[Eddy_JukeZ]

I can't stand his lack of intensity and urgency.

He strolls about as if he's Lionel Messi.

Diffrence is when Messi gets the ball, he absolutely terrorizes the opposition.

I just don't think he'll ever take that next step.

He's been here since 2015. He is the exact player same now he was 4 years ago when he joined. It's maddening. Don't know whether to blame him or the club/managers. Probably both.

 

[BusbyMalone]

It's always been weird to me how people will go into threads and criticize, Pereira, McTominay, Fred, Young, etc. and then in the same breath wonder why our striker is inconsistent? Surely it should be obvious?

Playing with such supply will bring any striker down, and make it harder to evaluate their quality.

That's true to a point and i agree, but Martial doesn't help himself. The buck can't simply be passed to the other players. He needs to show something himself. He's wildly inconsistent and his attitude sometimes rubs people up the wrong way. His off the ball moment is also quite poor and needs to improve.

 

[POF]

Started really well. I thought he was going to have a huge game. His ball to put James away was fantastic and he had some really nice link up play around the box in the first 15-20 minutes.

But then his head dropped and he drifted completely out of the game. It was really disappointing. He didn't get great service admittedly (Pereira had an absolute nightmare) but he needs to do more.

 

[friendlytramp]

Do twang to be a dick but I’m just. It sure he’s actually that good..?

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

It's always been weird to me how people will go into threads and criticize, Pereira, McTominay, Fred, Young, etc. and then in the same breath wonder why our striker is inconsistent? Surely it should be obvious?

Playing with such supply will bring any striker down, and make it harder to evaluate their quality.

I agree to a certain extent but Martial has always been overly protected by the fans for some reason. If this was Lukaku who played with no intensity he would be slaughtered. Zlatan was still producing despite being in a shite team and being as old as a fossil.

All we ask is for him to make runs and try but with his style it's sometimes hard to see it. I agree he needs more quality in the team, as does Rashford but feck me, people need to realise he's not that once in a generation talent they thought he was after his first season.

 

[Devil may care]

I see the morons are our in force again. Linked up play fairly well early on but was absolutely starved of any kind of service due to Pereira and McTominay having terrible games.

Spot on, some of the bullshit is crazy, Martial and Rashford were being served by chef's that think Anorexia is a fashion statement. There's virtually no creativity or real quality on the ball from the 3 midfielders.

 

[Paul_Scholes18]

He is not good enough as a central striker. We should have bought one this summer and we are paying for letting Lukaku go.

 

[He'sRaldo]

That's true to a point and i agree, but Martial doesn't help himself. The buck can't simply be passed to the other players. He needs to show something himself. He's wildly inconsistent and his attitude sometimes rubs people up the wrong way. His off the ball moment is also quite poor and needs to improve.

In my opinion, it definitely can, should, and must. Otherwise, we'll have people calling for the quality/ productive players' heads and eventually hounding them out while the poor players survive yet again, as has been happening year after year.

We saw with our own eyes the midfield and tactics on display. No use in getting angry that our striker didn't show the right body language under such conditions. Sort out the conditions first, then evaluate his body language. If it's still bad and we're in a position of strength then, by all means, get rid.

 

[He'sRaldo]

I agree to a certain extent but Martial has always been overly protected by the fans for some reason. If this was Lukaku who played with no intensity he would be slaughtered. Zlatan was still producing despite being in a shite team and being as old as a fossil.

All we ask is for him to make runs and try but with his style it's sometimes hard to see it. I agree he needs more quality in the team, as does Rashford but feck me, people need to realise he's not that once in a generation talent they thought he was after his first season.

Interesting you say that since we've seen a player who could potentially be such, Pogba, fare no better, and receive very similar criticism and even abuse. It's lead me to think, really, which generational talent would shine here? I've heard it said that Messi or Ronaldo would struggle here, and I don't think it's too far off.

I understand the defenders can sometimes be annoying but honestly, a lot of people just prefer watching a Martial who, while lackadaisical, excites and comes up with real quality, to Fred/ Pereira/ Lingard who, while hardworking with positive body language, offer nothing. And thus they don't care about his body language etc. and find it ridiculous that it is even brought up, especially given the context of our current situation.

In any case, I've always had the opinion that until we sort ourselves out, we shouldn't be too hard on the obvious quality playing in our team due to the circumstances.

 

[el3mel]

In my opinion, it definitely can, should, and must. Otherwise, we'll have people calling for the quality/ productive players' heads and eventually hounding them out while the poor players survive yet again, as has been happening year after year.

We saw with our own eyes the midfield and tactics on display. No use in getting angry that our striker didn't show the right body language under such conditions. Sort out the conditions first, then evaluate his body language. If it's still bad and we're in a position of strength then, by all means, get rid.

It doesn't make sense to praise him when he does well and scores them blame everyone else when he performs poor and not good enough, while playing with exactly same players in both situations. Throws logic out of the window this.

He's a good player, but the reality is he's not as good as many here believe him to be. He is a good option to have in your squad lbut he's not a main player material for any team with high ambitions. Of course, we are currently dogshite so he's our best attacker, better than Lingard, Mata, Pereira and Co, so he should always play and I can withstand his stinkers for the sake of his other good games, but if - and a big if - we finally become a good team again, I can't see him being a main player when this happens, probably a squad option.

 

[He'sRaldo]

It doesn't make sense to praise him when he does well and scores them blame everyone else when he performs poor and not good enough, while playing with exactly same players in both situations. Throws logic out of the window this.

He's a good player, but the reality is he's not as good as many here believe him to be. He is a good option to have in your squad lbut he's not a main player material for any team with high ambitions. Of course, we are currently dogshite so he's our best attacker, better than Lingard, Mata, Pereira and Co, so he should always play and I can withstand his stinkers for the sake of his other good games, but if - and a big if - we finally become a good team again, I can't see him being a main player when this happens, probably a squad option.

I would argue it makes sense, seeing as most of our goals have been through individual quality and we rarely create clear chances for our forwards to score. We're set up poorly so the forwards almost always struggle. Same goes for Rashford.

As for not being good enough to be a starter, I've suspected the same before, but the truth is you never know. Who knew Firmino would be a vital cog? Robertson and TAA? Salah and Mane? It's all about getting the best from a player, and the one time Martial has been set up to get the best out of him, he was our top scorer as a teenager in his debut season. And that was under LVG, who is not the most attacking manager on the planet...


He may have regressed and may not be good enough right now, but until we are able to see him at his very best, we'll never really know. The same goes for our other quality players as well.

 

[BusbyMalone]

In my opinion, it definitely can, should, and must. Otherwise, we'll have people calling for the quality/ productive players' heads and eventually hounding them out while the poor players survive yet again, as has been happening year after year.

We saw with our own eyes the midfield and tactics on display. No use in getting angry that our striker didn't show the right body language under such conditions. Sort out the conditions first, then evaluate his body language. If it's still bad and we're in a position of strength then, by all means, get rid.

Well first off i'm not really advocating to get rid of him, i'm simply pointing out his flaws, for which there are many. I agreed with you to an extent when you voiced your opinions on the rest of the team, but Martial cannot be absolved of blame. Criticising the team for his poor displays is just silly. He's shown throughout the years that he's wildly inconsistent and has flaws in his game that he seemingly hasn't worked on.

His off-the-ball moment, for example, is not good; that has nothing to do with our poor midfield. Also, we CAN get angry with a player for not showing the right body language under these conditions, 'cause we expect more from him, and rightly so. While he's definitely not the only problem with this team, he also doesn't deserve a free pass.

I like the guy, but he also has me pulling my hair out at times because, much like Pogba, you know there's so much quality there but the effort is lacking and i can't accept that.

 

[el3mel]

I would argue it makes sense, seeing as most of our goals have been through individual quality and we rarely create clear chances for our forwards to score.

As for not being good enough to be a starter, I've suspected the same before, but the truth is you never know. Who knew Firmino would be a vital cog? Robertson and TAA? Salah and Mane? It's all about getting the best from a player, and the one time Martial has been set up to get the best out of him, he was our top scorer as a teenager in his debut season.


