Should have given Liam more time; that was a brutal sacking.
Arne Slot | ex-Liverpool manager | The Bald sack watch is over
- Thread starter Samid
- Start date
It's fecking tragic. Incompetence of the highest order if this stands.
Well Slot is going to get them a 4th place finish and that would've been seen as a good season for them before Klopp got them punching above their weight for a few years
Well, Liverbird enthusiasts need to come to grips that Jürgen didn't just sing Slot's name for the giggles. He's here to stay and you will enjoy it.
No no no.
That's a completely mad take.
1st and 4th is not good enough for Slot.
It's funny how Liverpool fans just assume Alonso wants to go there. Maybe he's never had any interest in going back?
Plus they'd start only start crying every time he flys back to Spain.
Plus they'd start only start crying every time he flys back to Spain.
The meltdown if he does to Chelsea will be extreme
Get off redcafe, Arne.
FSG needs to save face. Can't sack someone who spent half a billion last season. I know it sounds stupid but it happens everywhere, upper managements protecting lower ones even if they perform badly because by sacking them they admit to fecking up and made a huge mistake. Looking good is better than anything in the corporate world.
My analysis is there is shortage of good managers.
Us - Carrick - first time PL gig
Arteta - first time gig ever as manager.
Slot - as you can tell, he will finish the season with less than Moyes points in 2014 after 500m spend.
Pep is Pep
Spurs - how many managers this season
Chelsea - LinkedIn manager
As you can see, there is no difference between Brighton, Brentford, Newcastle and the likes managers and 'top club managers' even us, people wanted to take the Iraola and Howe of this world to be our manager.
The Wenger, SAF, Mourinho,Conte,Klopp, are no longer there thus the drop in game evolution, game standards, quality of games and setup ( read Arsenal set-up)
Even in Europe bar PSG nobody has an elite coach.
Bayern - Kompany
Madrid - they want Mourinho back
All Italian teams have very average managers.
We are now on the new cycle of managers the Carrick, Arteta, Kompany, Arbeloa, Alonso, Lampard etc,
Which top clubs are scavenging on, while mid clubs have their own type of managers who have been on the game enough but not elite but can compete with this new crop of managers thus the difference is not as huge as before.
So the competition is stiff by looks of it.
Probably true. As I said before, we're in a terrible situation with our key decision makers all having 1 year left on their deal.
1st and 4th place finishes look great on paper. In reality, Liverpool have probably looked worse as time progressed instead of looking better on pitch with time. In first 6 months they secured the title (think it looked obvious at some point in February) and topped their CL group. Ever since they've been going out of cup competitions easily and not impressing in league either. Tudor's only point as Spurs manager was at Anfield. Chelsea's only point since 4th March until today was at Anfield. That was also the only game they outran opponent this season.
Every day Slot remains in charge they look worse and worse. What would've actually made them look good is that they realized that he's not the solution midway through the season and sacked him back then, because his time at Liverpool could've still been considered a success given the title last season. Keeping a clearly clueless and inept manager in place is definitely not "looking good in the corporate world".
They're business men, not HR partners, there's no shame in acting quickly if you realize you didn't get it 100% right at all imo. Their business might still be gaining value at the moment which is why they're happy to see it out but they'll act once it becomes a problem long-term. I'd honestly 100% without a doubt rather miss out on European football altogether next season with the guarantee of a new manager than getting CL but with Slot still in place.
Klopp also used to finish around fourth or lower the year after winning the league or challenging didn’t he?
You'd think they've been winning titles year after year under Klopp.
1st, 3th and 5th place finishes the season after we won or challenged for the title.
Slot just seems to be continuing the same pattern then
Klopp had far more good faith though and a clear way of playing. Each time they had a dip under Klopp they won a trophy the next season too, with one of them being dangerously close to a quad.
One more for the "a 1st and a 4th place finish is good though" brigade, it seems. The only truthful Utd poster on this page couldn't have put it any better and it's what all of you scoreboard watchers are omitting:
A 4th place finish would be totally acceptable if the on-field product was anywhere close to the required standards, but it hasn't been. He actively makes this team worse. Our only good moments in the last two seasons have come right at the start of his tenure when our players were probably just auto-piloting from what they knew under Klopp.
To be fair, they had 97, 99 and 92 point seasons in four years, but it only resulted in one title. Klopp's legacy could have been very different if it didn't coincide with Pep's best period for City.
And it's completely besides the point as well. We haven't won titles year after year, but no one expects or expected Slot to win consecutive titles either. Like, at all. We just expect that our manager shows that his presence makes our players better or at the VERY least ensures that they know how to play together. None of that has been proven this season, in fact it's the other way around - to the point that I'm starting to believe we would be playing better if we just let them decide amongst themselves rather than listen to Slot.
They showed under Klopp and the beginning of last season what they're capable of on the field so it's not just "this is their actual level" stuff either. And even if one would believe that it is, we should be looking for a manager that elevates their level, not one who consistently makes them play below a level they're capable of.
Yeah If Guardiola decided to stay at Bayern for another 5 years Klopp would have probably won 3-5 PL titles with Liverpool. That's why it's always stupid to judge accomplishments without any context/environment in which they happened.
The problem for Slot is not that Liverpool is 4th but that they play absolute dogshit football. Maybe he can turn it around next year but I would be sceptical.
The problem for Slot is not that Liverpool is 4th but that they play absolute dogshit football. Maybe he can turn it around next year but I would be sceptical.
