Appointing Solskjaer was a mistake

[roonster09]

Well off course it's a bad appointment.

What our fans asked is unrealistic, in order to become well supported our manager should :

1. Plays attacking football (while noble sometimes these is in conflict with other factors)
2. Blood youth (seriously, gomez greenwood and chong aren't ready yet, as seen by the last time greenwood hits the pitch. Is it realistic to play them just for the sake of it?)
3. Wins (although many are claiming that it doesn't matter if we lose as long as they see progress)
4. Have class (it's easy to do in particular, but it's very hard to stay classy when you need to pump some authority towards troubled player. Our fans seems to think that all our player needs is just an arm on their shoulder)
5. Not being given proper clean slate.
6. There's always a section of fans not happy with anything. Buying youth = cheap options for the glazer, buying top players = not looking for the future, buying young player = lack of ambition, buying old player = short termist, happy with the board = glazer stooges, not happy with the board = toxic management.

we are really becoming a poisoned chalice

Good post. Point 3 is spot on, people say that but they will only see the progress when they see the results. You win, people do the reverse engineering and come up with how well we did, we lose (no matter how unlucky) people will start with "I don't see any change since Moyes time".

 

[b20times]

After the Chelsea match he said this is just the start.
The start of what I ask?
Don't care what anybody says but it isn't the utd way losing to a poor team such as crystal palace, the money been spent on the team and Roy Hodgson , yes Roy Hodgson and his team of misfits roll into town and go home with 3 points.
How long does a club going through a transitional period last exactly?

 

[johanovic]

If all those players are sold in january then there is no one to play. It his fault that he did not get new midfield players and also sold Herrera and Fellaini and did not replace them. He also gave new contracts to Young, Mat and Jones.

Correct me if I´m wrong but are those players playing or contribruting when playing? The point I was making is that the fact like most of us know that the quility of signings over the last 6 years has been dreadful. I think the signings made this summer will be good and I can see a clear way of how Ole wants his team to play. Say for example that this squad would play the games until January in the 4-2-3-1 system:
Gk: De Gea
Rb: Bissaka,Laird
RCB:Lindelof/Tuanzebe
LCB:Maquire
LB:Shaw/Williams/Young
CDM:Pogba
CDM:McTominey,Garner
AMR: James,Lingard
AMC: Gomes,Mata
AML: Rashford,Chong
Striker: Martial,Greenwood

I would say that Gomes offers something no other midfielder does in being good in thight spaces and seeing play quickly and perhaps he can bring a new dimension to our midfield play that is often slow and clumbersome. He´s hardly a worse choice than Lingard or Mata and give the boy a chance.

Tuanzebe for me is a interesting player and seems to be 3 choice at CB. Garner is a very impressive player and he clearly has the makings of a future United midfielder. Greenwood is a rare talent and a player that can use both feet to good affect.

Then add 2 to 4 really good signings to this group in the next 2 windows like for example Sancho,Kane(how long will he last at Spurs without titles),Longstaff,Maddison.
But keeping Sanchez, Fred, Matic,Rojo, Mata,Jones,Young,Darmian and perhaps a few others makes no sense as they clearly have no future at United.

 

[Gehrman]

Ed is the problem and has been for some years now, he does not back any managers he protects the wealth of the Glazers. And he knows Jack shit about football, had he backed Jose last summer he would have had Maguire for 20 million less. And Jose would probably still be manager. Having said that I was still happy to see Jose sacked as he had too many issues with players. But the fault lies with Woodward who is still making the major decisions at the club despite having taken us from being a great football team to being a joke. What is happening right now at United is the result of a guy who has no idea about football, Woodward. His position is not in danger even though he has no clue.

TBF Van Gaal was backed and Mourinho spent a lot money even if he didn't get all his wishes. Part of our whole disaster is that we have spent 800 mil on transfers since Fergie and barely a single one have worked out as a succes.

 

[johanovic]

TBF Van Gaal was backed and Mourinho spent a lot money even if he didn't get all his wishes. Part of our whole disaster is that we have spent 800 mil on transfers since Fergie and barely a single one have worked out as a succes.

Good point and clear for all that want to compare our signins over the last years to City,Liverpool and Dortmund,Juve,Bayern ....

 

[Gehrman]

Good point and clear for all that want to compare our signins over the last years to City,Liverpool and Dortmund,Juve,Bayern ....

It's really mind boggling to have spent 800 mil and you just look at our squad and so few are United level. Pogba our biggest star atm is sure to leave next summer so we are more or less back where we started. Sanchez looks off never made it here, Lukkaku gone although he was never Rooney or RVP level. Depay looked like pub player, Di Maria didn't want to be here, Sweinsteigger past it, Schnerderlin not good enough, Falcao injured etc.

