Antony

RedRonaldo

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I can't see us signing a RW this summer, and even if we do, I can't see us going after this guy.

Lets be realistic for a second. We have Amad, Pellistri, Elanga and (Greenwood) in that position already. None of these above are likely to leave, and all are only a year or two younger than Antony.
Also RW is way down on the priority list for this summer market.

I think it is more likely we will chase a hybrid ST/ wide forward type of player (Nunez & Richarlison come to mind) than a dedicated RW.

I hope I am wrong.
I think you are wrong.

Greenwood - no chance we will play him again, even if he doesn’t end up in jail, playing him would seriously tarnish reputation of this club and anger our sponsors.

Elanga - not talent enough to play as starting 11 under ETH, can do as back up though

Pellistri - still far from first team level

Amad - physically not quite up to this league, although he seems to have talent to make it here one day

So we are only left with these players for our front 3:

Key starter: Ronaldo, Sancho

out of form/misfit: Rashford/Martial

Backup: Elanga, Garnacho, Diallo

We definitely need another starter, and perhaps better off selling one of Rashford/Martial.
 

sglowrider

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I would say if we are to make only two signings I will make Rice / Tchouameni and Raphinha / Antony
We will need someone at the tip of the spear. Ronnie cant play every match unless we have no European obligations, which I hope we dont.
 

sglowrider

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I think you are wrong.

Greenwood - no chance we will play him again, even if he doesn’t end up in jail, playing him would seriously tarnish reputation of this club and our sponsors.

Elanga - not talent enough to play as starting 11 under ETH, can do as back up though

Pellistri - still far from first team level

Amad - physically not quite up to this league, although he seems to have talent to make it here one day

So we are only left with:

Key starter: Sancho

out of form/misfit: Rashford/Martial

Backup: Elanga, Garnacho, Diallo

We definitely need another starter, and perhaps better off selling one of Rashford/Martial, or both.
ETH is a systems guy. He needs to get those players to play in the system and their flaws and deficiency are less prominent. How many of the Ajax team would get into the current United line-up? 2 maybe?
So its too early to rule out any of the Amads of the world.
 

RedRonaldo

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I think we will see a different Rashford when he has a proper actual pre-season. He should have got his surgery earlier instead of trying to play for the NT.
I’ve grown tired of hearing the surgery excuse. Has been going for too long really.

I personally think he would never make it under ETH. His football simply doesn’t suit the style we are going play.
 

RedRonaldo

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ETH is a systems guy. He needs to get those players to play in the system and their flaws and deficiency are less prominent. How many of the Ajax team would get into the current United line-up? 2 maybe?
So its too early to rule out any of the Amads of the world.
I am not ruling him out yet, he is in my backup list. But he is really physically too weak for this league, so we will have to see.
 

Adnan

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He's a fantastic player who works very hard for the team. His defensive contributions for Ajax, both in the Eredivisie and the Champions league are very good.

And then you also have his technical qualities, which are on a elite level already. His touch and technique is a joy to behold, and I don't believe anyone in our team is a match for him in that regard. His skill level in confined spaces is at times absolutely ridiculous (in a good way). He still needs to improve in some facets to become more effective as a player. But he's already a accomplished player at first team level being just 22 years of age, with champions league experience.

I said before we signed Memphis Depay that I had doubts about his ability, but I don't have doubts about Antony. Antony is a more talented player imo.

People have also said that they wouldn't want to see ten Hag raid his former team Ajax for players because Guardiola didn't do similar when he joined City. But the reason for that is very simple, and that is that his former clubs Barca and Bayern are bigger than City, and it would've been a step down for their (Barca/Bayern) players at the time to join City.

I think there's three players at Ajax who look very interesting and I hope we sign two. And those three players are Timber, Mazraoui and Antony. Bayern have probably almost sealed the Mazraoui signing, and if that is the case, then we should sign both Antony and Timber imo.
 

sglowrider

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I’ve grown tired of hearing the surgery excuse. Has been going for too long really.

I personally think he would never make it under ETH. His football simply doesn’t suit the style we are going play.
If you ask any pro player, pre-season is critical.
 

RedRonaldo

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If you ask any pro player, pre-season is critical.
Look I have been watching football for over 2 decades, I can easily tell the difference of players having lack of pre-seasons or just general shite at football, or not suit to particular style of play.

Look, a lot of international players at City /Liverpool didn’t have full preseasons after Euro final. They still did great this season didn’t they. Besides, its COVID period with jam schedule, a hell lot of players didn’t have proper pre seasons too, but they mostly did fine didn’t they.