He may have regressed and may not be good enough right now, but until we are able to see him at his very best, we'll never really know. The same goes for our other quality players as well.

We don't create much, but at the same time it doesn't mean the striker himself didn't have a poor match. No one blamed him for not scoring but for his general play and lack of urgency, which unfortunately keeps happening from time to time with him, and it's annoying how his performance varies that quickly from one game to the next.

You have a point that we don't know what will happen regarding him in the future so it will be mostly speculations from us streaming from our evaluation of his qualities that we have been seeing. For me he's a good player that I will like to have in the squad but if he doesn't solve his inconsistency or lack of urgency, then can't see him becoming a main starting player in a successful team. For the moment though, I will of course take him ahead of our other lot in the attack, so let's see what will happen in the future. Hopefully you will be the right one.

 

[He'sRaldo]

Well first off i'm not really advocating to get rid of him, i'm simply pointing out his flaws, for which there are many. I agreed with you to an extent when you voiced your opinions on the rest of the team, but Martial cannot be absolved of blame. Criticising the team for his poor displays is just silly. He's shown throughout the years that he's wildly inconsistent and has flaws in his game that he seemingly hasn't worked on.

His off-the-ball moment, for example, is not good; that has nothing to do with our poor midfield. Also, we CAN get angry with a player for not showing the right body language under these conditions, 'cause we expect more from him, and rightly so. While he's definitely not the only problem with this team, he also doesn't deserve a free pass.

I like the guy, but he also has me pulling my hair out at times because, much like Pogba, you know there's so much quality there but the effort is lacking and i can't accept that.

Fair enough, although I think the body language issue is a bit overstated; with footballers like this usually depends on the team. For instance, I remember Mane seemingly had poor body language and an attitude problem in Southampton, which suddenly vanished as soon as he arrived in Liverpool and started competing. And there are other examples.

Once we start challenging for major trophies and the players have good competition in all positions, I think these body language issues with Martial, Pogba and the like will disappear.

 

[Frank Grimes]

Vastly overrated, has been for years. A highlights player.

 

[eire-red]

I would argue it makes sense, seeing as most of our goals have been through individual quality and we rarely create clear chances for our forwards to score. We're set up poorly so the forwards almost always struggle. Same goes for Rashford.

As for not being good enough to be a starter, I've suspected the same before, but the truth is you never know. Who knew Firmino would be a vital cog? Robertson and TAA? Salah and Mane? It's all about getting the best from a player, and the one time Martial has been set up to get the best out of him, he was our top scorer as a teenager in his debut season. And that was under LVG, who is not the most attacking manager on the planet...


He may have regressed and may not be good enough right now, but until we are able to see him at his very best, we'll never really know. The same goes for our other quality players as well.

Agree with you here, so many of our goals come from individual moments of brilliance. We play Rashford and Martial up front and expect them to produce moments of magic to win games, that's not a sustainable style of play.

We never seem to score easy goals, we don't score from crosses, service from the wings and midfield is non-existent. When we play this way, with Rashford on the inside left, we need an attacking LB to be bombing into the space he's leaving to stretch defences, that's not happening. James is good, but he doesn't give us enough end quality from the right either, and Wan Bissaka, as brilliant as he is defensively, isn't great going forward. And in this set up, the no.10 position is the most important, and we have either Pereira or Lingard in there.

Where does the service come from? McTominay and Fred aren't that type of midfielder, Rashford and Martial feed of scraps. 1 on 1, Martial is the player I want to see being put through on goal. He's clinical, composed and has good link up play when there are actual quality players around him that are on the same page.

Today, you could see the gap in quality between Rashford and the Bournemouth players when he was actually given the ball. He had a couple of touches on the wings that were exquisite, and was taking the ball forward and looking up to see Martial marked by both of the Bournemouth centre halfs. It's these positions where we need runners from midfield, overlaps from the full backs, but we don't see any of that.