 

[johanovic]

It's really mind boggling to have spent 800 mil and you just look at our squad and so few are United level. Pogba our biggest star atm is sure to leave next summer so we are more or less back where we started. Sanchez looks off never made it here, Lukkaku gone although he was never Rooney or RVP level. Depay looked like pub player, Di Maria didn't want to be here, Sweinsteigger past it, Schnerderlin not good enough, Falcao injured etc.

Agree with you and I think the last player we signed that can be defined as a huge success is Robin Van Persie. Pogba has all the talent needed but needs both to give more at certain times and have better players around him. Lindelof,Martial,Shaw are Ok signings and can get better but the rest of the signings up until this summer have been flops in my estimate. Compare the list off Man Utd signings on transfermarkt.com to the other top teams in Europe and it´s just plain to see what has happend.

But I belive Maguire,Bissaka and James will be good signings and Ole needs time to rebuild as there is no quick fix with this squad. Promote youth, get rid of the last of the deadwood and make 4 signings in the next 2 windows like Sancho,Kane,Longstaff and Maddison.

 

[Wolff]

Correct me if I´m wrong but are those players playing or contribruting when playing? The point I was making is that the fact like most of us know that the quility of signings over the last 6 years has been dreadful. I think the signings made this summer will be good and I can see a clear way of how Ole wants his team to play. Say for example that this squad would play the games until January in the 4-2-3-1 system:
Gk: De Gea
Rb: Bissaka,Laird
RCB:Lindelof/Tuanzebe
LCB:Maquire
LB:Shaw/Williams/Young
CDM:Pogba
CDM:McTominey,Garner
AMR: James,Lingard
AMC: Gomes,Mata
AML: Rashford,Chong
Striker: Martial,Greenwood

I would say that Gomes offers something no other midfielder does in being good in thight spaces and seeing play quickly and perhaps he can bring a new dimension to our midfield play that is often slow and clumbersome. He´s hardly a worse choice than Lingard or Mata and give the boy a chance.

Tuanzebe for me is a interesting player and seems to be 3 choice at CB. Garner is a very impressive player and he clearly has the makings of a future United midfielder. Greenwood is a rare talent and a player that can use both feet to good affect.

Then add 2 to 4 really good signings to this group in the next 2 windows like for example Sancho,Kane(how long will he last at Spurs without titles),Longstaff,Maddison.
But keeping Sanchez, Fred, Matic,Rojo, Mata,Jones,Young,Darmian and perhaps a few others makes no sense as they clearly have no future at United.

Very good post! You can see the direction, and you can see what is in the making here. And add a few additional players to that you suddenly have a team competing.

 

[Craig Ward]

After the Chelsea match he said this is just the start.
The start of what I ask?
Don't care what anybody says but it isn't the utd way losing to a poor team such as crystal palace, the money been spent on the team and Roy Hodgson , yes Roy Hodgson and his team of misfits roll into town and go home with 3 points.
How long does a club going through a transitional period last exactly?

Ole has had ONE transfer window.

If you cant see the long term plan under Ole and how he has made changes in the squad for the better then more fool you.

Ole has a squad that currently still has players from Fergie's days, along with signings from THREE previous managers. Do you think Ole can sell upwards of 10 players in 1 window and replace them all with world class players under Woodwards rule? This is not football manager.

What ole has done is sign 3 players, 2 of which immediately come into our starting x11 and the other a good prospect / squad rotation.

He has also limited game time for problematic players such as Young/Matic and sold some unwanted players.

Ole has also promoted youth and continues to deal with questions about Pogba's future on an hourly basis.

If you want to talk about transition, be realistic. A transitional period can only work, if you don't sack the manager after 1-2 seasons. That is unless the Club has a whole has a vision and the next manager somewhat follows the philoshpy of the club. We don't have a philosophy bat chuck absurd money at players who don't really wanna be here, whinge, watch results dwindle and fire - repeat with new manager/new ideas.

This is the first time in years I've felt I've understood what the club is at least TRYING to do.

Is losing at home to palace acceptable? Absolutely not. Neither is drawing away at Wolves.

At least have the decency to look at the bigger picture and actually back the club instead of constant critique.

Remember, Ole is trying to sort the shambles of Moyes, LVG and Jose. Ole still has no DOF and has to try and get Woodward to buy/sell to fit HIS system. Ole has an unbelievably tough job. There will be bad results, but the only way we move forward is by sticking to what he has started

 

[romufc]

Ole has had ONE transfer window.

If you cant see the long term plan under Ole and how he has made changes in the squad for the better then more fool you.

Ole has a squad that currently still has players from Fergie's days, along with signings from THREE previous managers. Do you think Ole can sell upwards of 10 players in 1 window and replace them all with world class players under Woodwards rule? This is not football manager.

