So you are saying Amorim's responsible also for the games he is not in charge of? If they drop to 10th it's on Amorim and if they go to top 4 or whatever it's due to Fletcher's genius? I don't get it.
Are we now “the impossible job”?
- Thread starter IrwinwasbetterthanCarlos
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In the latest edition of the United Hour Podcast, Imran (@Annihilate Now!) & Jamie (@Vault Dweller) are here to discuss disappointed FA Cup exit at the hands of Brighton - confirming our shortest season in over 100 years. They also discuss the news that Michael Carrick is set to be United's manager until the end of the season.
Impossible job? It would just be nice if that board actually knew what they wanted and hired a manager to match.
I see posters saying all uniteds big trophies were won by 2 or 3 managers. Interestingly, the majority of madrids leagues and cls came under perez and bernebeu as presidents if memory serves me correctly.
Just reading how ETH is now a technical director and thought to deep look at our ex-managers post SAF.
Moyes:
Real Socidedad - Sacked
Sunderland - Relegated and resigned
West Ham (1) - short term stint to keep them up - left at the end of his contract
West Ham (2) - won the Conference League then left at the end of his contract
Everton - current manager
Giggs:
Wales - qualified for the Euros then stepped down due to his trial
LVG:
Retired
Netherlands: lost in the WC QF to Argentina
Retired
Mourinho:
Spurs - made the league cup final and sacked before
Roma - won the Conference League and sacked
Fenerbace - sacked after one season
Benfica - current manager
Ole:
Beskiktas - sacked after 8 months
Carrick:
Middlesbrough - sacked
Rangnick:
Austria - current manager; lost in R16 to Turkey at the Euros
Ten Hag:
Leverkusen - sacked after a couple of months
FC Twente - just appointed as a technical director
Ruud:
Leicester - relegated and left by mutual consent
Moyes:
Real Socidedad - Sacked
Sunderland - Relegated and resigned
West Ham (1) - short term stint to keep them up - left at the end of his contract
West Ham (2) - won the Conference League then left at the end of his contract
Everton - current manager
Giggs:
Wales - qualified for the Euros then stepped down due to his trial
LVG:
Retired
Netherlands: lost in the WC QF to Argentina
Retired
Mourinho:
Spurs - made the league cup final and sacked before
Roma - won the Conference League and sacked
Fenerbace - sacked after one season
Benfica - current manager
Ole:
Beskiktas - sacked after 8 months
Carrick:
Middlesbrough - sacked
Rangnick:
Austria - current manager; lost in R16 to Turkey at the Euros
Ten Hag:
Leverkusen - sacked after a couple of months
FC Twente - just appointed as a technical director
Ruud:
Leicester - relegated and left by mutual consent
Its not impossible. You need a manager and sporting setup that is focused on the long term view and ignores outside noise. And also owner willing to spend. There will be transfers that will work out and other that won't. You still have to be willing to spend to get there
This is why I don't think INEOS are it
The club needs investments how much more of their money are they willing to pour in when they are not the majority owners. And how can they be focused on the long term when a new owner can come in and buy the club
The ownership question needs to be settled first. INEOS need to put up the money to buy the club or sell. We need leadership that know it will be there for the long run. Get an experienced DOF for the long run. And get an experienced manager for the long run. And just commit to 3 years regardless of results
This is why I don't think INEOS are it
The club needs investments how much more of their money are they willing to pour in when they are not the majority owners. And how can they be focused on the long term when a new owner can come in and buy the club
The ownership question needs to be settled first. INEOS need to put up the money to buy the club or sell. We need leadership that know it will be there for the long run. Get an experienced DOF for the long run. And get an experienced manager for the long run. And just commit to 3 years regardless of results
I think Rangnick has been the best since united.
Am I missing something here? My understanding is:
Wilcox brought in Dorgu, Heaven, Lammens, Cunha, Mbuemo. All great signings. While it was Vivell who pushed for Sesko
Bereda pushed for Amorim, and Wilcox followed to get on board.
Is this wrong? I thought Wilcox was doing a good job
How are they all great signings?
4231
What do you mean now?
I think the problem are your owners and certain portions of your fan base. You've become a banter club for a while and Amorim seemed to have the right character to get club and culture right on track but decided to sack him when the team was starting to improve on the field.
If you look at our results this season they've been really underwhelming. I can't argue with sacking him. We had one month where we exceeded expectations, the other four have been average to bad.
Feels like we have been the impossible job since 2013, to be honest.
Ultimately the manager is only going to take you so far when the recruitment is terrible. Fixing the dud signings is more important than finding the perfect mythical coach who will bring us glory by himself. If we're smart we're unlikely to end up with a manager so bad he turns a squad capable of winning a league title into a bad team. We just are constantly in a state of having major weaknesses all over the pitch. If we have a set of players capable of challenging for a league title, I'm sure we can find multiple managers who can challenge for a league title with said players.
I think its unfair to look all of it and judge. We have to break it down into the Glazer era and INEOS era.
The later started beginning of last season and we are now in month 18/19. The manager appointments have not worked out. But there can be no doubt that recruitment is better and there is at least a desire to make things better.
Amorim was perhaps the right manager but at the wrong time - there was a lot of things that needed to happen before someone like a Amorim can take us to the next level.
Hopefully, Ole can help us finish in the top 5. And then we need to build the MF in the summer and add a high quality attacking talent.
The later started beginning of last season and we are now in month 18/19. The manager appointments have not worked out. But there can be no doubt that recruitment is better and there is at least a desire to make things better.
Amorim was perhaps the right manager but at the wrong time - there was a lot of things that needed to happen before someone like a Amorim can take us to the next level.