Rashford shouldn’t be the only exception. He has been totally shit and clueless for a year and half already. So, spare me with those lame pre-season excuses, I’ve heard enough of it.
 

SAFMUTD

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I can't see us signing a RW this summer, and even if we do, I can't see us going after this guy.

Lets be realistic for a second. We have Amad, Pellistri, Elanga and (Greenwood) in that position already. None of these above are likely to leave, and all are only a year or two younger than Antony.
Also RW is way down on the priority list for this summer market.

I think it is more likely we will chase a hybrid ST/ wide forward type of player (Nunez & Richarlison come to mind) than a dedicated RW.

I hope I am wrong.
Elanga, although is a hard working player, is not good enough. Greenwood won't play football at top level again, Pellistri is not even good enough to get minutes for a relegation team in Spain and Amad can't even get minutes in the Scottish league.

Besides CDM, RW is our most urgent position to fill out this summer.
 

ForeverRed1

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I can't see us signing a RW this summer, and even if we do, I can't see us going after this guy.

Lets be realistic for a second. We have Amad, Pellistri, Elanga and (Greenwood) in that position already. None of these above are likely to leave, and all are only a year or two younger than Antony.
Also RW is way down on the priority list for this summer market.

I think it is more likely we will chase a hybrid ST/ wide forward type of player (Nunez & Richarlison come to mind) than a dedicated RW.

I hope I am wrong.
Those players you mentioned are not even close to making us competitive. Do they compete with mane, Salah and Diaz? Because that’s what we’re chasing here. We won’t win anything with the players you just mentioned, not a chance.
 

Coops73

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Of all the players we’re linked with, especially through Ten Hag, he’s the one I would be the most excited about, not the most urgent of signings granted but he’s only 22 and just comes across as one of those really skilful players that United fans love.
 

flappyjay

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I think we will see a different Rashford when he has a proper actual pre-season. He should have got his surgery earlier instead of trying to play for the NT.
I have the same feeling too. Hopefully we see 20/21 Rashford next season.
 

sglowrider

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Those players you mentioned are not even close to making us competitive. Do they compete with mane, Salah and Diaz? Because that’s what we’re chasing here. We won’t win anything with the players you just mentioned, not a chance.
This you need to taper your expectations. This is as complete an overhaul as we will ever see in the past few decades. We are not going to compete against the likes of City or Liverpool any time soon. So its pointless to compare any new players or kids to the likes of current-day star players like Mane, Salah etc. They are at the peak of their careers.
ETH will bring in players who are young and will be off their peaks for another few years.

If anything you want to compare them to the Salah, Mane of similar age ie when they were in their teens or early 20s. Its unfair to compare any kid coming in to a peak Salah.
 
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Ten Hag taking the job tells me it’s likely he thinks a few non bank-breaking tweaks, such as Antony and Sancho as inverted wingers, a new DM and a full back, in his system, could make a World of difference.
 

Figgins

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He reminds me of Nani, he's an upgrade, i'm not sure there is enough end product. Will people get frustrated?
 

sullydnl

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Other than Raphinha, which actual RWers who will be available for around the same price as Antony would people want instead of him?
 

Luminous Lizard

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He reminds me of Nani, he's an upgrade, i'm not sure there is enough end product. Will people get frustrated?
If we had prime Nani now, the fans would love him as he’d be far and away our best player. We used to be much better so could afford to nit pick and moan more
 

sglowrider

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Look I have been watching football for over 2 decades, I can easily tell the difference of players having lack of pre-seasons or just general shite at football, or not suit to particular style of play.

Look, a lot of international players at City /Liverpool didn’t have full preseasons after Euro final. They still did great this season didn’t they. Besides, its COVID period with jam schedule, a hell lot of players didn’t have proper pre seasons too, but they mostly did fine didn’t they.

Rashford shouldn’t be the only exception. He has been totally shit and clueless for a year and half already. So, spare me with those lame pre-season excuses, I’ve heard enough of it.
Jaap stam
 

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We need a 25/30 goal a season CF along with wingers who will contribute 12/15 goals each per season.
This is a must if you want to top and win trophies. Don't know if Antony could do it in Premiership.
 

sglowrider

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Jaap stam is great. Your point?
:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Fergie thought that Stam wouldn't recover from his major surgery -- lost a lot of pace and mobility right after coming back. And he later admitted in his book that he sold him pre-maturely. Stam went on to have a fantastic career after leaving United. Pace and mobility all came back.
 

ForeverRed1

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This you need to taper your expectations. This is as complete an overhaul as we will ever see in the past few decades. We are not going to compete against the likes of City or Liverpool any time soon. So its pointless to compare any new players or kids to the likes of current-day star players like Mane, Salah etc. They are at the peak of their careers.
ETH will bring in players who are young and will be off their peaks for another few years.

If anything you want to compare them to the Salah, Mane of similar age ie when they were in their teens or early 20s. Its unfair to compare any kid coming in to a peak Salah.
No but saying don’t sign players because we have pellistri and amad isn’t going to make us anywhere where we need to be. I’m not saying don’t play youth or give them a chance; I’m saying we also need to sign quality players if we can and of course we won’t be anything near them in one transfer window but that has to be the level we get to over the next couple seasons to be competitive.
 

sglowrider

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No but saying don’t sign players because we have pellistri and amad isn’t going to make us anywhere where we need to be. I’m not saying don’t play youth or give them a chance; I’m saying we also need to sign quality players if we can.
Maybe they are quality? Like a Garner, they need to play more often.

If you want guaranteed quality then we buy players in their 24-26 range. But then they will obstruct any paths for our academy kids. We can't have it both ways.
Thats the balancing act a manager has to do.
 

MvG

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Other than Raphinha, which actual RWers who will be available for around the same price as Antony would people want instead of him?
Nkunku. Probably cheaper and much more versatile to boot.

I think Raphinha will disappoint at a big club.
 

sullydnl

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Nkunku. Probably cheaper and much more versatile to boot.

I think Raphinha will disappoint at a big club.
Is "much more versatile" a nice way of saying that like Sancho RW clearly isn't his best position but we should ignore that and sign him to play there regardless? Or is he is the actual RWer we need who will be at his best at RW but can also play elsewhere when needed?

Because my controversial take is that we should sign someone who is best played at RW to play at RW.
 

flappyjay

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20/21 Rashford was still a big problem. Sure he was still scoring goals, but he was already very lazy and his general play was poor.

We have to go back to 19/20 for him actually to be playing well.
I meant to say 19/20 when he, Greenwood and Martial gave us all that false hope. If he can recaptured that form he would save us millions.
 

flappyjay

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Is "much more versatile" a nice way of saying that like Sancho RW clearly isn't his best position but we should ignore that and sign him to play there regardless? Or is he is the actual RWer we need who will be at his best at RW but can also play elsewhere when needed?

Because my controversial take is that we should sign someone who is best played at RW to play at RW.
My feelings too, Antony and Raphinha are not at his levels but they are specialists at rw. We should concentrate more on how players fit our team and our system no point in getting a good player and playing him in a position he is not entirely comfortable in.
 

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I meant to say 19/20 when he, Greenwood and Martial gave us all that false hope. If he can recaptured that form he would save us millions.
Agreed. As bad as Rashford has been the last two seasons and as annoying as it is that some people try to make out that he hasn't been that bad (moreso last season than this), I also find a lot of people seem to have gone to the opposite extreme and pretend he was never good enough.

Rashford in the period directly before his back injury was fantastic and looked like he was in the process of stepping up to world-class level. The period wasn't that long (only a couple of months) so there was definitely a chance he wouldn't have maintained it anyway, but for those months he was the main man in our attack and at times was dragging us to victory with bits of magic. I've almost lost hope that he can ever get back to that level, but there is a small voice in the back of my head hoping that maybe he might if given a season with proper coaching and system around him.
 

mikeyt

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Antony instantly improves us, I'm all for Amad, Pellistri etc and really hope they become starters for us but Antony does that immediately.

He'd be a great start to the ETH rebuild
 

MvG

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Is "much more versatile" a nice way of saying that like Sancho RW clearly isn't his best position but we should ignore that and sign him to play there regardless? Or is he is the actual RWer we need who will be at his best at RW but can also play elsewhere when needed?

Because my controversial take is that we should sign someone who is best played at RW to play at RW.
He’s a much better footballer right now who can play across the frontline. And much more gettable.

I would like for us to get Antony eventually as well. But to answer your original question, Nkunku makes much more sense this summer.
 

amolbhatia50k

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He's a fantastic player who works very hard for the team. His defensive contributions for Ajax, both in the Eredivisie and the Champions league are very good.

And then you also have his technical qualities, which are on a elite level already. His touch and technique is a joy to behold, and I don't believe anyone in our team is a match for him in that regard. His skill level in confined spaces is at times absolutely ridiculous (in a good way). He still needs to improve in some facets to become more effective as a player. But he's already a accomplished player at first team level being just 22 years of age, with champions league experience.

I said before we signed Memphis Depay that I had doubts about his ability, but I don't have doubts about Antony. Antony is a more talented player imo.