It is all well and good saying he has had one transfer window but this squad isn't bad.

If you look at Lampard, he has had 0 transfer windows, and players from Jose, Conte, Sarri and youth.

But you can sell 4/5 players, we have managed to sell 1. Do not sugar coat this by saying it is not "football manager".

Pep has shown you can sell 4/5 players in one window.

 

[johanovic]

Ole has had ONE transfer window.

If you cant see the long term plan under Ole and how he has made changes in the squad for the better then more fool you.

Ole has a squad that currently still has players from Fergie's days, along with signings from THREE previous managers. Do you think Ole can sell upwards of 10 players in 1 window and replace them all with world class players under Woodwards rule? This is not football manager.

What ole has done is sign 3 players, 2 of which immediately come into our starting x11 and the other a good prospect / squad rotation.

He has also limited game time for problematic players such as Young/Matic and sold some unwanted players.

Ole has also promoted youth and continues to deal with questions about Pogba's future on an hourly basis.

If you want to talk about transition, be realistic. A transitional period can only work, if you don't sack the manager after 1-2 seasons. That is unless the Club has a whole has a vision and the next manager somewhat follows the philoshpy of the club. We don't have a philosophy bat chuck absurd money at players who don't really wanna be here, whinge, watch results dwindle and fire - repeat with new manager/new ideas.

This is the first time in years I've felt I've understood what the club is at least TRYING to do.

Is losing at home to palace acceptable? Absolutely not. Neither is drawing away at Wolves.

At least have the decency to look at the bigger picture and actually back the club instead of constant critique.

Remember, Ole is trying to sort the shambles of Moyes, LVG and Jose. Ole still has no DOF and has to try and get Woodward to buy/sell to fit HIS system. Ole has an unbelievably tough job. There will be bad results, but the only way we move forward is by sticking to what he has started

Agree with every word you say and perhaps some are missing the point that getting rid of Lukaku,Fellaini,Valencia,Herrara(would have kept him though) plus hopefully Sanches,Rojo,Darmian,Matic,Mata,Young,Jones in the coming transfer windows also put´s us in a strong position regarding ability to offer great contracts to the right players. The sad fact is that United were paying the highest wages for a squad last season and the thougt of that squad earning much more than the rest is just mind boggling.

 

[Enigma_87]

Agree with every word you say and perhaps some are missing the point that getting rid of Lukaku,Fellaini,Valencia,Herrara(would have kept him though) plus hopefully Sanches,Rojo,Darmian,Matic,Mata,Young,Jones in the coming transfer windows also put´s us in a strong position regarding ability to offer great contracts to the right players. The sad fact is that United were paying the highest wages for a squad last season and the thougt of that squad earning much more than the rest is just mind boggling.

It's naive to think that making a clean slate to the bare bones will solve all our problems and will somehow only buy quality players at right wages and all of them will work.

There's always scrapegoats and there will be always players/transfers that won't make it.

It's a transitional process of course but during that time you have to improve the overall quality of the squad - that's the whole point...

 

[romufc]

Big Mistake, his record in the PL speaks for itself.

He has not got the ruthlessness to be a top flight manager. He is too nice, he will need to get a ruthlessness if he has a chance to succeed.

 

[johanovic]

It's naive to think that making a clean slate to the bare bones will solve all our problems and will somehow only buy quality players at right wages and all of them will work.

There's always scrapegoats and there will be always players/transfers that won't make it.

It's a transitional process of course but during that time you have to improve the overall quality of the squad - that's the whole point...

Being navie I think sometimes you have to strip down a building and start over and that is the what Ole has started. For me this is the group we should use and then strengthen in the next transfer windows:
Gk: De Gea
Rb: Bissaka,Laird
RCB:Lindelof/Tuanzebe
LCB:Maquire
LB:Shaw/Williams/Young
CDM:Pogba
CDM:McTominey,Garner
AMR: James,Lingard
AMC: Gomes,Mata
AML: Rashford,Chong
Striker: Martial,Greenwood

Reported weekley salary cost of players sold and those I like to see sold:
Lukaku was on £200,000
Fellaini £100,000
Valencia £100,000
Herrara £75,000 but wanted a much better contract
Sanches £350,000
Fred £120,000
Rojo £80,000
Darmian £70,000
Matic £120,000
Mata £140,000
Young £110,000
Jones £50,000

Do you think any of those players that are left at the club will play a big part in a future United side? Really? But they sure are costing a lot without giving something back. Can we rebuild without getting rid of this salary cost? Is the plain fact of the matter not that we have sub standard players on contracts that make them difficult to sell?

 

[Craig Ward]

It is all well and good saying he has had one transfer window but this squad isn't bad.

If you look at Lampard, he has had 0 transfer windows, and players from Jose, Conte, Sarri and youth.

But you can sell 4/5 players, we have managed to sell 1. Do not sugar coat this by saying it is not "football manager".

Pep has shown you can sell 4/5 players in one window.

Chelsea have an Embargo - they have no choice. And bar 1 game they've looked pretty average. Not a good comparison.

Yes, you can sell 4/5. I'm not saying you cant. the point is, the entire squad needs work and its not a quick fix.

Whereas we have sold 1, its likely Darmian and Sanchez will leave. That's 3.

What Ole has also done is made Tuanzebe 3rd choice, Smalling/Jones/Rpjo aren't even in the squad. Matic/Young reduced to bench. May have sold 1, but other changes have been made to shake up the squad

 

[romufc]

Chelsea have an Embargo - they have no choice. And bar 1 game they've looked pretty average. Not a good comparison.

Yes, you can sell 4/5. I'm not saying you cant. the point is, the entire squad needs work and its not a quick fix.

Whereas we have sold 1, its likely Darmian and Sanchez will leave. That's 3.

What Ole has also done is made Tuanzebe 3rd choice, Smalling/Jones/Rpjo aren't even in the squad. Matic/Young reduced to bench. May have sold 1, but other changes have been made to shake up the squad

That is my point, Ole as the manager of the team has decided these players are not in my thinking. So why can't Ed Woodward get rid of them?

We had a chance to get rid of Rojo for £25m - that would have been very good business.

But the problem is we have a a good starting 11, other than that, nothing on the bench to change things up.

 

[johanovic]

Big Mistake, his record in the PL speaks for itself.

He has not got the ruthlessness to be a top flight manager. He is too nice, he will need to get a ruthlessness if he has a chance to succeed.

Was he not ruthless in getting rid of Fellaini straight away? Pushing Lukaku out the door? Pushing Smalling,Jones,Rojo out of the squad? I think you are underestimating OGS and he´s no pushover.

 

[Enigma_87]

Being navie I think sometimes you have to strip down a building and start over and that is the what Ole has started. For me this is the group we should use and then strengthen in the next transfer windows:
Gk: De Gea
Rb: Bissaka,Laird
RCB:Lindelof/Tuanzebe
LCB:Maquire
LB:Shaw/Williams/Young
CDM:Pogba
CDM:McTominey,Garner
AMR: James,Lingard
AMC: Gomes,Mata
AML: Rashford,Chong
Striker: Martial,Greenwood

Reported weekley salary cost of players sold and those I like to see sold:
Lukaku was on £200,000
Fellaini £100,000
Valencia £100,000
Herrara £75,000 but wanted a much better contract
Sanches £350,000
Fred £120,000
Rojo £80,000
Darmian £70,000
Matic £120,000
Mata £140,000
Young £110,000
Jones £50,000

Do you think any of those players that are left at the club will play a big part in a future United side? Really? But they sure are costing a lot without giving something back. Can we rebuild without getting rid of this salary cost? Is the plain fact of the matter not that we have sub standard players on contracts that make them difficult to sell?

My point is you release/sell not needed players and bring someone in their place. Then sell some more and bring some more. It's a continuous process, but you need a squad of 18-20 senior players that have at least 2-3 seasons under their belt and you can gradually introduce youth, new faces, etc..

It's a long season 50-60 games..

 

[romufc]

Was he not ruthless in getting rid of Fellaini straight away? Pushing Lukaku out the door? Pushing Smalling,Jones,Rojo out of the squad? I think you are underestimating OGS and he´s no pushover.

Maybe a bit of over reaction to the weekends result.

 

[johanovic]

My point is you release/sell not needed players and bring someone in their place. Then sell some more and bring some more. It's a continuous process, but you need a squad of 18-20 senior players that have at least 2-3 seasons under their belt and you can gradually introduce youth, new faces, etc..

It's a long season 50-60 games..

The next transfer window is not far away. If you look at the list of players I see as the squad until January and also include Romero,Smalling in that it´s 22 players. Say we manage to bring in the first 2 of the 4/5 quility players needed while continuing to get rid of the players not worth their place at United. Could it be that we would have a very strong squad on our hands and a squad with more promise than most others? Then in the summer finish of the signings needed and the clear out?

Imagine being a United manager and having a certain wage ceiling for your squad and then looking at this:
Lukaku was on £200,000
Sanches £350,000
Fred £120,000
Rojo £80,000
Darmian £70,000
Matic £120,000
Mata £140,000
Young £110,000
Jones £50,000

I think there will not be a huge line of clubs willing to pay these players what they are on at United but I would argue none of those are worthy of a place at United. But I belive we are heading in the right direction, I can see a clear pattern in how the team will play and I think the summer signings were good. So onwards and upwards.

