Arsenal 2021/22 | PLEASE LOCK (SERIOUSLY)

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Lost bear

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It took Klopp three full seasons to build a side that could compete for the title as well. By his third (his fourth in total) we were able to put a challenge in, and by his fourth full season we actually won it.

That’s how long it can take when you’re starting all over again.
A useful reminder to us that this will surely take a little time…
 

ThierryFabregas

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True that but you are also a pretty big club and should not be measured like Westham or Leicester.

Let me ask you what's the end goal with Arteta. Would you be fine if he finishes 6th next season and doesn't win the europa either?
Yes depending on points total. As our detractors point out, it's a bit harder playing league games with the fatigue of Europe.

If United and Spurs fans are right then they will be much better next season. So it will be harder for us to be get top 4 according to that argument. I'm not sure I totally buy this as both sides have their internal issues.

We should be near the 69 points of this season next season though regardless of placing. As long as that happens, top 6 is likely what our board are targeting realistically.

As for Leicester, they have finished above us many times now so they aren't a club to write off.
 

Conor

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It took Klopp three full seasons to build a side that could compete for the title as well. By his third (his fourth in total) we were able to put a challenge in, and by his fourth full season we actually won it.

That’s how long it can take when you’re starting all over again.
Yes, Klopp. Someone who had actually done something in management, and had earned time because of his potential. Completely different situation to Arteta, who looks like he's doing the square root of feck all really.
 

AshRK

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Yes depending on points total. As our detractors point out, it's a bit harder playing league games with the fatigue of Europe.

If United and Spurs fans are right then they will be much better next season. So it will be harder for us to be get top 4 according to that argument. I'm not sure I totally buy this as both sides have their internal issues.

We should be near the 69 points of this season next season though regardless of placing. As long as that happens, top 6 is likely what our board are targeting realistically.

As for Leicester, they have finished above us many times now so they aren't a club to write off.
Fair enough. I still feel there should be an end goal of finishing 4th ultimately. If ETH in his first season takes this mess of a side to 4th then it will be massive.
 

Conor

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Yes depending on points total. As our detractors point out, it's a bit harder playing league games with the fatigue of Europe.

If United and Spurs fans are right then they will be much better next season. So it will be harder for us to be get top 4 according to that argument. I'm not sure I totally buy this as both sides have their internal issues.

We should be near the 69 points of this season next season though regardless of placing. As long as that happens, top 6 is likely what our board are targeting realistically.

As for Leicester, they have finished above us many times now so they aren't a club to write off.
Jesus, you would be happy with a 6th place finish in his 4th season, if he spends another 100m quid? What sort target are you setting for Arteta to actually achieve something, 2030?
 

bond19821982

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It took Klopp three full seasons to build a side that could compete for the title as well. By his third (his fourth in total) we were able to put a challenge in, and by his fourth full season we actually won it.

That’s how long it can take when you’re starting all over again.
He pretty much started on a clean slate and had less money in the first 2 years, isn't it ? Yes, the Coutinho money changed the whole landscape but till then you were also shopping in an inferior market.

I would rather take Pep's season as a reference. Had something to build on and needed a final push.
 

ThierryFabregas

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Jesus, you would be happy with a 6th place finish in his 4th season, if he spends another 100m quid? What sort target are you setting for Arteta to actually achieve something, 2030?
Achieving the top 4 or 6 is an achievement. It's about understanding our current limitations. We have to accept our current level before we can expect to move on. You shouldn't punish a manager because the players he currently have aren't good enough to compete
 

The Corinthian

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Achieving the top 4 or 6 is an achievement. It's about understanding our current limitations. We have to accept our current level before we can expect to move on. You shouldn't punish a manager because the players he currently have aren't good enough to compete
fecking hell. I’m hoping some of the normal Arsenal fans read this and disown you.
 

Klopper76

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He pretty much started on a clean slate and had less money in the first 2 years, isn't it ? Yes, the Coutinho money changed the whole landscape but till then you were also shopping in an inferior market.

I would rather take Pep's season as a reference. Had something to build on and needed a final push.
Somewhat. We spent very little on players like Matip, Robertson, TAA (youth), Klavan and Karius. We did spend decent money on players like Chamberlain, Mane, Salah and Wijnaldum pre Coutinho going, but we were definitely shopping in a lower tier. It’s only really once Van Dijk and Alisson were signed that we could say we were signing players in their prime. Even now though we’re still signing players to make the step up for the most part (Jota, Konate, Diaz). We don’t sign Mbappe’s and Haaland’s and probably never will.
 

Scroto Baggins

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Achieving the top 4 or 6 is an achievement. It's about understanding our current limitations. We have to accept our current level before we can expect to move on. You shouldn't punish a manager because the players he currently have aren't good enough to compete
What was the general expectations going into the season? Top four? Europa league spot and a cup run? Im assuming even the most delusional Arsenal fans(Ty) didnt think you would be competing with City or Liverpool for the title.

Im guessing most fans knew it would be a bit of a rebuilding season or two, Arsenal have the youngest squad in the league. Will take a couple of seasons for things to gel and players to reach their potential.
 

Mastadon

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Rooney? Martinez? Rodgers?

Yh, okay.

Absolutely baffles me that, after Arteta gets a team who were predicted to finish 8th, to 5th, he's still being slated as being worse than Martinez and Rooney, and a Rodgers who most Leicester fans don't even rate much anymore.
North Korea would be proud of the level of propaganda you have come up with. 8th place predicted that’s a good one. Take a bow son.
 

Mastadon

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What was the general expectations going into the season? Top four? Europa league spot and a cup run? Im assuming even the most delusional Arsenal fans(Ty) didnt think you would be competing with City or Liverpool for the title.

Im guessing most fans knew it would be a bit of a rebuilding season or two, Arsenal have the youngest squad in the league. Will take a couple of seasons for things to gel and players to reach their potential.
Its not just where we finished because top 6 was always the expectation although Arteta may yet mindfk enough fans to start thinking top8 is where we are at. My main problem with him is the quality of football on display and the complete lack of ideas that we have in attack.

Arsenal under Arteta is the worst I’ve seen us it’s like we are being coached by a late career Mourinho and for some reason the fans are cheering him on. I don’t see what he brings to the table he should have been sacked the moment Conte became available.
 

Bebestation

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I like how Arsenal have improved their squad a bit with some quality.

At the same time, the management of them is not good enough.

If Arteta is not the reason that Arsenal have a better squad of players (maybe it’s edu) - then he is just a waste of time.
 

roonster09

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Rooney? Martinez? Rodgers?

Yh, okay.

Absolutely baffles me that, after Arteta gets a team who were predicted to finish 8th, to 5th, he's still being slated as being worse than Martinez and Rooney, and a Rodgers who most Leicester fans don't even rate much anymore.
People often forget that predictions are not just based on squad but also based on manager.
 
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sglowrider

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I think it's because the truth is kinda boring - he's performed acceptably.

Season 1 - Pretty good
Took over a team in 11th in December. Brought them up to 8th, won a trophy and qualified for the Europa League.

Season 2 - Pretty bad
Finished 8th and messed up a very winnable Europa League campaign.

Season 3 - On par
Finished 5th with the 5th highest wage bill and 5th/6th strongest squad.

He hasn't really overachieved or underachieved. In terms of results we're back where we were under the majority of Emery's tenure (barring the disastrous end that led to him being sacked). He's improved the foundations of the club by clearing out deadwood / unhappy players and thus dramatically reducing the squad's average age and wage bill. If he was to get hit by a bus tomorrow he would leave the club in a better position than when he arrived.

Is he likely to challenge Pep and Klopp's dominance in the near future. No? But neither are Tuchel and Conte, let alone ten Haag and (flavour of the month) Potter.
The fact that it took Klopp and to a lesser extent Pep a few seasons to achieve success should mean that its not impossible to knock them off their feckin' perch. It's about getting the right pieces together.

Chelsea is an anomaly. They have been consistently good regardless of their managers. If anything in the medium term, they may be looked at as the model to aspire -- but for clubs that can generate serious $$ which most of the top six/seven can.
 

Iker Quesadillas

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It took Klopp three full seasons to build a side that could compete for the title as well. By his third (his fourth in total) we were able to put a challenge in, and by his fourth full season we actually won it.
The season before Klopp took over, Liverpool's goal difference was +4. In his first season it was +13. In his second season it was +36. In his third season it was +46.
In his fourth it was +67.

The season before Arteta took over, Arsenal's goal difference was +22. In his first season it was +8. In his second season it was +16. In his third season it was +13.

Pretty different situations.

(Liverpool also reached two consecutive CL finals which would have been another benchmark of progress).
 
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Conor

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Achieving the top 4 or 6 is an achievement. It's about understanding our current limitations. We have to accept our current level before we can expect to move on. You shouldn't punish a manager because the players he currently have aren't good enough to compete
How is finishing in a worse position than this season, in his 4th season in charge, an achievement? Surely you would want him sacked at that point?
 

Kaushal

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Achieving the top 4 or 6 is an achievement. It's about understanding our current limitations. We have to accept our current level before we can expect to move on. You shouldn't punish a manager because the players he currently have aren't good enough to compete
You are not moving anywhere with your amazing ability to understand things like that. Don’t you worry. At what point your expectation will kick on to somewhat respectable level ? He’s gonna spend another £80-£100m this summer that takes his spending to £350m and 4 yrs in charge. You narrowly missed out on top 4 this season and finished 5th by more than 10 points above us. And after another hefty spend and another season in charge, finishing below this year would be understandable ?

