Are the pundits being kinder to Ole than Jose?

Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by United Hobbit, Oct 10, 2019.

  1. Oct 10, 2019
    #1

    United Hobbit Full Member

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    Feel free to group into his dedicated thread if you feel more suitable

    I was listening to a podcast earlier and it raised a very interesting point that almost all the former United players are being very quick to support Ole potentially because they played with him however Jose (who did help contribute to his own downfall) they were very quick to slate

    I hadn't really noticed it and while I don't want people being vitriolic about it, do we feel he is getting a slightly easier ride than our previous managers have? The podcast (cant remember what one as listened to 2) said if you're going to hammer Jose dont have different standards for Ole just because he's your mate

    However is this also represented across the fan base for example the poll on here and people perhaps slightly looking at him through rose tinted glasses due to his standing from when he was a player

    I'm not calling for them to absolutely slate him, however could they perhaps look at him a bit more detached and analyse perhaps where it's gone wrong for him- its perhaps the same way Pogba gets hit harder than say Rashford though they did call Rashford out after the Newcastle game?

    I do feel some sympathy for Ole as he does love the club and wanted to help us and I also had silly "Disneyland" type dreams and visions of him coming in, integrating the kids and making progress, leading to trophies, however unfortunately it's now got to the point where he is compromising us and out of his depth so time to go- I still respect him as a player but even though we are so bad under him I felt dislike towards Moyes, Ole I feel is helpless and needs to go but I cant bring myself to dislike him
  2. Oct 10, 2019
    #2

    clarkydaz Full Member

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    Jose asked the world to hate him, seeing him fail was much overdue for many. Ole just appears out of his depth
  3. Oct 10, 2019
    #3

    MyOnlySolskjaer Creator of Player Performance threads

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    The pundits have high expectations of Mourinho, there are no standards for Ole.
  4. Oct 10, 2019
    #4

    Wednesday at Stoke Full Member

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    Ole has always been nice and generous to everyone with his time and demeanour, that kind of helps. Jose turned into a surly asshole every time things started going down hill for him.
  5. Oct 10, 2019
    #5

    432JuanMata Full Member

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    While I agree with this, I feel like the pundits should come out and say that Ole is out of his depth because he is.
  6. Oct 10, 2019
    #6

    R'hllor Full Member

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    Respect
  7. Oct 10, 2019
    #7

    adexkola Arsenal supporter

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    And why do you need pundits to come out and say Ole is out of his depth?
  8. Oct 10, 2019
    #8

    Bastian Full Member

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    Absolutely no question. They are all shouting that Ole inherited a shit squad whilst leaving out that Jose finished 2nd with said squad, before he decided to go into self-destruction. Now, I do think the squad is not fit for purpose, if said purpose is being seriously competitive, but it should definitely have no problems finishing top 6 and should at least compete for top 4.

    But there is a silver lining with all these ex United pundits who won't want to go after Ole, they focus on the main problem which is how the club is run. Some just go after the players, but I'm hearing "the board is the problem" more and more these weeks. Of course, they don't mention the owners but probably all of them are angling for a future position.
  9. Oct 10, 2019
    #9

    fergiesarmy1 Full Member

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    Neither Jose or LVG got crushed after 10 months - 2 of which were the off season

    Neither came in mid season to repair the disaster that was unfolding
  10. Oct 10, 2019
    #10

    Harry190 Full Member

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    Respect.
  11. Oct 10, 2019
    #11

    United Junkie New Member

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    Respect
  12. Oct 11, 2019
    #12

    Valuedrug New Member

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    Maybe the ex-players he was affiliated with in his playing days are holding back, but others sure aren't. Was listening to The Totally Football Show, and everyone there basically said we have the worst manager in the the league. By some distance.
  13. Oct 11, 2019
    #13

    DoomSlayer Full Member

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    Ole is a nice person, very communicative with pundits and journalists and mostly comes off as honest in his interviews and press conferences. I think people in general like him a lot more than Mourinho, so it's normal they won't be going for his neck straight away.

    Jose might have been a master tactician, but he was the biggest asshole possible when he was criticised or asked tough questions that might be damaging his reputation. No wonder barely anyone in the industry has a good opinion of him.
  14. Oct 11, 2019
    #14

    Infra-red Full Member

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    Ole is getting a much easier ride, but there are good reasons for that:

    1) Substantially lower expectations due to Solskjaer's relative lack of experience/ability.