 

[Enigma_87]

The next transfer window is not far away. If you look at the list of players I see as the squad until January and also include Romero,Smalling in that it´s 22 players. Say we manage to bring in the first 2 of the 4/5 quility players needed while continuing to get rid of the players not worth their place at United. Could it be that we would have a very strong squad on our hands and a squad with more promise than most others? Then in the summer finish of the signings needed and the clear out?

Imagine being a United manager and having a certain wage ceiling for your squad and then looking at this:
Lukaku was on £200,000
Sanches £350,000
Fred £120,000
Rojo £80,000
Darmian £70,000
Matic £120,000
Mata £140,000
Young £110,000
Jones £50,000

I think there will not be a huge line of clubs willing to pay these players what they are on at United but I would argue none of those are worthy of a place at United. But I belive we are heading in the right direction, I can see a clear pattern in how the team will play and I think the summer signings were good. So onwards and upwards.

The likes of Pogba, De Gea won't stay in the process if you strip it to bare bones. They already want away and imagine if we miss out on CL for two seasons in a row. Also you can't attract the very best without being around the top and providing CL football.

Even Fergie ended with quite a few duds at a time - Djembax2, Kleberson, Miller, Bellion, etc..

The important thing is to constantly improve the team. You will end up with unsuccessful buys here and there - it's normal and part of the process.

You need squad players and senior players. As I said you just need to move them on gradually.

 

[red_de_pologne]

Was he not ruthless in getting rid of Fellaini straight away? Pushing Lukaku out the door? Pushing Smalling,Jones,Rojo out of the squad? I think you are underestimating OGS and he´s no pushover.

He also is doing his best to push Sanchez out of this team

 

[johanovic]

He also is doing his best to push Sanchez out of this team

True and OGS has the rare ability to treat all people with respect and humility but at the same time is not afraid to face the facts and make the difficult choices needed to be made.

 

[Velvet Revolver]

Saw a stat somewhere if you compare the last 15 PL games and place teams based on that the PL table will have united at 11th, Palace at 4th , arsenal 3rd and spurs relegated. This does puts things into perspective. Ole is a fairly good manager but he needs time and patience to make things better at united

 

[Sky1981]

Saw a stat somewhere if you compare the last 15 PL games and place teams based on that the PL table will have united at 11th, Palace at 4th , arsenal 3rd and spurs relegated. This does puts things into perspective. Ole is a fairly good manager but he needs time and patience to make things better at united

How do you know he's a good manager? When 8 months onwards we're 11th from your own stats.

Mind you we want jose sacked for finishing 2nd

 

[johanovic]

The likes of Pogba, De Gea won't stay in the process if you strip it to bare bones. They already want away and imagine if we miss out on CL for two seasons in a row. Also you can't attract the very best without being around the top and providing CL football.

Even Fergie ended with quite a few duds at a time - Djembax2, Kleberson, Miller, Bellion, etc..

The important thing is to constantly improve the team. You will end up with unsuccessful buys here and there - it's normal and part of the process.

You need squad players and senior players. As I said you just need to move them on gradually.

This is the squad I think we should use until Christmas. Proably Fred,Matic will be there also.
Gk: De Gea,Romero
Rb: Bissaka,Dalot,Laird
RCB:Lindelof/Tuanzebe
LCB:Maquire/Smalling
LB:Shaw/Williams/Young
CDM:Pogba
CDM:McTominey,Garner
AMR: James,Lingard
AMC: Gomes,Mata
AML: Rashford,Chong
Striker: Martial,Greenwood

But ad to this group players like Sancho, Kai Havertz,Konate and we would look much stronger. Then go in for Harry Kane with a contract offer of around 350.000 next summer.

 

[Enigma_87]

This is the squad I think we should use until Christmas. Proably Fred,Matic will be there also.
Gk: De Gea,Romero
Rb: Bissaka,Dalot,Laird
RCB:Lindelof/Tuanzebe
LCB:Maquire/Smalling
LB:Shaw/Williams/Young
CDM:Pogba
CDM:McTominey,Garner
AMR: James,Lingard
AMC: Gomes,Mata
AML: Rashford,Chong
Striker: Martial,Greenwood

But ad to this group players like Sancho, Kai Havertz,Konate and we would look much stronger. Then go in for Harry Kane with a contract offer of around 350.000 next summer.

Pogba most likely won't be here next summer.

Top 4 is hardly guaranteed and Sancho just signed a big extension and won't move for a non CL team. Haverz is Bayern bond and Kane won't come here.

You will need to overhaul that midfield and is a massive rebuilding job next summer as well as you will need to bring in Pogba replacement, another(or two) DM/CM, RW and a ST.

Most likely we will need a backup LB as well.