Hopefully, Ole can help us finish in the top 5. And then we need to build the MF in the summer and add a high quality attacking talent.
Depends on what we define the "job" as.
The Directorship seem to have deemed that we don't need a manager, just a great coach.
The fans want 'Glory, Glory, Man United' i.e to win titles year after year, playing entertaining football.
The Owners want to retain their prized 'cash cow'.
That trio of requests shouldn't be that difficult to achieve....should it?
We are becoming something of a footballing 'Rubic Cube'...solving it should be possible, its all in the understanding of what you are doing!
The Directorship seem to have deemed that we don't need a manager, just a great coach.
The fans want 'Glory, Glory, Man United' i.e to win titles year after year, playing entertaining football.
The Owners want to retain their prized 'cash cow'.
That trio of requests shouldn't be that difficult to achieve....should it?
We are becoming something of a footballing 'Rubic Cube'...solving it should be possible, its all in the understanding of what you are doing!
Great opportunity for a big severance package.
Career wise a bit shit, but who cares.
Career wise a bit shit, but who cares.
It just shows that the narrative that Utd make managers fail just isn't true, more like vice-versa.
United is probably the best job you can hope for as a manager at a top club.
The expectations from the fanbase and the club hierarchy are nonexistent. We talk about wanting to win the league again etc., but our short-medium term expectations are always nonexistent.
You can take us to our lowest successive finish and the fans will sing your name and proportion blame on everyone except you. We have seen this multiple times as our lowest finish keeps getting lower
The club always spends a lot of money, and prior to recently managers repeatedly had carte Blanche to sign whoever they felt like signing, once it was feasible for the club.
And independent of the fans, the upper management never seemed to actually expect much, and managers were only ever under any pressure when things were way, way beyond the point of being salvageable.
The expectations from the fanbase and the club hierarchy are nonexistent. We talk about wanting to win the league again etc., but our short-medium term expectations are always nonexistent.
You can take us to our lowest successive finish and the fans will sing your name and proportion blame on everyone except you. We have seen this multiple times as our lowest finish keeps getting lower
The club always spends a lot of money, and prior to recently managers repeatedly had carte Blanche to sign whoever they felt like signing, once it was feasible for the club.
And independent of the fans, the upper management never seemed to actually expect much, and managers were only ever under any pressure when things were way, way beyond the point of being salvageable.
I dont live in the UK so can only judge the sentiment from the media. Goldbridge and Talksport are far far too negative. Amorim was a crap manager that needed 7 defensibe players at home to Wolves.
Ole may not be the worlds best manager. But there is so much upside fitting this team into a 433 or 4231.
There is alot of goals if we just commited more people to attack. Bruno, sesko, cunha, mbuemo is a good front 4.
The rest just need to keep it tight.
Amorims idea to play our best goalscorer as a dm was bonkers. Glad hes gone.
Ole may not be the worlds best manager. But there is so much upside fitting this team into a 433 or 4231.
There is alot of goals if we just commited more people to attack. Bruno, sesko, cunha, mbuemo is a good front 4.
The rest just need to keep it tight.
Amorims idea to play our best goalscorer as a dm was bonkers. Glad hes gone.
Are we the baddies?
I've been thinking about this and the answer is no.
Between now and the end of the season, immediately play the obvious 4-2-3-1/4-3-3 integrate some kids and give them a chance. Give JJ Gabriel a spot on the bench on Saturday, lift the mood
Get players back from AFCON and injury, team should walk to a CL spot if you just put round pegs in round holes, weather the obvious storm coming with the City and Arsenal games.
Get to summer with a CL spot and a half decent FA Cup run.
Buy two midfielders, a right back and a left winger in the summer.
Small steps in each of the next two seasons, Arsenal will naturally decline. Guardiola is going, Liverpool will be worse. Chelsea are Chelsea, just keep it tight, make the obvious play, we are back in title contention for the 27/28 season imo.
Between now and the end of the season, immediately play the obvious 4-2-3-1/4-3-3 integrate some kids and give them a chance. Give JJ Gabriel a spot on the bench on Saturday, lift the mood
Get players back from AFCON and injury, team should walk to a CL spot if you just put round pegs in round holes, weather the obvious storm coming with the City and Arsenal games.
Get to summer with a CL spot and a half decent FA Cup run.
Buy two midfielders, a right back and a left winger in the summer.
Small steps in each of the next two seasons, Arsenal will naturally decline. Guardiola is going, Liverpool will be worse. Chelsea are Chelsea, just keep it tight, make the obvious play, we are back in title contention for the 27/28 season imo.
Unfortunately, Arsenal are going nowhere - they have a really young squad and talent pipeline.
It will always be impossible with the clowns upstairs. We may find stability on the field at some point but Ineos and Glazers will NEVER aid us, only hinder us.
Did you read the Delaney article in the Indo? Seems like he was talking to Frank. I had supported Sir Jim, thinking anything is better than the oil thing. I still think that but Ratcliffe seems to be an utter train wreck.
They will be there, but I don't think they will be what they are now. All teams have micro-cycles even within the longer life of that particular team, Arsenal will have played a lot of football by that time and are doing enough to win but they are hardly dominating the league, their regression will mean we are in more of a position to challenge earlier than we might initially think, as long as we make the sensible moves in the mean time.
Yeah just read it. Depressing reading.
2-1 playing well. Not impossible. Just play a sensible formation. Attack in numbers.
I think he was on track and it was going to get this bad (result wise) to implement a play style and change the culture. So whoever you appoint you guys need to be patient and the board has to be on the same track. Anyway he's already gone so good luck with whoever you appoint next.