    2) In the case of Neville, Keane, Scholes, Rio etc there is an obvious reluctance to throw a former team mate under the bus.

    3) Ole is not a cnut.

    Results and the overall standard of play have been far worse under Solskjaer than anything we've seen post-Ferguson, but Mourinho was practically begging for the sack from August 2018 onwards and therefore brought a lot of the criticism he received on himself.
  15. Oct 11, 2019
    #15

    Walters_19_MuFc Full Member

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    Jose had higher expectations because of his past, so if that is the case, then it's somewhat understandable.
  16. Oct 11, 2019
    #16

    Champagne Football Full Member

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    Kinder to Ole because the Ole way brings frustration and requires patience.

    The Jose way is to spend hundreds and hundreds of millions on ready-made overpaid stars, win a trophy or two, then get yourself fired in year 3 where at least you can say you won something along the way.

    The Ole way is far more complicated, is the correct way of doing things, so it commands more respect than the Jose way.
  17. Oct 11, 2019
    #17

    Raees Legal Guardian of the Football forums

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    Jose got away with it for ages from what I recall .. even after Sevilla he was still relatively blame free for a while. He successfully managed to make the players look far more to blame than he was but in truth all were not cut out for the task at hand. He was also manager for longer than Ole so Ole hasn’t really had that long a tenure for all the pundits to stick the knife in him.
  18. Oct 11, 2019
    #18

    red thru&thru Full Member

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    My take on this, putting the United pundits aside as they maybe biased, but other than Souness, all other pundits are focusing their attentions onto the board and structure. There is little point in talking about Ole as everyone knows he should never have got the job. He had no real qualifications to take such a job. But attention is rightly on the people who gave him the job.
  19. Oct 11, 2019
    #19

    SAFMUTD Full Member

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    Ole is the nice guy you feel sorry for, Mourinho is the cnut everyones waiting to fail so they can laugh at. Its clear the pundits are being kinder to Ole because they feel sorry for him, with Mourinho they know he's a winner so they know he can take the hits.
  20. Oct 11, 2019
    #20

    dev1l Full Member

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    Mourinho tends to be provocative..makes you want to hate him.
    Fergie used to do it a bit too...in order to create a siege mentality in the team on the lines of we have to work harder cause everyone s against us. He used that to motivate players
  21. Oct 11, 2019
    #21

    Buster15 Full Member

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    Apart from him being manager of Manchester United. That is the standard.
    Mourinho partially delivered by finishing 2nd.
    We will see what Ole can deliver.
  22. Oct 11, 2019
    #22

    ManUArfa Full Member

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    ....and Solskjaer has won it!
    The expectations are lower as this is seen as a rebuild following three failed managers and shambolic transfer dealings
  23. Oct 11, 2019
    #23

    SirAF Ageist

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    Yes.
  24. Oct 11, 2019
    #24

    Dwazza Gunnar Solskjær Lutefisk is it!

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    :lol: genuinely believe this is the correct answer
  25. Oct 11, 2019
    #25

    Sir Scott McToMinay New Member

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    I think pundits tend to be less critical of out of their depth failing managers, took a long long time until the Moyes bashing started in the media.
    Not to mention that some of them, were Solskjaer’s team mates, for years.
  26. Oct 12, 2019
    #26

    Foxbatt Full Member

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    I am sure that privately his former team mates would be worried about the situation at United. I am sure even SAF would be. Moyes thought he was a top class manager though he was not. He still believes it.
    I wonder when would Ole realise the jig is up?
  27. Oct 12, 2019
    #27

    Random Task Correctly predicted France to win World Cup 2018

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    You get the sense most pundits understand what Ole is trying to achieve and their expectations for the season were at a minimum. Ole also gave forewarning that he wasn't expecting United to be challenging so early in the rebuild.

    The fanbase, particularly the ones eager for success here and now, are not quite so understanding however.
  28. Oct 12, 2019
    #28

    Judge Red Don't Call Me Douglas

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    It’s says a lot when Roy Keane doesn’t have the heart to criticise you.
  29. Oct 12, 2019
    #29

    yumtum DUX' bumchum

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    Mourinho is a shark, Ole is a guppy.
  30. Oct 12, 2019
    #30

    Foxbatt Full Member

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    I do think they understand it very well that the chances of him succeeding is very slim. The excuses they come up with shows that. Honestly they beat around the bush and just cannot get them to say something against Ole because obviously he is a very nice guy and he won the CL for United and he was a good team mate.
  31. Oct 12, 2019
    #31

    RedDevil@84 Full Member

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    Yes of course. Jose is a man everyone loves to hate. He is loud mouth, and is good at pissing off people. His arrogance drives him.