You don't need to have 50m players in every position, you have to rely on rotational/squad players.

That doesn't mean you should stick with Smalling/Jones forever, just you need to move on players every 2-3 years if it doesn't work out just like other top teams.

Look at Barca and them moving on Coutinho, Gomes, Cillessen, Alcacer, Malcom, Suarez this very window.

Yet they brought in Griezmann, De Jong, Firpo, Neto and even want Neymar..

In other words you can't estimate our start players staying during that process and winning nothing or even not challenging for top honors. There aren't that many players that are loyal to a such extend nowadays.

 

[Velvet Revolver]

How do you know he's a good manager? When 8 months onwards we're 11th from your own stats.

Mind you we want jose sacked for finishing 2nd

He is a good manager, you can see the improvement he has done with this squad. We need him to be more than what he is and that's the fact. No one can change the fortunes of a team in 8 months. Even Pep needed a full year with 'unlimited funds' to get his team winning. ( no am not comparing ole to pep just giving you perspective)

Also You completely ignored the stats I posted, the CAF darling Poch with a much better squad has a worse record than ole in the last 15 games, so does that mean Poch is a fraud??

Jose was never a good fit for united, he was the only high profile manager available after LVG. it was more of his antics that caused us to want him gone.

 

[mad1max954]

Ole has had ONE transfer window.

If you cant see the long term plan under Ole and how he has made changes in the squad for the better then more fool you.

Ole has a squad that currently still has players from Fergie's days, along with signings from THREE previous managers. Do you think Ole can sell upwards of 10 players in 1 window and replace them all with world class players under Woodwards rule? This is not football manager.

What ole has done is sign 3 players, 2 of which immediately come into our starting x11 and the other a good prospect / squad rotation.

He has also limited game time for problematic players such as Young/Matic and sold some unwanted players.

Ole has also promoted youth and continues to deal with questions about Pogba's future on an hourly basis.

If you want to talk about transition, be realistic. A transitional period can only work, if you don't sack the manager after 1-2 seasons. That is unless the Club has a whole has a vision and the next manager somewhat follows the philoshpy of the club. We don't have a philosophy bat chuck absurd money at players who don't really wanna be here, whinge, watch results dwindle and fire - repeat with new manager/new ideas.

This is the first time in years I've felt I've understood what the club is at least TRYING to do.

Is losing at home to palace acceptable? Absolutely not. Neither is drawing away at Wolves.

At least have the decency to look at the bigger picture and actually back the club instead of constant critique.

Remember, Ole is trying to sort the shambles of Moyes, LVG and Jose. Ole still has no DOF and has to try and get Woodward to buy/sell to fit HIS system. Ole has an unbelievably tough job. There will be bad results, but the only way we move forward is by sticking to what he has started

Completely agree with this. If anyone is to blame its Woodward for not giving him the proper level of support in the transfer market. I refuse to believe Ole didnt want to add at least another midfielder and an attacker to replace Lukaku.

The squad is in pure transition and a lot of the players are not good enough. This isnt going to be fixed over night.

Sacking Ole wont fix anything!

That said, please dont start lingard in the next game!

 

[Hugh Jass]

Completely agree with this. If anyone is to blame its Woodward for not giving him the proper level of support in the transfer market. I refuse to believe Ole didnt want to add at least another midfielder and an attacker to replace Lukaku.

The squad is in pure transition and a lot of the players are not good enough. This isnt going to be fixed over night.

Sacking Ole wont fix anything!

That said, please dont start lingard in the next game!

This.

 

[StrettyEnder07]

To all the fans having a pop at Ole and demanding he is sacked, which I find absolutely ludicrous to be honest, can I ask what you would have done differently?

The day that Jose was sacked, if you had asked me what would you want from now (mid-late December 2018 to end of August 2019) from a new manager, I would have said:

Pick up the dressing room, get them enjoying their football again.
Play a more attractive style of football, as best you can with the squad at your disposal.
If possible, try and get back into the top 4 race and make a fight of it (as at the time we were a mile off).
In the summer, sort out that backline.
Give our exciting kids a chance.
Sort out the RW/DMC/RB/CB positions
Play with more energy, pace and a higher press.
Drop/sell as much deadwood as possible.

That personally is what I wanted from whoever the new man coming in was back in December. For me, Ole is pretty much doing everything I would have wanted him to try and do.

No way was I expecting us to be at the level of Liverpool/City this season, what I wanted was a side I could get behind, enjoy watching, that wanted to attack with pace, who wanted to press high and looked like they give a sh*t about the club, fight for the badge.

There are going to be defeats and poor performances along the way (Pep first year anyone, Klopp first 2 years).

