[Rolaholic]

It’s been said in this thread already but praise for Martial is always tempered both by our fans and pundits. It’s weird that some find it so hard to give him credit.

Yea he never gets the benefit of the doubt from either and always has much less leeway for mistakes which contrasts quite a bit to the treatment many English players get in the press. Even when he's in form you always hear reserved praise with the ever present caveat of 'well they still need a world class striker capable of scoring 25+ goals' (as if there's an abundance of those)

I doubt it'd be the case if he was Anthony Marshall from Salford but I digress

Just annoying seeing the blatant double standards and people repeating the same tired narratives from years ago

 

[Santoryo]

Yea he never gets the benefit of the doubt from either and always has much less leeway for mistakes which contrasts quite a bit to the treatment many English players get in the press. Even when he's in form you always hear reserved praise with the ever present caveat of 'well they still need a world class striker capable of scoring 25+ goals' (as if there's an abundance of those)

I doubt it'd be the case if he was Anthony Marshall from Salford but I digress

Just annoying seeing the blatant double standards and people repeating the same tired narratives from years ago

My favorite backhand compliment from pundit is their lazy "He did well this game but doesn't do it consistently. United still need a striker, someone like Kane in" or "He's an enigma, do it from time to time but just doesn't do it consistently enough" , another one is "He's disinterested, he looks like he doesn't want it enough(this is a criticism that was thrown at him straight after he scored his hattrick)". Meanwhile since the start of 2020 no player has scored more goals in the PL than Martial. He's scored in 4 consecutive home games and scored against both Chelsea and City in that run. Yet the narrative is still and always about how inconsistent he's been.

These lazy pundits don't do any research, they just rehash a narrative over and over and unfortunately your casual viewers(Loads of Caftards in there) just gobble that nonsense up and it becomes gospel to them.

 

[MikeKing]

When it's all said and done, he'll have the respect of everyone if he continues like this. All that needs to change is the success of the team for him to get people to take notice. The same way Salah was a flop, right up until he wasn't and now he is remembered as a class player even if he doesn't do very well consistently. If Martial scores an important goal in a final or contributes to a trophy, then pundits and the likes will come around.

He is a fantastic talent, and his application and hunger for the game isn't in doubt at all for me anymore. It's clear he wants to be a great player, not just a good one and he has the talent to become great. Ole clearly knows how to motivate him and make him happy.

 

[Strelok]

Martial has almost played as a false nine and Greenwood and Rashford find themselves in the box almost as much as him.

Inside forward or winger it's just how we want to call him. Surely the trio of Rashford, Martial, Greenwood interchange positions a lot but still Martial is the one who stay the most in the box. Rashford and Greenwood do make runs into the box but they don't tend to sit there when we have possesion, they were more lurking around. It's Martial who sit there. Out of the 4 last goals Martial has scored, 3 was typical of a box striker. Or the match against Spurs, he had like 3-4 shots in the box. If you look back at our matches in details, you'd see he usually has the best number of shots in the box.

I can't find any heat map or statistic data to back this but next time you watch a match pay attention to the position of Martial when we're in possession and we'll be back to this.

P/s: I found a site who generates pretty good heatmaps. For example here:
https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1...0-Manchester-United-Sheffield-United#heatmaps

You can see that Martial was in the box a lot compared to Rashford who mainly operated on the left. Of course one match says nothing but I can't find a summary. You have go through all the matches to see. Or at least 3-4 latest matches where we had the full trio. I picked the Sheffield one because it's the match we were really dominant and imo our trio were playing pretty much to the attacking plan they're supposed to. If you look at the heatmaps of Greenwood you'd definitely be surprised how little his presence in the box was.

 

[KennyBurner]

I think most pundits see United as big club who deserve to be winning the premier league often. They grew up at a time when Fergie was dominating and have high expectations of United.This is in contrast to many United fans who see United as lucky to be in top 4 nowadays and have developed this fan boy attitude towards certain players whether it's Rashford, Martial, Lingard, Pogba e.t.c. Whilst I don't agree with spending stupid money on Harry Kane, the pundits are correct to expect us to have a better attack. Currently I would say Greenwood has that profile of a United forward he is consistent and accurate but he is a young kid that must not have that pressure on him right now. Rashford and Martial are good but they are not Aguerro and Harry Kane which is what you expect from a Manchester United forward.