Yes I'm sure Gravenberch playing far better in a position he never played under Klopp was just on auto- pilot much like Mo Salah having his second best season at Liverpool having been given the freedom to not press was because of Klopp, or Hugo Ekitike's good displays are down to a man he never played for.
It's genuinely one of the stupidest arguments I've heard.
Did Feyenoord only win a title because the players were on auto pilot from the Dick Advocaat spell the time before?
We have seen that going from Sir Alex to David Moyes, or from Ruben Amorim to Michael Carrick means there's no such thing as being on auto pilot from the guy before!
Just because there are examples of autopiloting not being a thing it doesn't mean there aren't examples of it being a thing. I think you're taking it too literally as a comment aswell.
I can use an Everton example for instance. Martinez post Moyes built on the great defensive setup and organisation that existed and introduced his philosophy which tweaked the attacking play and got us our records point total. After that though as Martinez took more onus on our overall play it quickly became known that he is terrible at organising a defence and we dipped quite dramatically from the structure Moyes set in place.
Was Ten Hag a good fit for United or should he have been given more time because he won titles at Ajax?
Slot could be a good manager for Feyenoord or elsewhere for all I care, he just isn't the right fit at Liverpool at the moment and, once again and for the last time, has shown nothing in the last 14 months for me to think he could turn it around again or "just needs more time".
That requires people in power saying "yes, we fecked up big time and now we have to invest more money and sell failed investments at a loss". I don't think a good manager would let this imbalance squad keep going, he'd ask to sell some (at a loss) in order to bring some (new capital needed). In the perspective of owners, that's what Americans would call a double whammy. On top of that, often times the ego is too big that they'd rather let it be and give another chance. Top 4 isn't really forcing their hands because the situation is not bad enough.
FSG in particular simply lucked out with Klopp. They stuck through the shit period under Klopp and reaped the rewards later on. But outside of Klopp you can't say they've made some great decisions when it comes into hiring managers. From Hodgson, Dalgish, Brendan and now Slot. Awful record. They're just as clueless as the Glazers, their strategy involves hoping for another Fergie/Klopp (or back then, Rafa) by giving managers time and inshallah. In the mean time let's spend like it's the last day of Rome in order to support our new manager. I thought they wouldn't fall for it but they did. Repeated the same mistakes Glazers did.
Another trap here is you miss out on CL next season but still in EL or performances looked good enough but not the results. That's another reason to give another chance and we know how that ends up in most clubs. The best case scenario for Liverpool is actually the club going down fast and hard that you sack him mid season.
Last edited:
If Ten Hag had come 1st and 4th in his opening two seasons then I'd have said he was a good fit and deserved more time.
He didn't though so he wasn't a good fit. Also as I've said before, winning the title with Ajax is easier than with Feyenoord. Slot has been successful with every single club he's managed.
Who do you want next out of interest now that Alonso is going to Chelsea?
So did Martinez deserve credit for building on the work that Moyes did?
That was essentially what Slot did last season. He built on the work that Klopp did but kept the players fitter and more available, and helped squeeze one last elite season out of Salah before his legs fell off!
Clearly they have regressed this year, but only to the point where three teams are ahead of them in the table.
I don't think anybody hasn't given Slot some credit for last season though.
I think you need to read what Ornstein wrote again if that's the conclusion you've drawn from it. "Explores the possibility" so pointless to discuss at this point.
They don't need to sell anyone, they need to appoint someone else and hope he can get the best out of those "failed investments", way too early to call them that imo. New capital is also needed if Slot stays because clearly he'd argue that he needs better/other players to be able to play the way he wants to.
I agree with that and have already said that multiple times on here - they're nothing special in that regard, they were just lucky that an amazing manager was available and open to the challenge at the time.
Isn't it usually the other way round? That upper management sack the manager as a way to imply that their signings were actually good, and it is the manager who is messing it up?
Keeping Slot seems more like an admission that their signings were not great, and that they spectacularly messed up by not signing Guehi as Van Dijk's replacement.
As I said no good manager would come without being given some freedom to sell and buy players. The squad is honestly fecked, expensive players in the same positions that the only way to fit them in is playing out of positions or players like writz who is expensive but the cheaper ones can actually do a better job.
Its a whole package. You sack a manager you have to bring new players in. You keep a manager you dont have to do it. Admitting a mistake is expensive both financially and to ego as well. Thats why we see a lot of clubs doing it, persisting with both failed managers and players.
There have been some bad seasons under Klopp but I don't think you've ever looked as tactically clueless under Klopp as you have this season. This season brought in a tactical slide despite spending 400m. That's a concern.
I was responding to a post that said that the players were pretending that Jurgen Klopp was still in charge last season.
Alonso has said he will take the Chelsea job if they offer it to him. I'm not getting it from Ornstein but someone that works at Chelsea.
I think some of that is posturing because they're so bad now, as there have been moments when Slot has been given some credit for actions he took last season by the same posters. There is just far more bad and it's getting worse hence the general trend is negativity as there is no sign that the progression will be positive with him.
Slot is on 111 games for Liverpool with 66 wins. Ten Hag made it to 128 games with 72 wins. Can Slot get 6 wins in the next 17 games to match his countryman in the battle of the bald?
First then fourth is pretty consistent with what Klopp achieved. He'll be fine.
Comparing Klopp and Slot is stupid, because as much as I hate to admit it through (massive) gritted teeth, one of them is an absolutely world class football manager.
The other is an absolutely bang average one that lucked out on the platform left to him and a confluence of circumstances in his competitors.
The other is an absolutely bang average one that lucked out on the platform left to him and a confluence of circumstances in his competitors.