The quality is there, the onus is on the coaching team to create a style of play that will put our best players in positions to influence the game. If we begin to see that and Martial still isn't performing, then fair enough, I'll hold my hands up and say we need to get rid. But I've seen enough moments of sheer class from this guy in an otherwise disjointed and lost team to think that with the proper support around him there's a real player in there.

 

[Freak]

And Ole wants to rely on him and rashford as our main outlets for goals. FFS.

 

[flappyjay]

Prime 12/13 RVP wouldn't score more than 20 with this team. Our forwards James/martial/Rashford get stick for the performance of the people behind them. Who in midfield do you expect to provide assists to them. Even your favorite pl forwards from Mane to sterling to Kane rely on good service from their team mates.

Look at Mane and Firmino when we played Liverpool. They were hopeless when we were cutting the service from their fullbacks.

 

[Needham]

Vastly overrated, has been for years. A highlights player.

100% on the money. That recent thread about him being our most important player was nauseating. He'll outperform himself occasionally, like when he got that individual goal at Fulham or showed up at Norwich. But the effusive praise that follows is a spectacle of wishful thinking. He'd be a good player in a brilliant team. Based on years of seeing him play now my expectations are nonexistent.

 

[Raven]

Spot on, some of the bullshit is crazy, Martial and Rashford were being served by chef's that think Anorexia is a fashion statement. There's virtually no creativity or real quality on the ball from the 3 midfielders.

I get the distinct impression that half of the people criticising him didn't even watch the game. He pressed fairly well all game, made the right movements to get in behind and linked up play well early in the match, yet we have idiots calling him lazy, slagging him off for not dropping deep and not making runs. Either I was hallucinating or these people didn't watch the game.

 

[kouroux]

I get the distinct impression that half of the people criticising him didn't even watch the game. He pressed fairly well all game, made the right movements to get in behind and linked up play well early in the match, yet we have idiots calling him lazy, slagging him off for not dropping deep and not making runs. Either I was hallucinating or these people didn't watch the game.

The lazy "tag" comes from body language experts. If any players isn't exerting himself the way they fantasize about, he is labelled lazy.

 

[Devil may care]

I get the distinct impression that half of the people criticising him didn't even watch the game. He pressed fairly well all game, made the right movements to get in behind and linked up play well early in the match, yet we have idiots calling him lazy, slagging him off for not dropping deep and not making runs. Either I was hallucinating or these people didn't watch the game.

If you don't run around like loon then you're lazy according to some on the Caf, you'd think people would have learned from Lingard that you can run around loads and not actually do anything. Martial held he ball well hen our CM's actually got it to him, he pressed when it made sense and made several good runs that weren't found by the CM's.

 

[zenith]

He's a no. 9 now and his main task is to convert the chances that come his way and occasionally drop back to help our link up play and create the odd chance.

He certainly could have done better in the game but he was not a disaster as many would make him out to be.

 

[romufc]

He's a no. 9 now and his main task is to convert the chances that come his way and occasionally drop back to help our link up play and create the odd chance.

He certainly could have done better in the game but he was not a disaster as many would make him out to be.

How many passes into Martial were misplaced. Simple balls. We all talk about lacking creativity, but other teams manage to create chances against us easily.

 

[Hammondo]

His movement off the ball was god awful. Difficult to make any attacks using him.

 

[Shimo]

The lazy "tag" comes from body language experts. If any players isn't exerting himself the way they fantasize about, he is labelled lazy.

Yep. Often subconscious thing especially when people don't fancy a player that further convinces them of how useless said player is. Berbatov used to have the same charge often levied against him. For Martial, people look at Rashford and for Berbatov it was Tevez. Berba often had some of the highest amount of ground covered but, because he was languid most of the time he was deemed "lazy".

I rate Martial highly but, even I find myself expecting more visible effort. Yet, also often see that he is a lot more thoughtful on when and how he presses or when he tracks back. Doesn't make sense for him to press if no one else is pressing with him, waste of energy. Sure it looks great when Rashford sprints 20-30 yards to put in a challenge but, he just ends up out of position. I read after he came on during the Liverpool game how he was lazy, seemed like people are were expecting that he run around the 18 yard box chasing everything down. He did drop a little to try occupy space but, also what I was seeing was he was supposed to be the outball so had to make sure he was staying up.

I know he has been here quite while now but, just like Rashford, he has been shifted around, in and out of the team that he hasn't really had a chance to build any kind of consistency. In this #9 role for us now, after just coming back from a long layoff, the lack of consistency isn't a surprise but, also can see the quality he brings compared to others. Team needs time and just like the rest of the forwards, need better service to do what he is supposed to best.

 

[Yagami]

His movement off the ball was god awful. Difficult to make any attacks using him.

I don't think it's that bad. I constantly see him making runs off the ball but becaue our players are reluctant to play them forward passes/through balls due to knowing they're limited technically thus not wanting to lose possession, or they do play them and horribly misweigh them, it comes across as him not moving at all when he does.

Our forwards are being fed by Ashley Young, Fred, Pereira, McTominay for the most part. All of them are limited on the ball and, to be blunt, are rubbish at actually passing the thing, so our forwards are being starved of service.

 

[romufc]

I don't think it's that bad. I constantly see him making runs off the ball but becaue our players are reluctant to play them forward passes/through balls due to knowing they're limited technically thus not wanting to lose possession, or they do play them and horribly misweigh them, it comes across as him not moving at all when he does.

Our forwards are being fed by Ashley Young, Fred, Pereira, McTominay for the most part. All of them are limited on the ball and, to be blunt, are rubbish at actually passing the thing, so our forwards are being starved of service.

I agree, i don't think martial was too bad up top. When you have very limited players, what can we expect? No one can beat a man, Lingard thinks he can control a game but everytime he gets the ball and there is a clear ball to play he stops thinks and passes it back.

 

[Hammondo]

I don't think it's that bad. I constantly see him making runs off the ball but becaue our players are reluctant to play them forward passes/through balls due to knowing they're limited technically thus not wanting to lose possession, or they do play them and horribly misweigh them, it comes across as him not moving at all when he does.

Our forwards are being fed by Ashley Young, Fred, Pereira, McTominay for the most part. All of them are limited on the ball and, to be blunt, are rubbish at actually passing the thing, so our forwards are being starved of service.

Well in the last game it was very poor. Timing was way off, running in directions that are impossible to pass to, just going in the wrong direction at times. Hes not an intelligent striker.

 

[Sayros]

That's the best we will get from him. Blowing hot and cold, having a great game followed by a stinker. It's shame that supposedly our 2 best players (Pogba and Martial) are extremely inconsistent and have as many stinkers as great games.

He is a good player that I will like to have as a squad option in the team but people here overrate him way too much, probably because of the other shite show we have in comparison. Moving forward or whenever we finally have a good team with a good manager, we will have to drop him as a squad option and get better and more consistent players than him. He's good but not as good as his fans think.

It's almost as if this was a team-wide issue, regardless of who comes in or how talented and class they have been elsewhere.
Moving forward, when you do finally get a good team, and Martial and Pogba (unlikely) are still around, guess what? They will very likely perform much better than on this current team.

 

[el3mel]

It's almost as if this was a team-wide issue, regardless of who comes in or how talented and class they have been elsewhere.
Moving forward, when you do finally get a good team, and Martial and Pogba (unlikely) are still around, guess what? They will very likely perform much better than on this current team.

Pogba maybe, but for Martial I don't see it. Can't see him a starter in any successful team tbh. A good squad option to have that's it imo.

 

[Sayros]

Pogba maybe, but for Martial I don't see it. Can't see him a starter in any successful team tbh. A good squad option to have that's it imo.

It really depends on how successful we are talking about. Would he be a starter for Liverpool or City? No, I don't think so. But does that mean he wouldn't be a successful player for them? Not really. You put a good team around him, especially in the midfield and final third, he will make things happen; I have no doubts about that. You just need to go back a few pages on this very thread as it's already been mentioned, but his ability to link up in the final third, the quick passing, the ball protection, he has that flair in the final third where he can do some flick ons, some quick dribbling in tight space and create or finish himself, I can definitely see him succeeding in a better team, and possibly become a starter at the very top. He's one of the few players on this current Manchester United team I can say that about, because I can easily apply your assertion to the rest of the team as well if we're talking about the very top teams.

You put him in a team like City, I don't think he would start, but he would be successful whenever he does get on the field. He's not someone who I'd say will drag a team to a win, but if you have a good system with good players in place, he has shown that he has the tools to be a complement rather than a hindrance.

 

[el3mel]

It really depends on how successful we are talking about. Would he be a starter for Liverpool or City? No, I don't think so. But does that mean he wouldn't be a successful player for them? Not really. You put a good team around him, especially in the midfield and final third, he will make things happen; I have no doubts about that. You just need to go back a few pages on this very thread as it's already been mentioned, but his ability to link up in the final third, the quick passing, the ball protection, he has that flair in the final third where he can do some flick ons, some quick dribbling in tight space and create or finish himself, I can definitely see him succeeding in a better team, and possibly become a starter at the very top. He's one of the few players on this current Manchester United team I can say that about, because I can easily apply your assertion to the rest of the team as well if we're talking about the very top teams.

You put him in a team like City, I don't think he would start, but he would be successful whenever he does get on the field. He's not someone who I'd say will drag a team to a win, but if you have a good system with good players in place, he has shown that he has the tools to be a complement rather than a hindrance.

But that's what I'm literally saying above. He won't be a starter in a top successful team, but will be a good squad option to have around.

 

[Sayros]

But that's what I'm literally saying above. He won't be a starter in a top successful team, but will be a good squad option to have around.

I agreed with that, the only difference is you think that's his ceiling and I disagree with that, I think he could become a starter over time. There aren't a ton of other United players I can see playing that have that same sort of ceiling.

 

[el3mel]

I agreed with that, the only difference is you think that's his ceiling and I disagree with that, I think he could become a starter over time. There aren't a ton of other United players I can see playing that have that same sort of ceiling.

Fair enough.

 

[Forevergiggs1]

Martial is one of the most predictable players in our squad. Every single game is the same. If we start well as a team he's up for it and actually looks like he could make a difference but once we start getting pegged back which is 99% of games he just gives up, half presses, doesn't make those runs and basically just goes through the motions of acting like a footballer.

If we were always playing on the front foot Martial would probably be a good asset to have and if we sign better players he could shine but once we have to dig in to get results I wouldn't want him anywhere near me in the trenches. No way Jose.

 

[He'sRaldo]

Martial is one of the most predictable players in our squad. Every single game is the same. If we start well as a team he's up for it and actually looks like he could make a difference but once we start getting pegged back which is 99% of games he just gives up, half presses, doesn't make those runs and basically just goes through the motions of acting like a footballer.

If we were always playing on the front foot Martial would probably be a good asset to have and if we sign better players he could shine but once we have to dig in to get results I wouldn't want him anywhere near me in the trenches. No way Jose.

Not necessarily. He's gotten us results with his quality several times before, but can't do it consistently.

 

[roykeane19]

I get the distinct impression that half of the people criticising him didn't even watch the game. He pressed fairly well all game, made the right movements to get in behind and linked up play well early in the match, yet we have idiots calling him lazy, slagging him off for not dropping deep and not making runs. Either I was hallucinating or these people didn't watch the game.

most people on here just lazily regurgitate the same steretypes about a player constantly over and over, Martials being his "body language", whatever that is meant to mean

 

[Andersonson]

His best ever season is 11 goals in the league and 17 overall.

We need a better striker, pure and simple. He's talented, but not good enough if we're going to challenge for top 4

 

[MadDogg]

His best ever season is 11 goals in the league and 17 overall.

We need a better striker, pure and simple. He's talented, but not good enough if we're going to challenge for top 4

He's really only played as the main striker once before, and that was early on in his first season. Since then he's been used on the wing (and even then he was twice taken out of the team at a time when he was one of our best players).

If he can stay fit and is played up top I would expect to see him reach 20-30 goals.