Greenwood has come in at a time when we have our best players available. He wouldnt this consistent in a team with lingard pulling the strings. Rashford and martial are proving to be just as good as Kane and aguero this season.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

If Martial was playing for Marseille, Ajax, or Leverkusen doing what he’s doing right now, he’d be rated as an £80 million player and there would be a 100 page muppet thread full of Caf members salivating over him.

So strange how fickle football fans are.

 

[Santoryo]

Inside forward or winger it's just how we want to call him. Surely the trio of Rashford, Martial, Greenwood interchange positions a lot but still Martial is the one who stay the most in the box. Rashford and Greenwood do make runs into the box but they don't tend to sit there when we have possesion, they were more lurking around. It's Martial who sit there. Out of the 4 last goals Martial has scored, 3 was typical of a box striker. Or the match against Spurs, he had like 3-4 shots in the box. If you look back at our matches in details, you'd see he usually has the best number of shots in the box.

I can't find any heat map or statistic data to back this but next time you watch a match pay attention to the position of Martial when we're in possession and we'll be back to this.

P/s: I found a site who generates pretty good heatmaps. For example here:
https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1...0-Manchester-United-Sheffield-United#heatmaps

You can see that Martial was in the box a lot compared to Rashford who mainly operated on the left. Of course one match says nothing but I can't find a summary. You have go through all the matches to see. Or at least 3-4 latest matches. I picked the Sheffiled one because it's the match we were really dominant and imo our strikers were playing pretty much to the attacking plan they're supposed to. If you look at the heatmaps of Greenwood you'd definitely surprised how little his presence in the box was.

Martial doesn't sit around inside the box when we have possession. Of course when we build all the way up he ends up finding himself into the box ( so do our inside forwards), but normally when the play is being built Martial drops deep to join the build up. He doesn't reside and probe inside the box like traditional strikers.

The goals against Sheffield were scored inside the box because the play had developed further up the pitch, so of course he'd be in the box but so did Rashford and Greenwood. Both the first and second goal Martial was inside the box alongside Bruno, Rashford and Mason thus further proving my point that they all find themselves inside the box almost as often as each other.

You mentioned the Spurs game that Martial had chances inside the box, so did Rashford. Again proving my point. Greenwood also almost buried a chance inside the box in that game.

Rashford and Greenwood are inside forward and find themselves in the box every chance they get hence why they scoring loads of goals. Greenwood first goal against Bournemouth, Bruno found him centrally on the edge of the box and he scored from inside there. Almost similar scenario for his second goal where Matic pass found him centrally just by the edge of the box and ran it inside and took his shot. Heck it feels like Greenwood had more touches in the box that game than Martial. The latter had to drift left to find any joy.

 

[InfiniteBoredom]

People don’t realize how utterly dependent we are on his output. Or they subconsciously do, hence the often levied but erroneous accusation of inconsistency against him.

I just did a quick check, in 12/13, when RvP scored 26 league goals, he didn’t score in 17 league matches, of those matches, we won 11, drew 1 and lost 5.

This season, Martial has played 27 league games, missed 6, and didn’t score in 15, his longest goalless streak was 5, same as RvP 12/13. Of the match he missed of didn’t score, we lost a whopping 8 times and drew 7. Literally relegation form.

This is not to say he shouldn’t or couldn’t have done better, but his inconsistency has always been blown out of proportion and only ever a talking point because of how bad we were as a team without his contribution.

 

[Strelok]

Martial doesn't sit around in the box when we have possession. Of course when we build all the way up he ends up finding himself into the box ( so are our inside forwards), but normally when the play is being built Marti drops deep to join the build up. He doesn't reside and probe inside the box like traditional strikers.

The goals against Sheffield were scored inside the box because the play had developed further up the pitch, so of course he'd be in the box but so did Rashford and Greenwood. Both the first and second goal Martial was inside the box alongside Bruno, Rashford and Mason thus further proving my point that they all find themselves inside the box almost as often as each other.

You mentioned the Spurs game that Martial had chances inside the box, so did Rashford. Again proving my point. Greenwood also almost buried a chance inside the box in that game.

Rashford and Greenwood are inside forward and find themselves in the box every chance they get hence why they scoring loads of goals. Greenwood first goal against Bournemouth, Bruno found him centrally on the edge of the box and he scored from inside there. Almost similar scenario for his second goal where Matic pass found him centrally just by the edge of the box and ran it inside and took his shot. Heck it feels like Greenwood had more touches in the box that game than Martial. The latter had to drift left to find some joy.

All the points you've made are moments. And basically goals only. We're discussing the amount of time our trio were in the box. To have the best picture of that we need statistics, not moments. If you look at the heatmaps I've posted you'd definitely see that Martial sit the most in the box, then Rashford and Greenwood the least.