I’m not an Arsenal fan and even I’m enraged with your achievement classification. Achievement :lol:
 

PrKitty

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But that's not the situation we're in, there is no world class coach available to us to replace Arteta with. And we would struggle to attract him to Arsenal even if there was.
Tuchel and Conte was available, even Potter would be far better choice than Arteta.

The major problem with Arsenal is their fans are fooled into trusting Arteta's PR too much, look at their reddit sub, majority of those fans(or Pr agent?? hard to tell if those are real fans or fake, too delusional to be real ppl) will blindly believe anything that Arteta threw to them.

Fans do have the power to get Arteta sacked, but good PR from Arteta brainwashed majority of them into one of his cultist.
 

GoonerBear

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True that but you are also a pretty big club and should not be measured like Westham or Leicester.

Let me ask you what's the end goal with Arteta. Would you be fine if he finishes 6th next season and doesn't win the europa either?
I'll be honest with you, I'd be disappointed with that. I think we should be looking at either a top 4 finish, & if we finish just outside that, to win the Europa.

I want to see progression, so I want a better points total, I want more goals, less conceded, certainly less defeats, to be tougher away from home.

If we manage that in the league, we should be near top 4 again. In the Europa League, we made the semi last season, & were Aubameyang hitting the woodwork twice away from a final against you guys, so there's no reason why we shouldn't be aiming to better that this time.

I know it's going to be difficult, because we're now up against Pep, Klopp, Tuchel, Conte & Ten Hag, and all of them can't make top 4, never mind us. Someone will miss out, so someone will have failed.

Is it next season 5th might get you a Champions League place?
 

Verward

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Achieving the top 4 or 6 is an achievement. It's about understanding our current limitations. We have to accept our current level before we can expect to move on. You shouldn't punish a manager because the players he currently have aren't good enough to compete
Your current limitations are caused by your current Manager. If you look at his stats over last few years, majority of the stats doesn't show any progress.
If you are taking league position as progress then remember we were 2nd last season. Position means nothing for next season. Whenever I have seen Arsenal, I do not see any special.
Even during Wenger's latter years, his team would still play beautiful attacking football. Same cannot be said about Arteta.

If you think Arteta is some sort of genius, I believe you'd be in a surprise next season with Conte, ETH in the mix now along with Klopp, Pep and Tuchel.

You guys will be most probably back to your 8th position.
 

Iker Quesadillas

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Achieving the top 4 or 6 is an achievement. It's about understanding our current limitations. We have to accept our current level before we can expect to move on. You shouldn't punish a manager because the players he currently have aren't good enough to compete
Progress, and work in general, requires sober analysis, nuance, understanding context, etc. That's all true.

But a culture of excellence also requires setting some arbitrary standards, ones that don't exist 'in context.'

At winning clubs, you (almost always) fire people when they're not up to these standards. It may not be the right decision in the short term, but it is in the long term.
 

Daydreamer

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Linked with Morata?
When asked what he wanted from a striker signing, Arteta replied "someone that puts the ball in the back of the net".

Morata has a few things going for him, but that's not one of them.
 

WeePat

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When asked what he wanted from a striker signing, Arteta replied "someone that puts the ball in the back of the net".

Morata has a few things going for him, but that's not one of them.
He's beginning to feel like a pawn in a money laundering scheme at this point. Arsenal pay 30m for him, he underwhelms for 2 years but magically Arsenal have found an interested buyer. He moves to Aston Villa for 27m. Underwhelms there for a season, but magically Villa have found an interested buyer too. He moves to Roma for 25m.
 

Cloud7

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I really hope Arsenal sign Morata. Meme striker for a meme manager. Perfect match.
 

Cloud7

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He's beginning to feel like a pawn in a money laundering scheme at this point. Arsenal pay 30m for him, he underwhelms for 2 years but magically Arsenal have found an interested buyer. He moves to Aston Villa for 27m. Underwhelms there for a season, but magically Villa have found an interested buyer too. He moves to Roma for 25m.
I said this a while back (may have been on twitter or something?) but the fees that Morata goes for and the fact that there is always a willing buyer at these high fees seems like a money laundering operation.
 

lsd

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Prime wishing they were filming Arsenal now its kicking off on twitter
 

P-Ro

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The most liked comment on the accusation tweet is: "Sorry you had to go through this but we can't lose him this season". Arsenal fans living up to their reputation as the most cringe fanbase in the world.
 

Lewnited

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The most liked comment on the accusation tweet is: "Sorry you had to go through this but we can't lose him this season". Arsenal fans living up to their reputation as the most cringe fanbase in the world.
The state of those comments, jesus
 
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