    Ole is nothing like Jose.
  32. Oct 12, 2019
    #32

    Leftback99 Full Member

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    It should be obvious to any pundit worth their salt that this squad is nowhere near good enough especially with our injury situation. They don't look at the quality of our players with rose tinted glasses like our fans do.
  33. Oct 12, 2019
    #33

    MisterLupus Full Member

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    I'm starting to believe this club went from one extreme to another hiring Ole. You can't hate Ole even when he's losing - and Jose is hard to like even while winning everything there is. Mourinho is at times so assertive and arrogant his players loses the will to live and downs tools - Solskjaer is so gullible and optimistic he keeps investing his trust into players who's simply not good enough.

    It just proves that neither cynicism nor loyalty - pragmatism nor idealism - are sustainable when used in excess. Just hope Ole realizes this before he gets the axe - because if I see Mata or Fred fielded ever again and if he still haven't realized how dire our need for reinforcements up front are by January - I'll volunteer to swing it myself :lol:
  34. Oct 12, 2019
    #34

    Nevilles.Wear.Prada Full Member

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    I think Ole made more friends in the media and generally looks like one of them. I think many understood the poison chalice of the job that is manutd while Jose attitude just begs people to want to see him fail.
  35. Oct 12, 2019
    #35

    Eriku Full Member

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    He couldn’t overhaul the entire squad in one window, though.
  36. Oct 12, 2019
    #36

    Schneckerl Full Member

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    No doubt.

    Jose just has this toxic (sorry for this buzzword) attitude about him and a history with the media, while Ole looks to be just not very competent at his job.
  37. Oct 12, 2019
    #37

    Son New Member

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    I trusted Mourinho until he went a bit insane. He was also very very entertaining as our manager. Walking on the pitch in Turin, that was passion whether selfish or not!!! You can get behind that sort of guy and go to war with them.

    When someone like Mourinho came he really challenged some of our fans. We can’t hack sometimes that we aren’t the best club around. He pointed that out and our fans went wild at him. He was doing us a favour and putting pressure on the board though.

    Ole is a bit of a patsy. I find it hard to fully get behind him. He’s not a leader of men. You just kinda shrug your shoulders and wish him all the best.

    We have become a passive club for the time being which is hard to take. Big moves need to be made soon or else we’ll just remain mediocre.
  38. Oct 12, 2019
    #38

    MisterLupus Full Member

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    And the ones he did bring in have all improved us - but the reason he stated for not getting a couple midfielders and an attacker - wasn't that it couldn't be done but that the perfect candidates weren't available and also that he had confidence someone would step up. If the end of last season proved anything - it would be that this assessment - at best - should be described as "hopeful". Especially after Lukaku left because even though he may not have been the ideal professional or 100% fit for duty he was still our third largest contributor up front during that campaign.

    Also this isn't the first time Solskjaer does this. In Cardiff too he brought in a bunch of players he'd had good relations with in the past but who contributed nothing to his team whatsoever - who simply weren't cut for that level - and we all know how that ended. I believe the man has trust issues - only opposite of what's normal - as in he's got too much of it. He's too big a fan of his own squad and you just can't afford that luxury if you want to compete at the top.
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2019
  39. Oct 12, 2019
    #39

    Eriku Full Member

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    One of the big problems of this club is that we have a bunch of players who aren't up to the task or who aren't truly dedicated. Ole deemed it more important to sign the right players, rather than upping our wage bill with stop gaps which may prove hard to shift.

    And this isn't the first time Solskjaer does this? Which players has he brought to United that he'd had good relations with? That last paragraph of yours is hard to make sense of.
  40. Oct 12, 2019
    #40

    MisterLupus Full Member

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    Yes and that's what I'd describe as "excessive idealism" - because as you yourself point out - feck finding "the perfect one" pretty much any acquisition up front would be an upgrade to our current selection. That decision to not compromise and take a chance might very well be what ends up burying him. Also - this - in regards to my second paragraph: