doesn’t change the fact that it was evident going into the season Gomes was physically ready for the step up.

Despite the reservations of many here, I actually think he is physically very gifted. Modric, Isco, Xavi, Iniesta, David Silva, De Jong, Arthur Melo, Thiago Alcantara, Verratti, maybe Bernardo Silva - there are shades of some outstanding players in Gomes’ balance and agility, such is his grace in manipulating the ball.

You're entitled to your opinion but pre season and a home game vs Astana is absolutely no indicator whatsoever of a player's ability to handle to tempo and physicality of regular Premier League football.

Gomes is a gritty little player and is brave in his challenges but he is tiny, poor defensively and is slow over a longer run. He failed to track his runner in Astana which led to the winner through lack of speed rather than will.

You are right about pointing out his injuries which seem to happen at really inopportune times. Another indicator he is not yet physically ready for senior football.

I really like him as a player and would love for him to cement himself in the team as number 10. I didn't think it was realistic this season and saw him as a bench option this season and am disappointed he hasn't been that. But, if United want to aim to be competitive in the future, places in the team have to be earned.

He hasn't had a lot of chances but in the chances he's had, he's done nothing to justify being higher in the pecking order. Greenwood did, Williams did, they both play. Gomes didn't, he doesn't play. It really is that simple.

 

[Keirl]

Really interesting piece on Gomes in the Athletic today from Laurie Whitwell - a bit of insight into the player himself and chat on why he isn’t getting minutes. I wasn’t aware that Nani is Gomes’ godfather.

 

[Grande]

Really interesting piece on Gomes in the Athletic today from Laurie Whitwell - a bit of insight into the player himself and chat on why he isn’t getting minutes. I wasn’t aware that Nani is Gomes’ godfather.

What does it say?

 

[Keirl]

What does it say?

Mostly that it does seem that Gomes is on the way out of Old Trafford ultimately because of a lack of minutes. Not exactly revolutionary.

However Laurie interviewed Gomes himself who seems to really care about United - has been at United since age 6, youngest player for the first team since Duncan Edwards etc. His dad was coached by Carlos Quieroz and so the family know him well. He used to go round to Nani’s house as a kid.

Sad that a young player who seems to really want to make it at United looks like he’s going to leave (although there are plenty others who never make it). Agree with others that he’s looked bright when played, although the coaching staff will see him behind closed doors and if he’s not ready he ain’t ready.

Ultimately just because Mata, Lingard and Pereira aren’t playing well it doesn’t mean that Gomes would do any better. If we play him when he’s not ready and he’s poor it’ll set his confidence (and likely career) back - the folks in the media (and some on here) can be brutal when we’re bad. Sometimes not playing these kids too soon is important to protect them.

 

[Lee565]

Why do fans and maybe possibly Ole think gomes deserves not getting first team action because he will probably be leaving come the end of the season, there are load of instances of clubs knowing a player will be leaving their clubs on a free in the summer but most of them dont act childish and still continue using them for the rest of the season.

Look at the Hudson-odoi situation, he wanted out for long time but realized that under Lampard he would get plenty of chances for first team action at Chelsea, maybe the same could happen with gomes instead having him watch the likes of periera, Chong and bloody lingard get more starts and thinking he must not be favoured by Ole at all.

Its damn criminal that gomes doesnt even get a chance in the cup games and instead we have to see lingard starting these matches when he should be nowhere near this club.

 

[Rob Bowman]

but your question has been asked on this verypage twice already.

I don’t like how we have to pretend like there’s some big mystery.
The reason Gomes doesn’t start is because ....
He isn’t good enough to start.

He hasn’t shown enough in his first team appearances. That’s it. Williams and Greenwood did. So they’re around the first team.

People say “he can’t be worse than Lingard of Perreira” but, yes he can. Lingard is an england regular who has scored in FA Cup finals. Perriera will move to a decent side when he moves on. It’s a very hard position that Gomes isn’t ready for.