P/s: you also forget that out of three goals Martial scored in the Sheffield match, two were assisted by Rashford. He's in the box but not in positions to shoot, rather in positions to assist Martial.

 

[Sayros]

Funny, I went from reading the last few posts on pundits and commentaries about Martial from the media, and youtube was spying on me. Thought this video was pretty apropos.

 

[Raven]

Funny, I went from reading the last few posts on pundits and commentaries about Martial from the media, and youtube was spying on me. Thought this video was pretty apropos.

Really well put together video, gave me chills. Wish they had the "Oh YES!" Commentary for the debut goal though.

 

[lenny_1248]

Martial doesn't sit around inside the box when we have possession. Of course when we build all the way up he ends up finding himself into the box ( so do our inside forwards), but normally when the play is being built Martial drops deep to join the build up. He doesn't reside and probe inside the box like traditional strikers.

The goals against Sheffield were scored inside the box because the play had developed further up the pitch, so of course he'd be in the box but so did Rashford and Greenwood. Both the first and second goal Martial was inside the box alongside Bruno, Rashford and Mason thus further proving my point that they all find themselves inside the box almost as often as each other.

You mentioned the Spurs game that Martial had chances inside the box, so did Rashford. Again proving my point. Greenwood also almost buried a chance inside the box in that game.

Rashford and Greenwood are inside forward and find themselves in the box every chance they get hence why they scoring loads of goals. Greenwood first goal against Bournemouth, Bruno found him centrally on the edge of the box and he scored from inside there. Almost similar scenario for his second goal where Matic pass found him centrally just by the edge of the box and ran it inside and took his shot. Heck it feels like Greenwood had more touches in the box that game than Martial. The latter had to drift left to find any joy.

Yeah, and Martial is not scoring anything.
He literally scored 5/6 goals more than Rashford from open play.

 

[Sayros]

Really well put together video, gave me chills. Wish they had the "Oh YES!" Commentary for the debut goal though.

Yes! That was the one tiny negative I felt watching it, how could you not use that sound clip?!

 

[E-mal]

People talk about alot of Martial moments but playing Everton in the semifinal of the fa cup and the last minute goal remains my second most memorable moment of his last 5years. Of course nothing comes close to scoring against the scousers on your debut.

 

[Rolaholic]

People talk about alot of Martial moments but playing Everton in the semifinal of the fa cup and the last minute goal remains my second most memorable moment of his last 5years. Of course nothing comes close to scoring against the scousers on your debut.

The people who always rail against his demeanor/disposition always forget that moment


I hadn't screamed that much watching a United match since RVP's 3rd goal against Villa to clinch number 20

 

[roonster09]

Funny, I went from reading the last few posts on pundits and commentaries about Martial from the media, and youtube was spying on me. Thought this video was pretty apropos.

Fantastic video, Neville words are inspiring tbh.

 

[Raven]

Yes! That was the one tiny negative I felt watching it, how could you not use that sound clip?!

Love football videos that keep the commentary rather than adding some shite trap song or some such.

 

[Lj82]

I heard one slightly worrying comment from a pundit today. They suggested that Martial might be one of those players who thrive without the pressure of playing in front of thousands. He certainly looks like he’s playing with a weight off his shoulders. And it’s definitely a thing that some players look great in training but not so good under the spotlight. Thoughts?

His good form came before lock down. I am not concerned about his ability to handle pressure. As a 19 year old from France making his debut in England in one of the most famous derby in the world, with a 50 million price tag, he showed no hints of here when he scored THAT debut goal.

 

[ValenciasDrilledCrosses]

Would love another classic striker's goal against Villa ala Sheffield United, hopefully he gets the service. The worldies are great but there's just something about an aggressive near post-run, or a cross across the 6-yard box for a tap-in that gets me going

 

[Lj82]

When it's all said and done, he'll have the respect of everyone if he continues like this. All that needs to change is the success of the team for him to get people to take notice. The same way Salah was a flop, right up until he wasn't and now he is remembered as a class player even if he doesn't do very well consistently. If Martial scores an important goal in a final or contributes to a trophy, then pundits and the likes will come around.

He is a fantastic talent, and his application and hunger for the game isn't in doubt at all for me anymore. It's clear he wants to be a great player, not just a good one and he has the talent to become great. Ole clearly knows how to motivate him and make him happy.