People have also said that they wouldn't want to see ten Hag raid his former team Ajax for players because Guardiola didn't do similar when he joined City. But the reason for that is very simple, and that is that his former clubs Barca and Bayern are bigger than City, and it would've been a step down for their (Barca/Bayern) players at the time to join City.

I think there's three players at Ajax who look very interesting and I hope we sign two. And those three players are Timber, Mazraoui and Antony. Bayern have probably almost sealed the Mazraoui signing, and if that is the case, then we should sign both Antony and Timber imo.
High praise.
 

RedRonaldo

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:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Fergie thought that Stam wouldn't recover from his major surgery -- lost a lot of pace and mobility right after coming back. And he later admitted in his book that he sold him pre-maturely. Stam went on to have a fantastic career after leaving United. Pace and mobility all came back.
:houllier::lol: That’s not the main reason and it’s totally irrelevant to Rashford case.

Of course Stam did just came back from injury before we sold him. But he has always been our most important defender, whereas he never had gone through 1.5 years of total shite football like Rashford did for us. The months before he was sold, he was the best CB in the league, and was in PL team of the year. Rashford is like the worst forward in the league, and many want him to be sold, so there you go with your shit comparison.

The thing is, at the time we sold Stam, it was a complete shock to everyone, no one could have foresee that. Of course in Fergie words he was sold for 3 main reasons:

- there are doubts in his injuries as he seems past his peak
- Lazio had made an offer we couldn’t refuse
- he was approaching 30 at that time, it’s good timing to cash in

So you have conveniently miss out the other 2 reasons to make your point here, while the 1st one is irrelevant. We don’t just think Rashford has past his peak because of injuries, we simply think he is shit and totally useless player for us now.

And for most of us fans here who had gone through that period, of course we all knew more than that.

It was Stam controversy autobiography which caused the fallout with Fergie and had triggered the sell, really. We all knew Fergie wouldn’t give 2nd chance to those who has challenged his authority and cross the line. Stam had did all that - it was his autobiography which implied Fergie of tapping him up from PSV, to which was highly controversial at that time - and those remarks has upset/anger Fergie to the point of no return. Stam was quickly sold after that.
 
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AngeloHenriquez

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I think you are wrong.

Greenwood - no chance we will play him again, even if he doesn’t end up in jail, playing him would seriously tarnish reputation of this club and anger our sponsors.

Elanga - not talent enough to play as starting 11 under ETH, can do as back up though

Pellistri - still far from first team level

Amad - physically not quite up to this league, although he seems to have talent to make it here one day

So we are only left with these players for our front 3:

Key starter: Ronaldo, Sancho

out of form/misfit: Rashford/Martial

Backup: Elanga, Garnacho, Diallo

We definitely need another starter, and perhaps better off selling one of Rashford/Martial.
Soon see what is happening there, the further arrest conditions of the bail expire Sunday where they will have to charge or drop charges.
 

RedRonaldo

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Soon see what is happening there, the further arrest conditions of the bail expire Sunday where they will have to charge or drop charges.
Let’s see. But I don’t think he had a career with us anymore, even if his charges are dropped. The images and recordings are far too much for anyone to take/forgive. If somehow the club let him started, I suspect our players would even refuse to play with him.
 

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Agreed. As bad as Rashford has been the last two seasons and as annoying as it is that some people try to make out that he hasn't been that bad (moreso last season than this), I also find a lot of people seem to have gone to the opposite extreme and pretend he was never good enough.

Rashford in the period directly before his back injury was fantastic and looked like he was in the process of stepping up to world-class level. The period wasn't that long (only a couple of months) so there was definitely a chance he wouldn't have maintained it anyway, but for those months he was the main man in our attack and at times was dragging us to victory with bits of magic. I've almost lost hope that he can ever get back to that level, but there is a small voice in the back of my head hoping that maybe he might if given a season with proper coaching and system around him.
I always find myself agreeing with your posts. Probably the most frustrating player for me of the last 5 years because of his overly vocal and frankly blinkered fans, and you know, somewhere, beyond all the PR and other shite that he could still be a much more effective player if he changed up his game to occasionally enable his teammates and put his body on the line a lot more but I think he’s too far gone the other way now. He’s got his money made. His legacy is the meals and his future are the powerful friends he’s made along the way. He’ll be given another contract here because he’s too valuable from a marketing/PR standpoint to let go free and I think he’ll mostly phone it in for another 3 years and head down the league or go abroad and have a mini resurgence but never anything like a 300k a week player again. His attitude looks all wrong and has done for ages. He’s become a celebrity who happens to also play football. I can see him being initially enthusiastic under any manager until it’s time to take responsibility for his waining drive and massive wage and he’ll throw anyone he can under the bus to make himself look like he still cares. It’s toxic.
 
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