Whenever we get a little techno midget they’re hyped up to all hell before often fading away. I’ve watched Gomes for years now, but he just might not make the jump despite how talented he is.
I hate how we treat our young players on this forum. We build them up just to knock them down after a year in the first team, focusing on the next player we haven’t seen.
Gomes could make it. As of yet he doesn’t deserve to start and today we already had enough youth players starting. He will come in when he’s good enough or we can afford to bed him in.

This would make sense to me if not for the fact that I have watched Lindgard and Pereira waaaaaayyyyyy too much this year. I do not agree with you on their play thie EPL year. pereira has shown some signs of life. Lindgard has looked dreadful to me full stop.

Could we have not found a few games in a row to let him play and settle a little and see what he could show?

Again not saying you are wrong just say the competition was so dreadful I think we could have created a bit bigger sample of games to make this assessment and make it more clearly.

That make sense?

 

[sherrinford]

You're entitled to your opinion but pre season and a home game vs Astana is absolutely no indicator whatsoever of a player's ability to handle to tempo and physicality of regular Premier League football.

Gomes is a gritty little player and is brave in his challenges but he is tiny, poor defensively and is slow over a longer run. He failed to track his runner in Astana which led to the winner through lack of speed rather than will.

You are right about pointing out his injuries which seem to happen at really inopportune times. Another indicator he is not yet physically ready for senior football.

I really like him as a player and would love for him to cement himself in the team as number 10. I didn't think it was realistic this season and saw him as a bench option this season and am disappointed he hasn't been that. But, if United want to aim to be competitive in the future, places in the team have to be earned.

He hasn't had a lot of chances but in the chances he's had, he's done nothing to justify being higher in the pecking order. Greenwood did, Williams did, they both play. Gomes didn't, he doesn't play. It really is that simple.

I think you can look at those games and gauge a player’s physical capabilities relative to his teammates - players who have played and do play regular Premier League football.

Describing Gomes as tiny, defensively poor and slow over longer distances is accurate, but there are droves of (terrific) smaller players who aren’t suited to tracking opposition wide players. Are any of the players I mentioned in my previous post as sharing certain physical gifts with Gomes suitable? Do you not think Xavi et al could be similarly exposed in those situations? Would you be confident of Scholes tracking the runner in Astana? Because I think your description is spot on for Gomes and it encapsulates Scholes very well.

I honestly don’t see the relevance. You are talking about Gomes’ natural weaknesses, physically, rather than considering how his physical strengths - those aspects that he has developed his game around and that he actually relies on to be effective in the way he plays - will stand up at a higher level, against a higher class of athlete. Play Gomes left wing against a positive overlapping full back in the U23s and he would struggle just as he did in the senior side. He has always been smaller than his opponents, slower over distance than his opponents - these are not problems unique to making the the step up to the first team. Yet he has excelled. All his technical skill and game intelligence combine with his nimble movements etc. to make him the player that he is. How effective he can be in using these traits will determine how far he goes at the top level.

I don’t think anyone really wants Gomes on the left wing (including Solskjaer who very likely played him out there in later games to accommodate other players). If I were advocating playing Gomes off the left then you would be perfectly correct in your assertion that he has not, in the few chances he has had, earned a place in the team/ squad.

As a no.10 I would flat out disagree though. He showed enough in his first and only start in the central attacking midfield role to justify being given more minutes. I’m certainly not proposing he should have been thrust into Premier League starting lineups, but which one of Pereira or Lingard would you say has ‘earned’ their place directly competing for the no.10 role. Gomes was better in his first game than either had been in any game up to that point, as well as being better than Greenwood on the night.

For me, it’s obvious that Solskjaer went into the season with the intention of integrating Greenwood properly into the first team. He featured from the bench right from the first game of the season, after Lukaku had left without being replaced. He was used carefully and, though he’s now at the point where he is competing for a starting berth in league games, he did struggle somewhat initially in adjusting to the level. Gomes couldn’t get into the squad until Pogba got injured, finding himself down the pecking order with new contracts for both Pereira and Mata. He couldn’t get a look in in the league and only played one game in the Europa in a position that he is realistically going to play in for the first team. He did suffer injury too but the pattern was already plain to see. For me, the simple reason why Greenwood plays and Gomes does not is that Solskaer clearly likes and rates one youngster and blatantly does not fancy the other.