He scored a very important goal in the FA Cup semi final in his first season to drag us to the final. Unfortunately most people won't remember that

 

[RedCurry]

I heard one slightly worrying comment from a pundit today. They suggested that Martial might be one of those players who thrive without the pressure of playing in front of thousands. He certainly looks like he’s playing with a weight off his shoulders. And it’s definitely a thing that some players look great in training but not so good under the spotlight. Thoughts?

I have had that fear about our entire team, Pogba especially. We’ll see how it pans out next season. On the optimistic side, if they all finish the season playing like this, these players may finally realize what they are capable of.

 

[InfiniteBoredom]

He scored a very important goal in the FA Cup semi final in his first season to drag us to the final. Unfortunately most people won't remember that

And both goals in the final match day when we needed to beat West Ham to qualify for CL, too bad the rest of the team shat themselves.

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

The people who always rail against his demeanor/disposition always forget that moment


I hadn't screamed that much watching a United match since RVP's 3rd goal against Villa to clinch number 20

This game felt more like a final than the actual final.

 

[jamesjimmybyrondean]

The people who always rail against his demeanor/disposition always forget that moment


I hadn't screamed that much watching a United match since RVP's 3rd goal against Villa to clinch number 20

So clinical. His link up play had always been one of his best attributes

 

[RedTiger]

Funny, I went from reading the last few posts on pundits and commentaries about Martial from the media, and youtube was spying on me. Thought this video was pretty apropos.

That was a quality video.

 

[TheGodsInRed]

His finishing has always been class, but his movement was my main critism, and that seems to have improved greatly in 2020. I think Bruno has really helped with this, as he is able to pick him out and they are linking really well. I read Igahlo is helping him in training with his positioning too.

It's just a shame he wasted a couple of years progress under Mourinho where he literally learnt nothing. We will see the same from Harry Kane now, who is going to struggle if he isn't able to escape Spurs.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

Miss Herrera and Martial running through defenses.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

So clinical. His link up play had always been one of his best attributes

Oh yes, he's like a semi-playmaker from the Left Wing.
He have football intelligence clearly when he's on the ball.

I miss seeing that considering his newer disciplined role.

Wish he were actually playing false striker, but the CF role basically is helping to improve his overall game so not much complaints from me.
Hopefully in the future he'll have maybe a kind of dual roles or freer role.

 

[#07]

Martial really impressed me at Villa. He did all the dirty work you need your centre forward to do: Occupied defenders, scrapped for 50/50s, held up the ball when pressured. His role in our second goal was a textbook example of strong centre forward play. That aggression, that fight and bite, Wayne Rooney would've been proud of that. Martial has always had the flicks and tricks, thrills and skills but this season he's added that ugly stuff you need from your #9. Really pleased to see him prove me, and others who doubted he could be a proper striker, so very wrong.

 

[lenny_1248]

Personally believe he was MOTM today.

 

[El-Manos]

Delighted we have him. He’s getting better.

 

[Raven]

Martial really impressed me at Villa. He did all the dirty work you need your centre forward to do: Occupied defenders, scrapped for 50/50s, held up the ball when pressured. His role in our second goal was a textbook example of strong centre forward play. That aggression, that fight and bite, Wayne Rooney would've been proud of that. Martial has always had the flicks and tricks, thrills and skills but this season he's added that ugly stuff you need from your #9. Really pleased to see him prove me, and others who doubted he could be a proper striker, so very wrong.

Good post, he was gritty this evening. Disgusted to come off without a goal as well, which I love to see.

 

[el3mel]

Amazing performance despite not scoring. Played a great role in the second goal and was always a nuisance to their defense.

This period must be his best ever for us. Much better than his first season as well by a long margin.

 

[Volumiza]

Can’t find fault with his performance tonight even if he didn’t score! More of this please Tony!

 

[TrustInJanuzaj]

I thought he was really good and showed yet again that he is growing into the Striker role. So unlucky not to score when he hit the bar and post and it's also nice to see that anger about being brought off. Ruud used to only care about his own individual goal tally which is just what you want as your striker. Much more to come from our Tony I believe.

 

[TheNewEra]

Hoping he gets a goal the next game he deserves one

 

[Volumiza]

period must be his best ever for us. Much better than his first season as well by a long margin.

Agreed! Played really well tonight ... and he tackled someone

 

[BlahRules]

Martial game play is amazing. Does so much and I hope this myth that he is lazy is gone now.

 

[Yagami]

His effort that hit the woodwork was the spits of his goal against Wolves. So much power on his weaker foot.

His defensive work was brilliant tonight.

 

[Rozay]

Some performance that was.