Maguire, AWB look like solid class additions, James looks like a snip at 15M. I am happy to wait for a RW as long as we go all out for Sancho next summer (I know he has just signed a new deal but hear he has an agreement in place that he can leave next summer).

Smalling, Jones, Matic, Sanchez, Rojo, Darmian and Young look as though they are not first 11 and hopefully by the time next summer has ended they will all be gone.

The results and performances will come with time, my only issue is Lingard starting, personally would have Gomes being given a chance now but hopefully that will come.

People expecting a quick fix are being very narrow minded IMO, stick with it, bit of patience and get behind one of our own, he knows what we want and how we should be trying to play.

 

[pauldyson1uk]

To all the fans having a pop at Ole and demanding he is sacked, which I find absolutely ludicrous to be honest, can I ask what you would have done differently?

The day that Jose was sacked, if you had asked me what would you want from now (mid-late December 2018 to end of August 2019) from a new manager, I would have said:

Pick up the dressing room, get them enjoying their football again.
Play a more attractive style of football, as best you can with the squad at your disposal.
If possible, try and get back into the top 4 race and make a fight of it (as at the time we were a mile off).
In the summer, sort out that backline.
Give our exciting kids a chance.
Sort out the RW/DMC/RB/CB positions
Play with more energy, pace and a higher press.
Drop/sell as much deadwood as possible.

That personally is what I wanted from whoever the new man coming in was back in December. For me, Ole is pretty much doing everything I would have wanted him to try and do.

No way was I expecting us to be at the level of Liverpool/City this season, what I wanted was a side I could get behind, enjoy watching, that wanted to attack with pace, who wanted to press high and looked like they give a sh*t about the club, fight for the badge.

There are going to be defeats and poor performances along the way (Pep first year anyone, Klopp first 2 years).

Maguire, AWB look like solid class additions, James looks like a snip at 15M. I am happy to wait for a RW as long as we go all out for Sancho next summer (I know he has just signed a new deal but hear he has an agreement in place that he can leave next summer).

Smalling, Jones, Matic, Sanchez, Rojo, Darmian and Young look as though they are not first 11 and hopefully by the time next summer has ended they will all be gone.

The results and performances will come with time, my only issue is Lingard starting, personally would have Gomes being given a chance now but hopefully that will come.

People expecting a quick fix are being very narrow minded IMO, stick with it, bit of patience and get behind one of our own, he knows what we want and how we should be trying to play.

Nice post , agree with all of it.

 

[StrettyEnder07]

Nice post , agree with all of it.

Cheers bud, not gonna lie saturday was heartbreaking but can handle a few of them as long as we are on the right track finally

 

[The Brown Bull]

Appointing him was a mistake but I believe sacking him would also be a mistake.

 

[romufc]

People expecting a quick fix are being very narrow minded IMO, stick with it, bit of patience and get behind one of our own, he knows what we want and how we should be trying to play.

I want Ole to succeed and all but no one is expecting a quick fix on this however; losing to Cardiff at home and now Palace at home is not acceptable. I don't care how far behind we are behind Liverpool or City losing to these teams is not acceptable.

Just in case your response is "City lost to Palace as well", that was a shock result in City's season. We struggle to beat anyone these days.

It is frustrating to see when opponents get one chance they finish it and I watched Liverpool where the opponents get 4/5 chances and they fluff it and Liverpool end up winning 4-0 or 3-1.

How our luck has changed. I don't think it has to do with Ole, players missing penalties, can't take freekicks and we get punished by individual errors.

 

[Solius]

Some of the talk already is embarrassing. Yes it may not work out but Ole has had one transfer window where he wasn't fully backed and we've been unlucky in the two games we didn't win.

The Wolves game we were excellent in the first half and if Pogba puts away that pen everything seems great. The Palace game it's an individual error leading to a simple one-off goal and then we've been incredibly unlucky not to score the pen and also be given two others (also the Cahill red). Their winning goal was extremely fortunate.

 

[Enigma_87]

@StrettyEnder07

I think it has been discussed a lot but here it goes:

1. If he was to be appointed permanently on the merit of his initial appointment - CL qualification as a bare minimum last year - we finished 6th. When he took over we were 6th and ended that way.
2. Actual and definite style when approaching games. He started off with press then we ditched it. He started the current season with 4-2-3-1 with Lingard at #10 - enough said.
3. In game management close to the top managers in the game - late subs, man for man subs no real plan B.
4. Tactical flexibility when playing teams that defend deep or when facing top teams who take the initiative - we don't have plan B when things aren't going our way. Late LvG football at moments when we don't know what to do with the ball, naive mistakes especially in midfield.
5. Ease in young players, give them chance, but not put the whole responsibility on their shoulders - incredibly short first team which requires a lot from youngsters like James, Greenwood, Garner, Gomes who have had handful of appearances at top level. Overuse them and you can run them to the ground.
6. Create spine of the team - don't prioritize only the defence. You have to have at least 3 senior players (leaders) in each line. Lukaku was pushed out of the door and not replaced. Herrera was lost and not replaced.
7. Improve what we have in the team - I'm not sure I can pin point a single player whose form has drastically improved or a player that you can say Ole has improved single handedly.
8. Clean some of the deadwood - good start, but we still have Young, Mata on 3 year deal.
9. Lack of improving the basics - we still can't take set pieces and the penalty debacle was amateur level.
10. Brexit transfer strategy - there are ton of other and much cheaper continental options, yet we overlooked them (Woodward, scouting team of course will share the blame).
11. Going on the worst run we have seen since more than half a century - 3 wins in 15.
12. For this season top 4 is a bare minimum. Everything else should be considered a failure, especially when you consider us missing CL last year. Do that and we fall even more behind making the rebuild process even tougher with no top player wanting to join us.

 

[StrettyEnder07]

@StrettyEnder07

I think it has been discussed a lot but here it goes:

1. If he was to be appointed permanently on the merit of his initial appointment - CL qualification as a bare minimum last year - we finished 6th. When he took over we were 6th and ended that way.
2. Actual and definite style when approaching games. He started off with press then we ditched it. He started the current season with 4-2-3-1 with Lingard at #10 - enough said.
3. In game management close to the top managers in the game - late subs, man for man subs no real plan B.
4. Tactical flexibility when playing teams that defend deep or when facing top teams who take the initiative - we don't have plan B when things aren't going our way. Late LvG football at moments when we don't know what to do with the ball, naive mistakes especially in midfield.
5. Ease in young players, give them chance, but not put the whole responsibility on their shoulders - incredibly short first team which requires a lot from youngsters like James, Greenwood, Garner, Gomes who have had handful of appearances at top level. Overuse them and you can run them to the ground.
6. Create spine of the team - don't prioritize only the defence. You have to have at least 3 senior players (leaders) in each line. Lukaku was pushed out of the door and not replaced. Herrera was lost and not replaced.
7. Improve what we have in the team - I'm not sure I can pin point a single player whose form has drastically improved or a player that you can say Ole has improved single handedly.
8. Clean some of the deadwood - good start, but we still have Young, Mata on 3 year deal.
9. Lack of improving the basics - we still can't take set pieces and the penalty debacle was amateur level.
10. Brexit transfer strategy - there are ton of other and much cheaper continental options, yet we overlooked them (Woodward, scouting team of course will share the blame).
11. Not going on the worst run we have seen since more than half a decade - 3 wins in 15.
12. For this season top 4 is a bare minimum. Everything else should be considered a failure, especially when you consider us missing CL last year. Do that and we fall even more behind making the rebuild process even tougher with no top player wanting to join us.

Not gonna lie mate, absolutely dying of a cold and still dying from two days drinking before and after the game on Saturday in Manchester so will come back on all them tomorrow when my head is not pounding haha.

Not saying he has gotten everything right by any means but I am pretty sure a lot of the stuff you are saying about Ole, you could say about Poch as well (league they have been woeful, UCL very fortunate to make it through qtr & semi and didn't turn up in the final).

 

[StrettyEnder07]

I want Ole to succeed and all but no one is expecting a quick fix on this however; losing to Cardiff at home and now Palace at home is not acceptable. I don't care how far behind we are behind Liverpool or City losing to these teams is not acceptable.

Just in case your response is "City lost to Palace as well", that was a shock result in City's season. We struggle to beat anyone these days.

It is frustrating to see when opponents get one chance they finish it and I watched Liverpool where the opponents get 4/5 chances and they fluff it and Liverpool end up winning 4-0 or 3-1.

How our luck has changed. I don't think it has to do with Ole, players missing penalties, can't take freekicks and we get punished by individual errors.

Yeah I'm not one for "oh city lost to them so can take it on the chin", Cardiff last season was rock bottom that was horrendous, that cannot happen again.

Palace, we didn't play very well but as you say, they had two chances bang two goals, we missed a pen, should have arguably had another, lost a last min goal from a break away.

It will take time and the squad is a massive worry, Marital could be out on Sat and the squad is already looking very stretched.

No replacements for Rom/Herrera, is that Ole's fault or is it the board's fault.

Where the hell is this DOF ffs, driving me scatty

 

[Leftback99]

That is my point, Ole as the manager of the team has decided these players are not in my thinking. So why can't Ed Woodward get rid of them?

We had a chance to get rid of Rojo for £25m - that would have been very good business.

But the problem is we have a a good starting 11, other than that, nothing on the bench to change things up.

Rojo would almost certainly be gone if anyone had offered £25m for him. Probably even £10m.